Does everyone forget I mentioned he carries a device that let's him use echo location(source visual book).

Gif of Chirrut for illustration purposes.

It'd be kind of nice if they called out something like an echo box in the freaking movie/book.

Instead, we have a scene in which it zooms in on his head and ears and then pans around to different movements and sounds made by the Troopers, which gives off a very Daredevil-esque "I have extranormal senses" kind of feel. This is something we saw months earlier when Kanan used his force enhanced senses to fight Maul right after being blinded.

In the book from what I keep seeing here on this forum, they refer to Chirrut's hearing as almost supernatural , as if the writer doesn't quite want you to believe he is or isn't able to use the force in some way.

Instead of getting definitive evidence either way, we get a picture book that says "this stuff on his person does things". I didn't see any evidence of it doing anything other than adding to his overall look in the movie. 1 Stray line about an echolocation box would have been enough. Instead, the character consistently talks about the force as if he can feel it, has perceptions about people whom he has just met that are spot on, can hear kyber crystals like Ahsoka a trained force user, is able to shoot with extremely deadly accuracy.

If he isn't able to "use the force", then the force must be "using him".

LFL is being stupid. If they want to make sure people don't confuse Chirrut with a jedi they can just flat out say "he is force sensitive but he isn't a jedi" i don't think anyone would misunderstand such a sentence. Besides, as Groggygolem said, they never mention, even by mistake, an echo locator or other technological gizoms that help him fight, instead they focus on his physical senses and his talking about the Force. Then they tell us he isn't force sensitive and uses technology? No thank you, that's super sloppy writing, and the cure is worse than the desease.

btw, according to a canon book Ahsoka can hear the kyber crystals "singing" while non force sensitive cannot; so if Chirrut does hear the kyber crystal he must be force sensitive as well.

**comment removed because I just realized I really don't give a **** how a boring character in a boring movie did the things he did, and don't feel like nitpicking it anymore**

Wouldn't describe him as boring I actually like him more if he isn't FS because it makes what he says similar to the mantras you hear from other annoying religious zealots , yet, we accept what he says , I think LFL was playing a joke on us, although Donnie Yen had a lot of input and decided he would be blind.

I would describe him as boring, because I found him boring, and I found the movie boring. Not because he was force sensitive, or using a sonic locator like you suggest, but because he was boring. As to his mind numbing mantra, I didn't accept what he said, I also didn't find it all that interesting. He said it so fast, and so often that it just became noise. Anything said like that, for as long as that, becomes sonic chaff. I was actively wishing he would shut up while watching the movie. And his "heroic sacrifice" moment, where I'm supposed to feel some emotion about how he walks out there in his faith....all I thought was "Well that was *bleeping* stupid." But then again, there won't be many positive things about that movie that I have to say, as I didn't enjoy it at all. Or, well that's not accurate, I didn't find it all that entertaining. I was frequently annoyed and frustrated with the directorial choices they made, the editing, the acting, pretty much every level of it. Once in a while a scene might make me chuckle (like when Chirrut comments about a bag being put on his head), and a few scenes I thought had some good feeling to them. But for the most part, it felt like star wars fan fiction made into a full length movie, just to explain a "plot hole" that doesn't really exist. So you can argue about how Chirrut did what he did all day, I still don't care.

And if LFL was having a joke with us, by presenting him as a force sensitive, and providing NO evidence that he was anything else, and then, in an entirely separate bit of source material, say that his actions are something entirely different , the LFL are a bunch of a**holes, who apparently like trolling star wars fans.

LFL is being stupid. If they want to make sure people don't confuse Chirrut with a jedi they can just flat out say "he is force sensitive but he isn't a jedi" i don't think anyone would misunderstand such a sentence. Besides, as Groggygolem said, they never mention, even by mistake, an echo locator or other technological gizoms that help him fight, instead they focus on his physical senses and his talking about the Force. Then they tell us he isn't force sensitive and uses technology? No thank you, that's super sloppy writing, and the cure is worse than the desease.

btw, according to a canon book Ahsoka can hear the kyber crystals "singing" while non force sensitive cannot; so if Chirrut does hear the kyber crystal he must be force sensitive as well.

