I worked in Empire at War!!

I was a big fan of Empires at War back in the day, and will admit that something like the Zann Consortium could happen, I'm not exactly begging for them. There are so many Imperial and Rebel designs outstanding that Scum ships is very low priority. On top of that there is a distinct lack of canon commanders, officers, titles, etc. that most of it would have to be created whole cloth by FFG.

Give me more Legends and original designs

Give me First Order / Resistance

Give me Republic / Seperatist

Give me Old Republic / Sith Empire

Then I'll worry about wanting scum & Villiany

Personally, that's why i have offered the suggestion to allow all the non-Rebellion/Imperial faction ships (Mandalorians, Hapan, etc, etc, etc) be added to the game, but as "privateers" for the rebel alliance or "mercenaries" for the Empire. That way they can be added without trying to shoehorn ships into a scum faction.

Oh man, several people on this thread are going to buy into Scum, FFG clearly needs to make this a thing now! Watch out, Rebel and Imperial fleets, the epic scale of Armada just decided to spend even more time in Jabbas Palace! Thrill with excitement as you field ships people only minorly care about and don't recognize in order to get another faction in a game that really doesn't need a third! Recreate all those great moments from the movies where the Scum faction did (placeholder) or when Black Sun (second placeholder). And who can forget the importance of Cor SEC to the battle of (......)!

If we're playing magic FFG wish machine, can I get named rebel y wing squadron Wes Janson who rolls 2 black bomber dice for damage? And heck, I'll help my Imperial friends out. Throw in Interceptor pilot Erisi Dlarit and give her counter 5 or something else just as ludicrous? I mean, if we're speculating wildly and all.

I would also like a way for Rebels to field ISDs like this guy Ben does at my gaming group. Classic Ben.

Some of us still don't think Scum was a good idea and left the game because of what happened in X-Wing. Just because you like it personally doesn't make it a good idea, and there are several reasoned arguments why a third faction wouldn't work.

I mean, tell us: What canon ships would be third faction? And why should the rest of us be interested in them?

For my part, the Zahn Consortium is at least half of why I don't want a scum faction. I don't want that mary-sue "personal enemy of thrawn, star pupil of Jabba, thief of the Eclipse" Tyber Zann legitimized in canon or in Armada. Given the reaction people are having to the Assault Frigate, you'd think a lot of other fans would be happy to excommunicate other Empire at War contributions.

The whole canon argument is a fallacy when you look at some of the ships in Armada and X-Wing. It's even more BS when you go through the FFG Star Wars RPG books and all the starships they have.

In order to even remotely match the imperials or rebel fleet diversity, the third faction would need 4-6 ships, and probably 4-8 fighter models. That's 5-8 products on shelves that would need to be developed & playtested, and then dropped on the market at once. Some of the fighters could be drawn from existing packs, like Y-wings & Z-95s, but not all of them.

What would the unifying theme of 3rd fleet ships be? Would 3rd fleet even have large ships? Would they have a unique upgrade, like Peltas/Interdictors?

I think it would be just too difficult to make enough ships for an entire fleet without ending up with just reskins of existing ships. And if they are just reskins, then we aren't gaining anything in strategic depth. And all the time spent on bringing that 3rd faction up to speed would mean that the existing faction's player-bases would have nothing new to buy, and would be more likely to drift off to another game.

You guys do know FFG makes stuff up for this game, right? Whole ships, like the Raider? I don't see how a third faction would be a stretch.

Especially once they start to run out of ships and the game gets stale. Just like what was happening with X-wing, they'll reach into the EU and get creative rather than let a game dry out and die.

So the Raider is the only ship they've made whole cloth, but that was made entirely after the Disney purchase. This ship actually does a better job telling us about future plans than the entire EU pre-Disney.

Ships like the Raider are in-line with the existing Imperial design aesthetic and can be trademarked as unique. Most/many of the EU ships are generic sci-fi designs. Disney won't take these unless they are unique in heir design, such as the Assault Frigate 2.

Oh man, several people on this thread are going to buy into Scum, FFG clearly needs to make this a thing now! Watch out, Rebel and Imperial fleets, the epic scale of Armada just decided to spend even more time in Jabbas Palace! Thrill with excitement as you field ships people only minorly care about and don't recognize in order to get another faction in a game that really doesn't need a third! Recreate all those great moments from the movies where the Scum faction did (placeholder) or when Black Sun (second placeholder). And who can forget the importance of Cor SEC to the battle of (......)!

