I think what makes this all frustrating is that FFG keep creating either expensive droids (M9) that aren't especially amazing, or attempts at thematic cards (Black One) that don't do enough, all the while continuing to give the Scum faction cheap and powerful cards (Zuckuss' card does the same type of thing as M9 but costs 1 point and has no restriction). The IG crew card is precisely the kind of card that the rebels need as a title. On top of that, you have cards that help swarms (eg, Swarm Leader) that are targeted towards imperial ships, where this type of design space would be much better suited to the rebels. It's almost ironic that the rebels have less synergy than the other factions, even when all the films show them communicating and working together. Then you have bounty hunters who are in competition with each other instead helping each other out...

I'm sure we'll see a new pack, hopefully with squadron leaders, by the summer next year.

I'm not sure what bounty hunters you are talking about but I have read many books and seen a lot of shows that prove they are more than willing to work together if the score is big enough.

S-foil where you switch between speed and power. When wings closed agility rises and primary decrease, also gives a small boost. Wings open gives a free barrel roll and a fearlessness outside primary firing arc. So you make a choose (since that what you do in games), increase speed for less power or restore power, barrel roll outside firing arc and strike hard. Will it make T-65 and B-Wing more powerful in game? Yes. Will it be impossible to beat? No since they habe quite low agility and no evafe token chances.

S-foil where you switch between speed and power. When wings closed agility rises and primary decrease, also gives a small boost. Wings open gives a free barrel roll and a fearlessness outside primary firing arc. So you make a choose (since that what you do in games), increase speed for less power or restore power, barrel roll outside firing arc and strike hard. Will it make T-65 and B-Wing more powerful in game? Yes. Will it be impossible to beat? No since they habe quite low agility and no evafe token chances.

Jimbonx, I read a lot of your fix threads and everything, and I'm generally civil to indifferent of a lot of crazy ideas suggested by people... But the flappy s-foils drives a rather unreasonable hatred and angry response within me because of the level of ridiculousness it implies. Please, I encourage you, find one of your more imaginative ideas to replace it.

I must protest flappy Xwings. Since my opinion is important I will list some of the reasons for my protests.

S-foils are closed when cruising and landing. I would compare this to a soldier who carries a rifle on his back while marching. But once the fights on that soldier does not return that rifle to his back to "run faster".

It never happened in the X-Wing books. Those books are pretty good at explaining Star Wars ship combat.

A few video games used it as "boost" ability. But I think it was simply a visual fix to a mechanical problem.

Most references say the X-wing can travel faster with s-foils closed. In physics though speed decreases maneuvering. Any force used for acceleration cannot be used for braking or turning. Any force used for turning cannot be used for acceleration and braking, etc. So while it would be faster, the maneuverability would decrease (green turns become white, white turns become red).

A short burst of speed is all it could be worth, but at the expense of combat and actions (guns do not operate when s-foils are closed). Opening and closing s-foils takes time (an action in game mechanics). I personally would not want to lose an action to gain a green 4 straight.

If ever there was to be an upgrade with S-foils in the name, then let it be just a straight up benifit card like Lightened Frame of Vectored Thrusters. But what benifit could S-foils provide?

How about making Speed 2 turns green, or giving the option to change the speed of a bank by one less or more. Or it can give the ability to change one focus to a crit when using primary weapons.

Basically, anything BUT flapping.

Make it a title if you want but I would prefer a mod and a seperate title for Rogue Squadron for synergy shenanigans.

NO FLAPPING! FLAPPING IS SILLY!

NO FLAPPING! FLAPPING IS SILLY!

Especially for penguins, they just never seem to get off the ground.

So, I recently had an idea that I think would do the X-Wing and T-70 both a world of good. And rather than starting yet another thread, I figured I'd just put it here.

Resistance Modifications

X-Wing Only. Title.

You may equip 1 additional modification worth 2 or fewer squad points.

0 points.

Nice and simple. Now the X-Wing can equip Vectored Thrusters and Integrated Astromech, or Engine Upgrade and Vectored Thrusters, and the T-70 could equip Autothrusters and Integrated Astromech for more survivability. Not quite as fun of a fix as my previous suggested idea, though there might be room on the card for both.

Resistance Modifications

X-Wing Only. Title.

If you do not have a tech slot, after you execute a bank maneuver, you may rotate your ship 90 degrees and position your base along the template as if performing a barrel roll. If you do, treat this maneuver as a red maneuver.

You may equip 1 additional modification worth 2 or fewer squad points.

0 points.

What do you guys think?

