This is the third thread in 2 weeks you kids have shouted down into a multi-page argument. Feel free to continue, I'll continue to contribute. Bunch of conversationalist fascists. Next time it does come up (and it will), be adults and jjjust let it be discussed. I keep asking and it keeps getting ignored: What's the harm in that?

Oh I don't know, at what point will you come up with another degrading insult to label all the people who won't agree with you?

Dude, tbh, while I agree the community comes off as dicks half the time (seriously, you have no idea how much I'm on your side there), you don't really get to walk out of here with the moral high ground after all that. Heh.

Dude, You don't see the problem! I said bring the evidence and your response has been "I think". That is not evidence, that's an opinion. That is my problem, you're presenting your opinions as an actual argument that is overwhelming better than other's opinions. That is a flawed argument.

So bring the evidence or stop this nonsense.

I'll be honest, he's said several times he really doesn't actually even have a dog in this fight. It feels like he's just arguing to argue at this point.

Edit: NORTH FLORIDA. That explains it....

Nice, discrimination based on my geographical location? Dismissal for living in a place? That's pretty epic. I bet you're happy about tomorrow.

This is the third thread in 2 weeks you kids have shouted down into a multi-page argument. Feel free to continue, I'll continue to contribute. Bunch of conversationalist fascists. Next time it does come up (and it will), be adults and jjjust let it be discussed. I keep asking and it keeps getting ignored: What's the harm in that?

Oh I don't know, at what point will you come up with another degrading insult to label all the people who won't agree with you?

Probably the next time someone unloads his opinion like an elitist chump.

Dude, tbh, while I agree the community comes off as dicks half the time (seriously, you have no idea how much I'm on your side there), you don't really get to walk out of here with the moral high ground after all that. Heh.

Might as well end where I started. The ends justify the means, right?

This is the third thread in 2 weeks you kids have shouted down into a multi-page argument. Feel free to continue, I'll continue to contribute. Bunch of conversationalist fascists. Next time it does come up (and it will), be adults and jjjust let it be discussed. I keep asking and it keeps getting ignored: What's the harm in that?

Oh I don't know, at what point will you come up with another degrading insult to label all the people who won't agree with you?

Probably the next time someone unloads his opinion like an elitist chump.

Just like your comments about common core math?

This is fun.

I can see you're here RealStarKiller. What do you think so far?

This is the third thread in 2 weeks you kids have shouted down into a multi-page argument. Feel free to continue, I'll continue to contribute. Bunch of conversationalist fascists. Next time it does come up (and it will), be adults and jjjust let it be discussed. I keep asking and it keeps getting ignored: What's the harm in that?

Oh I don't know, at what point will you come up with another degrading insult to label all the people who won't agree with you?

Probably the next time someone unloads his opinion like an elitist chump.

Just like your comments about common core math?

You're still bent about that? Let's take it back to the other troll post about VT-49's being medium based ships and the elitist opinion-fest that generated.

This is the third thread in 2 weeks you kids have shouted down into a multi-page argument. Feel free to continue, I'll continue to contribute. Bunch of conversationalist fascists. Next time it does come up (and it will), be adults and jjjust let it be discussed. I keep asking and it keeps getting ignored: What's the harm in that?

Oh I don't know, at what point will you come up with another degrading insult to label all the people who won't agree with you?

Probably the next time someone unloads his opinion like an elitist chump.

Just like your comments about common core math?

You're still bent about that? Let's take it back to the other troll post about VT-49's being medium based ships and the elitist opinion-fest that generated.

No, but it was amusing. And I have no idea what you're talking about. I wasn't a part of that thread.

Further to my last, bit of a confession - I had Madine on a lifeboat flotilla less than hour ago, fleeing at speed three for a far off corner!

Now, flotillas can be annoying, however they are painfully predictable and easy to kill.

I played Aresius last night. He has a tooled up mc80 battle cruiser, 6 Awings, 4yt2400s and FIVE flotillas.

I won 8-3.

So either you call Aresius a bad player, or you admit that flotillas are easily countered.

Complain about Beatty assuming that everyone who thinks flotillas are overpowered is a bad player all you want,

I KNOW that everyone who cannot counter flotillas IS a bad player.

Discuss how flotillas are non thematic all you like, dont you dare call them game breaking.

I am pro-flotilla as well - but as the name indicates: there are no capital ships. There are a bunch of small ships of an unknown number just like squadrons are a bunch of spacecrafts of unknown number.

And so, thematically they fit better into the squadron phase. And game-wise as well. Hence that a single Firespray cost as much as a flotilla of rebel transports.

How can a bunch of small ships of an unknown number be your flagship? This does just not compute.

I pretty much like flotillas for their utility - but should not be allowed to be used as cheap pseudo ship activation. I don't see that they are in proportion to real ships. And so they shouldn't be threaded as real ships.

Dude, You don't see the problem! I said bring the evidence and your response has been "I think". That is not evidence, that's an opinion. That is my problem, you're presenting your opinions as an actual argument that is overwhelming better than other's opinions. That is a flawed argument.

So bring the evidence or stop this nonsense.

I'll be honest, he's said several times he really doesn't actually even have a dog in this fight. It feels like he's just arguing to argue at this point.

Edit: NORTH FLORIDA. That explains it....

Nice, discrimination based on my geographical location? Dismissal for living in a place? That's pretty epic. I bet you're happy about tomorrow.

Dude, I'm just gonna say it. Did we play each other in Marietta back in June, because I played this seriously humorless guy there and I know he was also from North Florida.

