Halflings of D'haz
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Type : Character
Cost : 4
Skill : 2
Icons : CCCCC
Subtype : Monster.
Game Text : Halflings of D'haz can only commit to stories on your turn. The loser of any C struggle in which Halflings of D'haz participated must receive an additional wound for each icon by which the struggle was lost.
Flavor text :
Illustrator : Raya Golden
Collector's Info : ASK F75

Hi all, I have a few questiona and a deep concern on Halflings of D'haz:

Belkar 's cousins ruling says that the loser of any C struggle in which HoD partecipated receive one additional wound for each icon by which the struggle was lost.

[humor]

From the manual, page 9, under combat struggle :

The player who loses a Combat struggle must immediately choose one of his characters (committed to that story) to take a wound, if able.

Which means, that the loser is the opponent of the player who won the struggle with the halflings gets shanked multiple times. In real life. Be sure to call the ambulance afterwards.

[/humor]

More seriously, what do the Halflings do (because their text really mean what is explained in the [humor] part above)?

1) The loser of the struggle applies the effect of a lost combat struggle multiple times, one for each icon the struggle has been lost by (so if no characters are defending, no harm done?)

2) The loser of the struggle applies the effect once, then gives one more wound to the wounded character for each icon the combat has been lost by.

3) The loser of the struggle chooses multiple controlled characters, even not committed to the story, and wounds them.

4) None of the above.

If the text as written on the card appears as you say, then it would seem to me that the loser of the combat struggle must choose and wound an additional number of characters (or the same character multiple times if it has Toughness) that were committed to the story in which the combat struggle was lost. If there are additional wounds left over, to me it seems that they would be lost if there were no other committed characters to wound.

~ROCKMAN

Rockman said:

The text appears as I say. Sadly there are no clear reference in the rulings. I'll mail this to FFG hoping for an answer.

I'd judge 2, for multiples reasons :

First, The card does'nt states that there is another combat struggle "check" (I'm kidding, another "resolution"). So, the player-looser must only choose one character to receive 1 wounds.

Then, the text specifies that the halfling allow you to give multiple wounds, but there's no references to multiples targets.

Speaking about windows of opportunity, the text is a passiv effect, so it gonna occurs right during resolution, ney ? So, this card doesn't create another windows for a combat check, IMHO.

Yeah, looks to me that all the wounds would go onto one target, which is more than likely gonna be overkill, but at least if you stack it right the Halflings can take out a pretty tough guy.

Also, am I wrong in noting [if it wasn't already] that if your opponent manages to out-Skull you when you're playing the Halflings, YOU take the extra damage. Right?

Exactly, DorkYoung !

And Notice that if you play the C struggle resolved with the help of others icons (I'm thinking about the Chess Prodige), this effect would'nt work, as it specifies that it works only with C icons.

Heu, there is a problem with 2 words in the text : The loser and receive.

1) The loser can be understand by "The player who lose the struggle" OK
2) When you lose a C Struggle you don't receive a wound, you must DEAL a wound to one of your committed character. Receive has no meaning in struggles.

So for me, the loser must deal another wound for each icon by which the struggle was lost. You have only one C struggle but you don't deal one wound but 1 + X wounds. So you can choose one or more characters to deal your wounds (probably you will give all wounds to the same character, but in combo it can be funny to wound your own gugs).

If the idea was to wound multiple times a same target, the wording would be different, I think.

I understand the card like that, but I may be wrong.

Dadajef said:

Ok, you 're totally right saying the "loser" is a new concept and the guy who loose the struggle must enact the struggle effect, which is, by rules, choose a character committed into the story and then wound him. Fine ?

Refering to the text :

The loser of any C struggle in which Halflings of D'haz participated must receive an additional wound for each icon by which the struggle was lost.

says clearly that you must deal another wound, but doesn't state anything about choosing a new target . Like you said, you deal 1+X wounds, but nothing allow you to choose another target.

Refering to a text that would allow the stabby Halflings to wound multiples targets, correct text would have been :

"the player who loose C struggle may choose and wound a character committed to this story for each C icon he lost the struggle by." ^^

PRODIGEE said:

The Halflings never reference which icons are used in the combat struggle. They only need to know the number of icons by which the struggle was lost. Their effect should still go off with Chess Prodigy.

Actually, it is stated which icons are used.

The text says "Combat Struggle". This refers to combat icons.

Terror Struggles use Terror Icons, Combat Struggles use Combat Icons, Arcane Struggles use Arcane Icons, and Investigation Struggles use Investigation Icons.

The rules say as much. If it were referring to using ANY icon, it would simply have said "Icon Struggle".

As far as how many creatures are wounded, it still seems to me that it should be up to the controller who is injured and how many times. I say this simply because it says "The loser of the combat struggle", meaning the controller of the cards "must receive an additional wound for each combat icon the struggle was lost by". It says nothing about only one target receiving the wounds. It strikes me that the effect is somewhat useless outside of dealing with characters with Toughness if this is in fact the case.

~ROCKMAN

well seems lots of cards have been poorly worded and then had to be fixed up with an errata. remember julia brown? i think this card wounds as many commited characters as able. if extra wounds are still floating after all commited characters are destroyed then they just fizzle. as for chess prodigy i see no reason why it wouldnt work.

Miskatonic University
Chess Prodigy
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Type : Character
Cost : 3
Skill : 3
Icons : I
Subtype : Sorcerer. Investigator.
Game Text: Fast. When Chess Prodigy commits to a story on your turn, name a struggle type. Resolve that struggle type at that story by counting I icons instead of that struggle type's normal icons at that story this phase. The normal struggle effects still apply.

combat struggle still happens just using different icons to determine outcome and "normal struggle effects still apply" if the halflings were worded deal extra wounds by as many (skulls) the struggle was won by i would say chess kid is usless here.

GrimWizard said:

I definetly quote the cards beside what I write so I can check .... My bad, sorry, you're right !

Rockman said:

Pearljamaholic and Grimwiazrd are right. Even if the way to resolve the struggle change with the text of a card. With the chess prodigy, Terror Strugle may be resolved with investigation and there are way to change what happens during struggle resolution. So, the combat struggle does not mean that you can do only C icons comparution. Rule says something, but remind the golden rule (the card text is upon the rule).

The text of the card does overpass the actual rule that says "the loser of the C struggle chooses of of his character and wound it." Problem is the definition of the "loser" terminology. Is it the controller or the character chosen to receive wounds ??? FAQ may answer this.

The card only deals another wounds. But wounding is something that needs a previous step (choose someone, then wound it). The text doesn't allow you to choose new targets. So, the halflings deals new wounds to the previous target. This effect might seems useless if you don't consider Toughness, but remind there is a whole new bunch of character (the Gug) which are playing with a lot of toughness...

Do the Halflings and Parallel Universe interact? Since you count the skill (which has no icons), I guess the two cards do not interact. Right?

Normally, when a player loses the combat struggle, he assigns a wound. I'd say with these halflings involved he (the loser) as to assign more then one wound at end of struggle. The loser chooses where wounds are assigned.

I think the OP's original question has now been dealt with by the FaQ.

As far as mischraum's question goes, I'm not sure what the right way to play it would be.

On a strict reading of the cards, I think that the Halflings' ability has no effect at a story with PU attached. The C struggle has not been won by any C icons, as skills were compared instead - therefore no extra wounds are caused irrespective of how much the skill comparison was won by, or if the Halflings would have caused multiple wounds if C icons had been compared.