31 minutes ago, Cgriffith said:

As to the added complexity as always do what the card says by Wave 11 this will all have faded

I think this is a good thing to mention - it's new and complex now, because well, it's a brand new way this kind of mechanic is applied. But all mechanics were new mechanics at some point. Who is to say that this time next year, most people will remember the gist of ISYTDS, or Hux' or Rex's conditions, just like people remember how Ion or Tractor tokens work or what a particular bomb does?

2 hours ago, Cgriffith said:

Fanatical Devotion does not worry me, and neither does Suppressive Fire the text included with them is to the point and direct; as to I'll Show You the Darkside; I think this card may lead to cheating in a game that which is casual and relaxed; who's to say your opponent now doesn't show up without all the pilot trait cards in the deck; who checks the deck? will that become a norm at organized play events?

I've been to a couple of tournaments (Regionals) that the TO asked everyone to count their first round opponent's damage desck and verify that the right number of cards were present and in the right amounts ( 33 cards, 2 of each crit except for Direct Hit! of which there are 7).

If anything, ISYTDS should make it less likely that someone brings a stacked damage deck. Unless it's fairly late into the game with a lot of damage cards already dealt then someone is going to be highly suspicous if they can't find any pilot crits in your deck. It's possible that all of the pilot cards ended up being at the very top of the deck but it's not very lightly.

12 hours ago, Parakitor said:

The Force Awakens is great. Kylo Ren is the best villain. That is all.

They really are the best. Really the best. Everyone says so. There's no reason to listen to old, out of touch, original series fans. Who don't really exist. Because everyone agrees that TFA and Kylo are the best.

I'm fine with them. It's just like anything else in the game, takes a few reads to grasp each one but then it's in my brain.

And Kylo is fine. Powerful, but not OP. We've had the hard counter card for years, it's called Determination. Literally stops Kylo COMPLETELY. For 1 point.

42 minutes ago, InterceptorMad said:

I'm fine with them. It's just like anything else in the game, takes a few reads to grasp each one but then it's in my brain.

And Kylo is fine. Powerful, but not OP. We've had the hard counter card for years, it's called Determination. Literally stops Kylo COMPLETELY. For 1 point.

Yeah and only kylo

For your ept slot

And for being screwed in every other matchups

Determination has been garbage since its inception, it is not suddenly because it counters a single card

Regarsless of how good kylo ends up neing, this is a poor solution

I doubt we'll see Determination pop up unless Kylo explodes in popularity and becomes an insane problem. Dengaroo could probably swap LW for Determination and be fine, Decimators could take Determination and mostly be fine, same goes for YTs (except Dash). However they will all sacrifice some offense to ignore it, so the moment they face a non-kylo list theyre gonna be upset.

After all, you never ever draw Pilot crits normally when you have determination. I put it on Oicunn to stop the bump damage crit primarily and out of probably 20 games with him every time i decided to dump Determination THATS WHEN I SAW IT ffs

Just now, WWHSD said:

Ion, Cloak, and Tractor tokens are all essentially conditions. The difference is that they come with a rule card that explains how the condition works instead of a "condition" card.

There may be some difference between those tokens and conditions if there is ever a pilot ability or upgrade that does something to a condition card or if you are targeting a ship with an assigned condition but currently there's no real functional difference.

There are literally dozens of ships that can use those tokens, and multiple ways to use them. Take the Ion token, for example. Ion Cannon, Ion Cannon Turret, Ion Bomb, Conner Net, Ion Projectors, EMP Device, all the way through to negative effects from Feedback Array or 4-LOM. You're never going to be short of the rules card or tokens, and you'll rarely run into someone who's unfamiliar with it's rules and application.

30 minutes ago, Vineheart01 said:

I doubt we'll see Determination pop up unless Kylo explodes in popularity and becomes an insane problem. Dengaroo could probably swap LW for Determination and be fine, Decimators could take Determination and mostly be fine, same goes for YTs (except Dash). However they will all sacrifice some offense to ignore it, so the moment they face a non-kylo list theyre gonna be upset.