Consider, however, we now have precedent for flappy S-foils in the U-Wing and TIE Striker, both of which are equally ridiculous conceptually.

And let's not forget the precedent set by Poe in TFA when he goes in to torpedo the oscillator.

Consider, however, we now have precedent for flappy S-foils in the U-Wing and TIE Striker, both of which are equally ridiculous conceptually.

And let's not forget the precedent set by Poe in TFA when he goes in to torpedo the oscillator.

This again

Poe closed the wings to fit into a tight gap, just like Wedge in RotJ. He did it at the last moment and opened it right after passing through the hole, inside the oscillator, in which he didn't fire his guns but needed all the agility he could get.

This is not possible to represent in X-wing.

U-wing flappy wings seems stupid, but not as stupid because we actually see U-wings in "landing mode" in combat over Scarif, TIE Striker doesn't have any flappy cards.

An S foils card that, when closed makes all straights green, prevents hard turns (in Rogue Squadron games, it turned slower but was faster) and gives a free boost, when open gives a free focus token and reroll one blank when attacking and defending would be ok, but not what I would want. I don't know why someone would close them in combat, but that doesn't happen unless you're flying through a small opening.

To be clear, that fix is essentially "use a T-70 ship instead" as the pilot abilities of all but Wes and Wedge are replicated in a better way by T-70 pilots.

Sure, the T-65 is meant to be an overall less powerful ship, but it should still be points-balanced. Along that line of thinking Ryad would be 20 points and come with two EPTs because the Defender is the best small base ship ever produced. All ships should be balanced point-wise for the 100/6 game, and fun to fly for other variants.

Not only is the T-65 unbalanced, but the T-70 is better in every single way. Its been said before, but in the game of X-wing, the classic X-wing should be at least present in the meta. Between the T-70 and T-65 combined only two pilots are routinely used: Wes and Poe, and neither are a good use of points at the moment.

SUM-Folks say that X-WING has gotten to big for it's britches. I agree. These kids have made it a super card game now. ACE WING...

The best thing to do is separate yourself from this ridiculousness and play fun games with friends and family.

The last thing I want from my beloved STAR WARS TOYS is gaddam complexe-sneaky-math and competitive drama.

That's what my group does, we don't due tournaments (if we did we'd probably get kicked out as we don't take them seriously) we are currently playing HoTAC and having a lot of fun with the campaign, and in the campaign I fly a Z-95 Headhunter, which is even more of glass cannon than the classic X-Wing (which I love). I think (and this is just my opinion here folks) that if FFG tried to balance out or fix the X-Wing they would ruin the game, not that the meta and turnny freaks already haven't

To be clear, that fix is essentially "use a T-70 ship instead" as the pilot abilities of all but Wes and Wedge are replicated in a better way by T-70 pilots.

Sure, the T-65 is meant to be an overall less powerful ship, but it should still be points-balanced. Along that line of thinking Ryad would be 20 points and come with two EPTs because the Defender is the best small base ship ever produced. All ships should be balanced point-wise for the 100/6 game, and fun to fly for other variants.

Not only is the T-65 unbalanced, but the T-70 is better in every single way. Its been said before, but in the game of X-wing, the classic X-wing should be at least present in the meta. Between the T-70 and T-65 combined only two pilots are routinely used: Wes and Poe, and neither are a good use of points at the moment.

SUM-Folks say that X-WING has gotten to big for it's britches. I agree. These kids have made it a super card game now. ACE WING...

The best thing to do is separate yourself from this ridiculousness and play fun games with friends and family.

The last thing I want from my beloved STAR WARS TOYS is gaddam complexe-sneaky-math and competitive drama.

That's what my group does, we don't due tournaments (if we did we'd probably get kicked out as we don't take them seriously) we are currently playing HoTAC and having a lot of fun with the campaign, and in the campaign I fly a Z-95 Headhunter, which is even more of glass cannon than the classic X-Wing (which I love). I think (and this is just my opinion here folks) that if FFG tried to balance out or fix the X-Wing they would ruin the game, not that the meta and turnny freaks already haven't

To be clear, that fix is essentially "use a T-70 ship instead" as the pilot abilities of all but Wes and Wedge are replicated in a better way by T-70 pilots.

Sure, the T-65 is meant to be an overall less powerful ship, but it should still be points-balanced. Along that line of thinking Ryad would be 20 points and come with two EPTs because the Defender is the best small base ship ever produced. All ships should be balanced point-wise for the 100/6 game, and fun to fly for other variants.

