Hi everyone!

My club will hold an internal X-Wing tournament in January, and because I think it'd be great to get everyone together playing one game I want to join in, too.

Problem #1 is that I've played just 2 games of X-Wing.
Problem #2 is that they call it a fluff tournament and limit all upgrade cards to 2 per ship and all legendary pilots to 2 per list. And that only after I complained, they already call me a power gamer haha!

So because I have no idea what I'm doing, and learned that I'm having A LOT more fun playing a list that is proven instead of randomly throwing something together in the hope that it works somehow - I am asking for your help.

Can you please help me build a list within the above restrictions, that is competitive but not too hard to fly for a complete beginner?

I like Empire and Scum more than Rebels, and in my last game I flew a Whisper with ACD, Gunner and VI and had a ton of fun (until I hit an asteroid ).

I'm not looking to win, I just want to stand an outside chance and have fun, and maybe not end up last.

To start things off I looked closer at two lists, but I'm grateful for all suggestions:

Whisper ACD Kallus
Yorr Palpatine
Omega Leader Juke Comms

96 pts

The list had VI on Whisper, too, but with the limit to 2 upgrade cards I thought Kallus is better? Or maybe I could move Kallus to Yorr and then take VI on Whisper? I'm also not quite sure what to do with the Llambda Shuttle other than hang around and take stress tokens? Is there something specific that I need to pay attention to?

Or:

4x Syndicate Thug TLT Unhinged Astromech

This seems pretty straight forward and would probably be easier to fly, but also seems somewhat less interesting to me due to having 4 identical ships.

What do you think?

Thanks for reading!

that is pretty harsh on limiting upgrades to at most 2 per ship. This puts a lot more power to swarms over aces. The problem with only 2 upgrades per ship is that it pretty much removes any and all bombers and secondary weapon users from the game HARDLY "fluffy".

What sets do you currently own or plan on getting before the "fluff" tournament? This infomation will greatly help what people can do for you.

If you want to bring the lambda toss darth vader on it and go with the "doomshuttle" tactic of 24 points of "i fly at you and do damage"

that is pretty harsh on limiting upgrades to at most 2 per ship. This puts a lot more power to swarms over aces. The problem with only 2 upgrades per ship is that it pretty much removes any and all bombers and secondary weapon users from the game HARDLY "fluffy".

What sets do you currently own or plan on getting before the "fluff" tournament? This infomation will greatly help what people can do for you.

If you want to bring the lambda toss darth vader on it and go with the "doomshuttle" tactic of 24 points of "i fly at you and do damage"

Hey Oberron, thanks for the super quick reply! That's what I said about the upgrades, originally they wanted to go with just 1 card! Not sure what is fluffy about that... They probably got burned once or twice by a good player with a good list, as our meta isn't exactly super competitive.

The good news is that I have access to pretty much everything as I can borrow from my friends, and 2 of them have 'everything'.

The lambda is really only in there because that was one of the top 10 lists of 2016 apparently, so I'm not partial to any ship other than disliking swarm lists and having had lots of fun that one game with Whisper.

The phantom is most likely the hardest ship to fly even more so with two upgrade limits. Even veteran xwing people can have problems with them now and then. shuttle (palpatine on a lambda) is pretty strong when supporting aces or x7 title defenders. Omega leader with comm relay and juke is fantastic for its points. I'm an empire only player so I can only really give real experience with those kinds of list. You could also play a 4 tie/fo omega squadron list all with comm relay and juke, it's a mini swarm that is fluffy and sold imo with those limits. If you don't want swarms and more power to a 2-3 ship list I'll fiddle around with some stuff and see what I can come up with

As for only having two games under your belt and seem to enjoy the phantom practice with how it decloaks more.

