Hi,

I'm thinking about starting getting some star wars rpg boxes. While the FFG product pages say that you can combine Edge of the Empire, Force and Destiny and Age of Rebellion. But I'm wondering how much of the core rulebooks are the same? I do not feel like buying three different core books priced at $60 if 90% of the content is the same.

Same question for the GM kits, are they similar between the different games?

Could you buy the Edge of the Empire core book, and then use expansions from all the other games to flesh out their respective themes?

My feeling, just from reading at FFGs website is that an adventure in a similar style as Star Wars IV-VI feels like it would "need" all the different games. Edge of the Empire (Han Solo, seedy space bars, smuggling, etc.), Force and Destiny (Obi Wan, Joda, Luke becoming a Jedi) and Age of Rebellion (Leia, Hoth, rebel attacks on the Empire).

EDIT: Or are the games better played separately? Would a combat character from the Edge of the Empire feel boring compared to a Jedi, or is the power lever of player characters balanced between the different games?

Thanks in advance!

I once crunched the numbers for page counts between the three systems, how much information was duplicated and how much was new. Mind you, this is a rough estimate, but it's about 60% new material, 40% reprint - mostly game mechanics, combat, space combat and How To Run A Game sections. Meanwhile races, careers, gear (mostly), planets, history and the canned game were all new.

That said, if I was only getting one core book, I'd probably go Edge, then Age, then Jedi.

I think, as far as buying one book and selecting supplements from all the ranges, you would get less out of the Jedi line than the other two. Once you start getting into the Force, you kind of need that core mechanic to make all the other bits in the supplements useful.

Angry Penguin tells all!! I really wish that FFG had done a Core Mechanics Book then released the three Core as Primary Source.... they do look kinda cool on the shelf though

Unless the GM hosts at their house, it's a lot of weight to transport if you mix the three settings. A compromise is if you mix settings and it's not at the GM's house, the GM and each player brings a different Core and splatbooks if needed

All the books work well together and are balanced well to be integrated.

If you feel that your players would be interested in force users then F&D should be your start point. If not start with Edge it is the best for an all round game, with AoR being good for a military game.

You do not need all the core books & I would only get one beginners box. You will probably end up getting all 3 cores in the end though.

From what I've seen, only Force and Destiny careers have no repeated specializations, and have new Force powers in each supplement. Some of the specializations don't need to grab Force Talents and still work thematically (like Racer). About half a dozen specializations have been repeated across Edge and Age, but characters like Pilots and Heavies seem like they'd be over-represented in the galaxy anyway.

You do not need all the core books & I would only get one beginners box. You will probably end up getting all 3 cores in the end though.

I have all the beginner boxes, and they're all worth in IMHO. With the PDF followup adventure download they're all pretty long, several sessions-worth of material. And if nothing else, you get dice which you don't have to buy separately. My favourite out of the box is the EotE beginner box, but I found the AoR followup adventure to be better.

But the main reason to get a beginner box is: this game takes some adjustment. If you've run other games (something like D&D being the most likely), then you have to "unlearn what you have learned" and figure out how to handle the narrative results. In D&D most uses of the dice give you a simple pass/fail result. With this game you get degrees of pass/fail, plus an additional narrative axis that allows the player to inject elements into the story. The beginner boxes do a good job of shepherding you through that process.

The game master's screens all have their worth, not so much for the shield as the other bits: each has their own adventure, and custom rules. The AoR GM screen has squad rules, and I believe the F&D screen has lightsaber construction rules. That said, I haven't made too much use of the squad rules or the lightsaber construction rules, so YMMV.

As for which core: pick a theme to run your first campaign based on what your group is most likely to enjoy. Then, make the campaign a short one, maybe only plan to run it up to 200 XP. After that you'll have a solid understanding of the rules, the players will understand better how the talents interact with the skill and combat systems, and you'll be in a better position to decide whether you need all the core books or not. Just MHO but I think the easiest way to start is with EotE, and maybe try to get at least one player to be Force Sensitive. This will let you dabble in all the mechanics, but in a way that won't be overwhelming.