He doesnt hear them singing, he hears its harmonic ( resonant frequency if you will, try to think of the vibration of a quaetz crystal, this description basically means it gives off a tone , it doesnt sing)

Quote - Designed as a symbolic source of inner illumination, it also allows Chirrut to better gauge where the end of the staff is, as he can hear both the battery and crystal harmonic.”

The heck is the battery for? It's literally a stick. There is nothing electronic about a stick, therefore where does the battery fit into the equation? One could surmise maybe the harmonic and the singing is the same thing and that only those with enhanced senses would be able to hear them.

Again no idea, but if it was to power the crystal so that it could be heard , then he wouldnt be able to hear the tone of jyns crystal. Perhaps it was to power it so that it could be used as a lamp .

Btw if it wasnt for the additional source material that everyone is so keen to argue against,you technically coukdnt say he was blind , he had white eyes and claimed to be blind at one point in the film, but we know he is blind, because the marketing and the people at LFL told us so. Based on what we see in the film he could equally have been conning everyone inti thinking he was blind, from what you see in the film, or that he was partially sighted, this would definitely be the viewpoint if you adhere to Occam's razor

This seems like a case of his nature being changed during the process of creating the movie and out-of-movie materials being used in an attempt to redefine something that's actually perfectly clear on screen.

Again no idea, but if it was to power the crystal so that it could be heard , then he wouldnt be able to hear the tone of jyns crystal. Perhaps it was to power it so that it could be used as a lamp .

Btw if it wasnt for the additional source material that everyone is so keen to argue against,you technically coukdnt say he was blind , he had white eyes and claimed to be blind at one point in the film, but we know he is blind, because the marketing and the people at LFL told us so. Based on what we see in the film he could equally have been conning everyone inti thinking he was blind, from what you see in the film, or that he was partially sighted, this would definitely be the viewpoint if you adhere to Occam's razor

Except this is a universe where there is literal magic energy fields that can be empirically proven to work, that has been shown to give people perception beyond their normal senses. If this was in the real world, where there is no such thing as magic, or the Force, or supernatural, then your argument would have merit. However, this is Star Wars, so you can't Occam Razor it, because the Force DOES do stuff like let the blind see, let people shoot lightning from their hands, let people lift other people with their minds, or choke a chump from across a solar system via video conference, etc etc.

So no, Occam's Razor is trumped by Lucas' Lightsaber. Which basically lets them handwave anything away with "Because the Force". And since we have canon examples of blind jedi being able to see, and shoot people with guns, and all kinds of other crazy things, because the Force, that doesn't exclude Chirrut from doing it for the same reason.

**comment removed because I just realized I really don't give a **** how a boring character in a boring movie did the things he did, and don't feel like nitpicking it anymore**

Wouldn't describe him as boring I actually like him more if he isn't FS because it makes what he says similar to the mantras you hear from other annoying religious zealots , yet, we accept what he says , I think LFL was playing a joke on us, although Donnie Yen had a lot of input and decided he would be blind.

I would describe him as boring, because I found him boring, and I found the movie boring. Not because he was force sensitive, or using a sonic locator like you suggest, but because he was boring. As to his mind numbing mantra, I didn't accept what he said, I also didn't find it all that interesting. He said it so fast, and so often that it just became noise. Anything said like that, for as long as that, becomes sonic chaff. I was actively wishing he would shut up while watching the movie. And his "heroic sacrifice" moment, where I'm supposed to feel some emotion about how he walks out there in his faith....all I thought was "Well that was *bleeping* stupid." But then again, there won't be many positive things about that movie that I have to say, as I didn't enjoy it at all. Or, well that's not accurate, I didn't find it all that entertaining. I was frequently annoyed and frustrated with the directorial choices they made, the editing, the acting, pretty much every level of it. Once in a while a scene might make me chuckle (like when Chirrut comments about a bag being put on his head), and a few scenes I thought had some good feeling to them. But for the most part, it felt like star wars fan fiction made into a full length movie, just to explain a "plot hole" that doesn't really exist. So you can argue about how Chirrut did what he did all day, I still don't care.

