Looking for a bit of clarity if a player decides to retreat all their ships in round 4 or 5 of a battle.

Does that end the battle there and then?

What about remaining squads?

What about remaining objectives that could be achieved, e.g. Destroying stations in Show of Force?

The standard rules apply. The ships count as destroyed for the battle (just not for repair/refit).

So if you have no ships, you "Lose". At the end of the Turn. Squadrons also count as being destroyed, as per standard game rules - and there is no Hyperspace exception for them, so they will be scarred.

And same as tabling someone on turn 4 in a regular game - the game ends "immediately" at the end of the turn. There is no chance to grab further objective points.

It does make it interesting for show of force. Apparently the Empire won't destroy stations while they're completely helpless.

Also, it makes another interesting use for the interdictor, using it to keep the last of the rebel ships from escaping so the stations can go down before the game ends. Fortunately the dictor is usually tanky enough to cop a few rounds of shooting (without needing to retaliate) for long enough to ensure the job gets done.

Thankfully the Rebels (who have no access to the experimental refits) don't suffer from this problem as (ironically) any ship that jumps to hyperspace in their special scenario will score them some resource points anyway.

"Jettison the cargo and make the jump to light speed!"

Thankfully the Rebels (who have no access to the experimental refits) don't suffer from this problem

I do so enjoy how they Future-Proofed the Rules though

Couldn't agree more

So the ships can escape becoming scarred, but the fighters can't. Really?

Seems like it, but you can unscar squadrons for cheap, even aces. Half the cost of even the priciest squadron hero is in the low to mid teens.

So the ships can escape becoming scarred, but the fighters can't. Really?

There's no rules for Hyperspacing Squadrons out, after all.

If you have a load of squads then hyperspacing out will be a very costly event. I think I may rule that squads don't get scarred as there's no rules to say what should happen to them. I guess it is just down to interpretation and what feels right for balance.

If you have a load of squads then hyperspacing out will be a very costly event. I think I may rule that squads don't get scarred as there's no rules to say what should happen to them. I guess it is just down to interpretation and what feels right for balance.

But there are rules... Well, no, there' snot. There's IMplications... I'll explain

If you Hyperspace out, the Hyperspace out rules apply to the ships that hyperspace out ....

Otherwise, APPLY STANDARD RULES TO THE GAME.

If there are any Friendly Ships alive at the end of the game, and on the table, Surviving Squadrons are Surviving ....

If there are no Friendly Ships alive at the end of the game (you Lose via Wipeout/Tabling), then , as per standard rules, those Squadrons are Scored as if they are Destroyed, so what's wrong with having them treated as destroyed ...

((EDITED TO CORRECT MY MISINTERPRETATION))

The standard rules apply. The ships count as destroyed for the battle (just not for repair/refit).

So if you have no ships, you "Lose". At the end of the Turn. Squadrons also count as being destroyed, as per standard game rules - and there is no Hyperspace exception for them, so they will be scarred.

And same as tabling someone on turn 4 in a regular game - the game ends "immediately" at the end of the turn. There is no chance to grab further objective points.

So... I was solidly in this court too, but was just challenged on it locally and I can't find rules basis in RRG, Tourney Regs, LTP, or CC for squadrons actually being destroyed at the end of a tabling. Certainly there is an implication that they are, and they're scored as though they were, but that's different than actually being destroyed for CC continuity.

The standard rules apply. The ships count as destroyed for the battle (just not for repair/refit).

So if you have no ships, you "Lose". At the end of the Turn. Squadrons also count as being destroyed, as per standard game rules - and there is no Hyperspace exception for them, so they will be scarred.

And same as tabling someone on turn 4 in a regular game - the game ends "immediately" at the end of the turn. There is no chance to grab further objective points.

So... I was solidly in this court too, but was just challenged on it locally and I can't find rules basis in RRG, Tourney Regs, LTP, or CC for squadrons actually being destroyed at the end of a tabling. Certainly there is an implication that they are, and they're scored as though they were, but that's different than actually being destroyed for CC continuity.

