Raider (and Epic) questions

By Thormind, in X-Wing Rules Questions

A friend and i just played our 1st epic game and we had some questions:

- The booklet that came with the Raider says it can make up to 2 attacks per rounds with his primary weapons. Is that because of the ability printed on the fore section card or can it attack once per section + an extra attack if it spends 2 energy?

- The attack(s) with the primary weapon, can they be performed only from the front arc or from both the front and side arcs?

- The booklet says after the primary weapon attacks(s), the ship can perform 1 attack from each of it's hardpoints. For those attacks it is said that the aft section can fire from both the front and the side arcs. Is that correct? Can the hardpoint from the fore section be fired from the side arcs as well?

- Assuming i only have one ship in range in my front arc and all my 3 hardpoint upgrades are equipped with missiles, does that mean i can: shoot twice with my primary weapon and then shoot 3 missiles? If the same ship is in one of my side arc instead, can i do the same thing?

- My friend was playing with the Tentative and he was saying the front section arc was 360 because it has a turret. I dont remember what card it was but he had an ability that could only happen when a ship was in arc(s). Are the rules the same for standard and epic play regarding arcs?

- If only the printed arcs count, if a card equipped on one section looks if a ship is in arc, would the ability trigger if the ship is in the arc of the other section? What if the ability is equiped on an enemy ship (ex: a ship with autotrusters is in the Aft arc but it's attacked from a fore section weapon, would the trusters trigger?)

- Since all regular hardpoints use energy, is there a point in using anything else than ordnance tube+missiles/torpedoes for seconday weapons?

Tks!

A friend and i just played our 1st epic game and we had some questions:

- The booklet that came with the Raider says it can make up to 2 attacks per rounds with his primary weapons. Is that because of the ability printed on the fore section card or can it attack once per section + an extra attack if it spends 2 energy?

It's because of the ability on the card. The Raider can make at most two primary weapon attacks per round, given sufficient energy to make the second.

- The attack(s) with the primary weapon, can they be performed only from the front arc or from both the front and side arcs?

The primary weapon is considered to be part of the fore section, and can only fire out of that section's arc.

- The booklet says after the primary weapon attacks(s), the ship can perform 1 attack from each of it's hardpoints. For those attacks it is said that the aft section can fire from both the front and the side arcs. Is that correct? Can the hardpoint from the fore section be fired from the side arcs as well?

No, a weapon can only use the arcs on the section to which it is equipped. So the primary and one hardpoint can fire from the fore arc, and two hardpoints can fire from the aft arcs. Both aft hardpoints can fire from the same aft arc if needed.

Also, you don't have to do the primary weapon attacks first. Or last. If you're going to make a second primary attack it has to be right after the first, because that's the timing of the ability that lets you do it, but you can do Secondary 1, Primary 1-2, Secondary 2-3.

- Assuming i only have one ship in range in my front arc and all my 3 hardpoint upgrades are equipped with missiles, does that mean i can: shoot twice with my primary weapon and then shoot 3 missiles? If the same ship is in one of my side arc instead, can i do the same thing?

I'm not sure I understand the question. When the Raider activates during combat, you can measure range/arc to any/all enemy ships, and then attack with as many weapons as have legal shots, in any order you like. If there's only one enemy ship near you, and it's at Range 3 in the sweet spot where your fore and aft arcs overlap, and you have a Target Lock on it, yeah, you can attack it with three Homing Missiles and twice with your primary.

By the way, remember you still need Target Locks to fire most ordnance. Weapons Engineer, the Impetuous title, and missiles that don't discard their Target Locks (Homing, Ion Pulse) are your friends for a missile-boat Raider.

- My friend was playing with the Tentative and he was saying the front section arc was 360 because it has a turret. I dont remember what card it was but he had an ability that could only happen when a ship was in arc(s). Are the rules the same for standard and epic play regarding arcs?

Yes. To wit, nothing has a 360 degree arc. The CR-90 can make attacks outside of its firing arc with its primary weapon (although it's still restricted by the Blue Line Rule, so it can't shoot things directly behind it, turret or no turret), but for effects that require the target to be in arc, you determine that normally.

- If only the printed arcs count, if a card equipped on one section looks if a ship is in arc, would the ability trigger if the ship is in the arc of the other section? What if the ability is equiped on an enemy ship (ex: a ship with autotrusters is in the Aft arc but it's attacked from a fore section weapon, would the trusters trigger?)

In arc is in arc. Unless the card specifically says it cares about the difference between huge ship sections, treat the ship as one ship.

- Since all regular hardpoints use energy, is there a point in using anything else than ordnance tube+missiles/torpedoes for seconday weapons?

Sure there is. As previously stated, being tied to Target Locks for your secondary weapons is very limiting. A huge ship can still only have one Target Lock (or two, with Weapons Engineer).

By the way, if you haven't already, you should go to the X-Wing Product Page and download the most current Huge Ship Rules and Epic Tournament Rules. The docs included with the ships are notoriously out of date. Well, at this point so are the pdfs you can download, but they're better.

Edited by digitalbusker

A friend and i just played our 1st epic game and we had some questions:

- The booklet that came with the Raider says it can make up to 2 attacks per rounds with his primary weapons. Is that because of the ability printed on the fore section card or can it attack once per section + an extra attack if it spends 2 energy?