And if LFL was having a joke with us, by presenting him as a force sensitive, and providing NO evidence that he was anything else, and then, in an entirely separate bit of source material, say that his actions are something entirely different , the LFL are a bunch of a**holes, who apparently like trolling star wars fans.

I would with that actually. Aside from the initial three, I didn't really feel much for the cast of rogue 1. I liked the broad perspective; but I felt that Cirrut and Blizk (or Blitz? I can't even remember his name) were fairly forgetable characters. They are the DnD defination of new players joining the party. "Hello, I see your lacking a fo- I mean marial artist." "No, but you look pretty respectable, fancy joining the team?" "Sure, since my temple was ransacked I don't see any particlar problem, oh and I also have my friend Ja- I mean Blizk," "What does he do?" "Autofires every day, here's his character sheet. Jury rig, autofire, the works. Those group of stormtroopers won't be a problem anymore!" and he then proceeds never to preform marital arts again as the other guy mows down all the minons.

I mean seriously, wouldn't have hurt them a little bit to all be in the same squad (pilot excluded for obvious reasons) just so we got a better feel for how they behave? I tire of them "assembling a squad of missfits because guardians of the galaxy did it" kind of way. That trick mainly worked because it was a comedy and action movie. It doesn't quite have the same impact outside that.

That, and I don't really think that the exhaust port was necessarily a bad weakness, No one but space wizards could have pulled that shot off. XD

That and I'm still not entirely sure whether killing the entire cast was a good idea. There are plenty of reasons why Rebels wouldn't have returned to Yavin immediately afterward. I am tried of the hesitancy to breed any heroes in this era beyond the Falcon's guys.

This seems like a case of his nature being changed during the process of creating the movie and out-of-movie materials being used in an attempt to redefine something that's actually perfectly clear on screen.

This is my point it isnt perfrctly clear on screen, as much as I wish it was also, I always went into the film thinking he was force sensitive becuase of reading qnd hearing the phrase attuned. The echo box was something that was created prior to the film being produced , I think you underestimate how much thought goes into the costumes qnd gadgets in these films now. Its purpose was defined prior to it even being made, Gareth Edwards made it clear that the main portaganists were not going to be force sensitive from before filming began, in fact I was shocked to find that Lyra Erso was.

This seems like a case of his nature being changed during the process of creating the movie and out-of-movie materials being used in an attempt to redefine something that's actually perfectly clear on screen.

This is my point it isnt perfrctly clear on screen, as much as I wish it was also, I always went into the film thinking he was force sensitive becuase of reading qnd hearing the phrase attuned. The echo box was something that was created prior to the film being produced , I think you underestimate how much thought goes into the costumes qnd gadgets in these films now. Its purpose was defined prior to it even being made, Gareth Edwards made it clear that the main portaganists were not going to be force sensitive from before filming began, in fact I was shocked to find that Lyra Erso was.

The main protagonists. Here's the problem. For me it means Cassian, Jyn and K2, stop. Everyone else, including Chirrut, Baze and Bodhi are non protagonist figures. Very important, but not enough to be protagonist. So Chirrut can be FS without problems. And use the echolocator for moving around normally, but when he fights he probably activates sense. So the echolocator is a help but not the main reason he is so good in combat. Besides i think you give too much credit to visual books, sometimes those who write them make the stuff up to sounds cool and technological.

This seems like a case of his nature being changed during the process of creating the movie and out-of-movie materials being used in an attempt to redefine something that's actually perfectly clear on screen.

This is my point it isnt perfrctly clear on screen, as much as I wish it was also, I always went into the film thinking he was force sensitive becuase of reading qnd hearing the phrase attuned. The echo box was something that was created prior to the film being produced , I think you underestimate how much thought goes into the costumes qnd gadgets in these films now. Its purpose was defined prior to it even being made, Gareth Edwards made it clear that the main portaganists were not going to be force sensitive from before filming began, in fact I was shocked to find that Lyra Erso was.

