...overly in the PCs direction?

I'm not wanting to get lots of TPK (I think that our last one was almost 2 years ago when we were all learning D4) but it seems that combat, particularly ranged combat is very slanted in the PCs direction. This has led me to thinking that either

a) we're doing it right and just fighting fairly wimpy enemies right now

b) we're doing something wrong

I looked over the rulebook many times and am convinced it's not "b" so by defauly (unless someone has something else that they can add) is that it's "a". Heck, when an AGI 5 character hits someone with a crossbow they are putting out a damage potential of 11 and that's on a normal hit. Factor in that cultists and little beastmen have a low TOU+SK they just go down in droves. One player last night commented something to the effect of why not take crossbows, we're murdering everyone with them and that got me thinking more about it.

I have been thinking of incorporating some ranged capable enemies into the mix soon and we'll see how that goes. Orc and goblin archers are coming up, but have I been too light on them with the enemies? Too many henchmen (not any weaker but die more quickly)? Other thoughts?

Thanks,

Mark

Hmm...

Not sure that you are doing anything wrong, but at what range are the NPCs starting out? If all your combats are starting out at long range so that the PCs get a couple of rounds of missile fire in before they have to worry about melee, then perhaps you are using too many henchmen. If they are at medium range, the NPCs can burn a wound to take an extra maneuver and get into close combat on a single turn. Once engaged, the PCs shouldn't be using crossbows unless they have the close-quarters shot action. Since crossbows have the reload action, they can only load and fire if they don't take any other maneuvers, or burn fatigue, so if the PCs want to try to stay out of melee and keep shooting, they will quickly get too much fatigue.

In my game this week I had 3 thugs with hand weapons attack the 3 PCs and they were backed up by a guy with a crossbow. Two of my PCs have ranged weapons and one prefers not to get into melee. Just having one ranged weapon armed foe seemed to make things quite a bit more difficult for them. I didn't kill anyone, but they definitely didn't enjoy being on the receiving end of ranged fire. It helps that I'm using the house rule that firing into melee causes party tension to increase, while the NPC shooter had no qualms about endangering his hirelings.

Consider using misfortune dice for modifiers if the enemies are doing anything but standing still on a perfectly sunny, clear, and windless day. You can assume that the default challenge difficulty for shooting ranged weapons is for hitting a non-moving target such as a barrel or sign post.

If the target is moving (or staying in one area but interacting with an object), consider using one or more misfortune (black) dice to represent the difficulty of hitting a moving target.

Also - environmental conditions are going to factor in; Is it cloudy, are there shadows moving over the battle area, is there a wind or a fog or heat shimmer or snowfall? As the GM, you can add misfortune dice to make it a bit more hard to hot those targets without being heavy-handed. Just my opinion.

I think that you both have good points and are things that I need to start exploring. Since we're new to the system I wanted to make sure that we have the mechanics right before thinking too much about modifiers (challenge dice) but those things make sense.

Two of my guys are very good about maneuvering to disengage and then fire and sometimes burnign a fatigue to reload, or using a repeating crossbow. I think that the rather weak nature of the enemies that I've been using up until now has also been an issue so I'll be adjusting that.

Thanks,

Mark

i have a good solution.

Make them fight a giant that has a giant crossbow with a damage rating of 10 and a critical rating of one.... that will show them! HAHAHAHAHAHAHA =P

I've seen this happen in many game systems. What always pissed me off as both a player and GM is that you got some wizard and ranger plunking from a distance while everyone else is down low getting hosed.

So now I do the following (and my players know it):

1. If the PC's do it, the enemies will too

2. If you've got a guy out in the range, chances are some assassin is going to sneak up behind him..eventually. Just like any sniper situation: the soldiers focus their firepower on them. Nothing worse than being a sniper and the enemy throws several people out just to kill YOU!

Another thing to consider is that RARELY should there be a clear shot for a ranged combatant: I'd give a misfortune die or 6 in a the forest, winding city streets (especailly with bystanders), The combat modifiers really should be used if you're having trouble in this instance.

jh

mac40k said:

I'm SO stealing this!!! It is brilliant use of the party tension gauge! Up until now I've been tossing in a misfortune die and 2banes = hit someone else - I may throw this in as well! Thank you.

That's funny: I've always felt that bows and crossbows were always nearly useless in most other RPGs...

I am thinking that the abstract movement system and lack of a grid also compounds the issue. I other systems with detailed terrain, its much easier to "sell" cover, line of sight, concealment, movement penalties, ect, ect. In 3e, the PCs are saying "What do you mean I cant see him, he is only two chits away!"

Paranoid Android said:

You can't see an opponent that is at medium range if I say you are in a dense forest where the trees are blocking line of sight to anything further than close range. What part of that is hard to sell? It's a shame your players lack imagination and can't envision the scene you are describing without seeing it all drawn out on a map sheet or represented by table top terrain.

After thinking about it some more I've come to the conclusion that most of my problems with balance, of what I thought were problems, come down to me. I've not used any monsters with ranged weapons of thier own yet. I've not made as good of use of active defense cards for the monsters (been more focused on dumping a load of extra ACE dice into the pools). Been using too many henchmen and not enough 'real' monsters and have not been thinking enough about extra challenge dice for various situations. I'll report back how our next game goes and hopefully will not be reporting that we had a TPK due to too strong of monster ranged combat

mark