If we're playing magic FFG wish machine, can I get named rebel y wing squadron Wes Janson who rolls 2 black bomber dice for damage? And heck, I'll help my Imperial friends out. Throw in Interceptor pilot Erisi Dlarit and give her counter 5 or something else just as ludicrous? I mean, if we're speculating wildly and all.

I would also like a way for Rebels to field ISDs like this guy Ben does at my gaming group. Classic Ben.

Wow, so salty - please state your LoL ingame name

To cut it short, I am not begging for a third faction but I am confident that FFG would be perfectly capable of balancing a three factions system, with the same fluctuations and distortions which we already have between two factions and which are inevitable in any game that is not plain chess.

Cannon-wise, some of the ships/squadrons we have now for imps and rebels have not seen a second of screentime as well, so that does not break S&V as a faction for me. Books, even games (EAW) managed a scum faction so that is not a limiting issue in my eyes.

Gameplay-wise it could become an issue, as it is not easy to launch a full scum wave with at minimum 3-4 ships and several unique fighters from scratch. What could work for me is the introduction of small/flotilla type S&V ships as auxiliaries to rebels and imperials respectively, similar to the S&V squadron pack. They could then merge the released squadrons and ships with alternate asses and unique titles/upgrades in a later stage by releasing 1-2 medium ships and some scum admirals.

In order to even remotely match the imperials or rebel fleet diversity, the third faction would need 4-6 ships, and probably 4-8 fighter models. That's 5-8 products on shelves that would need to be developed & playtested, and then dropped on the market at once. Some of the fighters could be drawn from existing packs, like Y-wings & Z-95s, but not all of them.

What would the unifying theme of 3rd fleet ships be? Would 3rd fleet even have large ships? Would they have a unique upgrade, like Peltas/Interdictors?

I think it would be just too difficult to make enough ships for an entire fleet without ending up with just reskins of existing ships. And if they are just reskins, then we aren't gaining anything in strategic depth. And all the time spent on bringing that 3rd faction up to speed would mean that the existing faction's player-bases would have nothing new to buy, and would be more likely to drift off to another game.

Yeah, it won't have anything for the diehard Imperial or Rebel players, but it'll only be one wave like that. As others have said, to play catch up in X-wing FFG was making half a wave for S&V, leaving Imperial and Rebels players with little to look forward to. Even though I started this thread, I don't want to see a third faction take over each wave in that kind of manner.

I think a campaign box that comes with a couple of ships and cardboard would be a good introduction for a third faction, followed by a third of the new waves after that. Maybe another box set with two new third faction ships at a random inbetween wave date, just to help play catch up.

And I have a hard time reading the whole "a third faction would just be reskins of what we have" argument. If it was strictly cardboard, then yeah that's all it would be. But a new faction should overall have a theme you can feel when you play it. Even now with the last two waves I hear grumblings on how newer ships feel like they're introducing not as strong cross faction tactics, with the Liberty's increased front arc and the Arqs for the Imperials (based on ships design, I personally don't buy into this). So reskins wouldn't be the way to go outside of the obvious squadrons, IMO.

Also, do you think FFG would take the easy way out with a third faction? If S&V hurt X-wing as bad as people here alluded to then I'm sure these professionals that take grest pride in their work have learned lessons from that on how to best introduce new elements.

FFG could do it. It's their game, they can do anything they want with it. Even kill it. Possibly by introducing a third faction...

I can't remember the state of X-Wing when the time came for Scum to be released. We had a healthy mix of ships when that strange faction came along and guave us new options. Was the game stale at that point? Perhaps... turrets did much to gut the competitive circle of friends I enjoyed the game with in its beginning.

However the more I think about the state of Armada now, I think there's still flexibility within the scope of the game now that a third faction won't be necessary to shake things up. The Corellian Conflict is doing a good job of that already by introducing to us a new mode of play. As one of my friends commented, Armada in CC is basically a different game. The core mechanics are the same but you'd have to approach listbuilding completely differently. And that may be enough to satisfy those craving a new play experience out of the Armada box.

I still don't think we'll see a new faction. The "slush" faction for things like pirates and bounty hunters works for Imperial Assault (individuals) and X-Wing (Smugglers and privateers, Bounty Hunters), but not for Armada, which is supposed to be about large fleet battles. As far as we know in Canon only the Rebellion mustered starships in significant enough groups to oppose the Empire. This isn't some cargo-drop gone sour that you could infer when setting up Scyk fighters and a YV vs an Imperial patrol. This is major fleet battles deciding the destiny of the galaxy. Scum doesn't want to do that, they want to profit off the struggle.