There is no evidence of the echo box on screen, though. That's like saying there are Ilum crystals in A New Hope because some non-movie source talks about them. If it's not in the movie, it's supplemental material.

I would with that actually. Aside from the initial three, I didn't really feel much for the cast of rogue 1. I liked the broad perspective; but I felt that Cirrut and Blizk (or Blitz? I can't even remember his name) were fairly forgetable characters. They are the DnD defination of new players joining the party. "Hello, I see your lacking a fo- I mean marial artist." "No, but you look pretty respectable, fancy joining the team?" "Sure, since my temple was ransacked I don't see any particlar problem, oh and I also have my friend Ja- I mean Blizk," "What does he do?" "Autofires every day, here's his character sheet. Jury rig, autofire, the works. Those group of stormtroopers won't be a problem anymore!" and he then proceeds never to preform marital arts again as the other guy mows down all the minons.

Oh the cast definitely felt like a typical roleplaying party. Single defining trait, to the exclusion of others, minimal backstory (if any), and very little communication between them. The guy with the big gun doesn't talk, because he just wants to shoot things and prove his build is OP. The guy playing the girl doesn't really know how girls act (sorry but Felicity is so wooden as Jyn she's almost a droid), so he just sort of muddles through his scenes, feeling awkward about having to roleplay a human being with reactions. Seriously it felt like I was watching a friend of mine, who always plays female PC's, when he tries to actually roleplay. It was as amusing as it was sad. So yeah, really spot on presentation of a gaming group....not really good presentation of a grizzled group of soldiers to make me feel their plight.

I mean seriously, wouldn't have hurt them a little bit to all be in the same squad (pilot excluded for obvious reasons) just so we got a better feel for how they behave? I tire of them "assembling a squad of missfits because guardians of the galaxy did it" kind of way. That trick mainly worked because it was a comedy and action movie.

Eh, I don't really mind that, as it's hardly a trend that was started by Guardians. New Hope did it. A farm boy, a rogue, a noble, an alien, an old wiseman, and 2 robot comic reliefs. That's about as "squad of misfits" as it gets. I would say they weren't copying Guardians, because they weren't really trying to be funny. While there was some comic relief, it was very minimal, and I was fine with that. I didn't find most of it funny but I didn't think it was out of tone for the movie.

That and I'm still not entirely sure whether killing the entire cast was a good idea. There are plenty of reasons why Rebels wouldn't have returned to Yavin immediately afterward. I am tried of the hesitancy to breed any heroes in this era beyond the Falcon's guys.

YMMV, but I was glad they killed them off. I was actually saying, before the movie came out, that I hoped they all died, just for the "war is he**" kind of feeling. I just didn't care when they died. I seriously had no emotional investment in any of the main characters, and their deaths were met with either indifference, or frustration in how they were executed. I honestly had more emotional investment in that Rebel soldier, who was screaming through the door, while Vader approached, trying to get someone to take the data drive. He had maybe 2-3 minutes of screen time, and I still felt more emotional reaction to his plight, than the 2+ hours of the main characters. When an extra gets more tear jerky feels from me than your trained actors, you're writing is terrible.

As to the thing about heroes in this era that aren't the main trilogy heroes, the problem I think is because of the fans. The "Where were they if they were alive in New Hope? Why didn't we see them sitting right next to Luke, with Leia on their lap and Chewie as a footrest? They should've been just as important! Why weren't they there?!?!" That's entirely why, I think, that they bothered with that stupid nod to Rebels, and having Hera's name said of the PA system at the base. Just so fans could go "*squee!* Something from another canon is showing up in this canon! *nerdgasm*" I personally don't care for that crap, and didn't even notice them say her name, nor did I see the Ghost in the flight of ships. Mostly because I am not an obsessed fan who has to inhale every scrap of data about everything Star Wars, who has to pause on every frame of the movie and catalogue the serial numbers of the ships so they can cross reference them to some database of ships, arguing for days in a forum about what the production year of certain ships was, and how this conflicts with movie canon, etc etc. I just don't care that much. I love Star Wars, but that level of obsession to anything disturbs the he** out of me, and I avoid it at all costs.