Whisper with vi and acd

Rear admiral on the Decimator with palp and fleet officer is 94 points pretty much use fleet officer to give whisper a focus token and focus fire one ship at a time with both of them when you are going to attack with whisper and are going to be shot back take evade token so you have a focus and evade then get another focus for defense you want to make sure you always hit with whisper, don't worry about ever k turning with whisper either the stress is just not worth it

The phantom is most likely the hardest ship to fly even more so with two upgrade limits. Even veteran xwing people can have problems with them now and then. shuttle (palpatine on a lambda) is pretty strong when supporting aces or x7 title defenders. Omega leader with comm relay and juke is fantastic for its points. I'm an empire only player so I can only really give real experience with those kinds of list. You could also play a 4 tie/fo omega squadron list all with comm relay and juke, it's a mini swarm that is fluffy and sold imo with those limits. If you don't want swarms and more power to a 2-3 ship list I'll fiddle around with some stuff and see what I can come up with

As for only having two games under your belt and seem to enjoy the phantom practice with how it decloaks more.

Yes, I noticed that the decloaking isn't easy. But it was still a lot of fun. I found the ACD very forgiving if you end up right in someone's firing arc.

What is an X7 Defender - is it a Tie Defender with a special loadout?

I just read the Vader crew card - that Doom Shuttle sounds pretty cool too - what else would you put in a list with it? I don't think anyone at the club would expect that.

Lastly, that list with Whisper and a Decimator sounds great! So basically I try to keep everything in 1-2 range, force them to attack the decimator and focus one ship after the other.I think I can do that!

X7 is a title card for the tie defender that makes them playable makes them a lot harder to kill and makes their point cost lower.

With such strict limits to list building,if you want to run whisper with the doomshuttle equip whisper with acd and sensor jammer and take countess ryad with the x7 title and push the limit. It works fluff wise because vader kinda oversaw the development of both of them and wanted to see first hand their results in combat

X7 is a title card for the tie defender that makes them playable makes them a lot harder to kill and makes their point cost lower.

With such strict limits to list building,if you want to run whisper with the doomshuttle equip whisper with acd and sensor jammer and take countess ryad with the x7 title and push the limit. It works fluff wise because vader kinda oversaw the development of both of them and wanted to see first hand their results in combat

You've given me some very solid options here, I'm now signed up for the tourney!

I do have more questions though if you don't mind. Right now I don't see whats so good about the x7 - how does it come together? Having to fly 3+ speed maneuvers would limit me quite a bit, or not? And won't I still receive stress when using ryads ability?

No you would not receive stress with ryad because she has green straights the defender is the most solid small ship empire has currently imo because of the x7. The x7 title asigns the defender free evade tokens, this does not take up their action, and ryad can Kturn as a green get an evade token if it is 3 or higher then focus ptl and get a target lock.

You don't always want to do 3 or higher maneuvers but when they get into combat go for it, also a defender has a natural 4 Kturn that is white

No you would not receive stress with ryad because she has green straights the defender is the most solid small ship empire has currently imo because of the x7. The x7 title asigns the defender free evade tokens, this does not take up their action, and ryad can Kturn as a green get an evade token if it is 3 or higher then focus ptl and get a target lock.

You don't always want to do 3 or higher maneuvers but when they get into combat go for it, also a defender has a natural 4 Kturn that is white

Thank you Oberron once again for your insights! You've made me quite like Ryad and after your vote of confidence for the Palpshuttle earlier I read up on that, too.

I've just about made up my mind and would like your opinion on the list I would like to fly:

OGP Palpatine

Ryad PTL x7

Whisper ACD

100 on the nose

Palp makes this list more forgiving because I will make mistakes no doubt, Ryad sounds really cool, and Whisper was a blast to fly. Now I don't have any points left for at least VI on Whisper - do you think this will still be viable? Or is Whisper too fragile without VI or Sensor Jammers?

Thanks, and I'll let you know how I did mid January!

