Hello there!

I am really sorry about this rather depressing way to start a new topic, but unfortunately I am not looking forward to a new wave of ships, for the very first time since I have started playing XWing.

Usually I can't wait to get my hands on the new ships, no matter if they are for my own faction or not.

But now it's completely different, because I am really sad to see the new game mechanics incoming, featuring the "I'll show you the dark side" card in particular.

I know, I know.... another Kylo Ren thread. Another rant about a card which has not even been published yet.

But seriously... I don't even know what ships to choose for a new list at the moment, because none of the things I like on the rebel fleet seems to be "Kylo Ren proof".

And Kylo Ren might be a thing in about 2 weeks already.

So why am I concerned about this?

Most Rebel Aces seem to be useless, if you can switch their pilot skill to level 0 or punish them with the "blinded pilot" card furthermore.

It's even worse when you are playing with the old damage deck (I havent got the new one yet).

There is not much you can do against Kylos skill, because it only takes one (not evaded) crit on your ship, to receive something like the "injured pilot crit" even through your shields.

But how could you evade this in the first place, if your ship has only got one green die?

RAC with Kylo Crew and Emperor Palpatine Crew will make a crit happen very easily and then any beloved rebel ace will be a very expensive piece of garbage for the rest of the match.

Han Solo, Wedge, Luke, Poe, Horton, Dash, Miranda... all of these ships have got 2 green dice max and they will most probably get shutdown with ease.

So, what can I do?

Play Rebel swarms or Chewbacca until they notice that the usage of Rebel lists haven fallen to 10% at competitive tournaments?

Determination Elite doesn't seem to be a valid solution, because it literally blocks your eliteskill, which would be important to use something like Predator, Push the Limit or Veteran Instincts.

With the PS the way it is, determination is a fine choice over VI if Kylo becomes popular.

Also useful: Integrated Astro and any 1-point droid. High hull plus shield regen. Chewbacca (as you mentioned).

Don't forget kylo crew is an action. Stress control and blocking are Rebel specialties. Oh and don't forget Conner net. Bombing K-wing's don't care about pilot crits.

Edit: My prediction is that Kylo will be the Boba Fett of wave 10. Good for the cost, easy enough to build into a list, not as horribly game breaking as everyone expects.

Warden Squadron K-Wing bombers don't really care about Blinded Pilot or Injured Pilot.

Bombing K-Wings and laught when the blinded pilots can still kill them with mines. Especially the large base Decimators that can't help but eat all of the tokens!

In case you don't know the basic list:

Warden Squadron Pilot (23)
Extra Munitions (2)
Sabine Wren (2)
Cluster Mines (4)
Advanced SLAM (2)

Warden Squadron Pilot (23)
Extra Munitions (2)
"Chopper" (0)
Seismic Charges (2)
Cluster Mines (4)
Advanced SLAM (2)

Warden Squadron Pilot (23)
Extra Munitions (2)
Intelligence Agent (1)
Seismic Charges (2)
Cluster Mines (4)
Advanced SLAM (2)

Total: 100

View in Yet Another Squad Builder

With lots of wiggle room for sprinkeling Conner Nets, downgrading one set of Clusters (probably on the Sabine caddy) to upgrade the IA to Cassian and even more bomb options.

What hope is there in wave 10?

Rebel lists are built on hope.

Range control helps a lot- RAC's ability doesn't work at range 3. Stresshog/Stressmule will keep the action from triggering if you keep the key peiece of your list out of range for a turn. Blocking also works.

Rebellions are built on hope...and stressing ships....and blocking....but mostly stress....and also bombs...and stress

BiggsbiggsBiggs

Blinded biggs!?

However shall i go on !?!?!?

And yeah, bomber ks dont give a solitary ****

And kylo is an action so, you know, have fun there

Another point to consider is that how much you need to counter Kylo depends on how many people bring Kylo, AND on how many people bring counters to Kylo. If Kylo gets popular enough, people will start bringing counters to him. This will both discourage people from continuing to bring Kylo and open up opportunities to score wins by countering the counters with a more generally good list.

This is already happening in the current meta with x7 Defenders. You've got the Defender lists, the anti-Defender lists, and the anti-anti Defender lists, any one of which can win a big tournament on any given day.

BiggsbiggsBiggs

Blinded biggs!?

However shall i go on !?!?!?

And yeah, bomber ks dont give a solitary ****

And kylo is an action so, you know, have fun there

Best part is you can always eject R4-D6 (given that you know you'll mostly be getting 2 hits plus grit thrown at you anyway), and STILL get a shot with Biggs.

Or, if you really want to throw away an extra point, R2-D6 + Determination basically makes you immune to crits.

How are rebel aces more susceptible to Kylo than any oyher faction's aces?

It's something everyone will have to deal with.

There is in Rouge 2

Okay right now I think the biggest problem with the rebels is that the faction characteristics have shifted as you move to the top of the meta. The original philosophy was

• Rebels were synergistic
• Imperials gave out Bonus Damage
• Scum was Disruptive

But if you look at the top of the Meta you have

• Manaroo's synergy
• Miranda's bonus attack dice
• Omega Leader's prevention of dice modification

So when you first start you learn to play a faction one way but in order to move up the meta you have to learn to play Scum the way you were playing Rebels, Rebels as if you were playing Imperials, and Imperials like you were playing Scum.

With the PS the way it is, determination is a fine choice over VI if Kylo becomes popular.

Also useful: Integrated Astro and any 1-point droid. High hull plus shield regen. Chewbacca (as you mentioned).

Don't forget kylo crew is an action. Stress control and blocking are Rebel specialties. Oh and don't forget Conner net. Bombing K-wing's don't care about pilot crits.

