I had an idea this morning. I've generally relied on high PS and repositioning antics to make up for my lack of real ability. Having tried swarms of low PS ships bumping into each other (and rocks) and failing to predict my opponent's moves, I found that I rarely prevent getting shot at. The (logical) conclusion is, since I rarely move to avoid attack, why bother moving at all? So I came up with a list that could either be some form of paradigm-shifting tactical genius or (more likely) just the work of a boring and untalented small man.

Anyway, here it is...

Omicron Group Pilot, tractor beam, advanced sensors, tactical jammer, intelligence agent, systems officer X2

Lieutenant Dormitz, advanced sensors, general Hux, systems officer, hyperwave comm scanner

In my mind it works like this...

Use Dormitz's ability and hyperwave comm scanner to set up in a corner like https://www.dropbox.com/s/u5xjv7019iz8txa/_20170205_121917.JPG?dl=0

As long as you keep doing 1 banks on the OGPs and straight 1 with the Upsilon you can sit in the corner with focus, target lock and no stress. Use the intelligence agent to decide who to target lock, tractor those who refuse to willingly fly into your death zone and wait for either victory or death.

My wife says it's stupid, boring and feels like cheating. I'm going to practise with it tonight and if it's not utter garbage I might take it to a store tournament next week.

I would love to know what you all think of castling as a valid tactic.

I think you are probably trolling. Your wife is correct. Fly or go home.

I know thisll sound insane, but listen to your wife

It's called fortressing.

The designer's assessment of it was that it was that while it was in their words an NPE (negative play experience) it was too ineffective to be worth errating out. In other words, it's completely legal.

It'll also make you a pariah in large sections of the X-Wing community, the forums included.

Short version, in a tournament you'll lose and in casual you'll have nobody to play with.

Sorry folks. I am not that well informed and didn't realise forterssing was a thing, such a hated, hated thing. I'm not trolling.

I shall listen to my good lady and put that one in the bin of bad ideas.

Has anyone ever played against a fortress? Is it as poor an experience as suggested?

Quote

I am not that well informed and didn't realise forterssing was a thing

Since Wave 2. The first one involved two Falcons flying to the middle of the map, flying into each other repeatedly so they didn't move and having 360 fire on most of the play area. The loss of action economy meant it didn't work but it still made people very angry.

Quote

Has anyone ever played against a fortress? Is it as poor an experience as suggested?

You just fly towards it, K-turn away, fly towards it and K-turn away over and over.

Someone did it in Worlds 2014 just as an opening (wait for the enemy to come near then break the fortress) and there were calls to disqualify him. People get very heated about fortressing.

Well also did not know such setup existed and is so hated but seeing it make me want to fly against it at least one time

Actual games against fortresses are fairly dull: like Decimator Versus Falcon you just roll dice until one dies. It's the concept people abhor: it's a list that doesn't move in a game where the tactical depth comes from the maneuver dial. People don't like feeling like their maneuvering is being negated: same reason PWTs have a sizeable hatedom.

Fortressing in general may be bad form but sometimes it's absolutely the best choice. For example the final of the Austin regional started with a fortress. It was winner take all and against bomber k wings he had final Salvo in the bag, so the best move was not to move at all.

Link:

Fortressing also generally... doesn't really work. It lets the enemy approach at their convenienceand set up the exact right lines of attack, then nuke a single ship in an alpha strike and win on time.

It's also irritating.

14 hours ago, Blue Five said:

Since Wave 2. The first one involved two Falcons flying to the middle of the map, flying into each other repeatedly so they didn't move and having 360 fire on most of the play area. The loss of action economy meant it didn't work but it still made people very angry.

You just fly towards it, K-turn away, fly towards it and K-turn away over and over.

Someone did it in Worlds 2014 just as an opening (wait for the enemy to come near then break the fortress) and there were calls to disqualify him. People get very heated about fortressing.

