It might be a bit more effort, but if it's feasible, I think it would be better to revise the cards for these expansions individually. Otherwise we could easily end up in a situation where one person has a great idea to balance card X, and another has a great idea for card Y, but they don't line up in a way that we could see them both.

We're going to do something for Adv Etheric rudder; looks like I left that out of the entry by accident. My fault there.

6 minutes ago, Mangipan said:

It might be a bit more effort, but if it's feasible, I think it would be better to revise the cards for these expansions individually. Otherwise we could easily end up in a situation where one person has a great idea to balance card X, and another has a great idea for card Y, but they don't line up in a way that we could see them both.

I was worried about balance issues with the cards and changed the format at the last minute. For example if we power up one card without accounting for another card being powered up, we could end up with unintentional additive effects and combinations. Ultimately I thought it was better to have full expansion sets so that each entry could be fully thought-through. It's not too late to change my mind I suppose.

2 minutes ago, Babaganoosh said:

We're going to do something for Adv Etheric rudder; looks like I left that out of the entry by accident. My fault there.

I was worried about balance issues with the cards and changed the format at the last minute. For example if we power up one card without accounting for another card being powered up, we could end up with unintentional additive effects and combinations. Ultimately I thought it was better to have full expansion sets so that each entry could be fully thought-through. It's not too late to change my mind I suppose.

Thank you, no worries.

I think you're right with this. Last season, we had a lot of cards that were developed privately and seperately, and we werent able to see the potential broken combos until well after the voting occurred, and we were experimenting with builds. I'd rather we avoid potential broken combos than have really good synergistic combos.

Not to purposely poo-poo on this anymore than I already have (I'm totally over it after my pity party lol), but I just caught this- Wasn't it illegal to submit upgrades that had identical text to an existing upgrade? Because Naboo Royal Starfighter is Sensor Jammer...

3 minutes ago, Kdubb said:

Not to purposely poo-poo on this anymore than I already have (I'm totally over it after my pity party lol), but I just caught this- Wasn't it illegal to submit upgrades that had identical text to an existing upgrade? Because Naboo Royal Starfighter is Sensor Jammer...

Hmm. This is an interesting point. The text isn't IDENTICAL, cause it has the PS clause, but the active effect is the same as something that already exists.

I think the best solution is that it must be changed during the adjustment phase.

56 minutes ago, Kdubb said:

Not to purposely poo-poo on this anymore than I already have (I'm totally over it after my pity party lol), but I just caught this- Wasn't it illegal to submit upgrades that had identical text to an existing upgrade? Because Naboo Royal Starfighter is Sensor Jammer...

Oh. Clearly the author needs to study more about this game... :/

1 minute ago, Odanan said:

Oh. Clearly the author needs to study more about this game... :/

Nahh it was an easy mistake to make. Someone should have just caught it sooner.

My biggest problem with the dial proposed for the N1 Starfighter is that nowhere onscreen do we see anything that could be considered a green 1 hard out of the naboo Starfighter. It all seems to be based on "this one description says it's maneuverable, so lets give it an awesome knifefighting dial" which doesn't follow what we see.

It's a more expensive, more maneuverable Awing with an astromech slot and no high PS pilots or EPT generics.

I had my own dial and point costs entered, of course, but I got voted down, so clearly not everyone shares my concerns.

6 minutes ago, Rakaydos said:

My biggest problem with the dial proposed for the N1 Starfighter is that nowhere onscreen do we see anything that could be considered a green 1 hard out of the naboo Starfighter. It all seems to be based on "this one description says it's maneuverable, so lets give it an awesome knifefighting dial" which doesn't follow what we see.

The movies themselves were never a great source for any ship's stats, but what I saw in the screen was a ship very capable of dogfighting.

Anyway, it's sad that, in this format, you need to pick one full expansion and discard entirely another. I hope the rules in the future are changed to a way we can pick the best of each submitted expansion. For instance:

- Odanan's ship stats;

- Rakaydos' ship dial;

- Odanan's Leia ability;

- Rakaydos' Queen Whatever-her-name ability;

- Other-Guy astromech card;

- Other-Guy title...

and so on...

Can I propose a change for a future season? To split the voting in two steps:

1- we vote which ship will get the expansion

2- we vote on the people's propositions (stats, pilots, dial, upgrades...)