But millions of fans do give that much of a shi* about it, and thus they have to preserve the sanctity of the original trilogy, by not letting anything spill over. Because apparently Star Wars fans are incapable of comprehending when something is made 40 years prior to what you are watching, there is no way to insert it in the original (without lots of terrible editing and cgi). And they apparently don't understand that just because the heroes of one show were around, it doesn't mean they would be in the same freaking scenes as the main characters.

With a few exceptions, based on how they are presented, I just chalk it up to "it's a big **** galaxy and they have other things going on elsewhere." Some characters, I do state "if they were alive at this time, they would be here." kind of stuff. But just because a movie makes them the protagonists, doesn't mean they are special snowflake enough for anything else.

This seems like a case of his nature being changed during the process of creating the movie and out-of-movie materials being used in an attempt to redefine something that's actually perfectly clear on screen.

This is my point it isnt perfrctly clear on screen, as much as I wish it was also, I always went into the film thinking he was force sensitive becuase of reading qnd hearing the phrase attuned. The echo box was something that was created prior to the film being produced , I think you underestimate how much thought goes into the costumes qnd gadgets in these films now. Its purpose was defined prior to it even being made, Gareth Edwards made it clear that the main portaganists were not going to be force sensitive from before filming began, in fact I was shocked to find that Lyra Erso was.

There is no evidence of the echo box on screen, though. That's like saying there are Ilum crystals in A New Hope because some non-movie source talks about them. If it's not in the movie, it's supplemental material.

Edit- oh and if you look close enough you can see the actual holes laid out to look like some sort of speaker amplifier set up that looks like it gives off sound (ultra sonic maybe?. Its not just a device listed in some book, its part of his costume.

I found this on another website which seems to have collated much of the info I've found in a lot of the canon material for Chirrut.

Chirrut Îmwe's Backstory – Star Wars: Rogue One Lore

December 26, 2016

TheCancrizans

Born on the desert moon of Jedha, around 52 years before the events of Rogue One, Chirrut Îmwe believed that all living things were connected through the Force and that the Force was always with him. Consequently, he joined the Guardians of the Whills, a near-extinct order that sided neither with the Jedi nor the Sith. As such, he loyally protected the Temple of the Kyber in Jedha City. However, due to the Galactic Empire's hunger for kyber crystals, the temple was ransacked, forcing the guardians out into the streets. Due to his blindness, the origins of which he never spoke of, Chirrut struggled the most to acclimate to a new life. Thankfully, fellow guardian Baze Malbus was never far from his best friend, acting as his protector. Despite this, and his incurable disability due to the simplicity of Jedha medicine, Îmwe was a highly skilled duellist. The warrior monk practiced zama-shiwo, a Jedha martial art also known as “the inward eye of the outward hand”. The main focus of which involved the perfection of physical awareness, so conscious accounting of a body's position, contact and internal functions. It was said that masters of these techniques could alter their heart rate and oxygen intake to produce seemingly supernatural feats. As a result, using crucial information from his remaining senses, Chirrut was able to move with pinpoint precision through his imagined surroundings. In fact, he often took advantage of his disability to overcome underestimating enemies.

Taking a closer look at his equipment and clothing, Chirrut equipped a reforged gold Jedha pendant of an ancient starbird symbol only recently modified by the Rebel Alliance, a traditional charcoal kasaya robe, and an echo-box transmitter to assist in situational awareness. He also wielded a flame-hardened uneti-wood walking staff. The top of which was capped with a metal lamp containing kyber silver. This not only helped Îmwe gauge the end of the staff, as he could hear both the battery and crystal harmonic, it also symbolised an inner illumination. Equally as iconic, Chirrut utilised a handcrafted lightbow, which was more powerful than a heavy rifle. These weapons were built by the Guardians of the Whills upon completion of the seventh duan – marking their progression to physical perfection. The lightbow was a complicated form of the Wookiee bowcaster. Consequently, operating in a similar manner, the limbs of the bow extended on articulated risers, and each was tipped with a polariser array that drew a charged particle round from the serving barrel. The weapon also consisted of a telescopic sight rest, a recycled E-11 blaster handle, a stabilising handle, a flashback suppressor rim, and a case-hardened emitter barrel.