Richard Hsu, an X-wing advocate and re-occurring member on one of the X-wing alliance podcast. He was flying actually some sort of X-wing B-wing Z-95 wall I think and was up against a hypermobile phantom-interceptor build (before the cloak nerf). He deployed it sort of as a wall in the corner (lol build a wall, people go crazy).

Either way fortress is something that breaks the theme and since hidden information such as dials and movement are considering the hallmarks of the game people think of bypassing it as bad form. Sure you can argue that you lose your action but there are ways around it, dauntless title, lando <pilot>. Still because you are not moving people know exactly where you are going to be at. Further more there are more ways to get pass the fortress. Zeb <crew> is quite literally the battering ram when it comes to fortresses, (lets not forget about Oicunn who takes ramming seriously) bump into the weakest ship and keep firing untill it is dead with the other ships taking their turns ploping in and out of range to add in their dice. Focus down the weakest ship in the fortress, and the wall will come tumbling down.

That hatred of it is somewhat hypocritical, I'd assume that a majority of the outcriers were ones who played in that traffic jam meta of Wave 2-3 where all the ships just pile into the center and would not be moving for two or three turns as each ship would just bump right into each other. That's okay but intentionally bumping in your ship is not?

Also, if you wanna fortress with Hux, this is the build I think:

RAC/Hux/Rebel Captive/Systems Officer/Wingman

Kylo/Pattern Analyser/whatever

Drive kylo out in front of RAC, bump RAC into Kylo. Kylo stops, PA coordinate Hux on RAC, rac does 2 forward, bumps Kylo, giving him a TL, wingman clears the stress, repeat ad nauseam. If only there was a way to get RAC the lock as well...

Fortressing to gain an idea of the enemy line of approach then countering it is fine. But sitting and waiting is definitely no fun.

Besides - many players will know how to break the fortress with concentrated fire so if you wait TOO long you get blatted quite comprehensively.

If you want to be That Guy(tm), run this:

Rey (54)
YT-1300 (45), Expertise (4), Finn (5)

Chewbacca (46)
YT-1300 (42), Expertise (4), "Chopper" (0)

Run 'em into one another; 360 modified shots every round with an extra die in Rey's arc. Actions optional.

3 hours ago, varthanna said:

Fortressing in general may be bad form but sometimes it's absolutely the best choice. For example the final of the Austin regional started with a fortress. It was winner take all and against bomber k wings he had final Salvo in the bag, so the best move was not to move at all.

Link:

Fortressing I really dislike it, I have not seen it for a while as it seemed to have become largely ineffectual....but

I watched the final from above and at first was intrigued by the Gand Findsman build, then I watched what he did for the first several turns and my heart sank.

Fair play to Sable that he did all the work in trying to winkle him out of the corner but left himself in an inferior position.

if it was me I would have just said " listen Mate, if you are not coming out of that corner, let's just go to Final Salvo, as I have some grass outside I need to watch grow"

Hope this does not become a thing.

I ran a 3 Trsndoshian Slaver list, that I fortressed in a corner for the first few turns. I actually did it for a joke, but it actually was kinda fun. I used a specially designed formation to set up in the corner on turn 2. Then I used green 1 moves to stay there and K4 security droids to get TLs. I did ok, for a joke list and went 2-2. It was pretty fun and no one got mad. I did loose to triple jumpmasters(this was pre nerf) but I beat a Palp aces list. I think if I had practiced with it at all,(I thought of it the night before and never used it before game one of the tournament) I probably could have gone 3-1. I say all that to say, don't over react to a fortress list. They can be fun for both players, because the game goes fast and the fortress usually loses. Also I find a fortress list way better to face off against than a list that runs for the whole match. I played against a 4 TAP with PTL list in my last tournament(I was running 5 TAPs with title, Proton rockets, and GC) that literally ran for 60 of the 75 mins. We didn't even shoot until like turn 20! I tried all game to get him in arc and he ran away and arc dodged(without even shooting me) I finally won by catching him in arc after a good block, and actually killed 3 of his 4 ships while only loosing 1 of my own, but it was the worst game I've ever played.