This way we can get the best of all worlds (and not ditch some great stuff, like we did in the round).

24 minutes ago, Odanan said:

The movies themselves were never a great source for any ship's stats, but what I saw in the screen was a ship very capable of dogfighting.

Anyway, it's sad that, in this format, you need to pick one full expansion and discard entirely another. I hope the rules in the future are changed to a way we can pick the best of each submitted expansion. For instance:

- Odanan's ship stats;

- Rakaydos' ship dial;

- Odanan's Leia ability;

- Rakaydos' Queen Whatever-her-name ability;

- Other-Guy astromech card;

- Other-Guy title...

and so on...

Can I propose a change for a future season? To split the voting in two steps:

1- we vote which ship will get the expansion

2- we vote on the people's propositions (stats, pilots, dial, upgrades...)

This way we can get the best of all worlds (and not ditch some great stuff, like we did in the round).

I see your concerns, but i don't think it's particularly viable. What happens then is, just like last season, we get a whole bunch of stuff that isn't designed to work together and we end up with a hodgepodge of pilots and upgrades that wouldnt be as good if, instead, we had just voted in one comprehensive set.

With this system, at the very least we know that what we got was the best that was available. And theres nothing in the rules stating i can't take "inspiration" from the other packs and change up some of my stuff so that we CAN get the best of all worlds.

Alright, now for the N-1 Starfighter:

Naboo Palace Guard: For 1 point more than a Refit A-Wing you get Barrel Roll instead of Boost, plus an Astromech and Torpedo slot. That's reasonable. Another way to look at it is it's a TIE/fo with +1 Shield and -1 Hull, and the aforementioned upgrade options. More susceptible to Direct Hits that can sneak past shields, but otherwise more resilient to crits. Also reasonable for 1 point, though I'll comment on the dial later.

Queen Sosha Soruna: I'd much prefer if she were Rebel Captive, only affecting the first ship each round. Given the "no identical text to existing cards" restriction however, at the very least maybe only affect ships that are a) not already stressed (see Mara Jade, Flechette Cannon), or b) shooting you for the first time each turn (otherwise Gunners are punished pretty hard).

Leia Organa: Love the nod to the crew card. Don't see it being broken, but could see restricting it to Range 1-3 given how much people like to complain about Palpatine and Manaroo's unlimited ranges.

Shara Bey: Same PS, same ability, not complaints there. She comes in at a point less than Arvel's A-Wing, though, with options for Torpedoes and an Astromech. I know Arvel's not exactly the most competitive ship, but more options at a lower cost is a bit power-creepy. Probably fine given the A-Wing's current shortcomings.

G8 Astromech: I really like this guy. Very good effect (especially since it prevents an untimely Direct Hit on the N-1) and reasonable downside of possibly only being one-time use. Makes his cousin Salvaged Astromech pretty sad, though. Maybe he could flip them face-down, but only blow up on a <hit>?

Naboo Royal Starfighter: I like it, but it's probably a little too strong. Sensor Jammer is a pretty underrated card. Since we're not supposed to copy existing text anyway, how about "When defending, the attacker cannot change more than one <eye> result into a <hit> or <crit> result." So spending a Focus still helps, but not so much on multi-eye rolls, and they also can't double up with say Calulation plus a normal Focus effect against you.

N-X Cruiser: This one I simply don't like. The N-1 goes from being an A-Wing with Barrel Roll instead of Boost, to an A-Wing with Barrel Roll in addition to boost, plus a Torpedo slot. Not sure what to do about it, though.

Last but not least, the dial. Where to start. First, it has too many maneuvers. 18 before even considering Boost or Barrel Roll is ridiculous (yes, the TIE/sf has 18, but 4 of the standard straight/bank/turns are red). I actually kind of like the layout of green maneuvers, and R2 Astromech does virtually nothing for the ship (R2-D2 on the other hand should quite like it). I would start by dropping one of the K-turns (probably the 2). After that... I don't know, but right now it just looks like it has way too many good options to me. Maybe dropping a K would be enough.

2 hours ago, Razgriz25thinf said:

And theres nothing in the rules stating i can't take "inspiration" from the other packs and change up some of my stuff so that we CAN get the best of all worlds.

