Special: Resolve a special ability on another card in play as if it were your card.

Now I just read the FAQ here regarding things like thermal detonator. Am I correct in interpreting that Cunning doesn't actually copy a card but merely mirrors it? As in the FAQ, if my opponent has 2 thermal detonator in play and I roll a double special cunning and resolve, all his characters take 6 damage and he is forced to discard both TDs while I do not have to discard my cunnings? Equally so, if I have 2 TDs and 2 cunnings on my side showing all 4 specials, if I resolve all of them at once, would the end result be that my opponent takes 12 damage across the board and I lose both TDs?

Special: Resolve a special ability on another card in play as if it were your card.

Now I just read the FAQ here regarding things like thermal detonator. Am I correct in interpreting that Cunning doesn't actually copy a card but merely mirrors it? As in the FAQ, if my opponent has 2 thermal detonator in play and I roll a double special cunning and resolve, all his characters take 6 damage and he is forced to discard both TDs while I do not have to discard my cunnings? Equally so, if I have 2 TDs and 2 cunnings on my side showing all 4 specials, if I resolve all of them at once, would the end result be that my opponent takes 12 damage across the board and I lose both TDs?

When you perform a Resolve Dice action, you can resolve as many dice as you want, but you resolve them one at a time.

First Example - You have 2x Cunning w/specials and he has 2x Thermal Detonators

1. Say you'll be resolving dice with the special icon

2. Resolve the first Cunning on one of your opponent's TDs. His characters take 3 damage each and he discards the TD.

3. Resolve the second Cunning on the other TD. His characters take 3 damage each and he discards the second TD.

In your second example, you only have two TDs, so you can only ever use their ability twice. You'd be best off resolving the TD specials normally and then using the Cunnings on something else.

Yea, I kinda figured it was supposed to go like that. Thanks.

Stupid question: Does my opponent have to roll a special on their dice for me to 'cunning' it?

Stupid question: Does my opponent have to roll a special on their dice for me to 'cunning' it?

No

Stupid question: Does my opponent have to roll a special on their dice for me to 'cunning' it?

Nope

If my opponent has a "Linguist" upgrade, can I Cunning her Linguist?

How does that resolve?

another cunning scenario.

my opponent has already resolved his kylo saber die. he also has a character with 1 shield and X health.

i decide to copy kylo saber to remove his shield and do 1 damage. whose pool does the die get rerolled into?

Tentatively I would say neither player's. As per the RRG (page 10), inactive dice cannot be manipulated. Also see page 21 for a similar ruling on Poe.

another cunning scenario.

my opponent has already resolved his kylo saber die. he also has a character with 1 shield and X health.

i decide to copy kylo saber to remove his shield and do 1 damage. whose pool does the die get rerolled into?

In this scenario, let consider if the their Kylo Saber die IS still in the pool.

Cunning forces a card ability to resolve. It does NOT force a die to be spent. You would not reroll any dice you are not manipulating a die anymore when the triggered ability resolves.

But wait! What about the cunning die? Shouldn't I reroll that one, since that was the one I spent?

NO. You spend the die to get the effect of Cunning, which is seperate from any ability you trigger with Cunning. This is very important, because if Cunning were copying an ability, copying things like thermal Detonator would cause it to discard itself (which it doesn't, it causes the Detonator be triggered to self destruct)

I guess I'm not fully understanding the wording separation on cards vs cunning.

Thermal Det - deal 3 damage to each of an opponent's characters. discard this upgrade from play

kylo saber - deal 2 damage to a character. if any of this is blocked by shields, reroll this die instead of removing it from your pool.

force choke - deal 1 unblockable damage to another character. then you may turn one of its character or upgrade dice to any side

cunning - resolve a special ability on another card in play as if it were your card

So cunning is only allowed to manipulate cards and not dice? So thermal detonator is "copied" and my opponent is forced to discard his own card. Kylo saber is "copied" and 2 damage is dealt and if that character has 2 shields, then cunning can only copy the first part of kylo saber and i am not allowed to manipulate my opponent's dice regardless of if it is in their active pool or not? For instance if my opponent had an active KS die in his pool showing a special, i cunning his KS but his die remains on a special and the 2nd part of the card is inactive to cunning? Same for force choke....cunning only copies the first part of the card and does not allow for manipulation of an opponent's active pool die? Or is that different because force choke has "then" trigger on the card?

No, you can manipulate the dice if an effect allows you.

Maybe it will help someone - here is everything you need to know about Cunning used on:

AT-ST - "Discard a support from play." - You can discard that AT-ST (because it does not say "another").

