The TIE Fighter has largely gone by the wayside in the current meta. Long a staple of Imperial lists for its blocking and jousting potential, the high defense in power lists has rendered it's 2-dice gun largely unimportant, while action-free dice modification has made its blocking ability less significant.

I think it is not an obsolete ship, however.

A lot of my Imperial squads recently could be broadly described as "weighted triple ace", basically one of the Imperial Pocket Aces (usually Omega Leader) and two more capable aces. I took a squad like this to Regionals this year, making top 8 with Rexlar Brath, Quickdraw, and Omega Leader. The general idea is that the small ace as a third ship lets the two bigger aces to be more capable and more effective at securing the win in the end game. Playing this squad archetype, however, opened up ideas about including 2 TIE Fighters in the pocket ace position. Some meta analysis makes me think they have something to offer.

Imperial Meta:

TIE Defenders, everywhere. Countess Ryad is the most significant TIE Defender threat, because she is the primary enabler of Vessery. However, her offense, and therefore the offense of the Ryad/Vessery combo, is very action dependent. With the x7 title encouraging a select number of moves, she is very blockable on the approach, denying the majority of her squad's action economy. TIE/x7 defense is largely action independent, but their offense is not, and a single Evade token is a poor defense agaisnt serious offense from 2 heavy aces and perhaps a close-range TIE Fighter.

PalpShuttle. TIE Fighters have their strongest attacking power agaisnt low AGI ships, such as a Lambda. They also move before the Lambda, taking away an important control tool in Lambda blocking, and reducing it's significant offense.

Decimator with Hotshot Copilot, Gunner, and/or Kylo. The Decimator is the most favorable defensive profile for TIE Fighter to attack. They do a lot of damage for their 24 points against 0 AGI. Furthermore, the Decimator will likely need both its shots to shut down an ace with Kylo, which leaves 3 ships (an ace and 2 TIE Fighters) to deal damage. You sort of get a 4-ship list on the cheap vs this kind of target.

Rebel Meta:

Miranda/generic K-bombers: Another good target for TIEs with her 1 AGI. More importantly, blockers shut down SLAM and action bombs, protecting your aces from one of its hardest counters.

Ghost: Like the Decimator, TIEs get cheap attack dice for their points. Ghosts don't hate blockers, but stopping that K-turn or blocking a Ghost onto a rock can be a game winning move.

Rey: Rey hates having her S-loops blocked, and the TIE Fighters can do meaningful damage out of arc.

Scum Meta:

Bossk+ something: TIE Fighters can engage Bossk and do good damage for the points while you keep the aces away. This opens up a lot of opportunities to engage in ways that don't result in the immediate loss of an ace to a giant Bossk Homing Missile.

Mindlink: Mindlink's resistance to blocking gives TIE Fighters limited utility agaisnt Mindlink lists, but they do offer valuable service for blocking Fenn Rau so he can boost to Range 1. Limiting his range control can be tremendously valuable. The guns will still contribute damage vs Manaroo and the third ship in the list.

Anyway, I'm sure I'm missing some weaknesses, and probably some strengths, but I think the humble TIE Fighter deserves consideration for players that can use the utility of a couple cheap blockers. Thanks for reading, and for any thoughts you may have.

I've been having similar thoughts about the PS1 TIE Striker. A pair of them (title only) cost the same as an Imperial Ace and can do some crazy things when it comes to blocking and setting up surprise kill boxes. They also add a pair of three attack guns to your squad. I think on average they end up being slightly less durable than a TIE Fighter (one more hull, one less agility).

5 minutes ago, WWHSD said:

I've been having similar thoughts about the PS1 TIE Striker. A pair of them (title only) cost the same as an Imperial Ace and can do some crazy things when it comes to blocking and setting up surprise kill boxes. They also add a pair of three attack guns to your squad. I think on average they end up being slightly less durable than a TIE Fighter (one more hull, one less agility).

Exactly my thoughts. Been playing around with Ryad, Inquisitor and 2 Imperial Trainees. The blocking is very good

TIE's are still best used in numbers unless you are only adding one to a list expressly as a blocker. They are still one of the best ships in the game.

35 minutes ago, WWHSD said:

I've been having similar thoughts about the PS1 TIE Striker. A pair of them (title only) cost the same as an Imperial Ace and can do some crazy things when it comes to blocking and setting up surprise kill boxes. They also add a pair of three attack guns to your squad. I think on average they end up being slightly less durable than a TIE Fighter (one more hull, one less agility).

Yeah, I haven't played Strikers much yet, but it could definitely play a similar role. You get some guns and blocking and still have plenty of points for some mainstays.

