Why build one when you can build two for twice the cost? DS2 was clearly in construction while DS1 was still being built.

Most likely the Emperor foresaw the destruction of the first death star through the force. He probably even had all the traitors who poop pooped on the force and felt they were now the true power in the galaxy because of the battle station on the station so they would die with it.

This is probably also why, in part, he needed to take direct command of the second death star and put a 'yes man' in charge of its initial construction.

Or it would be very suiting for the Emperor to build two of those anyway. He was kinda megalomaniac you know...

Exactly. The first one took just under 20 years to build (was shown at the end of Revenfe of the Sith under construction). Granted the second one would have taken a shorter time because all the R&D had been done. So in order for the second one to be operational by the time of ROTJ it would have had to have been under construction before the first one was finished.

Not necessarily, part of the time taken to construct the DS1 was probably just establishing the manufacturing infrastructure to fabricate all the massive and specialised components. When they built the second one, they already had everything they needed from the R&D, designs and supply chains right down the industrial capacity for the the stuff they were building.

I see no plot hole......just stuff for future creative book/comic and movie writers to work with

Or it would be very suiting for the Emperor to build two of those anyway. He was kinda megalomaniac you know...

Catalyst sort of implies the Separatists were building the DS2, and the Empire got control of it later.

Catalyst sort of implies the Separatists were building the DS2, and the Empire got control of it later.

I didn't get that vibe - the Republic Weapons Group used the fear that they had one, to justify the creation of their own - but thanks to Dooku & Sidious's actions, that fear was ungrounded.

Or it would be very suiting for the Emperor to build two of those anyway. He was kinda megalomaniac you know...

Catalyst sort of implies the Separatists were building the DS2, and the Empire got control of it later.

And who was pulling Seps' strings....?

Knowing what I do about large IT being in that position, nobody with even half a brain keeps only one copy of their data in one single place. There have to be other "data centers" that the empire had records of the Death Star project for -- Scarif was simply the one known to the rebels and thus made it the focal point of the movie. The film doesn't need to say "oh there were other sites that just don't matter" - they can focus on the one that does.

Also, with how long it took to build DS1, who said DS2 wasn't well on the way by the time of Rogue One?

I feel for the crew of that one SD, just trying to get a little shore-leave and refit when all of a sudden they gotta raise anchor and get out of the way of the DS Test-shot. Talk about a useless display of Star Destroyers... Rogue One makes a complete mockery of the Imperial Navy and I don't think its screen-writers even realize it.

Considering the phasing out of the clone army, many of which also crewed the republic fleet, and the sheer scale of the Empire's military scope, it is likely that with the sheer volume of Star Destroyers produced, much of the crew are 'green', just out of the academy.

The empire is not even 20 years old, the clones were phased out about that time. So most imperial personnel are likely quite young, with the older ones being clone war vets.

The crew may (or may not) be green but the command crew should still be experienced. The purpose of academies and drills is to train and maintain crew competency. Even if they have never been in actual battle before, the crew should know their duties and get on with them. I agree though that the battle of Scariff does tarnish the image of the "Dreaded Imperial Starfleet".

Exactly. The first one took just under 20 years to build (was shown at the end of Revenfe of the Sith under construction). Granted the second one would have taken a shorter time because all the R&D had been done. So in order for the second one to be operational by the time of ROTJ it would have had to have been under construction before the first one was finished.

Not necessarily, part of the time taken to construct the DS1 was probably just establishing the manufacturing infrastructure to fabricate all the massive and specialised components. When they built the second one, they already had everything they needed from the R&D, designs and supply chains right down the industrial capacity for the the stuff they were building.

Not to mention all of the R&D that went into the first one that shouldn't need to be done with the second.

In the real world far too much of the "cost" for certain weapon systems (and other things) happens in the years that go into creating the first one. After that first one the second is much cheaper and the third may be even cheaper. If you look at the B-2 or Zumwalt Destroyers their costs would drop if more were made as it would spread the R&D costs out more.

Maybe DS2 is the Republic/Empire one and DS1 is the original seperate one that still needed the superlaser etc problems resolving.

Pretty sure we see a momentary picture that looks vert much like DS1 in the PT?

Maybe DS2 is the Republic/Empire one and DS1 is the original seperate one that still needed the superlaser etc problems resolving.