BB-8 - "Reroll this die and one of your other dice." - "this die" means corresponding BB-8's die, so if that die is in your or your opponent's pool, you reroll it. If it is not, you simply do "Reroll ... one of your other dice".
This part "Do not remove this die from your pool after resolving this ability." does nothing, because it applies to the normal resolving of BB-8's die.

Black One - "Deal 1 damage to a character. Reroll this die instead of removing it from your pool." - "this die" means corresponding Black One's die, but this part "Reroll this die instead of removing it from your pool" does nothing, even if the Black One's die is in your pool, because it's a replacement effect and it replaces "removing it from your pool". Since you are not removing it in the first place, the effect has nothing to replace, thus does nothing.

Force choke - "Deal 1 unblockable damage to another character. Then you may turn one of its character or upgrade dice to any side." - You do the part after "then" normally (that is, you can manipulate those dice). Force choke is interesting becuase of "another" word. That word is there to forbid choking character by itself. So you can Cunning > Force choke yourself as long as those upgrades are not attached to the same character. (And obviously, if choking part was not successful, you don't get "then" part.)

Infantry grenades - "Deal 2 damage to each of an opponent’s characters. Discard this upgrade from play." - "this upgrade" means Infantry grenades (and that scenario is clear thanks to FAQ).

Jetpack - "Remove a die showing melee damage and give attached character 1 shield." - if Jetpack is attached to an opponent's character, you must give it a shield even if you do not want to.

Kylo Ren's lightsaber - "Deal 2 damage to a character. If any of this damage is blocked by shields, reroll this die instead of removing it from your pool." - "this die" means corresponding lightsaber's die, but this part "If any of this damage is blocked by shields, reroll this die instead of removing it from your pool" does nothing, even if the Kylo Ren's lightsaber's die is in your pool, because it's a replacement effect and it replaces "removing it from your pool". Since you are not removing it in the first place, the effect has nothing to replace, thus does nothing.

Outpost - "Resolve the battlefield ability as if you had just claimed it." - If you use it on Mos Eisley spaceport ("Return one of your upgrades in play to your hand to gain 1 resource."), then it's possible for Cunning to return itself.

Sith Holocron - "Switch this upgrade with a Blue ability upgrade in your hand, ignoring its play restrictions. Then you may spend 1 resource to roll its die into your pool, if able." - You can't use Cunning on opponent's Holocron, because that would mean taking opponent's card into your hand (out of play area), which is forbidden. But you can use it on your Holocron obviously.

Thermal detonator - "Discard this upgrade from play." - "this upgrade" means Thermal detonator (and that scenario is clear thanks to FAQ).

There are two interesting cases while using Cunning on Poe Dameron 's ability and then discarding:
BB-8 - the effect would be "Reroll ... one of your other dice" as explained above.
Sith Holocron - the effect would be taking Holorcon from your discard pile to your hand, discarding a blue ability and rolling its die into pool (if paid).

I guess I'm not fully understanding the wording separation on cards vs cunning.

Thermal Det - deal 3 damage to each of an opponent's characters. discard this upgrade from play

kylo saber - deal 2 damage to a character. if any of this is blocked by shields, reroll this die instead of removing it from your pool.

force choke - deal 1 unblockable damage to another character. then you may turn one of its character or upgrade dice to any side

cunning - resolve a special ability on another card in play as if it were your card

So cunning is only allowed to manipulate cards and not dice? So thermal detonator is "copied" and my opponent is forced to discard his own card. Kylo saber is "copied" and 2 damage is dealt and if that character has 2 shields, then cunning can only copy the first part of kylo saber and i am not allowed to manipulate my opponent's dice regardless of if it is in their active pool or not? For instance if my opponent had an active KS die in his pool showing a special, i cunning his KS but his die remains on a special and the 2nd part of the card is inactive to cunning? Same for force choke....cunning only copies the first part of the card and does not allow for manipulation of an opponent's active pool die? Or is that different because force choke has "then" trigger on the card?

You can't manipulate inactive dice. Re-roll =/= roll.

You have to use all the special. So if you use a grenade the you have to discard cunning. You can't pick and chose what parts of a special you want

You have to use all the special. So if you use a grenade the you have to discard cunning. You can't pick and chose what parts of a special you want

No. Read the FAQ.

Oh holy crape, FFG is about one more stupid ruling away from loosing money. The biggest being being, "Zero is an acceptable choice!"