8 hours ago, Bubbachop said:

I am not that well informed and didn't realise forterssing was a thing, such a hated, hated thing. I'm not trolling.

Ironic that your thread is called Hux's Castle. . .

It It used to be that fortressing didn't work because of action economy. But in Wave 10, there are so many things that give free actions and tokens, I wonder if it might not be possible now in a way that it hadn't previously?

But trying that with 2 ships, each with 1 green die... I'm not sure how long they'd last, tbh.

1 hour ago, Hawkstrike said:

If you want to be That Guy(tm), run this:

Rey (54)
YT-1300 (45), Expertise (4), Finn (5)

Chewbacca (46)
YT-1300 (42), Expertise (4), "Chopper" (0)

Run 'em into one another; 360 modified shots every round with an extra die in Rey's arc. Actions optional.

Nah, if you fortress you assume that your arc will be avoided if there's any benefit to doing so. Run Lando (+ Predator + Luke) instead of Rey and give Chewie a free TL action every turn to complement the Expertise.

If the designer view from Wave 4 stands then the moment fortressing becomes viable it'll be FAQed out of the game.

I don't know how you could.

Seriously, how would you suggest doing that?

1 hour ago, Sparklelord said:

Nah, if you fortress you assume that your arc will be avoided if there's any benefit to doing so. Run Lando (+ Predator + Luke) instead of Rey and give Chewie a free TL action every turn to complement the Expertise.

Actually, I'm thinking Gunner + Captain Rex on Lando. Same points as Luke, but it's an actual Focus token for the second attack.

3 hours ago, Ashley said:

Fortressing I really dislike it, I have not seen it for a while as it seemed to have become largely ineffectual....but

I watched the final from above and at first was intrigued by the Gand Findsman build, then I watched what he did for the first several turns and my heart sank.

Fair play to Sable that he did all the work in trying to winkle him out of the corner but left himself in an inferior position.

if it was me I would have just said " listen Mate, if you are not coming out of that corner, let's just go to Final Salvo, as I have some grass outside I need to watch grow"

Hope this does not become a thing.

It's a sane strategy- do you really want to try to chase down those ships with normal arced no-reposition ships that have limited turning options? Might as well just push your advantage and make him come to you.

52 minutes ago, Panzeh said:

It's a sane strategy- do you really want to try to chase down those ships with normal arced no-reposition ships that have limited turning options? Might as well just push your advantage and make him come to you.

I watched that game on the stream and as soon as I saw the Scum players strategy I was sure the Rebel K's would just make a bunch of passes shooting their turrets at the Z-95 at range 3 and out of the Gands range. I'm not sure why he didn't do that but it would have broken the fortress and left the K's with a huge advantage.

8 hours ago, Marinealver said:

Richard Hsu, an X-wing advocate and re-occurring member on one of the X-wing alliance podcast. He was flying actually some sort of X-wing B-wing wall I think and was up against a hypermobile phantom-interceptor build (before the cloak nerf). He deployed it sort of as a wall in the corner (lol build a wall, people go crazy).

Either way fortress is something that breaks the theme and since hidden information such as dials and movement are considering the hallmarks of the game people think of bypassing it as bad form. Sure you can argue that you lose your action but there are ways around it, dauntless title, lando <pilot>. Still because you are not moving people know exactly where you are going to be at. Further more there are more ways to get pass the fortress. Zeb <crew> is quite literally the battering ram when it comes to fortresses, (lets not forget about Oicunn who takes ramming seriously) bump into the weakest ship and keep firing untill it is dead with the other ships taking their turns ploping in and out of range to add in their dice. Focus down the weakest ship in the fortress, and the wall will come tumbling down.

That hatred of it is somewhat hypocritical, I'd assume that a majority of the outcriers were ones who played in that traffic jam meta of Wave 2-3 where all the ships just pile into the center and would not be moving for two or three turns as each ship would just bump right into each other. That's okay but intentionally bumping in your ship is not?

I was there! I took a photo!

Search for Wellington Square in my 2014 World's write-up. https://teamcovenant.com/general/2014-world-championships-photo-diary