Source - http://www.thecancrizans.com/single-post/2016/12/26/Chirrut-Îmwes-Backstory-–-Star-Wars-Rogue-One-Lore

Got another link to give more info on it that presumes more influence with the force , which is how I personally view it, that the force can step in when required to do what is required (shown in game by DP flips), because I certainly dont believe that blind luck helped him at the end (selfish monk flipped all the lightside Destiny Points anf this led to a TPk)

http://screenrant.com/star-wars-rogue-one-chirrut-imwe-blind-powers-force/

Finally here is confirmation that that the whole backstory for Donnie Yens character was and has been fully fleshed out way beyond what we know even from this thread in an interview with Donnie Yen.

Home Interviews Interviews A Lengthy Backstory Exists For Donnie Yen’s Chirrut Imwe By Justin LaSalata - December 15, 2016, 8:56 PM, GMT Rogue One features some serious action sequences involving the blind warrior Chirrut Imwe played by martial arts master Donnie Yen. Chances are this character will become a fan favorite in a relatively short amount of time given his uniqueness and just plain badassery. But will fans be treated to more appearances of Imwe in future Star Wars mediums? Yen states his character has a pretty extensive backstory that goes well beyond what will be shown on screen in Rogue One. “THAT’S A BACKSTORY ACTUALLY, WE DID A LOT OF BACK AND FORTH DISCUSSIONS AND RESEARCH BETWEEN ACTORS, PRODUCERS, AND DIRECTORS SO THAT IS SOMETHING, IT’S PROBABLY (MOTIONS A LARGE BOOK) THIS THICK OF MATERIALS AND RESEARCH, BUT I’M NOT ALLOWED TO TALK ABOUT IT.” THAT BACKSTORY ALSO INCLUDES HOW THE CHARACTER CAME TO BE BLIND, AND WHEN ASKED FOR FURTHER DETAILS, HE AGAIN SAID: “THAT IS ALSO BACKSTORY, AND I’M NOT ALLOWED TO TALK ABOUT IT (LAUGHS).”

This article was first reported on Jedi News UK. Read more at http://www.jedinews.co.uk/interviews/articles/lengthy-backstory-exists-donnie-yens-chirrut-imwe/ .

This seems like a case of his nature being changed during the process of creating the movie and out-of-movie materials being used in an attempt to redefine something that's actually perfectly clear on screen.

This is my point it isnt perfrctly clear on screen, as much as I wish it was also, I always went into the film thinking he was force sensitive becuase of reading qnd hearing the phrase attuned. The echo box was something that was created prior to the film being produced , I think you underestimate how much thought goes into the costumes qnd gadgets in these films now. Its purpose was defined prior to it even being made, Gareth Edwards made it clear that the main portaganists were not going to be force sensitive from before filming began, in fact I was shocked to find that Lyra Erso was.

There is no evidence of the echo box on screen, though. That's like saying there are Ilum crystals in A New Hope because some non-movie source talks about them. If it's not in the movie, it's supplemental material.

Look at the gif earlier in the thread the box is there, clearly stralped to the front of his hody.

Edit- oh and if you look close enough you can see the actual holes laid out to look like some sort of speaker amplifier set up that looks like it gives off sound (ultra sonic maybe?. Its not just a device listed in some book, its part of his costume.

There's some apparatus on his costume, yes, but there's nothing showing it's this echo box thing in the movie. The movie doesn't give any indication that there is anything going on with that part of the costume, or that something like an echo box is a thing in Star Wars.

LFL is being stupid. If they want to make sure people don't confuse Chirrut with a jedi they can just flat out say "he is force sensitive but he isn't a jedi" i don't think anyone would misunderstand such a sentence. Besides, as Groggygolem said, they never mention, even by mistake, an echo locator or other technological gizoms that help him fight, instead they focus on his physical senses and his talking about the Force. Then they tell us he isn't force sensitive and uses technology? No thank you, that's super sloppy writing, and the cure is worse than the desease.

btw, according to a canon book Ahsoka can hear the kyber crystals "singing" while non force sensitive cannot; so if Chirrut does hear the kyber crystal he must be force sensitive as well.