Why would Infantry Grenades force you to discard Cunning? Cunning lets you resolve a special on a card as if it were yours. So you resolve Infantry Grenades, the last part of which says, "Discard THIS upgrade from play." Cunning doesn't BECOME Infantry Grenades, it just lets you resolve it, so you'd resolve Infantry Grenades, then discard Infantry Grenades.

So pick and choose whatever you want. BB8's card card states re-roll and if the grenade states remove then there is no difference. FFG needs to pull their head out

And can you use the Cunning to activate an adverse Cunning which will activate my other Cunning... ?

I suppose you can !

Why would Infantry Grenades force you to discard Cunning? Cunning lets you resolve a special on a card as if it were yours. So you resolve Infantry Grenades, the last part of which says, "Discard THIS upgrade from play." Cunning doesn't BECOME Infantry Grenades, it just lets you resolve it, so you'd resolve Infantry Grenades, then discard Infantry Grenades.

Just like you said it didn't become the grenade so why is the grenade being discarded ? Pick and chose whatever you want or follow the rules as written. Oh yeah why use common sense.

Oh holy crape, FFG is about one more stupid ruling away from loosing money. The biggest being being, "Zero is an acceptable choice!"

Why would Infantry Grenades force you to discard Cunning? Cunning lets you resolve a special on a card as if it were yours. So you resolve Infantry Grenades, the last part of which says, "Discard THIS upgrade from play." Cunning doesn't BECOME Infantry Grenades, it just lets you resolve it, so you'd resolve Infantry Grenades, then discard Infantry Grenades.

Just like you said it didn't become the grenade so why is the grenade being discarded ? Pick and chose whatever you want or follow the rules as written. Oh yeah why use common sense.

It actually makes sense for me. The character is using his cunning to use their own grenade against them, so the grenade blows up but the character is still sly. Discard the grenade, keep Cunning.

Oh holy crape, FFG is about one more stupid ruling away from loosing money. The biggest being being, "Zero is an acceptable choice!"

Why would Infantry Grenades force you to discard Cunning? Cunning lets you resolve a special on a card as if it were yours. So you resolve Infantry Grenades, the last part of which says, "Discard THIS upgrade from play." Cunning doesn't BECOME Infantry Grenades, it just lets you resolve it, so you'd resolve Infantry Grenades, then discard Infantry Grenades.

Just like you said it didn't become the grenade so why is the grenade being discarded ? Pick and chose whatever you want or follow the rules as written. Oh yeah why use common sense.

It actually makes sense for me. The character is using his cunning to use their own grenade against them, so the grenade blows up but the character is still sly. Discard the grenade, keep Cunning.

Exactly, You're using your opponent's card against them.

Thing is, NOTHING on Cunning says you have to discard it. NOTHING on Infantry Grenades says anything about discarding anything but Infantry Grenades. Any other reading is just you imposing your opinion of what SHOULD happen on what actually does.

So pick and choose whatever you want. BB8's card card states re-roll and if the grenade states remove then there is no difference. FFG needs to pull their head out

I usually never say this, but I think you might want to stop playing Destiny. After seeing a number of your posts, you seem exceedingly angry about the rules and have become argumentative and almost aggressive about them. Most people here don't have a problem understanding the rules and the wordings on cards. And when they do we can have some civil discourse about it, but you take this whole game to a dark place. Maybe it's time to find a different hobby.

Oh holy crape, FFG is about one more stupid ruling away from loosing money.

Something tells me they'll persevere in your absence.

I hope you don't mind me taking some artistic license with your typo. Happy holidays!

So all things being equal, I think Cunning is a super interesting card that does super awesome things. Having said that, I honestly think printing it now was a mistake. Cunning is a weird card were the super fine details of how the game system functions matter a lot to how you use the card. As a community, I think we have successfully gotten to the point that Cunning is understood as being seperate from the ability it triggers, which is a big step. Some folks are a little upset that this game has complexity that requires such close examination, (I generally think it's a fine, wholsome thing.) But this card in particular does so many odd, quirky things. A new game system is like computer software. You create a set of instructions for the game to operate under, and the players interact in that 'game environment'. All new software releases with bugs, and all games release with somewhat unconsidered edge cases. So far, I'm impressed with Destiny. I've tried hard, but I can't find anything that breaks the game (Breaks in the "This part of the game doesn't function correctly" sense, not the "This card/combo is overpowered" sense). But i feel like cunning could have stood to be held back for a set. Just to give the little kinks a chance to shake out, and more importantly, get the user base to a common level of understanding of the 'program' before introducing something this technically demanding.