If you plan on creating your own game, ask yourself the basic theme you want to be running. That will likely point you towards an appropriate CRB.

If you want to stick with published material, ask yourself and your PCs the kind of characters they want and what they want to do, that will point you towards what adventures and CRB you want.

You can supplement as you progress at that point.

Here's a qualifying question to consider; how experienced a GM are you?

If you are good at creating stories and adapting plots to the PC's then you may not even need the beginner boxes. However, if you're just starting this hobby, then definitely start with one of the beginner boxes (based on what type of Star Wars campaign your players are interested in).

But ultimately, the answer to this question is going to depend on what your particular group wants.

If your group is going to have strong Force sensitives, then you'll need Force and Destiny (FnD).

If the group is wanting to jump into the epic conflict between the Rebels and the Empire, then start just with the Age of Rebellion (AoR) core book.

And if the group would love to try to make a living plying the spacelanes in the midst of an intergalactic war, then start with Edge of the Empire (EotE).

And yeah, at between $30 - $70 per book, I understand the hesitation to put that much money down on three rule books.

To answer the core question, the core rules are the same. I consider all Three books (EotE, AoR, & FnD) to be a triumvirate of the one Star Wars Role Playing Game.

On first glance, there appears to be a lot of duplication between the three core rulebooks.

But on further investigation, you find out that while you might see a lot of the same species, or weapons, or armor, or ships, or other equipment, where they differ is in the flavor that is highlighted. Mechanically, the species or weapon or armor or whatever may be the same, but they will be presented differently, with different explanations, different fluff text, and feel very different.

So, if you’re really good at taking a single object and then describing it in a variety of ways to make it seem like it’s a dozen different things to different people, then you might not want/need all three books.

On that note, I have to ask you the question — what is an Elephant like? Is it like a tree? Is it like a rope? Is it like a snake?

EDIT: Or are the games better played separately? Would a combat character from the Edge of the Empire feel boring compared to a Jedi, or is the power lever of player characters balanced between the different games?

I have had zero issue with having non-Jedi being over powered or overshadowed by Jedi. Our current game has three Jedi and an engineer. And sure, the Jedi can lift heavy things with their minds and crush stormtroopers with said heavy things - but lets see them pull a non-stop pile of stuff out of their pockets with the Utility Belt talent, jury rig a Magnetic Shield to prevent a hanger bay full of hostages from venting to space with the Creative Invention Signature Ability or point out that a Dark Jedi's lightsaber hasn't had proper maintenance done to it in years and is about to fail with Bad Motivator.

We're well over 500 points and I am in no way a sidekick to the others. And you'll find that my experience with the engine is what other people are seeing too.

EDIT: Or are the games better played separately? Would a combat character from the Edge of the Empire feel boring compared to a Jedi, or is the power lever of player characters balanced between the different games?

I have had zero issue with having non-Jedi being over powered or overshadowed by Jedi. Our current game has three Jedi and an engineer. And sure, the Jedi can lift heavy things with their minds and crush stormtroopers with said heavy things - but lets see them pull a non-stop pile of stuff out of their pockets with the Utility Belt talent, jury rig a Magnetic Shield to prevent a hanger bay full of hostages from venting to space with the Creative Invention Signature Ability or point out that a Dark Jedi's lightsaber hasn't had proper maintenance done to it in years and is about to fail with Bad Motivator.

We're well over 500 points and I am in no way a sidekick to the others. And you'll find that my experience with the engine is what other people are seeing too.

500? Bah! We're* over 1,000! Puny mortal...

*well, the characters in the game I GM are.

Desslok's correct many times over and I wouldn't worry about cross-book balance. The game just works and works well.

HE'S OVER NINE ONE THOUSAAAAAAAND!

Thanks for all the informative answers. I'll try and adress some questions you all had to me.