It was a joke. I'm joking with you. Florida has a reputation (much like my home state of Texas) which draws a lot of teasing. It's not personal. I'm not actually saying you're somehow lesser for geographical reasons. I'm just joking. Jesus H Christ, you guys drive me nuts sometimes.

And it's completely irrelevant, but I'm as filthy liberal as they come.

How does one show evidence in a tabletop game just curious?

Does one sight games from their local area where this is a common practice? If so then this is very common here in tourny and casual play.

Does one have to use someone else's regional data about top lists?

Or lastly "this is a joke" check wikipedia?

Its a shame. I dont really have an issue with real star killers point, but boy did this derail

I am pro-flotilla as well

Hahahah omg that is tooo funny. All this time Sygnetix is trying to defend your point of view about flotillas and letting these rule discussion take place and here you are, a flotilla loving player like the rest of us.

But you do have an interesting point of view. I think FFG had to make a decision on the sliding scale with flotillas. GR-75 is 90m, Decimator is like 40m? and CR90 is 150m?

How does one show evidence in a tabletop game just curious?

Does one sight games from their local area where this is a common practice? If so then this is very common here in tourny and casual play.

Does one have to use someone else's regional data about top lists?

Or lastly "this is a joke" check wikipedia?

You could collect your own regional data if you want, but schmitty's is pretty reliable. I don't think he's specifically fudging the numbers or anything to cover up his pro-flotilla agenda.

I think the fact remains, if someone actively wants to change a rule, there needs to be good evidence to show it can be changed and the level of evidence that person provides is the level of evidence that is necessary to be used against them. If they only bring an opinion, I'm only going to bring an opinion. If they bring an anecdote, all I'm bringing is an anecdote.

Its a shame. I dont really have an issue with real star killers point, but boy did this derail

heh if you think this thread is bad, you should see the rest of the US...regardless of your politics, people are not freaking happy.

Xindell nails it in my opinion. We have passionate opinions on these things because we like this game. It gets tiresome seeing all the nay-saying and the people who want the game to change to them rather than them just change the way they play the game.

I do agree with you, Sygnetix, that people do come off pompous and snarky, but I'm sure that has more to do with them being worn out fighting these ideas rather than all the jerks having to land on the pro-flotilla side. Ha. I was just providing context to your statement.

Taking a step back is probably a good idea, but for some people that's not easy since, as I said, they've invested in this game.

Can we not be hostile now?

Here's the problem. Every time this comes up, the "pro-Floats" enter the thread, issue their opinion, demean, talk-down to, and otherwise conduct themselves like the "anti-Floats" aren't worthy of the time no one asked them to invest in dictating their opinions.

They rarely join the discussion in any meaningful way such as, "from a pro-Float perspective, a good compromise would be xyz."

They nearly always join the discussion with this format: Thinly veiled insult to validate everything that's coming. Thoroughly self serving paragraph of why their opinion is validated. Sometimes a little closing block of how great their perspective is and to reiterate why people must be bad for being "anti-Float."

Three times in 2 weeks. If someone is discussing something about flotillas, maybe let them discuss it. It's not the "pro-Float" opinion that derails these discussions EVERY TIME. It's the presentation made by the same 5 or so people. When you come into a conversation no one made you join and your first words are explaining why the conversation is meaningless because everyone having it is just "bad" or can't "deal" with flotillas....it doesn't matter what your opinion is at the point.

All that matters at that point is you're a ****** that's either too self righteous to see how big of a ****** he is or so self righteous to see how big of a ****** he is.

The disturbing part is how many fanbois and fangurls flock to defend the behavior.

Am I innocent here? No. But it was all reactionary to people's presentation of their opinions....or more importantly, how they chose to portray (in their own minds) myself and others here just minding own business, having a chat about flotillas.

From a pro-float perspective, a good compromise would be not compromising.

I don't feel you have to compromise in order to have a productive conversation about a topic.

I've already agreed with you six ways from Sunday that the community comes off pompous and arrogant on occasion...

having a chat about flotillas.

All that matters at that point is you're a ****** that's either too self righteous to see how big of a ****** he is or so self righteous to see how big of a ****** he is.

But Beatty isn't the one proposing a change. A person proposing a change should bring evidence for the change. Beatty is well within his rights to not provide evidence to back up his position, his position is the default.

I can link all the videos to Many games played at tournaments and none of them show a Flotilla problem, but they do display great tactics and game play.

But as a Scientific argument goes, which when talking about these rules changes I think that is the best method we need to use, he does need to be the one to show the evidence. The burden of proof is on the one presenting change.

I'm trying to figure out those asterisks... is it a-hat. It's a-hat isnt it?

But Beatty isn't the one proposing a change. A person proposing a change should bring evidence for the change. Beatty is well within his rights to not provide evidence to back up his position, his position is the default.

But I can still provide evidence. None of the National's or The World's were won by Flotillas. I have watched just about every game on YouTube and many in person and I can guarantee there is no statistical data to back up his claim. But I am giving him a chance to prove me wrong if he can produce some evidence.

I can link all the videos to Many games played at tournaments and none of them show a Flotilla problem, but they do display great tactics and game play.

But as a Scientific argument goes, which when talking about these rules changes I think that is the best method we need to use, he does need to be the one to show the evidence. The burden of proof is on the one presenting change.

Right you are, mate. I almost cut in that the evidence was actually backing the pro-flot side, but I didn't feel it added to the point.

I'm trying to figure out those asterisks... is it a-hat. It's a-hat isnt it?

Close, female hygiene product that includes a bag. I was going to bypass and then thought better of it.