I used an Epsilon in my double xD Defender list and it basically shuts down Dengar's sloop. However, with the prevalence of attani mindlink lists and in particular manaroo, blocking someone to deny a focus is **** near useless in 1/4 of meta lists. The blocker will come back in wave 10 with the quadjumper because reducing agility is the "it" thing these days, but again, its scum, not imperial.

I've been tempted to try an Omega Sqd + Intimidation for19pts and that reduces agility. Now blocking mindlink lists have a purpose. Blocking defenders really have a purpose. Could also switch out an ace for two black sqd + intimidation for 32pts. Ive tried one in my squad but it gets gunned down quickly before any block attempt. Two may work, but 32pts for two blocking ties? meh.

Don't forget about Wampa. He is still a pain to deal with, especially paired with Palpatine. I have been running him with Kenkirk and Countdown.

19 minutes ago, shadowswalker said:

Don't forget about Wampa. He is still a pain to deal with, especially paired with Palpatine. I have been running him with Kenkirk and Countdown.

Even without Palp, Wampa attracts very outsized levels of attention. The more chances he has to roll dice, the more likely it is that he'll slip damage cards in under your shields. That, plus having only three hull and a single focus token, means he's usually targeted early. Unfortunately, three green dice and a focus token means it usually takes at least two attacks to bring him down.

All that, and he's only 14 points. He's the Imperial Biggs.

really wish we had Armada Mithel in X-wing

Armada Mithel doesn't **** around

A Place for TIE Fighters you say. Would that be Rebel or Imperial?

ive brought a naked Wampa in lists purely to do just that: draw attention. Even though he is virtually no threat, both for the flight path hes taking and its unlikely w/o palp around, he draws a TON of attention which lets my real powerhouses do work. PTL+Mk2+x7 Ryad is most vulnerable on the initial joust, after she gets behind you GL getting rid of her.

I like lists that give my opponent difficult decisions. I dont like pouring everything into 1 ship and hoping he evades the joust focus. For the longest time my favorite list was "The Deadly 7s" which composed of Mauler Mithel, Scourge, Omega Ace, and Maarek Steele (Backdraft once he came out). All PS7, hence the name. Do you go for the 2 TIEs because theyre the squishiest? Do you get rid of the automatic crit because he scares your high HP ship to death? Or do you go after the super evasive one that if you dont remove him first hes a royal pain later? Your move...creep.

Lot of the TIE fighters (both regular and /fo) are awesome distractions. Their abilities can be outright brutal but because of the platform theyre on theyre still "tame" in the end. If Mithel or Scourge was on a Defender oh holy crap that'd be broken lol. People generally dont use them because theyre not an "Ace" - WE HAVE MORE THAN ACE LISTS NOW!!! lol

If you're bringing TIE fighters, definitely bring Wampa like people are saying. I've always found Night Beast to be worth the points too.

I would argue that Deathfire with Concussion Missile, Cluster Mines, Long-Range Scanners at 25 points is solidly better than 2x Academy TIEs. I'm also experimenting with the PS2 TAP with Concussion Missile, chips, and title at 21 points. Imperial lists with 3 and 4 ships have a wide variety of options right now. Cheap munitions carriers bring the punch that TIE fighters just don't have right now.

One of the top 8 lists in our local regionals used exactly this idea:

41 Whisper w/ VI, FCS, Kallus, ACD.

35 Vessery w/ Juke, X7.

24 (2x) Academy.

The list was knocked out by triple swarm-leader defenders.

One of the problems I see with academies, and blockers in general, is the overall reduction of blocking as a viable strategy. It's still somewhat useful in a positioning sense, but there's so many ships nowadays that don't need actions and don't care if they bump. Also formation flying has become much less common, so you can no longer wreck your opponent's formation with a cleverly placed blocker.

Also Omega Leader is probably one of the best 26pts you'll ever spend, and can always act as a blocker to PS8+ stuff if you need her to.

16 minutes ago, CRCL said:

One of the top 8 lists in our local regionals used exactly this idea:

41 Whisper w/ VI, FCS, Kallus, ACD.

35 Vessery w/ Juke, X7.

24 (2x) Academy.

The list was knocked out by triple swarm-leader defenders.

One of the problems I see with academies, and blockers in general, is the overall reduction of blocking as a viable strategy. It's still somewhat useful in a positioning sense, but there's so many ships nowadays that don't need actions and don't care if they bump. Also formation flying has become much less common, so you can no longer wreck your opponent's formation with a cleverly placed blocker.

Also Omega Leader is probably one of the best 26pts you'll ever spend, and can always act as a blocker to PS8+ stuff if you need her to.