I've been a GM and played a lot of different roleplaying games for a long time (15+ years). Warhammer fantasy roleplay 3ed from FFG which has similar narrative dice is a favourite of mine and the dice system in WFRP3ed is actually the main reason I'm looking to get Star Wars. The adventures and dice in the beginners boxes sounds interesting though, it could be a good way to start a gaming group. Are there only pre-gen characters in the beginner boxes, or can the players create their own?

Good to hear that the balance between the games is solid! Some games I've played has had expansions that made previous careers/classes obsolete, which is kind of boring for the players.

Sounds like EotE is a good way to start, but I noted that The Force Awakens Beginner Game has no follow up rpg. In the description it seems to have a broader approach than the other beginner boxes?

The beginner games are nice, they have the pre gen characters and some diverse enemy stats (I do remember reading that they are not the same stats as in the core books) as well as great little adventures. They do not however have rules for character creation so if you wanna whip up some characters you'll need the core books as the various chapters on species, career, and gear will make up most of your characters statistics.

I have both edge and age and the two books can mingle together fine, a few notable variations are things like duty (AoR) and obligation (EotE) they are actually very similar mechanics but vary in theme. Other major differences will be obviously careers (lots of scoundrels in edge and lots of soldiers in age) and vehicle and NPC stats (lots of freighters in edge and lots of fighters in age)

As far as I know they are pretty interchangeable, for instance you could start a campaign in Edge of the empire and if one of your players was hell bent on being an ace pilot he could just use the material from the AoR core or source material for his characters race, career and specializations no problem.. He or she could even still purchase specializations from the Edge of the Empire book but at the standard increased cost for non-career stuff.

Force and destiny is one that I havent dug into but from what I understand is a bit more stand alone in regards to content. Lots of stuff in that one that Isnt found in the other two for sure, and its important to note that there arent any Jedi characters in Age or Edge, only ''force sensitive'' characters, so if one of your players wants to be a jedi you may have to spring for FaD.

A lot of each book is game play mechanics and character creation, though not word for word most of the time, youll find much of the info to be the same until you start getting into races, skills, careers, and talents/specializations.

Just to update you all, I just ordered the Edge of the Empire beginners box. I'm hoping it will be a good introduction, so I can find an interested group of players before buying "everything". Then I'll probably buy some extra dice and a core book. As a WFRP3ed player, I have a feeling you need a lot of dice for this game. How many sets is needed for the game to run smoothly?

Regarding space ships, some players I know love to focus on space travel, trading, smuggling and moving from port to port. So how does EotE (or any of the other Star Wars games for that matter) handle a crew of players? Such as a pilot, mechanic, gunner(s), etc. Is space travel something that can be made interesting for the whole group, or is it mainly the pilot who will do the flying?
I'm thinking that EotE would be a game well suited for adventures similar to the episodes of the Firefly series, would the rules (in the core book) support such an adventure group where the ship is central, and almost a character in itself?

Thanks for all the replies so far!

50 minutes ago, k7e9 said:

Just to update you all, I just ordered the Edge of the Empire beginners box. I'm hoping it will be a good introduction, so I can find an interested group of players before buying "everything". Then I'll probably buy some extra dice and a core book. As a WFRP3ed player, I have a feeling you need a lot of dice for this game. How many sets is needed for the game to run smoothly?

Regarding space ships, some players I know love to focus on space travel, trading, smuggling and moving from port to port. So how does EotE (or any of the other Star Wars games for that matter) handle a crew of players? Such as a pilot, mechanic, gunner(s), etc. Is space travel something that can be made interesting for the whole group, or is it mainly the pilot who will do the flying?
I'm thinking that EotE would be a game well suited for adventures similar to the episodes of the Firefly series, would the rules (in the core book) support such an adventure group where the ship is central, and almost a character in itself?

Thanks for all the replies so far!

You'll love it I'm sure, the EotE beginner is what got me hooked, and you'll find the forums to be a treasure trove of knowledge if you run into snags.. There is a youtuber by the name of Runeslinger. I highly recommend his Star Wars RPG vids. He does a masterful job of explaining things and covers nearly every topic you can think of.. just find his videos and start from the beginning.