I know you didn't ask me But I would at least put adaptability on Whisper. Or drop to stygium and you can have have Fire control, with adapt OR Vet and a 1 pt bid. Other option is drop PTL for a more typical whisper. All are reasonable IMO, fly them and see what you are more comfortable with. Personally I think whisper will struggle at PS7

Wow, just realized this is a one upgrade per ship tournament, my bad! Going to have to rethink this, but firmly believe stygium is probably the best upgrade for a nearly naked whisper. It appears titles don't count ? Then try this

Palp (100)

Omicron Group Pilot (32) - Lambda-Class Shuttle

Emperor Palpatine (8), Emperor Palpatine (8), ST-321 (3)

"Whisper" (34) - TIE Phantom

Stygium Particle Accelerator (2)

Colonel Vessery (34) - TIE Defender

Veteran Instincts (1), TIE/x7 (-2)

Wow, just realized this is a one upgrade per ship tournament, my bad! Going to have to rethink this, but firmly believe stygium is probably the best upgrade for a nearly naked whisper. It appears titles don't count ? Then try this

Palp (100)

Omicron Group Pilot (32) - Lambda-Class Shuttle

Emperor Palpatine (8), Emperor Palpatine (8), ST-321 (3)

"Whisper" (34) - TIE Phantom

Stygium Particle Accelerator (2)

Colonel Vessery (34) - TIE Defender

Veteran Instincts (1), TIE/x7 (-2)

Thank you very much JSwindy, your opinion is very welcome!

It is actually a 2 upgrade/ship tournament, I just managed to mess up the thread title and seemingly these can't be edited :/

I never knew Adaptability existed, it seems like an auto include when you've an elite slot open, very cool.

What do you like about Stygium more than ACD? Is it that it's more reliable when you're not guaranteed to have the highest PS on the board? I do expect a few swarm lists in our tournament as I was basically the only one complaining about the restrictions, so I'm hoping thst there's not a lot of high PS ships around, but I can't be sure. What I do know is that I'll probably be the only one bringing a proper tournament list, so no BroBots, Dengaroo or TLT spam I would wager.

Finally, what is so awesome about Vessery? You get that free target lock, OK, but only if you already have a target lock from someone else on the same ship. That sounds good, but not as spectacular as to include him in most lists?

Vessery gets a free target lock when he rolls attack dice which means he is able to use it in the same attack. That with the x7 means he gets a target lock and evade token pretty much all the time freeing up his action to barrel roll or focus (most of the time focus) so now he can have a full tokened up defense if he is being attacked or a full modified attack with TL+focus, VI on him makes him sitting at 8 letting him equal or beat most other ships in PS letting him pick what the best action he can do. Vessery gets a lot of mileage out of very little upgrade cards.

As for whisper with Stygium over ACD I don't think he knew that it was 2 upgrade cards and not 1 per ship. If it was only 1 then I'd agree that SPA is better than ACD but VI lets whisper sit at 9 where only the best pilots sit so it lets whisper use his action for evade token and with attacking first hopefully getting a hit so it gets a free focus and a cloak of ACD letting it get the best of both worlds as a phantom, high attack and high defense with a focus token and evade token for his action.

TLT ys are a no brainer is such enviroment...always a solid and irritating list, but needs some experience when to split and judge ranges.

If you feel confident enought to play Whisper i would go with her - first list you crafted is pretty solid after some mods:

Whisper + VI + ADC (stygium is ble. Just no. No. NO. Noooooo...)

Omicron + Palpi + HLC (thats one big lol with that HLC but in that setting...well you got points for it )

Omega + Juke + Comms

Or just stick with Defenders if you have Vets - that list is not even crafted for that event, its list i would take when going 2def+shuttle, with addition of Mk2 on Ryad - but you can live without them.

Ryad PtL, x7

Vessery Juke, x7

Omicron Palpi

Vessery is very strong - cause his ability and title pulls him to 3 actions per turn. And if he shoots first or got wingmates that does not spend target locks (vader, omega) its super cool. Trust me

I think I was misunderstood, if (for whatever reason) you expect whisper to be low on the PS then Stygium is more reliable, IMHO. If you can get Vet Inst and ACD great! Do that!!! As far as Vess goes, play around with him, he's a beast!!! FCS on whisper would make him super cool (but probably not an option here) and the title on palp schuttle put a TL out there easy for whoever you want Vess to hi!!