The Separatist holo:

The ROTS construct:

The Catalyst novel tells us that after the Republic took Geonosis, the Republic Weapons Group secretly started building a Death Star with the captured Geonosian plans (the same ones Dooku had handed over to Sidious, which Sidious gave the Weapons Group in his Palpatine guise as captured spoils of war.)

The ROTS one is the Republic one.

Exactly. The first one took just under 20 years to build (was shown at the end of Revenfe of the Sith under construction). Granted the second one would have taken a shorter time because all the R&D had been done. So in order for the second one to be operational by the time of ROTJ it would have had to have been under construction before the first one was finished.

Not necessarily, part of the time taken to construct the DS1 was probably just establishing the manufacturing infrastructure to fabricate all the massive and specialised components. When they built the second one, they already had everything they needed from the R&D, designs and supply chains right down the industrial capacity for the the stuff they were building.

Not to mention all of the R&D that went into the first one that shouldn't need to be done with the second.

In the real world far too much of the "cost" for certain weapon systems (and other things) happens in the years that go into creating the first one. After that first one the second is much cheaper and the third may be even cheaper. If you look at the B-2 or Zumwalt Destroyers their costs would drop if more were made as it would spread the R&D costs out more.

Yeah, the phrase economists use is "marginal cost to produce". As a real, but very extreme, example: when making a new line of pharmaceuticals, the first pill costs $10,000,000. But the second pill costs $0.01.*

*This is not why pills in America are so expensive, and anyone who says otherwise has never studied the healthcare systems of other countries.

Exactly. The first one took just under 20 years to build (was shown at the end of Revenfe of the Sith under construction). Granted the second one would have taken a shorter time because all the R&D had been done. So in order for the second one to be operational by the time of ROTJ it would have had to have been under construction before the first one was finished.

Not necessarily, part of the time taken to construct the DS1 was probably just establishing the manufacturing infrastructure to fabricate all the massive and specialised components. When they built the second one, they already had everything they needed from the R&D, designs and supply chains right down the industrial capacity for the the stuff they were building.

Not to mention all of the R&D that went into the first one that shouldn't need to be done with the second.

In the real world far too much of the "cost" for certain weapon systems (and other things) happens in the years that go into creating the first one. After that first one the second is much cheaper and the third may be even cheaper. If you look at the B-2 or Zumwalt Destroyers their costs would drop if more were made as it would spread the R&D costs out more.

Yeah, the phrase economists use is "marginal cost to produce". As a real, but very extreme, example: when making a new line of pharmaceuticals, the first pill costs $10,000,000. But the second pill costs $0.01.*

*This is not why pills in America are so expensive, and anyone who says otherwise has never studied the healthcare systems of other countries.

Executive greed is why pills are so expensive in America.

Exactly. The first one took just under 20 years to build (was shown at the end of Revenfe of the Sith under construction). Granted the second one would have taken a shorter time because all the R&D had been done. So in order for the second one to be operational by the time of ROTJ it would have had to have been under construction before the first one was finished.

Not necessarily, part of the time taken to construct the DS1 was probably just establishing the manufacturing infrastructure to fabricate all the massive and specialised components. When they built the second one, they already had everything they needed from the R&D, designs and supply chains right down the industrial capacity for the the stuff they were building.

Not to mention all of the R&D that went into the first one that shouldn't need to be done with the second.

In the real world far too much of the "cost" for certain weapon systems (and other things) happens in the years that go into creating the first one. After that first one the second is much cheaper and the third may be even cheaper. If you look at the B-2 or Zumwalt Destroyers their costs would drop if more were made as it would spread the R&D costs out more.

Yeah, the phrase economists use is "marginal cost to produce". As a real, but very extreme, example: when making a new line of pharmaceuticals, the first pill costs $10,000,000. But the second pill costs $0.01.*

*This is not why pills in America are so expensive, and anyone who says otherwise has never studied the healthcare systems of other countries.

Needs more than one "like" as it is so true. With the pharmaceuticals a sad thing is how much of that initial development probably comes from grants and other "free money" to them but which they still charge out over the long run.

So it dawned on me. They steal the Death Star plans and provide them to the rebel fleet, the imps don't get them back. The place (the only place known to leaders and overseers) where they house the plans is destroyed, (Proby where our X-65 fix is) and they kill all of the leaders, scientists that worked on the Death Star. In fact the place where everyone is working on it is blown up.

So how could that make a 2nd one.............