Space travel can be as exciting or mundane as you make it. In the fortunate event that everything on board the ship is working and the crew are healthy and happy then you may not narrate that flight at all. However, that's rarely the case in star wars.. on board a ship like an old YT1300 theres bound to be heaps to do for all the players and if there isn't... a sudden crash of the life support systems would spring those characters to action for sure, or perhaps that nav beacon actually turned out to be a hijackers disguised ship.. Lets the dice help tell the story and even as the GM you may be surprised from time to time.

As far as how many sets.. In my opinion three are needed. I have somehow ended up with 7 lol, and I still havent grabbed the AoR beginner game so itll soon be 8. There is an official Dice roller for this by FFG and its great (I tend to prefer physical dice myself but its nice to have when I am brainstorming someplace and wanna test the results of a would be action) and its only 5 bucks I think.

best of luck and welcome!

As for how many dice sets you need, I'd recommend two to start. (Yes, you can get by with just one, but two is more comfortable).

And as Mfluder pointed out, you should quickly top out at three sets.

The dice app can be fun and its cost effective, but I like the feel of the physical dice in the hand. Most of our group is migrating to using physical dice as it's easier to read and interpret (than the dice app).

Yes, I know the dice app calculates everything up for you, but for new players, the question we always got was, "What does this even mean?" With the dice, its easier for multiple people to check out the results and sort through the symbols together.

And I"m up to five sets of the SW RPG dice sets and two of the other players have one set apiece.

On 1/23/2017 at 1:01 PM, Desslok said:

HE'S OVER NINE ONE THOUSAAAAAAAND!

I love it!

As far as dice go, I'd say it depends on how many players you have. It also depends on how much of a hoarder you are. I hope to get enough to fill a kiddy pool and roll around as I enjoy all those colors and shapes! Seriously, the dice are brilliantly designed and it's a pleasure to use them. They call to the kid in me with all those colors and shapes and nifty symbols.

Don't judge me.

I highly recommend getting the force awakens beginner box, as that galaxy map included in it is very handy to have, plus additional dice and an adventure which you surely can adapt to something.

9 hours ago, k7e9 said:

Warhammer fantasy roleplay 3ed from FFG which has similar narrative dice is a favourite of mine and the dice system in WFRP3ed is actually the main reason I'm looking to get Star Wars. The adventures and dice in the beginners boxes sounds interesting though, it could be a good way to start a gaming group. Are there only pre-gen characters in the beginner boxes, or can the players create their own?

You shouldn't have a problem making the transition, EotE is a simplification of WFRP3, which is a good thing. You can make do with 1 set of dice, but 3 is optimal. I would also run the first session with the pregens, to let everybody get a feel for the rules. Chargen can be complicated, and you don't want to have people making decisions they don't know anything about. Both EotE and AoR beginner boxes have a natural transition point at the end of the adventure in the box, where you can easily pull in new characters and phase out the old ones. I will say, my players were so enamoured with the EotE pregens they kept them One thing to note about the pregens is they spend almost all their initial XP on their characteristics, and most people find this an optimal strategy.

Space combat is a learning experience. There is definitely room for everybody to be doing something, but it's up to the GM to structure the encounter accordingly (just like any other). The pilot and gunners are no-brainers, but techies can "jam transmissions" and hack into the enemy ships, while leaders can provide fire control benefits and sweet-talk customs agents. One caveat is that space combat can be lethal, at least in terms of rendering the ship powerless and adrift, so be prepared for activities like boarding and in-flight mechanical fixes. The rules don't really catalogue all the possibilities, so you have to be inventive. So I'd start out slow with space combat, make sure you have a handle on the rules before diving deep.

Don't be intimidated by space combat. I think the main reason people are hesitant to dive into it is that many RPGs strongly delineate between personal and vehicular combat. There are differences in this game, to be sure, however it's been designed to cleave to the base strenghths of the system. To me, it's a beautiful animal that once interacted with, gives a richer SW experience.

