I refer to the text used to describe "ignored" looking at the RRG it states that anything received in excess of is ignored. Notice how it is received in excess of, not you cannot gain or does not receive.

Do a Search function for the word ignored and see if that changes any thoughts.

Ah, but now I see your issue ...

How do you interpret IGNORE?

Do you simply ignore that Shield token that you would receive?

Or do you ignore the qualifying act of receiving Shields entirely, because you're at 3, therefore DISqualifying Qui-Gon from his ability?

I'm forced to contradict myself now ... any Shield over 3 would be ignored , so if Qui-Gon is already at 3 Shields when on a later turn he would receive a fourth, that Shield is ignored, along with Qui-Gon's "before this character gains 1 Shield" ability ... because he's not gaining it ... it's being ignored.

Although, thematically, I'm trying to make sense of it. I envision Qui-Gon opening up his defensive stance (sacrificing Shield) in order to deflect damage back at his foes before closing his stance back up again (receiving the new Shield). It seems like an odd thing to "fill up"?

Perhaps, doing his fancy lightsaber deflections takes considerable focus and accuracy and can't be combo'd up indefinitely. Every so often (when his Shields are maxed out at 3) is has to buckle down to recenter (ride out the max 3 Shields until they are lowered).

That's how I think I'll play it ...

I think the rules would say "discarded" as opposed to "ignored" if the act of gaining was still to take place before any actual hypothetical gaining.

This argument can't be resolved until we get an answer to the following question.

Do shields that are ignored due to a character already having three shields still count as being gained?

The answer is super important and isn't in the rules, so far as I can tell.

Last try, you're wrong, this issue has already been CLEARLY addressed in the rules.

First some definitions, because words have actual meaning in this game: (RRG Page16)

TRIGGERED ABILITIES

A triggered ability has a trigger condition and an effect. When

a triggered ability meets its trigger condition, the ability

resolves. There are two types of triggered abilities: ”after” and

“before” abilities.

••Triggered abilities exist independently of their source. Once

triggered, the entire ability resolves, even if the card it was

on leaves play.

TRIGGER CONDITION

A trigger condition indicates the timing point at which an

ability may be used, and always follows either the word “after”

or “before.” A trigger condition matches a specific occurrence

that takes place in the game.

Example: Qui-Gon Jinn (r37) is about to gain a shield, which

is the trigger condition for his ability that says “Before this

character gains 1 or more shields, you may remove 1 of his

shields to deal 1 damage to a character.”

BEFORE ABILITIES

If, during the course of a game, a before ability meets its

trigger condition, immediately resolve the before ability

before continuing to resolve the rest of the effect. In this way,

before abilities can interrupt the flow of the game.

Example: One with the Force (r42) says “Before attached

character is defeated, this card becomes a support for the

rest of the game.” The trigger condition is “attached character

is defeated,” and the timing word “before” tells you to resolve

the rest of the effect before the trigger condition resolves.

QUEUE

After abilities enter an imaginary line once they meet their

trigger conditions, known as the queue. They wait in the

queue until the trigger condition is complete. If the trigger

condition was part of another ability, that entire ability is

completed before the after ability resolves. Abilities in the

queue are resolved in the order they entered it. Each one

must fully resolve before the next one resolves. If, during the

resolution of an ability in the queue, another ability is added,

it moves to “the end” of the queue and is resolved last.

••Abilities enter and leave the queue in chronological order,

based on a “first in, first out” principle.

••If two or more abilities have the same trigger condition, the

player who controls the battlefield decides the order they

enter the queue.

So let's review how this game is played...

1) The player has 1 or more dice with the shield symbol

2) BEFORE the player takes the Action to Resolve shield dice, QGJ's ability is triggered

3) QGJ's ability sits first in the Queue. He currently has 3 shields and removes one to bring his total down to 2 and deals one damage to an opponent's character

4) The Dice showing Shield symbols are now resolved. QGJ is a legal target because he only has 2 shields.