I'll be the jerk that disagrees with you on that one.

There have been enough newbie posts on this forum and others where people define all good force users as "Jedi" and all bad ones as "Sith" that yes, I think some nub reporter would make the same mistake, publish it, and it would take off like wildfire. There would be tons of poorly written articles from Fox News to CNN all talking about the "blind Jedi" and when the movie hit and Chirrit fought with a stick, didn't wear a brown robe, didn't bust out a saber, and didn't demonstrate obvious force powers, the unwashed masses would be confused and angry for totally dumb reasons, but confused and angry none the less.

I agree that it's sloppy. I agree that not mentioning a tech solution is dumb. I agree that the character as a non-Jedi force sensitive works really well and presents a facet of the universe not well explored in canon. I agree that Chirrit being a non-Jedi force sensitive makes just as much sense as Han shooting first.

But, we're not Lucasfilm, and we don't have to worry about bad reporting (and yeah, it's getting worse and worse it seems, and I do say that with some professional experience in the field) hurting our bottom line, especially when they already made the risky move of replacing a well known and long dead actor with a digital homunculous. Lucasfilm was taking a lot fo risks with Rogue One, so as much as I hate the half-muled "force attuned but not sensitive" explanation, I at least can see why it happened.

As a side note this is also why I despise the idea of trying to make non-story material "canon." The essential guides, the visual dictionaries, the video games and so on have always played it a little fast and loose with continuity, I don't feel it's worth it to try and canonize them now...

I will add one more thing before I bow out because im mostly repeating myself now, but the film does make a point of , pointing out that he was using his hearing for the stormtroopper battle. Also in connection with the Ahsoka hearing the "singing" who is to say that ,yes, jedi can hear it if they know what to listen for ,but they are hearing it not through the force but with their force boosted hearing, IE the sound is thwre , just that anyone with normal hearing cannot hear it, however, if someone with "almost supernatural" (there is that word again) hearing comes along, perhaps they can hear it to.

In the end , unlike others I went into the film expecting him to be Foece sensitve, I cam out thinking he was Force Sensitve, the difference seems to be that when the people that created it say he isn't, then I can accwpt that, especially after taking the time to rewatch it (albeot only once since being told, twice in total) and bearing that in mind while reading the novel, when watched and read subjectively , I could find no evidence to thw contrary.

I can understand people believing him to have been written as a Force Sensitive, but it makes little sense when those writers have quite plainly said no. I know we fans are a passionate bunch, but ahould this fact change how we enjoyed the movie, not one iota in my place, a I loved it, others didnt, it certainly didnt hood a candle to the character development we saw in TFA, I felt more for them than I did R1, but then the same could be said the other way if you compare stories between the two. I felt they should have left leia facing the other way at the end as the CGI drew ne completely out of the filn, whereas I didnt mind Tarkin so much. I had probably more connection with Galen as a result of reading Cafalyst, but reading a book shouldn't be required for your enjoyment of a filn, but Roogue One was definitely better for me having read it. This all being said I will bow out of this one.

If anyone does want to continue friendly debate on it with me Id be happy to take it ro PM's but anymore here and it will feel like Im ramming LFL's stance on it (note that its not necessarily how I would have called it , I wouldn't have had him blind in the first place to avoid these assumptions, if they wanted us guessing at it they should have left it like that, but if they wanted him non force sensitive they should have done more to make that clear in the film , with more than a 2 second clip to show he was listening, they did the same with Kanan, and he definitely was doing it through his sensitivity - or was he)

Remember, as CI isn't Force-sensitive, a droid with broken optical sensors should be able to do everything he does.

Remember, this is a GAME. Anyone's adherence to RAW or canonical references doesn't need anyone else's approval, support, LIKEs, etc., beyond their own play table. The massive rainstorm on the Chirrut Imwe Parade has now invoked other forum members' medical history (and without their acknowledgment in said thread), trolling and heavily dismissive opinions, and outright refusal to consider other canonical sources or ideas.