Actually there was- cat copy someone else's card without permission.

Just now, Rakaydos said:

Actually there was- cat copy someone else's card without permission.

Never said copy. Said take inspiration from. Take some good ideas and interpret them differently.

There's very little that's entirely new under the X-wing sun. As long as it is not a verbatim, functional, or virtually functional copy, you're OK.

14 minutes ago, Babaganoosh said:

There's very little that's entirely new under the X-wing sun. As long as it is not a verbatim, functional, or virtually functional copy, you're OK.

Yeah, i mean stuff like "Oh, hey, this Astromech solves X issue for ship Y though trigger Z... How could *I* solve X issue for ship Y in a different way, without using trigger Z?" Mostly my process for card creation involves discovering a problem, scheming the best way that problem would be solved, then figuring out a unique and efficient way to trigger the solution for that problem. For example: Adv. Etheric Rudder.

Problem: The X-Wing has a problem with it's mobility and it's defense. IA simply isn't enough. I must also do this in such a way that Biggs isn't directly buffed in defense as well.

Solution: Giving the X-Wing access to post-maneuver actions and tokens could curb both. I don't want to use boost as i want the T-65 to feel like a separate ship from the T-70. By giving the X-Wing the option to either perform a barrel roll or an evade action, i leave space for counter-play through stress, while also giving the X-Wing the mobility and defense that it needs.

Trigger: The /X7 card does a good job of encouraging a certain speed of maneuvers while providing a good bonus, but does so simply too well. It's too cheap and getting the token, as opposed to getting an action, is very, very powerful, which the X-Wing doesn't need at it's price point. If i restrict the trigger to speed 2 and 3 maneuvers, Biggs has a harder time gaining the bonuses as Biggs likes to roll at speed 1. It also reinforces the X-Wing as a faster ship than it's usually flown at. Biggs can use this card, but it requires a change in tactics to a more dangerous and aggressive squad positioning, which is a rather large disadvantage.

About Etheric Rudder- I think we'll just include it in the expansion. I'm updating the expansion document now.

4 minutes ago, Babaganoosh said:

About Etheric Rudder- I think we'll just include it in the expansion. I'm updating the expansion document now.

You're the boss, it's your call.

I like AER except that it almost completely replaces Vectored Thrusters as an option.

2 minutes ago, ObiWonka said:

I like AER except that it almost completely replaces Vectored Thrusters as an option.

Hey, that's what the adjustments phase is for. Nonetheless, i don't really see any X-Wings running it anyways, not even T-70s, which is why i didn't worry too much about that. Cause X-Wings aren't going to take it instead of IA. AER is sort of like, a supplement for IA and VT, except unlike IA it's not free(so that may be a better choice sometimes if you're trying to save points), and unlike VT you can't use BR whenever you want.

Out of curiosity could we see the rest of the voting results to see how all the other packs did?

The vote results should be public already; just go back to the vote poll. Let me know if you have trouble seeing them.

1 hour ago, Babaganoosh said:

The vote results should be public already; just go back to the vote poll. Let me know if you have trouble seeing them.

"The form CCL Season 2 Rebel Expansions is no longer accepting responses.
Try contacting the owner of the form if you think this is a mistake."

2 hours ago, Odanan said:

"The form CCL Season 2 Rebel Expansions is no longer accepting responses.
Try contacting the owner of the form if you think this is a mistake."

Thanks for pointing this out. APPARENTLY, google forms has gone through an update that makes it a pain in the neck to share the result analytics. But I found a workaround and you can check out the results by following this link: RESULTS

Darn. My ace pack was third place, but my naboo starfighter net 15 votes negative.

Awings did well but didnt win, so perhaps next year I'll go for Bwing+Awing.

15 hours ago, ObiWonka said:

Last but not least, the dial. Where to start. First, it has too many maneuvers. 18 before even considering Boost or Barrel Roll is ridiculous (yes, the TIE/sf has 18, but 4 of the standard straight/bank/turns are red). I actually kind of like the layout of green maneuvers, and R2 Astromech does virtually nothing for the ship (R2-D2 on the other hand should quite like it). I would start by dropping one of the K-turns (probably the 2). After that... I don't know, but right now it just looks like it has way too many good options to me. Maybe dropping a K would be enough.

Proposal for new N-1 dial: