How do you approach this mission as the rebels? I saw on BGG that the Imperials have a 90% winning rate. We have been losing constantly so I'm looking for some advice, so we don't get creamed.

Well, as the Rebels you probably shouldn't have any insider info about the mission. Play smart- user your abilities to achieve your objectives while taking down some Imperials along the way.

Try to stay alive.

Mission spoilers ahead, obviously

Well, as the Rebels you probably shouldn't have any insider info about the mission. Play smart- user your abilities to achieve your objectives while taking down some Imperials along the way.

Try to stay alive.

I'd say Desperate Hour is the most imbalanced mission I've ever played, he needs some insider information to even have a chance to put up a fight (even that I didn't say "chance to win", I said "to put up a fight")

Normally we would consider "wound all 4 on last dice roll" as "balanced". Desperate Hour I've killed off (i.e. withdraw) 3/4 heroes without even thinking

Well, as the Rebels you probably shouldn't have any insider info about the mission. Play smart- user your abilities to achieve your objectives while taking down some Imperials along the way.

Try to stay alive.

I'd say Desperate Hour is the most imbalanced mission I've ever played, he needs some insider information to even have a chance to put up a fight (even that I didn't say "chance to win", I said "to put up a fight")

Normally we would consider "wound all 4 on last dice roll" as "balanced". Desperate Hour I've killed off (i.e. withdraw) 3/4 heroes without even thinking

Yeah, I get that. Just played a campaign myself that ended with this mission and the Rebels beat me pretty handily, to be honest.

And of course, as long as the campaign group is fine with the Rebels researching missions, OP is more than free to ask away (assuming their group is well aware and accepting of that kind of metagaming). I appreciate at least putting spoiler tags in, so thanks for that. Gotta keep those rebel eyes off the plans.

I agree with subtrendy that we shouldn't encourage Rebels to seek insider information regarding their missions, that really does defeat the purpose of it all. Instead we should be asking what his parties composition is and giving tips on final builds, how to use existing abilities etc..

I actually lost this one as the Imperial's for two reasons.

1) I wounded two heroes very quickly and figured it wouldn't be fun if they didn't get to the last event. I kept hitting them, but I wasn't focusing fire to force someone to withdraw or become wounded.

2) Their last healthy hero got pinned in a place that was nearly impossible to for me to attack, so I couldn't wound him.

If you want just one tip (no real spoilers, but I'm using tags so other Rebel players who would rather not see):

Just played as Rebels and managed to win this one against a very experienced Imperial player (playing subversive deck). Thought I share some insight as to how to do it. It contains spoilers of the mission. I didn´t know anything about the mission beforehand. Its all from memory, so some parts might be incorrect.

My team consisted of Jynn, Diala, Fenn and Gideon. With master of command on gideon (three uses of command at cost of 4 strain) and being able to get a player focused when declaring attack (thus, 5 strain), simply started by letting Fenn (all blasted up including reward from his side mission),kill of the royal cards and get some blast dmg on the door (not enough to open it). Imperial activated the elite storms, but with starting position on jynn she refired and killed one of them and killed the other by quick draw. Jynn had by then (with extra movement points from being attacked/attacking) positioned herself close to the crate at the top room. Her activation was simply picking the crate and killing the last stormtrooper. Thus, Imp was basically out of units straight on.

Turn 2 he used threat to mobilize a few new units. I had positioned fenn and diala close to one of the doors (the dmg one) since I didn´t know what to expect when they opened and wanted a clear fireing line. Weiss gets out, and he gets some dmg on fenn. But basically i get him down to 5 health with use of command and diala (removing one of his defensive dices). Seeming how quick i kill him, imp panics a bit (his only mistake) and use his deplete ability to roll for heal (healing him 5 hp). Turn 3, Weiss is still alive but on my first round i managed to kill of all remaining imps but one, forcing him to activate Weiss without any target ( i hid behind the walls). I then heal up on a few characters (he got the ability where he can interupt to attack, but since im out of range he can just move. At the end, he does, but tries to move away from me. Mid turn three, i manage to kill him off, spawning "my" at and some new imperial ones. I decide to quickly move forward, leaving the new spawned imps behind.

This is where my main mistake take place. I get the crate just outside the "inner"-part of the map, and get a card where im able to see his reserve deck. I find Weiss in there again, and I get the idea in my head that my AT will be "taken over" by Weiss. So i keep running forward with the team, leaving the At behind. My main reasoning is that I might be able to fight off anything in there without the ATST, but I wont be able to fight with a ATST in my back killing Gideon. IMP conserves threat (sitting on 23) since the deploy area is back with my atst and the figures deployed would not be able to catch my people anyway. I, probably mid turn 5, use a strain move as first thing on Dialas activation to "activate" the outdoor stuff. (by this time, all of my team is close to fully healed. Jynn and Diala got about 5 dmg but no strain, Gideon one dmg no strain, and Fenn 2 strain), but gideon has already activated.

