they are one of my favorite units, but i haven't been playing them much recently. so many good new toys to play with. in theory they would be good, but the auto surge block really hurts.

I haven't run a battle, but at a cursory glance Vader vs Jedi Luke is probably in favour of Vader. I think that yes, with the two attacks, and Pierce 3, Luke can hit well, however, Vader rolls 2 Black dice for defence and two Reds for Attack (plus a yellow to add some colour). Before we even get to special abilities and command cards. How many Force Chokes on Luke before he gets there?

On a map or in a cage, Vader vs Jedi Luke would be a good battle. Two forces led by these guys would be great to see.

That would be interesting to see. Vader and his 4 move vs. Luke and his 4x2. Since they both move 8, neither can really run from the other without command cards. Luke can hit Vader and run 8 away, but then if Vader DOESN'T have init, Vader moves 8 right up next to Luke, gets passed the init token, and saber swing force choke. Luke can swing twice, then init token passes to Luke, ... I think he has to swing twice. If he doesn't, the above just repeats. If he swings twice, he can only move 4 away, then Vader moves up 4 and saber swings, init token passes to Vader, he saber swings and force chokes....

Basically depends entirely on command cards and how often Luke dodges compared to how often Vader can throw the double triple block.

If he doesn't Dodge, Luke can only take two of Vader's hits and a Force Choke. Vader can take 3-4 hits from Luke. It might boil down to who gets initiative/the first strike.

Luke stays away at least 6 spaces and around a corner till Vader has Ini. Then he double moves and attacks Vader. Ini passes to Luke, he attacks and double moves away at least 6 spaces and around a corner. That way, he should keep unharmed and kill Vader some rounds later.

Luke's mobility has to give him the edge in this one I think

6 hours ago, DerBaer said:

Luke stays away at least 6 spaces and around a corner till Vader has Ini. Then he double moves and attacks Vader. Ini passes to Luke, he attacks and double moves away at least 6 spaces and around a corner. That way, he should keep unharmed and kill Vader some rounds later.

Well that works until Vader decides he doesn't want to play that game. What if Vader backs up to range 11? Or goes for an Objective? Or drops Urgency/ForceRush/Jump Jets and Fleet Footed? Or moves 4 and uses Force Lightning to stun Luke? You run up hit Vader and Vader takes Init? Focus?

And of course, everything that Vader can do, Luke can do as well. Well, except Deadly Precision. And Force Lightning. At least Lord of the Sith doesn't help, nor does Lure of the Dark Side, two of Vader's best cards.

There are all sorts of things that could vary that fight. However, yes I'd probably still give that fight to Luke, who merely needs to run around until Son of Skywalker is drawn.

Wouldn't 0-0-0 will solve the problem with luke? You can just 1 shot luke by playing maximum firepower, rolling max damage for 9 damage, play heightened reflexes, and finish him off with assassinate.

1 hour ago, SummonMoreZiggurats said:

Wouldn't 0-0-0 will solve the problem with luke? You can just 1 shot luke by playing maximum firepower, rolling max damage for 9 damage, play heightened reflexes, and finish him off with assassinate.

BT-1, but yes, I have also thought of that combination. Looks fun on paper, but the odds of rolling max damage are slim.

DT and I played a game on Vassal where he alpha striked with Jedi Luke & Son of Skywalker in round one (thanks to R2 using Devotion in the deployment zone). Between my eWeequays, Onar and Shyla, Luke was gone by the end of round two. DT did a masterful job w/ his eRangers to win the game, but I didn't feel like the damage Jedi Luke did to me was too overwhelming.

I think the main point is not being able to respond. I think whether it's Luke and SOS, Bantha with Jundland/Ferocity or even a Squad Swarm/ Call of Vanguard / Strength in Numbers combo on Dewbacks plus Take Initiative you get in situations were three attacks in a row just wreck any list and makes it super hard, if not impossible, to come back from. Meanwhile you can't do anything.

That in my opinion is a bad game, especially if the tools are in place round 1. Sure you can play with spies or not bunch up against Bantha, but when is it really that fun to be on receiving end?

On 2/13/2017 at 5:28 PM, draco193 said:

Has anyone seen good use of eISB agents against Luke? They have deadly, and if well positioned you could get 3 attacks in an activation against him.

I tried and the +1 evade on top of the Dodge makes it harder to use Deadly.

52 minutes ago, Tvboy said:

I tried and the +1 evade on top of the Dodge makes it harder to use Deadly.

Yeah, my strategy against Jedi Luke has been pure-damage dice (red/green). You'll notice figures that relies on surge (esp. eStorm) will have difficult time to even dent Jedi Luke's armor

He goes down fast with eWeequay or ePigs though, and it's not uncommon to do ~4dmg/hit with them