15 hours ago, Tvayumat said:

What? This doesn't look fun to you? Look at all the tactical depth!

Wow, that would need a huuuuge table. And a few hours (months?) to play. Not to mention the second mortgage for the expansions and the massive card to read down to the cost of fielding that many units, and just thinking about painting them might finish you off.....

On 31/1/2017 at 10:36 AM, jonboyjon1990 said:

I'm not talking miniature scale, I'm talking the 'scale' of the battle; of the armies.

In the core set you get around 95 points worth of models, 4 units and around 25 figures per army.

Now double that and then make room for upgrade cards and you're at a full army, but you're still only at around 50 figures and 8 units MAX.

That's fine, but to me it doesn't give the sense of a full, epic, rank and file army vs army feel.

It still feels more like a skirmish game...

I played WFB for a decade and no thanks.

You can choose to propose 300-400 point battles with your friends but 200 points is perfect. It suites tournaments, it suites casual players and tactical players, it makes the game quite cheap. I remember those warhammer tournamentes with battles expiring in turn 2 or 3, endless miniature deployment... no thanks.

You can ALWAYS make the game bigger if your friends agree, you can play with less characters to field a lot more units.

Less is more, the simpler the better. There are dozens of wargames in which you have to expend lots of hours and lots of money. And there are wargames that are simple but not tactic. This game is not too complex, but it has deep tactics. That's all I ask

Just to clarify.
I think 200 pts is fine for now, given the limited model selection and everyone still learning the rules.
I'm perfectly happy with 200 pts.

But if they later decide to bump it up to 300 pts, I'll be perfectly happy with that too.

I see a lot of 200 pt lists being made that are around 5 units on the table.
Right now it's fun, but I *can* see that getting stale a year from now.

I believe the age of epic scale miniature games is more or less over. Small skirmish sized games seem to be far more popular (IE Guild ball, malifaux, Infinity, Batman etc). Many games still fall in between (warmachine, age of sigmar). Although the argument could be made that age of sigmar can be quite large depending on the faction (looking at you skaven). Still, it's evident that companies realize not many are interest in such large armies. Examples: Warmachine increasing the number of warjack points so armies can take more large models, and less units. Age of sigmar did the same thing more or less, making larger models, but less of them.

A lovely -albeit undead- sight if you ask me.

Nothing beats the sight of massive, shambling undead hordes.

That said; I cannot wait to play my fist game RMG coming Sunday!

(yes; my Warmaster undeads)

The issue here is it's 28mm. too much leaves absolutely no room for maneuverability, and intensive visual clutter.

I believe what you desire falls more in the 10-15mm range, like old Warmaster or the current Battle Valor Fantasy.

I greatly prefer ranks and file in the 15's, but that is a more common market for Europe, not the states. While I believe FFG take

everything into account, they need to stick with what is the default scale and # of minis in my observation.

Also, Runewars minis are designed to be fun and easy to paint - lots of ridges, plates, cloth ripples, exaggerated features, etc. I mean, I'm 20 minis in, in less than a week, and having a ball!

Infinity minis, by contrast, are a real fiddle (while being the most beautiful minis I've seen) and I've done less than 20 in a year! I can imagine smaller scale not being half as much fun on the hobby side of things...

On 19. 4. 2017 at 8:45 PM, Trafficman said:

Im sorry, but thats the first thing I thought of looking for, and was REALLY dissapointed with 200 points.

I just made a 200pt list.. it has 3 units, and 1 of those units is just a filler rune golem, which will either do nothing because its so slow, or get murdered quickly.

++ Standard Army (Daqan Lords : Wave 0 (2017)) [198 Points] ++

+ Infantry +

Spearmen [95 Points]: 3x3 Trays, Eagle-Banner Bearer, Front Line Rune Golem, Kari Wraithstalker, Shield Wall, Trumpets

Spearmen [86 Points]: 3x3 Trays, Citadel Weapons Master, Front Line Rune Golem, Raven-Pennon Bearer, Shield Wall, Trumpets

+ Siege +

Rune Golems [17 Points]: 1 Tray

++ Total: [198 Points] ++

I wouldnt even call this OP.. this is like standard stuff here. ... and thats all I need to field it. Please note that other than the upcoming special character box... I can simply buy another core set, and piecemeal the rest thru btown and ebay ... without buying anything else.

Now they want me to put THAT list on a 3'x6' table.. really FFG... really?

This list is going to be really weak against Carrion lancers, 4 single models and your only possible damage will be damage modifier on the dial. Two blight tokens on each of your stacks will nulify your dices and rest of waiqar army will eat your troops.

I'd just like to address the difference between scale and scope. "Scale" is the size of the minis. "Scope" is the size of the forces involved in the game. The OP is asking about the Scope of the game.

For the record, I'm happy with the Scale and Scope of the game.

5 hours ago, Shauni55 said:

I believe the age of epic scale miniature games is more or less over. Small skirmish sized games seem to be far more popular (IE Guild ball, malifaux, Infinity, Batman etc). Many games still fall in between (warmachine, age of sigmar). Although the argument could be made that age of sigmar can be quite large depending on the faction (looking at you skaven). Still, it's evident that companies realize not many are interest in such large armies. Examples: Warmachine increasing the number of warjack points so armies can take more large models, and less units. Age of sigmar did the same thing more or less, making larger models, but less of them.

There is more diversity in the sizes of games being played but predicting the end of epic miniature games may be a bit premature. WHFB has gone away, but KoW is going strong and so is 40k.

15 hours ago, eilif said:

There is more diversity in the sizes of games being played but predicting the end of epic miniature games may be a bit premature. WHFB has gone away, but KoW is going strong and so is 40k.

But 40k's also getting the AoS Treatment this year. Of course I can only speculate but I feel pretty safe saying that the number of models on the board will probably be lower with the new rules. Not to mention the new squad based games they're pumping out for 40k like Armageddon

18 hours ago, Yandril said:

This list is going to be really weak against Carrion lancers, 4 single models and your only possible damage will be damage modifier on the dial. Two blight tokens on each of your stacks will nulify your dices and rest of waiqar army will eat your troops.

I don't think that you'd even get that. If you take away all of the dice in the attack, there is no attack.

RRG 10.5:
"If a game effect removes dice from an attack such that
there are no dice to roll, the attack is canceled."

22 hours ago, Shrapnelsmile said:

The issue here is it's 28mm. too much leaves absolutely no room for maneuverability, and intensive visual clutter.

I believe what you desire falls more in the 10-15mm range, like old Warmaster or the current Battle Valor Fantasy.

I greatly prefer ranks and file in the 15's, but that is a more common market for Europe, not the states. While I believe FFG take

everything into account, they need to stick with what is the default scale and # of minis in my observation.

Intellectually I completely agree with you. 10-15mm is a great size for figures you can actually see but affordable and quick enough to make large battles easily doable. I sometimes do mech battles in 10mm (using rebasied Mechwarrior clix figs) and it's alot of fun and very easy. Many folks who read the KoW rules comment that it reads like a ruleset intended for 15mm figs. Unlike Runewars, where the relatively low number of figs and casualty removal works best for 28mm, there's nothing about KoW that wouldn't go easier in 15mm.

However, tradition, nostalgia and my heart say 28mm forever! Part of it is that I'm already incredibly invested in 28mm figures and terrain and I've got the ability to setup a 7x6 table at home. Alot of it, is just that I love the look and character of 28mm. I know even with a big table, the number of figs and size of table is probably not accurate, and there's certainly alot more time spent painting (something I don't even like that much) but I don't care. I just love the look of a table filled with 28mm figs.