Seeing everything spawn and the door close, I´m happy to have my whole team in position. Main problem is that i left the At far behind, now having to fight without it. I position Diala at the bot close to Weiss with a double move, while Fenn makes a double attack on the e-web elite, using the close proximity to Weiss to score 6 points of blast dmg on him while almost killing the e-web. E-web activates, jynn managed to stun it, leaving one attack aimed at her. She takes enough dmg to be wounded and having full strain (he uses ability where he converts some of dmg to strain). Weiss gets two attacks, scoring some hits on Fenn, who is close to be wounded (he got rebel elite so 15 hp). He then deploy for 23 threat, with the map simply overun by imp figures. I start turn 6 with Gideon commanding Fenn to fire 3 times, using all his strain to also letting him be focused for one of the shots.Fenn, despite being targeted by the imp ability where he gets -1 dmg and -1 defense, managed to injure Weiss to what is now a total of 17 points (9 hp left). The e-web dies from blast. IMP activates royal guards, killing jynn (/before she can activate) and succesfully managing to stun fenn. Weiss activation moves him further away from DIala, who has yet to activate. I activate Fenn, removes stun and get another 5 dmg points down on Weiss (now only 4 hp left), mainly thanks to 2 extra dmg from the trench fighter ability with Weiss now standing withing 3 spaces). His defensive rolls with Weiss is really bad. Weiss fires on Diala (probably a mistake), but I roll a clean defense and she gets focused. He then rushes Diala with elite royal guards, they fail to stun her (rolling bad again) but converts dmg into strain, having her fully strained and about 5 hp from wounded. I activate Diala, she uses the bacta pump (best item in game) to remove one strain (could have been a stun), reaches Weiss on 5 move (through royals with art of movement), rolls as focused (having her light saber and the attachment that gives one surge on exchaust). He rolls 4 defense, she rolls 5 dmg, i use the exhaust ability for the surge and use the pierce 3. 4 points of dmg and I win, having one straing left in case I´d had to reroll. The win is possible despite having "my" ATST not making a single attack. Close as hell, very difficult, needs some good dice, but doable.

I think you need a lot of "extra moves" for you to get there. Gideon got 2 mp every time he uses command (usually two times per turn (4 mp) he heals first then command and master command), Fenn got tactical movement (+2 to him or friendly), Diala art of movement (5 move no constraints) and Jynn everything (3 moves in total if attacking and damaging, one move if shoot upon). All in all, it made me able to move forward quickly, and it really helped to be all healed up and at the "right side" of the door still having some activations left when triggering the final area. I never targeted anything but Weiss (well, the E-web, but that was just in order to get easier dmg by blast) and I had Gideon not wounded standing next to the door, 3 spaces away from Fenn. Leading up to the finale, we had won 12 xp each, with me winning more of the side missions ( i had rewards on fenn, jynn and diala). I also had better dice than the IMP-player in this scenario, but it wasn´t crazy, just slightly better overall. I also had good weapons on Jynn and Fenn, both rolling 3 dices in attack. Jynn had the dual pistol trait being able to use surge from two guns, thus having straing effects like pierce 2, dmg 2, dmg 1, etc.

So, all in all, it felt impossible, but it was doable, despite leaving the At and the IMP-player playing well. Hope it works as encouragement.

So, tl;dr - with the best possible group of heroes, all of whom were maxed out, the mission was "doable"... Hmmm.

You can't command 3x in a round, command is a special action so you can only do it once. Masterstroke gives you a free command after performing one so the most you can do is 2

I would say Mak is much better than Jyn for the finales so the best Rebel setup in Core is Mak/Gideon/Diala/Fenn. But Gaarkhan & Jyn aren't far behind

I'm the Imp player in our group and for the past couple of missions I've been focusing all on getting to "Desperate Hour" for our finale; I mean, the Rebs get to have a frigging AT-ST! This will be so great for them!

At the same time -- seeing as we're playing friendly games and strive for story rather than wins (with all players, including me as the Imp, frequently discussing the wisest Rebel strategies before each round) -- I don't want to crush the Rebs with waves upon waves of Imperials in this mission. Of course, I don't mind the Imps winning, but this is the finale and it has to at least be interesting and exciting and cool. To make matters worse, I am guaranteed to get Darth Vader in the 2nd round (due to Agenda Cards uping Threat and reducing Deployment Cost), or even in the 1st round since they are likely to bring in Luke (Hero of the Rebellion) as an ally for the finaly.