After all, you never ever draw Pilot crits normally when you have determination. I put it on Oicunn to stop the bump damage crit primarily and out of probably 20 games with him every time i decided to dump Determination THATS WHEN I SAW IT ffs

I am seeing Quickdraw with it right now. I could see A-wings using it as their second EPT if Kylo gets popular.

14 hours ago, Cgriffith said:

Fanatical Devotion does not worry me, and neither does Suppressive Fire the text included with them is to the point and direct; as to I'll Show You the Darkside; I think this card may lead to cheating in a game that which is casual and relaxed; who's to say your opponent now doesn't show up without all the pilot trait cards in the deck; who checks the deck? will that become a norm at organized play events?

As to the mechanics of the condition Kylo needs to deliver a crit and depending on the carrier with 3/4 dice (even maybe 5 at R1) the likelihood is good. It is also an Action which for repeatable use may force that player to decide on very important tactics while using it in certain situations. As to the added complexity as always do what the card says by Wave 11 this will all have faded

Checking your opponent's DD contents has been something you could do, and even should do casually, before every game since the beginning. Before you'd probably be doing it just to make sure there are enough Direct Hit cards in there and the deck wasn't stacked with crits that wouldn't affect your opponent's ships all that much. Now you may want to check for the Pilot crits as well but when Kylo goes you get to search and if that first search comes up empty, especially with no damage cards on the table, it's time to call a Judge and claim you win.

Where would it say Kylo needs to deliver the crit? Kylo is needed to put the condition on the target but once there it acts independently of its source. This is part of what makes that card's interactions unusually complex.

14 hours ago, Cgriffith said:

21 hours ago, ficklegreendice said:

Conditions DO have straight up rules cards

Theyre just called condition cards and are smaller

WRONG, because There's a rule card for conditions!

So condition cards are really one card split into two

Anyways, some people like the added complexity conditions bring to the table. I am not such of a fan as they do bring more clutter to an already crowded play space for which I already made my opinions HERE in this thread. After All Agent Kalus didn't need a token and he acts more like a condition card than anything other.

As for the whole must include titles to make ship better because the dial and stats would not survive the power creep is not a favored feature of mine. I like variety in my upgrades and so called auto-include upgrades I don't find very elegant. Especially the 0 point cost ones with no drawback because then you just can't chose not to take it. It becomes another loose thread on a ship that has to be tucked in. Now I am not saying that there can't be the best upgrade that matches the ship. I am perfectly fine with PTL and Soontir Fel because you could chose other EPTs or even a cheaper EPT. Sure it won't work as well but it is an option. You will not take an ARC-170 without the title. It is just stupid to think such a thing and why some people says that bring variety to the ship as it doesn't act like another ship with similar stats and dial, I say some of the character is lost because now the title slot is permanently tied up.

On 2/3/2017 at 2:22 PM, evanger said:

I join the group of those who are a bit nervous about the concept of Condition cards.

For one, they represent yet another mechanic tacked onto the game.

For another, it makes the semi-successful dark side wannabe Kylo Ren the only person in the game who can "Show you the Dark Side". Not even Vader, or, worse yet, not even Palpatine can pull that off. Dark Lords of the Sith can't manage what a half-trained failure from the future can.

It reminds me of the new (small) Pelta-class frigate in Armada, which, oddly enough, is supposed to be a better command ship than Home One. What?

Both might be examples of over-valuing the new at the expense of the old.

Star Wars: Rebels and The Force Awakens aren't better than the Original Trilogy, but FFG seems to want to turn those products up to "11".

Or, you know, the Pelta-class and Kylo came out more recently, so they got to introduce new mechanics while the material from the original trilogy was exhausted for the first few waves? It seems natural that FFG would put out the iconic stuff everyone can recognize first (stuff from the trilogy), which also means that the classics will have the simplest mechanics and be closest to the base game design.

As new stuff comes out, in order to sell it and keep design space open, FFG develops new mechanics, and they are implemented with new ships/characters. Now that there is a new canon being produced, and it has a wider audience than the old EU, naturally FFG draws their new material from the more accessible, fresh and publicized sources. That means sequel trilogy, stand alone films and Rebels.

Its all quite reasonable, predictable, and has nothing to do with a conspiracy by an evil mouse to make its stuff more powerful than the things we all loved growing up.