Edit: My prediction is that Kylo will be the Boba Fett of wave 10. Good for the cost, easy enough to build into a list, not as horribly game breaking as everyone expects.

This.

But, I'm telling you, TLT's will kill this game. Seriously.

There is in Rouge 2

I don't know if you are doing this on purpose to troll people like me, or if you genuinely don't realize, BUT DEAR GOD MAN IT'S ROGUE NOT ROUGE.

On topic, Rebels have plenty of options as others have pointed out. Biggs will hardly care, Ks don't care, it's an action and Rebels are literally the kings of stressing things.

Stress bot and blocking. The real question is how will the other factions deal with it.

Rebels have it easy.

Hope , never heard of this pilot , whats his ability?

Stress bot and blocking. The real question is how will the other factions deal with it.

Rebels have it easy.

Stressbot doesn't work sadly. Round 1 engagement happens as follows:

Stressbot moves, takes action

RAC Moves, takes Kylo action on stressbot, selects blinded pilot

RAC shoots, pushes blinded pilot onto stressbot

Stressbot skips attack due to blinded pilot

Stressbot cannot double stress RAC to prevent further actions

(and then you repeat the next turn, and on the 3rd turn he dies before he can shoot)

I suppose it "works" in that your 26 point Gold Squadron is getting the attention of Kylo instead of your 40pt ace, but a 26pt meat shield to counteract a 3pt upgrade + action doesn't seem like a good trade.

I suppose it "works" in that your 26 point Gold Squadron is getting the attention of Kylo instead of your 40pt ace, but a 26pt meat shield to counteract a 3pt upgrade + action doesn't seem like a good trade.

You literally just described Biggs, who works very very well and is basically a good trade 100% of the time.

There is in Rouge 2

I don't know if you are doing this on purpose to troll people like me, or if you genuinly don't realize, BUT DEAR GOD MAN IT'S ROGUE NOT ROUGE.

The word is also 'genuinely', not genuinly.

Stress bot and blocking. The real question is how will the other factions deal with it.

Rebels have it easy.

Stressbot doesn't work sadly. Round 1 engagement happens as follows:

Stressbot moves, takes action

RAC Moves, takes Kylo action on stressbot, selects blinded pilot

RAC shoots, pushes blinded pilot onto stressbot

Stressbot skips attack due to blinded pilot

Stressbot cannot double stress RAC to prevent further actions

(and then you repeat the next turn, and on the 3rd turn he dies before he can shoot)

I suppose it "works" in that your 26 point Gold Squadron is getting the attention of Kylo instead of your 40pt ace, but a 26pt meat shield to counteract a 3pt upgrade + action doesn't seem like a good trade.

Use old damage deck if you are concerned about that.

Stress bot and blocking. The real question is how will the other factions deal with it.

Rebels have it easy.

Stressbot doesn't work sadly. Round 1 engagement happens as follows:

Stressbot moves, takes action

RAC Moves, takes Kylo action on stressbot, selects blinded pilot

RAC shoots, pushes blinded pilot onto stressbot

Stressbot skips attack due to blinded pilot

Stressbot cannot double stress RAC to prevent further actions

(and then you repeat the next turn, and on the 3rd turn he dies before he can shoot)

I suppose it "works" in that your 26 point Gold Squadron is getting the attention of Kylo instead of your 40pt ace, but a 26pt meat shield to counteract a 3pt upgrade + action doesn't seem like a good trade.

See, here Its soaking 3 points of upgrade...plus however many points the fatassimator is

Plus the deci just offered its ass to the rest of your squad cause it sure as hell aint boosting if it kylos

RAC can't auto-crit at range 3. Good range control is all it takes.

Stress bot and blocking. The real question is how will the other factions deal with it.

Rebels have it easy.

Stressbot doesn't work sadly. Round 1 engagement happens as follows:

Stressbot moves, takes action

RAC Moves, takes Kylo action on stressbot, selects blinded pilot

RAC shoots, pushes blinded pilot onto stressbot

Stressbot skips attack due to blinded pilot

Stressbot cannot double stress RAC to prevent further actions

(and then you repeat the next turn, and on the 3rd turn he dies before he can shoot)

I suppose it "works" in that your 26 point Gold Squadron is getting the attention of Kylo instead of your 40pt ace, but a 26pt meat shield to counteract a 3pt upgrade + action doesn't seem like a good trade.

Use old damage deck if you are concerned about that.

That really, really hoses the Ace the Stressbot is supposed to protect, so I don't think that's a viable option.

Bombing K-Wings and laught when the blinded pilots can still kill them with mines. Especially the large base Decimators that can't help but eat all of the tokens!

Good God. Then you have to own and play with three K-Wings...

Imp Aces won't be too threatened by Kylo because you've got to actually hit to trigger the effect. Good luck hitting most tokened up aces, especially if Palp is there.

Rebel regen aces will have a bit more difficult of a time as they generally rely on just regenerating whatever damage they take instead of avoiding it completely. I don't think it is a bad thing to have a card that is good against a regen ace. They don't have any "hard" counter upgrades like Imp aces do with auto blaster turrets and bombs. There's a reason Fel, Vader, and the like have all disappeared from the meta: there are lots of HARD counters to them now. I don't even think Kylo will counter regen like said tactics stomp Imp aces. Kylo crew definitely has counter play, much of which has already been mentioned.

Unlike when facing Uboats, a regen ship won't just evaporate against Kylo. It isn't good for the regen ship, but you can put things in your list relatively easily to stop action-dependent upgrades, which Rebels couldn't do against Uboats. With good list building and play, a player flying a regen ship can fight back against Kylo.