Now, I want this finale to be a great gaming experience, and I want my players to get the most out of the mission, so I'm wondering, what should I (the Imp) do to ensure a fair and fun game here? Obviously, I should refrain from deploying loads of cheap Imperial units since Über-Weiss gets to act once after ever Imperial activation, but what other advice can you guys give me to help make this mission fun for everyone without basically throwing the game?

2 minutes ago, angelman2 said:

I'm the Imp player in our group and for the past couple of missions I've been focusing all on getting to "Desperate Hour" for our finale; I mean, the Rebs get to have a frigging AT-ST! This will be so great for them!

At the same time -- seeing as we're playing friendly games and strive for story rather than wins (with all players, including me as the Imp, frequently discussing the wisest Rebel strategies before each round) -- I don't want to crush the Rebs with waves upon waves of Imperials in this mission. Of course, I don't mind the Imps winning, but this is the finale and it has to at least be interesting and exciting and cool. To make matters worse, I am guaranteed to get Darth Vader in the 2nd round (due to Agenda Cards uping Threat and reducing Deployment Cost), or even in the 1st round since they are likely to bring in Luke (Hero of the Rebellion) as an ally for the finaly.

Now, I want this finale to be a great gaming experience, and I want my players to get the most out of the mission, so I'm wondering, what should I (the Imp) do to ensure a fair and fun game here? Obviously, I should refrain from deploying loads of cheap Imperial units since Über-Weiss gets to act once after ever Imperial activation, but what other advice can you guys give me to help make this mission fun for everyone without basically throwing the game?

What do you own outside the core?

3 minutes ago, subtrendy2 said:

What do you own outside the core?

Core Game, Twin Shadows , and Jabba's Realm

+about a dozen figure packs (basically all cardboard token replacements for Core & TS + a few random stuff)

Well, that rancor might be tempting to bring in, since massive units can occupy interior spaces in this mission.

Last time I played this, I threw an E-WEB down outside. Since the Rebels have an area that they all kind of have to funnel through, it did pretty well, acting as a sort of preliminary outside obstacle before getting to the big guy.

Anyway, enjoy! It's definitely a fun mission, and you're right about the Rebels often getting really excited about their walker.

Wow... the Rancor! As totally insane as it sounds, fielding the Rancor would CERTAINLY surprise my players I'm a little aprehensive about fielding that sweety prior to his proper place in Jabba's Realm, but I've got to say it sound really tempting. Thanks!

Your other (hidden) advice are really pertinent too and I'll make sure to heed them.

Man, I can't wait to see the look on my Rebel players' face when I give them the AT-ST; "What?! We own this now? Sweeeet!" It's gonna be great!

2 hours ago, angelman2 said:

Man, I can't wait to see the look on my Rebel players' face when I give them the AT-ST; "What?! We own this now? Sweeeet!" It's gonna be great!

Spoiler for Mak's side mission:

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.

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After losing that mission, my players would probably be annoyed if they got an AT-ST (even if it doesn't replace a hero)

@Stompburger : Yeah, my Rebs lost Brushfire too because of the special rules in that mission (no spoilies). I hope that getting to run an AT-ST against my pesky Imps will soothe the pain a little.

15 hours ago, angelman2 said:

Wow... the Rancor! As totally insane as it sounds, fielding the Rancor would CERTAINLY surprise my players I'm a little aprehensive about fielding that sweety prior to his proper place in Jabba's Realm, but I've got to say it sound really tempting. Thanks!

I totally get that. The rancor is begging for a big reveal (seeing as you, like me, seem to be a pretty thematic player), and this is totally up to you whether or not this is big enough.

Spoilers for the near end of Return to Hoth

1 hour ago, subtrendy2 said:

(seeing as you, like me, seem to be a pretty thematic player)

Oh yeah, I'm basically a GM at heart and the power of the story is MUCH more important to me then who wins (which is why I love Jabba's Realm as it has a much stronger and more defined story than Core & Twin Shadows; should I ever get around to it, I want to publish a fan-source "story emphasis" compendium to each of the campaigns 'cause I've got some ideas... *wink wink, nudge nudge*)

Btw., how do I hide texts here? I'm pretty tech-stupid and can't figure it out on my own...

While I'm waiting for instructions on hiding text, would you mind explaining (in hidden text) how you justify fielding that on Hoth? (Or was that scenario located on a more appropriate world?) Not that you have to justify it, but I'm curious how that works from a story perspective. (Awesome use of your game, btw!)

