Ok, within an encounter, it takes a manouvre to change a talent socketed to a career (or party) sheet.

There is an interesting phrase in the rules for party sheets that go something like this "a player can use a manouvre to change a talent on the party sheet with one of the available talents of the ACTIVE player"

it specifically uses the term active player rather than "that" player.

Does this then mean, that for instance, if the active player (let's call him Bob) uses an action card that grants an ally (let's call him Dave) a free manouvre (such a card, i think, exists), that Dave can use that manouvre to change a talent on the party sheet for one of Bob's talents? If the above sentence is to be taken literally, then the answer is yes, isn't it?

Could Dave also use that manouvre to change a talent on the party sheet for one of his own talents? Again, in RAW, i think yes.

How are other people letting talent exchange on the party sheet happen? Even with all the above said, i think i might only allow players to swap talents on the party sheet with one of their own talents, unless the above sentence is clarified in the FAQ at some point...

Does this then mean, that for instance, if the active player (let's call him Bob) uses an action card that grants an ally (let's call him Dave) a free manouvre (such a card, i think, exists), that Dave can use that manouvre to change a talent on the party sheet for one of Bob's talents? If the above sentence is to be taken literally, then the answer is yes, isn't it?

Yes. Technically, Dave can spend a maneuver and allow Bob to socket one of his (Bob's) talents to the party sheet.

Could Dave also use that manouvre to change a talent on the party sheet for one of his own talents? Again, in RAW, i think yes.

No, Dave is the not active player (Bob is). Since only the active player's talents can be socketed, only Bob's talents are options during Bob's turn.

dvang said:

Ah, but don't forget the rule on standard manoeuvres.

"As a manoeuvre, a character can replace one of his talents from the character sheet or from the party sheet with a different talent from the same category from his supply."

Therefore even though Dave isn't the active player, he can use his free manoeuvre any way he wants, and that includes replacing a talent on the party sheet with one from his supply.

pumpkin said:

The way I interpret it, Dave can't spend his maneuver until he becomes the active player.

I think this is being read into way too much. The folks that write rule books are (usually) not lawyers, and more importantly are (usually) human, and therefore make mistakes. When it is said that a player may spend a manoeuvre to swap out the party talent with another from the active player, I'm pretty sure "active player" was simply used as a pronoun, and was suposed to refer to the player that spent the manoeuvre. Especially since later rules specifically spell out that a player may use a manoeuvre to swap out the party talent with one from their own stock.

The only real way to tell is to ask the developers what they really wanted the rule to be, however as it has been said many many times in these forums, play it however you want, do whatever is the most fun for you or your group.

I understand that picking apart the specific language of the rule books can be a lot of fun, me and my friends have done this with many systems over the years, so if you want to discuss it for entertainment value, please do, just remeber, the book is written by someone, who is fallable, and the words aren't always as precise as you may like, and they may not always mean exaclty what they appear to be saying.

I agree with active player.

BCA said:

Yep, beside the rule aspect of that question, this is WFRP universe where GM decides things. That's different from the whole d20 universe (that i do play and respect though) where the rules can play against GM.

So I wouldn't get too lawyerish when reading this rulebook and would instead focus on the narrative aspect of this capacity... How this talent switch may be described in the story ?

Usually, as a GM, I demand Players to roleplay this capacity to share a talent through the party sheet.

I.E. : an observation talent shared means the PC watch over the whole party all time and roleplay it like that.

I.E. : a more-damage talent means the PC support the whole party's anger and will-to-win through fight.

Having tested it a couple of time, we all (GM & PCs) had a lot of fun while making these rules "live" in the story.

Sinister said:

You mean that Dave can't use his free manouvre until he becomes the active player?

Yer, that's an interesting interpretation I hadn't really thought about before.

Think I am still inclined to let Dave use his manoeuvre in Bob's turn (saves Dave having to remember he has got an extra free manoeuvre when his turn comes round), but I think I am going to limit Dave to exchanging the talent with one of his, rather than one of Bob's... that just keeps things simple.