Is this the best we got? Is this a welcoming community? Can we not agree to disagree without tearing down someone else or their ideas? Just...wow...

So Cunning 5, Perception 5, Brawn 4, Agility 4, Coordination 5, Knowledge Lore, Melee (a lot), Coordination Dodge. But 2 Setback on all tasks normally related to vision (it would have been 4 without the echo box).

I have always liked the character, this is just giving him more depth which i like.

I think it's meant to be undefined - in the movie, the only thing that is explicitly said is that he isn't a JEDI. I think plenty of people can use the force to some degree without realizing they are doing it. The whole point of the FFG system is that there are numerous ways to build a character concept and none of them are really wrong (which is why they don't stat canon characters in the first place). Also, it would just cause people to argue about something that no one will ever fully agree on.

Personally, I saw him as using the Force passively (possibly without realizing it). Otherwise he is just a groan-worthy Daredevil rip off that really has no place in Star Wars. Star Wars is largely a mundane place where nobody is all that special...except when the Force is involved. The Force is the only reasonable way a human could do all the things we see. Frankly if a fully-trained Jedi like Kanan needs to use the Force to fit the archetype, then some rando monk needs it too.

I would say in game terms that he is using Sense and Foresight, but always committing his Force dice to the Sense upgrade or the Foresight one that keeps it activated. I'd probably put him as a the Martial artist/Marauder going into Force-Sensitive Exile (as the church of the force people have been kicked out of their temple and need to lay low in the same way the other force-sensitive types do).

That said, I can see the argument for well used Destiny flips to explain what he does in game terms. Either way, he is using the Force to accomplish his greatest feats.

Otherwise he is just a groan-worthy Daredevil rip off that really has no place in Star Wars.

I think that cinches it for me, too.

As for the whole Attuned vs. Sensitive argument, it's kind of tomato, tomahto for the most part. All that an Attuned seems to be is a weak Force Sensitive. Which is fine, I just wish LFL would have deigned to make an explicit distinction for us.

(sorry but Felicity is so wooden as Jyn she's almost a droid),

Meh, she was better than Perpetually Angry Rey. Each time I watch TFA the more I notice she only has like two facial expressions, angry and sour.

Otherwise he is just a groan-worthy Daredevil rip off that really has no place in Star Wars.

I think that cinches it for me, too.

As for the whole Attuned vs. Sensitive argument, it's kind of tomato, tomahto for the most part. All that an Attuned seems to be is a weak Force Sensitive. Which is fine, I just wish LFL would have deigned to make an explicit distinction for us.

Yeah, this is what I would go with too. They seem to be trying to say that he is Force Sensitive but has had no training and has no active ability with the Force, more passive user, but without actually saying that. I'm guessing its probably just miscommunication or bad information given to the person who wrote that, perhaps he was working from an earlier version of the script?

And I think you'll find its tomaYto not tomaHto, fiend!

(sorry but Felicity is so wooden as Jyn she's almost a droid),

Meh, she was better than Perpetually Angry Rey. Each time I watch TFA the more I notice she only has like two facial expressions, angry and sour.

Eh, I disagree. I thought Daisy Ridley was very expressive, sometimes overly expressive. She had moments of wonder/joy on her face, like when she bypassed that thing in the Falcon, and turned to Han with a "I did a good thing!" kid expression. She looked afraid plenty of times, etc. I do agree that when she had the angry/sour face, it was Cranked Up to Eleven, but I think that's mostly due to Daisy Ridley's face. She's got a very wide mouth, with a lot of distinct teeth. I don't really know how to describe it without it sounding like I'm criticizing her looks, because I'm not, but she's very....mouthy, i guess is the best way to put it. When she smiles or grimaces, she shows ALL of her teeth, her mouth opens really wide and expressively. And it can be a bit, offputting, so I get the criticism you are making. I just disagree with the statement that those are the only expressions she ever exhibited in the movie.