Not only is the T-65 unbalanced, but the T-70 is better in every single way. Its been said before, but in the game of X-wing, the classic X-wing should be at least present in the meta. Between the T-70 and T-65 combined only two pilots are routinely used: Wes and Poe, and neither are a good use of points at the moment.

SUM-Folks say that X-WING has gotten to big for it's britches. I agree. These kids have made it a super card game now. ACE WING...

The best thing to do is separate yourself from this ridiculousness and play fun games with friends and family.

The last thing I want from my beloved STAR WARS TOYS is gaddam complexe-sneaky-math and competitive drama.

That's what my group does, we don't due tournaments (if we did we'd probably get kicked out as we don't take them seriously) we are currently playing HoTAC and having a lot of fun with the campaign, and in the campaign I fly a Z-95 Headhunter, which is even more of glass cannon than the classic X-Wing (which I love). I think (and this is just my opinion here folks) that if FFG tried to balance out or fix the X-Wing they would ruin the game, not that the meta and turnny freaks already haven't

My problem is that I play all levels. I play epic, HotAC, home games and tournaments. The problem is the tournaments don't resemble Star Wars much now, not the classic Star Wars, anyway. I liked the old EU, but I want to fly classic Xwings, and I do... It's not easy though and so many of the newer ships produced are way better of the game price. So either they abandon the Xwing or they fix it... I'd rather wait though so they can do it right.

If you say 'too bad, tournaments don't need the Xwing,' then you are denying me my Star Wars just as much as if I declared something didn't need to be used in more casual settings.

This situation is a main reason I dont bother trying to play x-wing in stores. The x-wing is one of the most solid ships created in the EU, but because the way the game is turning out with every other ship completely out performing the x-wing is complete crap not only to the fans of Starwars, but the creators of the original content as well. There are so many moments in starwars that clearly state, sure the x-wing isnt the BEST in all roles but it is a solid ship that can work in most situations. Its not the fastest, but its has solid shields, sure the shields arnt as strong as the y-wing and it doesn't have the weapon firepower of a B-wing, but it is maneuverable enough to keep in a dogfight with interceptors and defenders, which are arguably way better at the dog fighting roles.

What I feel FFG has done here is base the x-wing on the worst possible pilot/x-wing combo instead of the best, and you cant do that when creating a competitive ship, especially one so rooted in success as the original x-wing. You need to make note of its best performance to allow the ship the possibility to shine as well as it can. The real deciding factor weather it sucks or not, should come down to the dice roles, and the other upgrade cards and positioning created by the player.

Good example is when you take a look at Wedge Antilles in the EU, he clearly is one of the best pilots, but how often is he honestly used anymore in X-wing. I watch games at stores when i go buy new models, but shock shock, ZERO players are using wedge, and if Biggs DOES show up, its not to show case the T-65, its to create a tad more HP on a DIFFERENT SHIP, so in reality, Biggs x-wing isnt really a ship in play as it is a upgrade card attached to whatever ships you are trying to protect. and to me, that is just disgusting to think in that way.

Well one thing I was thinking about last night is if you look at the T-70 X-Wing is an upgrade of the T-65, which in modern day military happens, for example when I was in the Army we got the M-1's around 1985, in 1987 they came out with the M-1ITTS's an upgrade to the basic M-1, that was followed by the A1 and A2 versions of the M-1. Do I think FFG maybe needs to make some card just for the T-65 X-Wing, yes keep the classic X-Wing playable in all formats (meta, turrny's casual play). Just my humble opinion here..

There's precedent for an upgrade card distinguishing between the X-wing types (Black One) so I could certainly see them with a T-65 only cards in the future.

I'm not certain how much complaint one can muster about a flappy X-wing card when the U-wing showed up with "landing mode" in a space combat game. The Striker title (and model) also seem to indicate "flapping" is going on.

If you need to massage your head cannon, then imagine the "etheric ailerons" are more effective when S-foils are closed.

I'm not certain how much complaint one can muster about a flappy X-wing card when the U-wing showed up with "landing mode" in a space combat game. The Striker title (and model) also seem to indicate "flapping" is going on.

If you need to massage your head cannon, then imagine the "etheric ailerons" are more effective when S-foils are closed.

Landing mode for the Uwing is giving you the extra green in combat position where the ship is pretty much going to live. The closed/landing position is not something you are going to use outside of tricky flying. Most people are not going to be flapping those sfoils.

Striker does not have any cards for flapping either. They made the model nice and fancy but there is nothing to show landing position (the purpose for these folding wings here too) in game.

It's not the head cannon that's messed, it's the design of a card that encourages constant flap to get benefits both ways. In universe canon, there is nothing that hints to this outside an arcade game that is non-canon.