Now, if Rebels/VIII hands us a new power player on the galactic scene, then I can see the push for a new faction. Something that would speed up the Resistance/First Order to oppose this new force present in 8, or if the Hapes came back as a proper military force, or if they decided to flesh out the Chiss into something serious. Until that happens, I think it'll be just two factions.

So you have a fleet that shoots forwards to great effect, another that shoots sideways to great effect.

So that would make scum shoot backwards to great effect. :wacko:

I'm mighty curious where you all think the rebellion got most of its capital ships from...because it would quite easily explain how a 3rd faction got hold of some capital class ships that they refitted.

There are many space yards in the SW universe, I mean Mon Cals were cruise liners, retrofitted to be capital ships. This idea that only the Imperials can produce capital ships, and a few planets else where is ridiculous, it is based in an entire galaxy, not one solar system. Anyone with the means and the desire could be churning out most ship sizes we see in game.

Hell didn't we just get a boat load of super squadrons that are freighters??

what about neutral ships for both factions like the correlian gunship/corvette, dreadnought, quasar fire and imperial nebulon-b

or and

sub factions like Smugglers' Alliance Talon Karrde and back sun pirates Xizor

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Rebel_privateer

hero capital ships like the Freelance

I hope there will be no Scum faction for Armada.

Not that I'm against new factions - Republic/Separatists would be cool, for example - but Scum would just be lame.

I agree with the general consensus that Armada is too large a scale for a full third faction...however....I do foresee factional "cross over ships" of Frigate size and lower. Maybe the Dreadnaught, at largest. I think we'll eventually see "factionless" squadrons, freighters, single ships (like the YT's and whatnot), and....up to frigate size.

No wonder these threads become so heated.

"I would quite enjoy a third faction"

"If a third faction is introduced Armada is DEAD"

People chill. I am tired of anytime a thread regarding a third faction is brought up it just brings out the same irritating whinging fr9m the same groups of people.

Instead of immediately saying no or claiming itll ruin everything why not dont post, as you've most likely posted you opinion several times across the many third faction threads, or try to be constructive.

None of our opinions matter one way or another. FFG will decide which way it wants to take Armada. So instead why dont we try to be constructive and see how maybe hypothetically a third faction could play out.

Ya'll can always make your own scum faction. Buy from Mel's and use Kuat Drive Yards for your cards. Boom. 3rd faction you can play with your friends.

3rd faction, no. 4 factions, maybe.

Either add CIS/Republic or First Order/Resistance (possibly New Republic). No really solid sources exist for a Scum faction. Some books a few have read or some ancient video games (maybe newer than I realize). Nothing with really good marjet penetration. Like it or not, TCW is the untapped show for a lot of material.

I for one want to see the CIS added with some sort of distinct mechanics for Droid Fighters.

I would like to see a independent faction that could be hired as imperials or rebels or be their own group. I run narratives with my games and having more ships types to work with would be cool. We've seen numerous examples of independents in various star wars media...Pirate gangs, corporate security forces, Mandalorians, Private house security and such, and a third group could open up various space stations to add to the game.

I would also like to see a Clone wars add-on. The clones wars is the one time in which large fleet battles were possible. I would like to see it separate from the GCW to prevent rebel vs. republic and such.

I didn't read the whole thread so if I repeat...

As a full on "faction" I don't see it. It is like making Al Capone a faction in Axis and Allies.

As a scenario box or new "core box" with a flotilla-ish ship/small based vessel and some new squadron cards and maybe a three player set-up given a "Rebels"-centric flavor it could be neat. A couple of Arquitens, Pelta, Ghost, a few A-wings and Ties, the Scum vessel, a firespray or arc, a few things to let you mix it up with other expansions. Especially if you condense it down to a 3x3 and 200 point lists or something meant of shorter/faster games.

I wouldn't be too opposed to cross faction ships, so long as they are new and unique concepts. I don't want rehashed Nebs or CR90s or ISDs.

I see it as a dangerous path with getting cross faction ships, but what about squads? I know people are going to ***** about not getting cross faction squads.

Honestly, I'd rather FFG spend time expanding Rebels and Imps than spend time forcing a scum faction in Armada. Armada does not need a third faction.

Did not read. No 3rd faction please.

I opened a thread for conversation and POSTULATION on a THEORETICAL third faction. This isnt an open letter to FFG this is just a fun attempt to bounce around ideas of how a third faction may play on the table. If your like Thraug above please don't post there.

I can see something along the lines of a rogues and villains pack 2. Maybe mercenary ships like mandalorian crusader corvettes or some semi affiliated pirate mother ship or sector security force. I just don't see an outright 3rd faction.