I played a game where I was facing a tie fo shooting at my falcon. We were almost side to side and the range ruler from closest point of the fo to closest point of the falcon was range 2 but if you measured from his firing arc it hits the falcon at range 3. Which range do you use when firing regular shots? Does the falcon get the range 3 bonus?

Anything that has an Arc has the range in arc measured (so in your case the Falcon would get the Range 3 bonus) the falcon however would get to shoot back at range 2 if that is the closest point due to the primary weapon turret.

7 minutes ago, taulover55 said:

Anything that has an Arc has the range in arc measured (so in your case the Falcon would get the Range 3 bonus) the falcon however would get to shoot back at range 2 if that is the closest point due to the primary weapon turret.

Not quite accurate, given that everything has an arc except the GR75

For an attack that can only be performed in arc, such as that of the /fo, you measure the range to the closest point in arc, from the closest point in arc - i.e., along the line of the edge of the arc.

For an attack that can be performed out of arc, you measure the closest point on the plastic base, to the closest point on the plastic base.

If the bases are 100% parallel and aligned with each other, the attacker chooses a parallel line to call the closest point to closest point measurement, for the purposes of checking to see if the attack is obstructed.

As noted when a range needs to be "in arc" then you measure in arc. That would be the primary weapon attack on most ships unless they specifically allow targeting outside the arc like the PWT.

While the attack range may be need to be taken "in arc" there may be other factors in play that just look at what I'll call absolute range which would always be the closest points/shortest distance between the two ships.

Looking at the original post I almost wonder how it is possible to have a Falcon and TIE "side by side" with the TIE having the Falcon in arc at R3. If they are R2 apart I just don't see the firing arc as being that wide. Then again maybe side by side should be "parallel courses" which could put the Falcon far enough ahead of the TIE that it's arc catches the back of the Falcon while the front is at R2.

Yes, logically, if a target ship is in weapon arc, the nearest part of the shooter's base is in that arc, usually a corner.

3 hours ago, Herkybird said:

Yes, logically, if a target ship is in weapon arc, the nearest part of the shooter's base is in that arc, usually a corner.

Not really.

The shortest distance between two ships is usually corner to corner unless one is directly in front/back of or beside the other ship. In cases where ship range is shorter than the attack range the range is rarely going going to be from the the to the corner of the target ship.

12 hours ago, Herkybird said:

Yes, logically, if a target ship is in weapon arc, the nearest part of the shooter's base is in that arc, usually a corner.

That's just not correct, sorry.

Indeed. There are examples of exactly this sort of thing in the FAQ, range in arc section, demonstrating how an attack can be made at range 1 with a PWT, but the target can still be in arc at range 2 to block AUtothrusters from working, or allow Tactician to trigger.

1 hour ago, debiler said:

That's just not correct, sorry.

I do not understand... please look at this image and you will see where my statement comes from... The Y-Wing arc of fire and the targets arc of fire.

1 hour ago, Herkybird said:

I do not understand... please look at this image and you will see where my statement comes from... The Y-Wing arc of fire and the targets arc of fire.

...

In your example both ships are completely within the other's firing arc. Attack range and real range would be the exact same thing and in those cases you likely are measuring from the corner of at least one ship.

1 hour ago, StevenO said:

In your example both ships are completely within the other's firing arc. Attack range and real range would be the exact same thing and in those cases you likely are measuring from the corner of at least one ship.

That is the only example necessary. In my original statement, to paraphrase, I said the target of the attack had to be in the shooters firing arc, and that obviously, the nearest part of the targets base is measured from this arc, which determines the range band of the shot.

I may not have been very clear in my original statement?

8 minutes ago, Herkybird said:

That is the only example necessary. In my original statement, to paraphrase, I said the target of the attack had to be in the shooters firing arc, and that obviously, the nearest part of the targets base is measured from this arc, which determines the range band of the shot.

I may not have been very clear in my original statement?

Here's the distinction that people are making:

A ship is "in arc" if any part of its base is inside the firing arc. In the case where the defender's entire base is in arc, yes, the shortest distance is going to be corner to corner (unless the base sides are exactly parallel). But if the closest corner of the defending ship is not in arc but part of the defender's base is in arc, the entire defending ship is considered "in arc". However, you don't measure the attack range in this case corner to corner unless the attack isn't limited by firing arc. So you have a situation where the range between the two ships, measured corner to corner, can be shorter than the range of the attack.

See the "Inside Firing Arc at Range X" diagram on page 5 of the 4.2.3 FAQ for a couple examples of this.

If you already knew all this and have all along been trying to talk exclusively about defenders that are completely within the attacker's firing arc, then, yeah. You were unclear.

2 hours ago, Herkybird said:

That is the only example necessary. In my original statement, to paraphrase, I said the target of the attack had to be in the shooters firing arc, and that obviously, the nearest part of the targets base is measured from this arc, which determines the range band of the shot.

I may not have been very clear in my original statement?

You may not be very clear in your original statement but even what you have here is sometimes wrong.

IF a ship attacking has the attack restricted to the arc then the attack range is measured within that arc. Sometimes the closest part of the target in arc is NOT a corner of the target. Sometimes your arc doesn't matter one bit when it comes to determining attack range. I guess we could go back to the original.

19 hours ago, Herkybird said:

Yes, logically, if a target ship is in weapon arc, the nearest part of the shooter's base is in that arc, usually a corner.

If a targeted ship is entirely in the attacker's firing arc normally that closest point is measured to a corner of the target. I'll agree with that. The problem is that the thread topic was concerning those times when ship range and attack range are NOT the same thing; in those cases it is extremely UNLIKELY that the closest attack range will go to a corner of the target as the nearest corner would be out of arc to cause that difference.