1 minute ago, gennataos said:

Huh...sooo...any 2-hull ship could be Direct Hit one-shotted? Should I pack up Corran, Jake and Tycho?

Just now, ficklegreendice said:

PILOT crit only

so two-shotted

But two shots where you can't fire back. And maybe. What it means is your shields are meaningless you've got to live on your green dice alone. Corran definitely hurts.

Biggs, baby

he's always there when you need him

If they wanted someone other than rebels to shine for a while this and paratanni will do the trick. I am more concerned about the latter only because it is on tables and I don't see a counter yet.

9 hours ago, Embir82 said:

Only for those who like to fly swarms. Personally I hate to fly in formation, it looks unrealistically, and is tiresome. Also flying ships with no abilities is less fun than using aces. May I add swarm lists require barely any tinkering or list building which is huge minus for me.

I'll disagree that flying aces is more fun than ships with no abilities. I know enough people to say that there are those people that prefer to fly generics over high PS aces all the time.

Also....you don't have to fly many ships in a formation. I don't fly Tie Formations, but I do fly Tie Swarms....you know...where you actually swarm the enemy?

6 minutes ago, ficklegreendice said:

Biggs, baby

he's always there when you need him

Except for that one time where Wedge had to save Luke instead. . and we will never forget it.

1 minute ago, Viktus106 said:

Except for that one time where Wedge had to save Luke instead. . and we will never forget it.

blame the player for poor flying

Kylo is a lot less scary if you can land blocks on him. No action, no ISYTDS. Granted, the Dauntless title solves this, but it makes him more expensive.

Boba Fett can also serve as a strong counter. Kylo will likely be bound and determined to shut Boba down, so it allows the rest of your list to burn down RAC.

Yeah, it will change the meta, but I think that is good. We'll see less 2 ship builds, and I'm OK with that. There are multiple viable ways to counter him, so I'm not worried.

Meh, high AGI low HP ships have had their counters in the meta for a while now in bombs, ABT Ghosts, and other such auto damage. Not sad that a card is released that will be good against low AGI high HP ships. Not seeing much discussion of the Kylo pilot. I'm going to be trying him out with some EH. Can't decide if EH with IR or just an EU is better at making him more maneuverable.

When everyone in my group will start playing RAC with Kylo, i will bring back my old Chewbacca+Leebo list and play it until they stop. It's that easy.

2 hours ago, gamblertuba said:

Surprised that I have not seen "Draw Their Fire" discussed much or at all in these Kylo threads. A green squaddie with DtF and Determination as a wingman makes any ship absolutely immune to Kylo.

You really just need DtF. It allows the Greenie to suffer the uncancelled critical hit result. ISYTDS only triggers when the ship with the condition suffers a critical hit result.

Basically, if Kylo puts ISYTDS on Biggs, then the Greenie can suffer the critical damage and draws from the damage deck. If Kylo puts the condition on the ship with DtF, then just have Biggs should suffer the crit as normal.

39 minutes ago, player1480659 said:

Kylo is a lot less scary if you can land blocks on him. No action, no ISYTDS. Granted, the Dauntless title solves this, but it makes him more expensive.

Boba Fett can also serve as a strong counter. Kylo will likely be bound and determined to shut Boba down, so it allows the rest of your list to burn down RAC.

Yeah, it will change the meta, but I think that is good. We'll see less 2 ship builds, and I'm OK with that. There are multiple viable ways to counter him, so I'm not worried.

I think you're going to see some Dauntless.

1 hour ago, PhantomFO said:

You really just need DtF. It allows the Greenie to suffer the uncancelled critical hit result. ISYTDS only triggers when the ship with the condition suffers a critical hit result.

Basically, if Kylo puts ISYTDS on Biggs, then the Greenie can suffer the critical damage and draws from the damage deck. If Kylo puts the condition on the ship with DtF, then just have Biggs should suffer the crit as normal.

True. But then determination makes it pointless to use ISYTDS on the green squaddie. I'm imagining a green squad flying wingmate to Corran not Biggs. Biggs already has integrated astromech so I don't think he would make a great target for ISYTDS.