TLT ys are a no brainer is such enviroment...always a solid and irritating list, but needs some experience when to split and judge ranges.

If you feel confident enought to play Whisper i would go with her - first list you crafted is pretty solid after some mods:

Whisper + VI + ADC (stygium is ble. Just no. No. NO. Noooooo...)

Omicron + Palpi + HLC (thats one big lol with that HLC but in that setting...well you got points for it )

Omega + Juke + Comms

Or just stick with Defenders if you have Vets - that list is not even crafted for that event, its list i would take when going 2def+shuttle, with addition of Mk2 on Ryad - but you can live without them.

Ryad PtL, x7

Vessery Juke, x7

Omicron Palpi

Vessery is very strong - cause his ability and title pulls him to 3 actions per turn. And if he shoots first or got wingmates that does not spend target locks (vader, omega) its super cool. Trust me

Thanks again Oberron and JSwindy, and thank you for chiming in, too, Vitalis!

So the bottom line is, it's not really feasible to squeeze Whisper, Ryad and Palp into one list without compromising one ship or the other, that's OK.

The idea with the HLC on the shuttle is really good actually - that would - as I understand it - present my opponents with 3 ships that they'd ideally all like to target first:

Whisper should win 1v1s in the endgame and dishes out lots of damage especially when left alone.

Omega Leader even thrives in the endgame.

And the Palpshuttle is now so heavily armed that you can ill afford to let it hang around taking shots all game, plus with 10 points worth of tanking potential it won't go down so fast.

Sounds good to me!

TLT ys are a no brainer is such enviroment...always a solid and irritating list, but needs some experience when to split and judge ranges.

If you feel confident enought to play Whisper i would go with her - first list you crafted is pretty solid after some mods:

Whisper + VI + ADC (stygium is ble. Just no. No. NO. Noooooo...)

Omicron + Palpi + HLC (thats one big lol with that HLC but in that setting...well you got points for it )

Omega + Juke + Comms

Or just stick with Defenders if you have Vets - that list is not even crafted for that event, its list i would take when going 2def+shuttle, with addition of Mk2 on Ryad - but you can live without them.

Ryad PtL, x7

Vessery Juke, x7

Omicron Palpi

Vessery is very strong - cause his ability and title pulls him to 3 actions per turn. And if he shoots first or got wingmates that does not spend target locks (vader, omega) its super cool. Trust me

Thanks again Oberron and JSwindy, and thank you for chiming in, too, Vitalis!

So the bottom line is, it's not really feasible to squeeze Whisper, Ryad and Palp into one list without compromising one ship or the other, that's OK.

The idea with the HLC on the shuttle is really good actually - that would - as I understand it - present my opponents with 3 ships that they'd ideally all like to target first:

Whisper should win 1v1s in the endgame and dishes out lots of damage especially when left alone.

Omega Leader even thrives in the endgame.

And the Palpshuttle is now so heavily armed that you can ill afford to let it hang around taking shots all game, plus with 10 points worth of tanking potential it won't go down so fast.

Sounds good to me!

Well that HLC is a big lol like i said. I never have seen a palpshuttle with HLC you either go buzzshuttle or palpshuttle but hey why not - some stops and 1s bumps into omega may yield you some shots and in that enviroment you got points to squeeze it without compromising core cards for the list.

And as for Whisper/Ryad/Palp.... whats wrong with:

Whisper - VI , ADC

Ryad - Juke, X7

Omicron - Palpi

Exacly 100 points with 2 cards limit.

Well that HLC is a big lol like i said. I never have seen a palpshuttle with HLC you either go buzzshuttle or palpshuttle but hey why not - some stops and 1s bumps into omega may yield you some shots and in that enviroment you got points to squeeze it without compromising core cards for the list.

And as for Whisper/Ryad/Palp.... whats wrong with:

Whisper - VI , ADC

Ryad - Juke, X7

Omicron - Palpi

Exacly 100 points with 2 cards limit.