- The attack(s) with the primary weapon, can they be performed only from the front arc or from both the front and side arcs?

- The booklet says after the primary weapon attacks(s), the ship can perform 1 attack from each of it's hardpoints. For those attacks it is said that the aft section can fire from both the front and the side arcs. Is that correct? Can the hardpoint from the fore section be fired from the side arcs as well?

- Assuming i only have one ship in range in my front arc and all my 3 hardpoint upgrades are equipped with missiles, does that mean i can: shoot twice with my primary weapon and then shoot 3 missiles? If the same ship is in one of my side arc instead, can i do the same thing?

- My friend was playing with the Tentative and he was saying the front section arc was 360 because it has a turret. I dont remember what card it was but he had an ability that could only happen when a ship was in arc(s). Are the rules the same for standard and epic play regarding arcs?

- If only the printed arcs count, if a card equipped on one section looks if a ship is in arc, would the ability trigger if the ship is in the arc of the other section? What if the ability is equiped on an enemy ship (ex: a ship with autotrusters is in the Aft arc but it's attacked from a fore section weapon, would the trusters trigger?)

- Since all regular hardpoints use energy, is there a point in using anything else than ordnance tube+missiles/torpedoes for seconday weapons?

Tks!

  1. Because of the ability printed on its fore section card
  2. Only in the front arc, as that is the arc associated with the fore section, which is the only section with a primary weapon
  3. Secondary weapons can only fire at targets within the firing arcs printed for the section to which they are equipped (weapons equipped to the rear section use the rear section firing arcs)
  4. See 3.
  5. Same rules for standard and epic: card effects that require being "in arc" refer to the printed firing arcs on the ship token (base).
  6. Unless the card specifies section, its effects can use either section for measuring, and this includes the firing arcs, unless the card specifies "primary" firing arc.
  7. You're limited to Target Lock ordnance, you need to acquire the target lock, and often spend it, and there is not any ordnance with a range beyond 3. Some energy weapons fire beyond range 3, some can fire multiple times, and none require a target lock on the target. Also Ordnance Tubes is a modification meaning you forgo the opportunity to use the other modifications which might be more useful.

Ha, too slow on my research and posting!

Edited by Kharnvor

Tks for your help!

Another question: My friend was using a ship that would let another ship use his focus tokens when attacking. He said it was ok to let his huge ship use that ability when it attacks. Is that true? He had some other ability that made the tentative attacks with a huge amount of dices (like 6-7 if i remember). With access to focus and target locks it was devastating (on the OP side i would say).

He said that question had already been answered by FFg but i could not find anything in the errata. What i had found from the rule: Focus, evade, and stress tokens do not affect huge ships...

The ruling that epic ships, which are not allowed to have Focus tokens, can still take advantage of Esege Tuketu's Focus while attacking, is from an email from Frank Brooks. I don't think it's made it into a FAQ, which is not surprising given how infrequently the epic docs are updated.

Basically, don't get too hung up on the "do not affect huge ships" part of the sentence. The actionable rules text is "When a huge ship receives any of these tokens, immediately remove them....". Spending Esege's Focus during an attack doesn't involve assigning the token to the CR-90, so it works.

As for buffing the CR-90's number of attack dice, Jan Ors (pilot) and maybe Finn (crew) can do that, although Finn only adds a blank, so would require spending a Target Lock to get any chance of a hit.

The good news: Hawks and K-Wings are squishy, especially when they're trying to keep formation with a CR-90. Light 'em up.

Basically, don't get too hung up on the "do not affect huge ships" part of the sentence. The actionable rules text is "When a huge ship receives any of these tokens, immediately remove them....". Spending Esege's Focus during an attack doesn't involve assigning the token to the CR-90, so it works.

Tks for the name of the ship, i was searching for it. The abilitly reads: "When another friendly ship at Range 1-2 is attacking, it may treat your focus tokens as its own"

As per the rules as written, the huge ship would not be able to use that token if it was its own. It would just be removed. No matter what part of the rule you read, there is no way a huge ship can use it's own focus token... With no errata, i do not see how the rule could be interpreted differently.

The good news: Hawks and K-Wings are squishy, especially when they're trying to keep formation with a CR-90. Light 'em up.

Hehe, easier said than done when they are hiding behind that huge ship hitting you for 5-7 dmg per turn as soon as youre at range 5 and threatening to bump/destroy you if you get too close... :-)

Basically, don't get too hung up on the "do not affect huge ships" part of the sentence. The actionable rules text is "When a huge ship receives any of these tokens, immediately remove them....". Spending Esege's Focus during an attack doesn't involve assigning the token to the CR-90, so it works.

Tks for the name of the ship, i was searching for it. The abilitly reads: "When another friendly ship at Range 1-2 is attacking, it may treat your focus tokens as its own"

As per the rules as written, the huge ship would not be able to use that token if it was its own. It would just be removed. No matter what part of the rule you read, there is no way a huge ship can use it's own focus token... With no errata, i do not see how the rule could be interpreted differently.

Rules as Written says Focus tokens are removed from a huge ship immediately upon receiving them. In this game, "receiving" has a specific meaning that is not just "any transition from me not having the token to me having the token". Esege lets the CR-90 "have" the Focus token (for the purposes of spending it during an attack) without "receiving" it, so the huge ship Focus rule doesn't apply.