This is probably the real reason why Admiral Jerjerrod couldn't get the second Death Star completed on time (that is, until Darth Vader came on board and "motivated" his men)

In the real world far too much of the "cost" for certain weapon systems (and other things) happens in the years that go into creating the first one. After that first one the second is much cheaper and the third may be even cheaper. If you look at the B-2 or Zumwalt Destroyers their costs would drop if more were made as it would spread the R&D costs out more.

If you're talking procurement cost that's true.

In total life cycle cost, the cost of operating and maintaining the system dwarfs both RDTE and production costs (rule of thumb: O&M and personnel account for about 70% of a systems life cycle cost). The exception is space systems like satellites, but the Death Star would probably be best modeled like a modern aircraft carrier.

There's cost, and then there's cost.

Please note, the death star plans were on the death star itself. The engineers aboard were about to analyze the rebel attack and told Tarkin he needed to leave.

Also, there is a reason the Jedi were needed to be generals in the republic army. It would seem if you aren't a force user in the SW universe, you are just an incompetent boob. Darth Vader's star destroyer did just fine in the battle. The whole point of star was was the force is what guides people and made them capable of doing tasks. You can't even rely on a targeting computer to make a shot with proton trops, you need the force to do that.

The force was simply not with those two ISDs.

In the real world far too much of the "cost" for certain weapon systems (and other things) happens in the years that go into creating the first one. After that first one the second is much cheaper and the third may be even cheaper. If you look at the B-2 or Zumwalt Destroyers their costs would drop if more were made as it would spread the R&D costs out more.

If you're talking procurement cost that's true.

In total life cycle cost, the cost of operating and maintaining the system dwarfs both RDTE and production costs (rule of thumb: O&M and personnel account for about 70% of a systems life cycle cost). The exception is space systems like satellites, but the Death Star would probably be best modeled like a modern aircraft carrier.

There's cost, and then there's cost.

The darn thing about operation cost is that it may cost the same or more to operate an old system as a new system even if/when the old system doesn't perform nearly as well. It's that good old "upkeep" cost for units in many strategic game and I've seen some powerful units that are relatively cheap to acquire but far too expensive to keep around for any length of time.

If you want to look at that operating cost isn't the Ford class carriers supposed to be cheaper to operate than the Nimitz Class ships (and Enterprise) that they will eventually replace? They are supposed to be more versatile.

The darn thing about operation cost is that it may cost the same or more to operate an old system as a new system even if/when the old system doesn't perform nearly as well. It's that good old "upkeep" cost for units in many strategic game and I've seen some powerful units that are relatively cheap to acquire but far too expensive to keep around for any length of time.

If you want to look at that operating cost isn't the Ford class carriers supposed to be cheaper to operate than the Nimitz Class ships (and Enterprise) that they will eventually replace? They are supposed to be more versatile.

Depends on the design. The ability to design in lower operating cost improves with time, but since we also tend to add more features in the process, on average operating costs tend to increase anyway. The oldest vehicle in the US Army's combat vehicle fleet is the M113; it's also the cheapest to operate despite being old. Why? Far fewer features to support, and fairly simple, rugged mechanical systems.

The darn thing about operation cost is that it may cost the same or more to operate an old system as a new system even if/when the old system doesn't perform nearly as well. It's that good old "upkeep" cost for units in many strategic game and I've seen some powerful units that are relatively cheap to acquire but far too expensive to keep around for any length of time. If you want to look at that operating cost isn't the Ford class carriers supposed to be cheaper to operate than the Nimitz Class ships (and Enterprise) that they will eventually replace? They are supposed to be more versatile.

Depends on the design. The ability to design in lower operating cost improves with time, but since we also tend to add more features in the process, on average operating costs tend to increase anyway. The oldest vehicle in the US Army's combat vehicle fleet is the M113; it's also the cheapest to operate despite being old. Why? Far fewer features to support, and fairly simple, rugged mechanical systems.

There's a really good reason the AK-47 is still in high demand.

So it dawned on me. They steal the Death Star plans and provide them to the rebel fleet, the imps don't get them back. The place (the only place known to leaders and overseers) where they house the plans is destroyed, (Proby where our X-65 fix is) and they kill all of the leaders, scientists that worked on the Death Star. In fact the place where everyone is working on it is blown up.

So how could that make a 2nd one.............

Those 5 guys Krennick had shot... not the only engineers/scientists in the Galaxy. Even Galen Urso says it himself "they didn't need me to finish it....." Given the time he was working on the project he was probably concerned with the process of harnessing the Kyber Crystals into the weapons system, rather than all the other jazz required to make something like that exist.