You know what? I am beginning to agree. This card is terrible game design. Not because it's OP or an NPE, its name is just too friggin long. Even the abbreviation is a pain in the butt.

Edit: extraneous apostrophe...

I don't think it shuts down Dengaroo as much as people think.

Blinded Pilot: (Pilot) You cannot perform attacks. After your next opportunity to attack (even if there was no target for an attack), flip this card facedown.

Dengar: Once per round after defending, if the attacker is inside your firing arc, you may perform an attack against that ship.

So technically, if RAC is in Dengar's arc when he deliver's this crit, Dengar just misses out on his return shot, but still gets his regular shot. If he's not in arc, but another ship attacks Dengar and is in arc, then he gets that shot if he missed his regular shot. So Kylo may force Dengar to fly a little differently, but I think BMST has done that pretty well too.

There are a lot of lists that will still work even with Kylo in the mix. And as others have stated, this could make 4 ship lists very viable in this meta as well. I don't believe it will be meta defining, but it may mean that people have to fly differently with their favorite lists. To make a Kylo RAC viable against swarm lists as well, I think you would need a combination of Dauntless and EU to get out of as many arcs as possible. But, RAC+Kylo+Gun+HSCP+Daunt+EU = 65 points. Even against two ship lists, the 0 agility of the decimator means you'll likely lose half points on it most games, so you are giving up 32 points MoV in tournaments to have this ship. Plus what wingman do you take at 35 points to give you the best chance of victory once the Decimator falls?

Bottom line, I think Kylo will shake up the meta, and we'll see him on some lists, but I don't think he will define a new meta.

As far as fun factor, I don't know about you, but if I got slammed with that condition, I would love having my other ships hit back in revenge. Revenge is fun for me, so I don't think the fun factor would necessarily be lost completely.

biggest thing v dengaroo is you have to hit dengar

and dengar doesn't give a goddamn about hotshot copilot. dude has infinite focus

1 hour ago, heychadwick said:

Also....you don't have to fly many ships in a formation. I don't fly Tie Formations, but I do fly Tie Swarms....you know...where you actually swarm the enemy?

THANK YOU! If nobody else said it, I was going to say it. When you don't fly in formation, you make it really hard for your opponent to figure out where all those little ships are going. Glorious!

8 minutes ago, gamblertuba said:

You know what? I am beginning to agree. This card is terrible game design. Not because it's OP or an NPE, it's name is just too friggin long. Even the abbreviation is a pain in the butt.

Kylo Ren does not approve of your insult.

9 minutes ago, Parakitor said:

THANK YOU! If nobody else said it, I was going to say it. When you don't fly in formation, you make it really hard for your opponent to figure out where all those little ships are going. Glorious!

I cringe when I hear about Howlrunner and a "Tie Swarm".

17 minutes ago, Raven19528 said:

I don't think it shuts down Dengaroo as much as people think.

Blinded Pilot: (Pilot) You cannot perform attacks. After your next opportunity to attack (even if there was no target for an attack), flip this card facedown.

Dengar: Once per round after defending, if the attacker is inside your firing arc, you may perform an attack against that ship.

So technically, if RAC is in Dengar's arc when he deliver's this crit, Dengar just misses out on his return shot, but still gets his regular shot. If he's not in arc, but another ship attacks Dengar and is in arc, then he gets that shot if he missed his regular shot. So Kylo may force Dengar to fly a little differently, but I think BMST has done that pretty well too.

I feel pretty much the same, especially vs. RAC without VI.

Also, Dengar is higher PS than non-VI RAC. This means RAC likely won't be able to Kylo first round (Dengar will be out of range 1-3 as he hasn't moved yet), so RAC can take as many as 3 Dengar attacks (round 1 shot possibly plasma torp, round 1 retaliation, round 2 shot) before it had the first chance to Kylo. Even then, vs 3 greens (Countermeasures) +infinite Focus (so HSCP does nothing)+ Lone Wolf it's not a given a crit goes though first time.