Hey, now I've got two cool lists that'd I would both be happy to fly!

For some reason I thought Ryad needs PTL to be really good, but looking at Juke it synergizes well with the x7 Title! Which in turn obviously synergizes well with her pilot ability. I've taken a liking to her because a green K-Turn seems really valuable to get out of trouble but still keeps your guns aimed at something.

Do you think there's anything in particular that I have to pay attention to when playing either of those lists? Not running Whisper into an asteroid preferably, but other than that I think I can fly them.

Well that HLC is a big lol like i said. I never have seen a palpshuttle with HLC you either go buzzshuttle or palpshuttle but hey why not - some stops and 1s bumps into omega may yield you some shots and in that enviroment you got points to squeeze it without compromising core cards for the list.

And as for Whisper/Ryad/Palp.... whats wrong with:

Whisper - VI , ADC

Ryad - Juke, X7

Omicron - Palpi

Exacly 100 points with 2 cards limit.

Hey, now I've got two cool lists that'd I would both be happy to fly!

For some reason I thought Ryad needs PTL to be really good, but looking at Juke it synergizes well with the x7 Title! Which in turn obviously synergizes well with her pilot ability. I've taken a liking to her because a green K-Turn seems really valuable to get out of trouble but still keeps your guns aimed at something.

Do you think there's anything in particular that I have to pay attention to when playing either of those lists? Not running Whisper into an asteroid preferably, but other than that I think I can fly them.

Ryad with PtL need Tie MK2 and thats 3 upgrade cards She is good on her own cause that flexible Kturn.

And that PtL is mostly for her to be able to paint things for Vessery with a TL.

If you want to fool-proof that Whisper in case you worry about asteroids do a litle mix to:

Echo - VI, ADC

Yorr - Palpatine

Glaive - CrackShot, X7

This way your Phantom can fly over debris and don,t care about it. As well as Kturn and cloak after.

Echo is two edged sword here - if flew correctly she is in even more best mode than Whisper. But if somehow you frakk up - Whisper can cope better.

Hmmmm no, I think I like Whisper better than Echo, but thanks for the suggestion I'll definitely be taking one of the 2 lists now, and it's going to be a blast!

If you want my opinion, I'd go for the scum TLT Ys as they are amazing, or go with 3x PS4 K-wings each with TLT and advanced Slam. Both work wonders, especially with this restriction. The Y-wings putting out 6-8 damage every turn is frightening and can bring down big ships/ low agility down like no tomorrow. The k wings require a bit more effort to play, but sitting in at PS4 mean they shoot before other generics you're likely to see (ps1-3 swarms) and with their slamming you can dodge unfavourable situations more easily.

Coming from a guy who has played both lists in competitive tournaments and came second (Y wings) and fourth (k wings). It's up to you but these are my suggestions.

With those rules, I'd just go back to triple Glaives with x7 and crackshot. I might switch some of them for Vessery or Ryad, maybe. These restrictions take out many of the ships that could prey on the Glaives (except for TLT carriers).

IME, messing with the rules make it far easier to game the system. A crackshot swarm would also see its biggest threats removed, though it's not as simple to fly.

With those rules, I'd just go back to triple Glaives with x7 and crackshot. I might switch some of them for Vessery or Ryad, maybe. These restrictions take out many of the ships that could prey on the Glaives (except for TLT carriers).

IME, messing with the rules make it far easier to game the system. A crackshot swarm would also see its biggest threats removed, though it's not as simple to fly.

Thank you JD0GE and drjkel, I think you're both absolutely right - with these restrictions and being a complete beginner I'd probably have the best chances playing some kind of fairly easy to pilot 'spam' list. And I thought about it. But I don't think I'd have any fun with those. I'm starting to realize that I love the kind of lists you can craft when combining cool different ships and upgrades, and that's what I like about the game.

And I agree on the strange restrictions, apparently our meta is quite fearful of aces...

Have you had the event yet? If so, what did you fly, and how did it go?