While I do think that looking at the specifics of the rules are important. I believe you must also consider the "intent" in this case. Why in the world would FFG create this really cool effect for Qui Gon with 1 and 2 shields but when he gets to a thirds shield say, "no it doesn't work anymore"? To me that would seem silly. Until FFG explicitly states otherwise, if I have QG with 3 shield and I can gain a shield. I'm for sure dealing out damage to drop him to 2 and then adding the third shield back.

The example in the RRG seals it for me...

Example: Qui-Gon Jinn (r37) is about to gain a shield, which is the trigger condition for his ability that says “Before this character gains 1 or more shields, you may remove 1 of his shields to deal 1 damage to a character.”

Qui-Gon has 3 shields.

Then

Resolve a shield die or another action to give him shields....so he's about to gain shields, but doesn't yet because his before ability triggers.

Then

Resolve his before triggered ability

Then

Resolve the shield die or other action that was about to give him the shields.

The example in the RRG seals it for me...

Example: Qui-Gon Jinn (r37) is about to gain a shield, which is the trigger condition for his ability that says “Before this character gains 1 or more shields, you may remove 1 of his shields to deal 1 damage to a character.”

Qui-Gon has 3 shields.

Then

Resolve a shield die or another action to give him shields....so he's about to gain shields, but doesn't yet because his before ability triggers.

Then

Resolve his before triggered ability

Then

Resolve the shield die or other action that was about to give him the shields.

Absolutely concur with this. Because Qui-gon's text says 'before' he can remove 1 sheild to deal 1 damage, then receive the shield and be back up to 3 shields.

Ok, per the rules...

"If, during the course of a game, a before ability meets its

trigger condition..."

Qui-Gon's trigger condition is that he "gains 1 or more shields".

If he is already at 3 shields and you resolve a shield die targeting him, does he 'gain 1 or more shields'? Yes or no? If no, the before condition is not met. The answer can only be yes if ignored shields are treated as gained shields. The rule book doesn't tell us to treat ignored shields as gained.

I think if he has 3 shields, resolves the shield dice he is about to gain a shield. It is not ignored until it is placed. So the 'before' kicks in before he gains the shield that would be ignored.

Curious to see what you guys make of this.

Let's say I have a First Order Stormtrooper in play. He has 3 shields. It's my turn to perform an action. I choose to Resolve Dice and choose the shield icon. I resolve a single shield die, choosing my Stormtrooper. Given that the Stormtrooper is already a 3 shields, the extra shield is ignored.

Did the Stormtrooper gain a shield? Yes or no.

Ok, per the rules...

"If, during the course of a game, a before ability meets its

trigger condition..."

Qui-Gon's trigger condition is that he "gains 1 or more shields".

If he is already at 3 shields and you resolve a shield die targeting him, does he 'gain 1 or more shields'? Yes or no? If no, the before condition is not met. The answer can only be yes if ignored shields are treated as gained shields. The rule book doesn't tell us to treat ignored shields as gained.

The game thinks that he's about to gain a shield though, which per the example in the Rules Reference, is what triggers his ability.

Curious to see what you guys make of this.

Let's say I have a First Order Stormtrooper in play. He has 3 shields. It's my turn to perform an action. I choose to Resolve Dice and choose the shield icon. I resolve a single shield die, choosing my Stormtrooper. Given that the Stormtrooper is already a 3 shields, the extra shield is ignored.

Did the Stormtrooper gain a shield? Yes or no.

No, but before the die is fully resolved, it was about to, which per the Rules Reference is when Qui-Gon's ability triggers.

Your example would have it check the status AFTER the shield is gained or not. His ability is BEFORE.

Ok, per the rules...

"If, during the course of a game, a before ability meets its

trigger condition..."

Qui-Gon's trigger condition is that he "gains 1 or more shields".