Yeah, I'm pretty adamant on it, because of that Scoring Implication - if they're scored as if they're destroyed, they should be destroyed.......

Mostly because I don't want those bastards getting away scott-free... If you run away, then you run away. You shouldn't get free stuff surviving....

Scarring the Squadrons is a disincentive, and shows that not everyone makes it home when you abandon them .....

...

Do I have Core Rules? On a *third* read-through. No. I don't have Rules. Only an Implication.

But I'll still stick to it, because I think its both fair and more thematic as it is....\

But yes, totally admitting wrong there... I thought there was hard-and-fast rules, and there is not. So I'll stand both corrected, and by my implication

Yeah, same here, I was quite confident they were defined as destroyed, but when I went to prove it, it's not there.

Strictly speaking they're not even scored as destroyed, because you get the flat 400 and victory regardless of the total fleet value.

Verg brought up a good point though: at that point it's probably moot because it's probably cheaper to just retire the fleet anyway...

Fighters can hyperspace in the films, so it would seem strange for all the ships to hyperspace away leaving fighters behind. Thematically it makes more sense to me if a complete retreat also included the fighters.

Fighters can hyperspace in the films, so it would seem strange for all the ships to hyperspace away leaving fighters behind. Thematically it makes more sense to me if a complete retreat also included the fighters.

Thing is, you can either make one set of blanket rules, or you can rule on it class by class for fighters...

Because only certain ones have Hyperdrives.

And typically they need to sync up with ships so they go the same way (in the films)...

Hard to hyperspace away while engaged and under fire as well..

If going for a Blanket Rule - I'd say, Make it None. There's enough to "justify" fluff wise, that they can't get away scott free - they can get away, for sure - that's why they're not just deleted ..... Yes, there are some factors that let some get away, but I feel they're outweighed by the negative factors.

This sounds like another one of those issues that each CC-playing group should decide on before starting the campaign.

My friend and I are houseruling that fighters which are canonically equipped with hyperdrives can choose to hyperspace out. They can't be engaged, and can't move, shoot, or be activated by a ship that round. Then they bug out at the same time as ships.

But that's definitely not supported by the rules as written.

My friend and I are houseruling that fighters which are canonically equipped with hyperdrives can choose to hyperspace out. They can't be engaged, and can't move, shoot, or be activated by a ship that round. Then they bug out at the same time as ships.

But that's definitely not supported by the rules as written.

I love house rules. Go for it!

To some degree this thematic house ruling that unbalances things is already precedented in the CC rules. Take the Interdictor or unique squadrons as an example. They arguably get bonus's in this campaign that aren't covered by their points cost (and hence, aren't strictly 'balanced' with everything else).

But FFG decided to put the rules in anyway, probably because it felt cool and felt right.

So, no reason you couldn't house rule the hyperdrives for squadrons stuff and have a clean conscience when some of the squads miss out on being allowed to hyperspace because, canonically, they don't have hyperdrives. I'd still run TIE fighters under those circumstances.

At 40 points to get 10 TIEs unscarred, that's what those expendable little guys are for!

I'm running a CC campaign soon (still making fleets) but I won't be having squadrons scarred if all the ships hyperspace retreat. The reason being, is that this rule will just make it so the Empire player (as all Rebel fighters have hyperdrives) will just leave one small fast ship on the table to fly in circles for two turns just to keep the TIEs from dying. That's no fun for anyone.

The only place I see that squadrons count as destroyed is in the Tournament Rules, and even that suggests if all ships are destroyed, that the winner receives 400 points for the fleet and a win. It does not state that squadrons are destroyed. Could someone point me to the rule that explicitly states squadrons are destroyed?

Looking the RR and latest FAQ, once a side's ships are gone (destroyed or jumped to Hyperspace) the game immediately ends and the opposing side wins. This to me, and the folks I've been playing with, means that for purposes of CC you can jump out, the game ends and your opponent wins. Technically, your squadrons are not destroyed and you don't need to calculate scores.