2 minutes ago, heychadwick said:

I cringe when I hear about Howlrunner and a "Tie Swarm".

I too cringe when I hear people discuss focus firing and offense modification. Rolling red dice with just a focus up (or nothing at all) feels great!

I honestly think Kylo is just going to make the rich richer rather than shake things up ala trip jumpmasters.

At first I thought Kylo was going to absolutely destroy my Kanan/Biggs thing that I have going on. But then I realized two things... 1) I might be able to make the list even better by adding DTF to Biggs (via R2D6 instead of R3A2), protecting Kanan from Kylo getting into range of Kanan but not of Biggs, but also to protect him a bit from alpha strikes, which an unlucky crit can ruin Kanan's day... But in general, Biggs provides Kanan 2, if not 3 rounds of protection from Kylo. In that time period, I probably have taken: Round 1, R2 shot + TLT (5 damage), Round 2, R1 shot out the back (5 damage), Round 3, R3 shot + TLT (6 damage), killing him off more than likely, even without Biggs taking a single shot (because he's blinded). And in the mean time, he's killed 27 points of mine, and I've killed 62 points of his... I think I like that match up! Bring on Kylo! (As long as you're protected by Biggs, which is really a bad game design choice as it reduces build variety).

I have to say, I am really excited to hear this much discussion over Kylo Ren. I haven't been so excited about an expansion pack since the Imperial Raider. I cannot wait to put Kylo on the table. Will I try the whole RAC+Ren crew thing? Maybe, I don't know (probably not). But I've already got 13 different squads saved in my squad builder utilizing the Upsilon-class Shuttle with First Order wingmen. It's going to be AMAZING!

I flew against Chiraneau loaded with Kylo last night. It can suck. I have the old damage deck so he hit me with injured pilot which in this specific match didn't hurt me to much because I had already blew his phantom off the map. I got hit twice with blinded pilot. I did end up winning the match but, it can suck to go against. Don't think he had the strongest list for this card. The only thing that was debated about the whole thing, and this is how we played it, was that your shield does not protect you according to the way the card reads. So instead of taking a shield off you basically take a crit to your hull. I am assuming this could be a problem for some in tournaments until it is clarified from FFG.

6 minutes ago, bamhvac said:

I flew against Chiraneau loaded with Kylo last night. It can suck. I have the old damage deck so he hit me with injured pilot which in this specific match didn't hurt me to much because I had already blew his phantom off the map. I got hit twice with blinded pilot. I did end up winning the match but, it can suck to go against. Don't think he had the strongest list for this card. The only thing that was debated about the whole thing, and this is how we played it, was that your shield does not protect you according to the way the card reads. So instead of taking a shield off you basically take a crit to your hull. I am assuming this could be a problem for some in tournaments until it is clarified from FFG.

Yeah, it's clear it goes under shields.

I'm not sure the sky is falling.

You must still be delivered a CRIT... And there's not such thing as a "good crit." So you play against Kylo just as you would any other dangerous ship, with excellent DIALS.

I flew (3) Crack/Snap Green-Sq AWINGS each with Prockets + Operations Specialist on Ahsoka TIE and Kylo's shuttle melted under 21 red dice in the opening exchange.

I think you need to re-familiarize yourself with Alpha Strikes.

20 minutes ago, bamhvac said:

I flew against Chiraneau loaded with Kylo last night. It can suck. I have the old damage deck so he hit me with injured pilot which in this specific match didn't hurt me to much because I had already blew his phantom off the map. I got hit twice with blinded pilot. I did end up winning the match but, it can suck to go against. Don't think he had the strongest list for this card. The only thing that was debated about the whole thing, and this is how we played it, was that your shield does not protect you according to the way the card reads. So instead of taking a shield off you basically take a crit to your hull. I am assuming this could be a problem for some in tournaments until it is clarified from FFG.

The card specifies that you are dealt the faceup damage card instead of suffering critical damage. It's the same language used for both Wampa and Proton Bombs, which similarly ignore shields.