This goes before the text:

Edit: Nevermind, look at what a1bert said. I keep on creating accidental spoilers by trying to write it out.

Rancor explanation is now like 3 spoilers deep... Extra confidential, apparently.

Write it between [spoiler] [/spoiler].

Cool, thanks

@subtrendy2 : I fully buy your rational :D

Hi all,

Last night we finally played Desperate Hour and ended our first run-through of the core campaign, and what a brilliant game it was!

The Rebs fielded Luke (Hero of the Rebellion) with meant that due to a couple of Threat Agenda cards on my hand I could field Darth Vader with points to spare at the end of round 2. Weiss went down first thing in round 3, before Darth Vader could get into the frey. The Rebs were extatic over getting the AT-ST and used it to plug the hallway as the heroes sprinted towards the exterior objective. Unfortunately, the Rebel AT-ST didn't do much damage to my Imps because of a lucky dodge from one of my Imperial Officers and a bad roll on the second try, but the "chicken leggs" as the Rebs dubbed their toy did block the Imps' movement, meaning that the Rebs managed to get two locked blast doors between themselves and Vader & friends. The end rounds consisted of the heroes hitting Super-Weiss with everything they got -- including using a newly purchased "Combat Knife" to full effect (2 damage on all 5 rolls) -- while Vader & some Imperial Guards , assisted by several Imperial Officers and loads of stormies, slowly hacked their way through the blast doors. Luke did well early in the campaign, sabering down Weiss.01, but when he reached the exterior space he was so hurt that a single Trandoshan scared him to death with his Strain-causing ability. When finally Vader came storming out of the Imperial facility, all heroes but Fenn were wounded and he had 4 health left when finally Super-Weiss went down just as Vader (having double-ran with extra movement from friendly officers) positioned himself for a brutal attack with Force Choak next round.

The Rebs were lucky to get the locked blast doors between themselves and Vader & co, but it all came down to lucky rolls against Super-Weiss (especially with the "Combat Knife" which will forever hold a legendery status in our group). All in all we had a great time and Desperate Hour was a fitting end to a very fun campaign for my group

Thanks to everyone who helped me out with my questions and all :D

2 minutes ago, angelman2 said:

Hi all,

Last night we finally played Desperate Hour and ended our first run-through of the core campaign, and what a brilliant game it was!

The Rebs fielded Luke (Hero of the Rebellion) with meant that due to a couple of Threat Agenda cards on my hand I could field Darth Vader with points to spare at the end of round 2. Weiss went down first thing in round 3, before Darth Vader could get into the frey. The Rebs were extatic over getting the AT-ST and used it to plug the hallway as the heroes sprinted towards the exterior objective. Unfortunately, the Rebel AT-ST didn't do much damage to my Imps because of a lucky dodge from one of my Imperial Officers and a bad roll on the second try, but the "chicken leggs" as the Rebs dubbed their toy did block the Imps' movement, meaning that the Rebs managed to get two locked blast doors between themselves and Vader & friends. The end rounds consisted of the heroes hitting Super-Weiss with everything they got -- including using a newly purchased "Combat Knife" to full effect (2 damage on all 5 rolls) -- while Vader & some Imperial Guards , assisted by several Imperial Officers and loads of stormies, slowly hacked their way through the blast doors. Luke did well early in the campaign, sabering down Weiss.01, but when he reached the exterior space he was so hurt that a single Trandoshan scared him to death with his Strain-causing ability. When finally Vader came storming out of the Imperial facility, all heroes but Fenn were wounded and he had 4 health left when finally Super-Weiss went down just as Vader (having double-ran with extra movement from friendly officers) positioned himself for a brutal attack with Force Choak next round.

The Rebs were lucky to get the locked blast doors between themselves and Vader & co, but it all came down to lucky rolls against Super-Weiss (especially with the "Combat Knife" which will forever hold a legendery status in our group). All in all we had a great time and Desperate Hour was a fitting end to a very fun campaign for my group

Thanks to everyone who helped me out with my questions and all

55 minutes ago, subtrendy2 said:

Very cool! I love the idea of an enraged Vader cutting his way through the locked down base, only to arrive just a second too late! Sounds like you guys had a great time!

Indeed we did

I had actually half planned for Vader to get into the fight just too late to stop the Rebs' escape, to the point that I deployed him at the furthest away Deployment Point, and it worked brilliantly. I have found that the threat of Vader's powerful attack is more dramatic and tense than actually combat with him, so I wanted him to chase my heroes for half the game rather than tearing them apart in the 3rd round; nice scene!