When you got cards like expertise, and pattern analyzer the bump meta no longer is a factor. FFG is trying to push high pilot skill high jousting for their meta which means swarms are pushed back further and further. Although I find it funny now most of the factions will have two choices for a 12-13 point cost ship.

2 hours ago, Marinealver said:

When you got cards like expertise, and pattern analyzer the bump meta no longer is a factor. FFG is trying to push high pilot skill high jousting for their meta which means swarms are pushed back further and further. Although I find it funny now most of the factions will have two choices for a 12-13 point cost ship.

Expertise only works on offense, and Pattern Analyzer doesn't do anything to mitigate blocking.

4 minutes ago, PhantomFO said:

Expertise only works on offense, and Pattern Analyzer doesn't do anything to mitigate blocking.

Yeah but bumping is it's own form of defence, especially if you can then PS-kill whatever you didn't bump (made easier with Predator and expertise). Nothing I like more than bumping a ship with Rey, then annihilating another ship at R1 with the Expertise + Finn + Rey combo.

It's been a slow erosion of blocking as a strategy. Each new wave has added cards that make it a less useful as a strategy. It started with Predator, but now we've got a large number of upgrades that reduce a ships reliance on actions: AdvSensors, Expertise, FCS, Mindlink, Palp, Manaroo, Glitterstim, etc.

3 hours ago, PhantomFO said:

Expertise only works on offense, and Pattern Analyzer doesn't do anything to mitigate blocking.

I'd argue that it works on defense as well as it lets you sit on your Focus/Evade, while not losing any offensive capabilities

I like a single Crackshot TIE as 15 point filler.

This is pretty much the entire reason that my imperial war machine list works..

Vader, Vessery, Alpha, Epsilon. - The alpha is not a tie fighter, but instead of a pocket ace - I get a spotter for vessery in case vader goes down, dual blockers, and the alpha can do some serious damage when ignored. Blocking is actually better now, even though there are some automods - there are still a lot of ships that don't like to be blocked for positional / escape reasons.

I agree that certain pilots have their place on the mat; but you have to be selective, and all of the other originals, are kinda mitigation specialist or fairly-capable filler ships.

When I read all the belly-aching about the poor T-65, I don't see an equal love for the other heart of our beloved game. I would think any boost to the T-65 should have an equal but different boost to the old-school TIE. I do love the roar of TIEs moving in on slashing, proton torpedo running X-Wings....

When the TIE goes obsolete it means stuff needs nerfing, not buffing. The TIE fighter was better than most of the stuff in the game and a lot of the ace packs were bringing stuff up to its level. Buffing the TIE means then needing to buff everything that was buffed to the TIE. Enter Fix Leapfrog.

.

13 minutes ago, player346259 said:

I would politely disagree with this statement. I have had a lot of success with mindlinked Manaroo/Contracted Scout/Fenn Rau list which is all about controlling opponents moves by blocking and then murdering them with Fenn.

I managed to win a small regional with this list.

Also there was a list with triple Mindlink bumpmaster scouts, which came 2nd in a (much larger) US regionals.

Even in my list with just 2 blockers you can pull of some serious amount of movement and action denial.

I had a couple games where opponents Asajj was blocked for literally 10 turns in a row, right until the end of the game.

Blocking is still good, even against Mindlink :-)

This is a good point. PS 1 blockers are also counter-blockers. They can clear space for your higher PS ships that would prefer on to be blocked.

4 hours ago, Blue Five said:

When the TIE goes obsolete it means stuff needs nerfing, not buffing. The TIE fighter was better than most of the stuff in the game and a lot of the ace packs were bringing stuff up to its level. Buffing the TIE means then needing to buff everything that was buffed to the TIE. Enter Fix Leapfrog.

Nerfing or buffing new stuff? Not a great chance of that happening, the creep is so on. Yeah, TIEs we're good and swarms we're great, but that's in history, many waves ago. It's all about synergies to improve older, classic, loved ships. No leap frog needed. I think there is a way to do this; bumps to squads that fly the same ship type would be a way to get squadrons of all factions on the mat. It might make purists a bit more happy to pew-pew and it might curtail the odd-ball, manipulated game controlling freighters just enough to expand what's possible. Chin up mate; it's not rocket-science.....it's little plastic-ship-science.

It's interesting how nobody ever makes posts about making the tie fighter great, yet the T-65 has a loyal fan following. The fact is, the designers feel that the tie fighter is the benchmark for this game. That is that they believe it's the best value, and that they design considerations for other ships often come from this as being the base.

As a player who is loyal to the Empire, I find that they're really only good as low PS blockers in this meta. Some will argue crackshot blacks, but I'm not convinced. Still, I find the low PS guys still well worth the points! Especially Wampa. He's the Imperial "Biggs" but costs way less.