Comparing the pre-generated characters to ones that are created through the normal character generation system, there’s not a whole lot of difference. There are a few simplifications that are made, but there have been plenty of players that have been happy to take the pre-gens they started with and continue the campaign using those same characters.

With regards to space combat in Star Wars, it depends on the type of ship you’re on and what kind of equipment it has. On some ships, there may not be a whole lot for anyone to do who isn’t the pilot, and the pilot might be overloaded. On other ships, there may be plenty of spots where PCs can do useful things, and you might even need to fill in with some NPC crew members.

For the most part, ship combat works a lot like personal combat, with a few important differences. But I believe that the best way to handle most ship combat and keep it interesting for everyone is to use the chase rules. One group is chasing the other through an asteroid belt until the group being chased can make the calculations to make the jump to hyperspace, or they’re being chased through a battle as they try to make it to the capital ship where an important person has been captured and is being held prisoner, or whatever. If you run ship combat as one set of ships on one side that are firing at another set of ships on the other side, it will be brutal and short and whoever shoots first is likely to win.

Regarding dice, in WFRP 3ed I probably have 10+ dice sets to make the game work smoothly for 4 players + me as a GM. Sounds like I need a lot less dice for Star Wars.
The Force Awakens sounds nice, maps are nice in any RPG and a good galaxy map is probably a must have for a space-travel oriented game.

10 minutes ago, k7e9 said:

Regarding dice, in WFRP 3ed I probably have 10+ dice sets to make the game work smoothly for 4 players + me as a GM. Sounds like I need a lot less dice for Star Wars.
The Force Awakens sounds nice, maps are nice in any RPG and a good galaxy map is probably a must have for a space-travel oriented game.

A single dice set comes with a lot.. Until you need to roll an agility check of 4 dice.. Or until you need to upgrade that die pool with 3 proficiency die. Really from that perspective you only need two sets as players should never be rolling more than 6 green dice anyways. The problem is that the sets only come with one red challenge die so upgrading difficulties or dealing with opposed checks becomes tricky with only one set.. Granted there are rules for upgrading and downgrading more dice than you have or you could simply re-roll but that's no fun lol. we want fist-fulls of dice flying The only reason I don't say 4 sets is because if you are throwing 4 red die at a player you either are aiming for their failure or they are seasoned characters who's players likely have their own dice. and you can never have too many boost and setback dice though I think after a certain number the math of a roll gets out of hand with regards to probability.

2 hours ago, mfluder said:

A single dice set comes with a lot.. Until you need to roll an agility check of 4 dice.. Or until you need to upgrade that die pool with 3 proficiency die. Really from that perspective you only need two sets as players should never be rolling more than 6 green dice anyways. The problem is that the sets only come with one red challenge die so upgrading difficulties or dealing with opposed checks becomes tricky with only one set.. Granted there are rules for upgrading and downgrading more dice than you have or you could simply re-roll but that's no fun lol. we want fist-fulls of dice flying The only reason I don't say 4 sets is because if you are throwing 4 red die at a player you either are aiming for their failure or they are seasoned characters who's players likely have their own dice. and you can never have too many boost and setback dice though I think after a certain number the math of a roll gets out of hand with regards to probability.

That sounds similar to WFRP3ed dice packs where you only get 1 challenge die (purple in WFRP) per pack and difficulties could go up to 4-5 purple dice, but the Warhammer the start box contained about 4-5 dice packs in total. So there you had a good starting dice pool right out of the box.

If I get a regular group together I'll probably aim at getting about 4 dice packs to start with. The beginner boxes seems like a good way to do it as they contain both dice and a lot of other fun stuff, such as adventures. So after some consideration I'll probaby start by getting all the four beginner boxes, and get a feel for each game through the included adventures. Then I'll see which game I'll start collecting first.

Fist-fulls of dice should definitly be flying around the table.