My ideas:

R2 Series Astromech Droid: -1 point cost

When attacking or defending, if the ship is inside your primary firing arc, you may re-roll a number of dice equal to the speed on your revealed movement dial.

R6 Series Astromech Droid: 2 points - X wing Only

When attacking with a primary weapon, you may roll one less attack die. if you do, you may perform this attack twice. You may not attack again this round.

R8 Series Astromech Droid: 0 point

Your upgrade bar gains the systems upgrade icon. If you equip a systems upgrade, its squad point cost is reduced by 2 (to a minimum of 0).

MG7-A Proton Torpedo: 2 points

Rebel Only

Attack [Target Lock]: Discard this card to perform this attack. The defender cannot spend focus tokens during this attack. Attack: 4. Range 2-3.

Condition: Deflector Screen - Double Front - T65 only - ? points

When a ship with this condition card is defending, if the attacker is within their primary firing arc, they may roll additional evade dice equal to the shield tokens remaining on their pilot card. If the attacker is outside the defender's primary firing arc, they may change 1 [hit] result to a [critical] result.

I like the R2 and R6 droids but I think R8 needs to be T-65 only, or the T-65 will still be in the T-70's shadow. Those MG7-A torpedoes are better and cheaper than other options currently available, by about 1 point. It may be better to give a discount on the current torps instead of adding a Rebel only option. I love the Deflector Screen mechanic, here are my takes on the theme:

Power Reroute: (title, X-wing Only, 0 pts) - I think this is a defender-level fix that would shoot the X-wing to the forefront of competitive play.

[side A] Increase your agility value by two. When you are defending against an attack, the attacker may ignore your shield tokens when dealing damage.

[side B] When you reveal a speed 1 or 2 straight/bank maneuver, you may recover 1 shield token (up to your shield value).

You may flip this card after executing a maneuver.

Shield Overlap (title,T-65 X-wing Only, 0 pts)

When defending against an attack, if a friendly ship is at range 1 of you, you may add 1 evade result to the roll.

I'm not certain how much complaint one can muster about a flappy X-wing card when the U-wing showed up with "landing mode" in a space combat game. The Striker title (and model) also seem to indicate "flapping" is going on.

If you need to massage your head cannon, then imagine the "etheric ailerons" are more effective when S-foils are closed.

Landing mode for the Uwing is giving you the extra green in combat position where the ship is pretty much going to live. The closed/landing position is not something you are going to use outside of tricky flying. Most people are not going to be flapping those sfoils.

Striker does not have any cards for flapping either. They made the model nice and fancy but there is nothing to show landing position (the purpose for these folding wings here too) in game.

It's not the head cannon that's messed, it's the design of a card that encourages constant flap to get benefits both ways. In universe canon, there is nothing that hints to this outside an arcade game that is non-canon.

The point is that if one so wanted to, one could switch the U-Wing's wings each turn, not whether it's a good idea (or even whether it makes sense in space combat to begin with). The premise behind the Striker's card (whose name doesn't really make sense outside of being alliteration) certainly points to flappy wings. But then, according to various canon sources, the Striker should be a brick in space combat and it's far from it, so gameplay has clearly trumped fluff/story/tech specs which is as it should be.

Personally I'm against flappy S-Foils because once in combat they stay open (Poe and the oscillator notwithstanding), but there is precedent for them, and if flappy S-foils are deemed the best way to boost the X-Wing, then we'll get flappy S-foils.

At this point I'm expecting an X-Wing Game Show in the future with Jeopardy format and categories and one of them is Fixes: where the host reads a potential fix and the contestants guess what ship it's for.

X-wing will more than likely eventually receive two titles.

possibilities are many

-Red 2 may perform tallon rolls on banks

-Red 5 may spend shields to add red dice once per game

-Rogue Squadron gain EPT and may equip an astromech at reduced cost

-Red Squadron may equip torps at reduced cost with munition token

-Blue Squadron may execute red manuevers with a stress token, discard any stress tokens beyond the first

-Partisan Fighter cost reduction, blocks torp slot and gain ept

Something like that will eventually make it's way to the top of FFG's to do list.

X-Wing _____________ title: Rebel Alliance Only . When you are defending treat all attacks as if they were at range 3. If you are not stressed you may take a free evade action at the start of the combat phase. Pilot skill 6 and higher

I apologize in advance if this already got brought up; but correct me if I am wrong, wouldn't this solve the problem with any X-Wing buff helping the T-70 as well? Aren't all T-65's Rebel Alliance and T-70's Resistance?