If he is already at 3 shields and you resolve a shield die targeting him, does he 'gain 1 or more shields'? Yes or no? If no, the before condition is not met. The answer can only be yes if ignored shields are treated as gained shields. The rule book doesn't tell us to treat ignored shields as gained.

The game thinks that he's about to gain a shield though, which per the example in the Rules Reference, is what triggers his ability.

The trigger isn't "about to gain one or more shields"... it's "gains 1 or more shields". His before ability only triggers immediately before he actually gains a shield. It doesn't trigger immediately before a player trying to give him a shield. Massive difference there... a difference most people seem to be ignoring.

Yes, but the value exceed 3 so the excess was ignored. I refer again to the the ignored text in RRG. If you choose to heal a target for 5 damage but is already at full hp, did you heal them? You certainly performed the action to heal, now it might not have been efficient, but the target still received healing from the action. The same goes for dice and the like. If you do unblockable damage it "ignores" the shields, does that mean for that exact moment they dont exist? No, it bypasses them.

I don't think you will be satisfied until you have the exact wording that states that gaining something at max shields is still gaining.

Think of it like a glass of water where 3 shields is completely full, if you add 3 more shields to it it overflows, but your still adding to the glass.

Never change, FFG forums. Never change.

Curious to see what you guys make of this.

Let's say I have a First Order Stormtrooper in play. He has 3 shields. It's my turn to perform an action. I choose to Resolve Dice and choose the shield icon. I resolve a single shield die, choosing my Stormtrooper. Given that the Stormtrooper is already a 3 shields, the extra shield is ignored.

Did the Stormtrooper gain a shield? Yes or no.

No, but before the die is fully resolved, it was about to, which per the Rules Reference is when Qui-Gon's ability triggers.

Your example would have it check the status AFTER the shield is gained or not. His ability is BEFORE.

Ok, so you acknowledge that in a situation where a character already has 3 shields, that assigning him another one does NOT cause him to gain a shield. Qui-Gon's ability triggers off gaining a shield. It does NOT trigger off of being assigned a shield. You'd need to resolve the shield die and as you're about to put the shield token on his card, stop and resolve his ability as you've triggered its before condition.

How are you triggering his before condition (gains 1 or more shields) when you've acknowledged that he's not gaining 1 or more shields?

Ok, per the rules...

"If, during the course of a game, a before ability meets its

trigger condition..."

Qui-Gon's trigger condition is that he "gains 1 or more shields".

If he is already at 3 shields and you resolve a shield die targeting him, does he 'gain 1 or more shields'? Yes or no? If no, the before condition is not met. The answer can only be yes if ignored shields are treated as gained shields. The rule book doesn't tell us to treat ignored shields as gained.

The game thinks that he's about to gain a shield though, which per the example in the Rules Reference, is what triggers his ability.

The trigger isn't "about to gain one or more shields"... it's "gains 1 or more shields". His before ability only triggers immediately before he actually gains a shield. It doesn't trigger immediately before a player trying to give him a shield. Massive difference there... a difference most people seem to be ignoring.

There's an example of how his ability triggers in the Rules Reference, it says Qui-Gon is ABOUT to gain a shield so it triggers...

Curious to see what you guys make of this.

Let's say I have a First Order Stormtrooper in play. He has 3 shields. It's my turn to perform an action. I choose to Resolve Dice and choose the shield icon. I resolve a single shield die, choosing my Stormtrooper. Given that the Stormtrooper is already a 3 shields, the extra shield is ignored.

Did the Stormtrooper gain a shield? Yes or no.

No, but before the die is fully resolved, it was about to, which per the Rules Reference is when Qui-Gon's ability triggers.

Your example would have it check the status AFTER the shield is gained or not. His ability is BEFORE.

Ok, so you acknowledge that in a situation where a character already has 3 shields, that assigning him another one does NOT cause him to gain a shield. Qui-Gon's ability triggers off gaining a shield. It does NOT trigger off of being assigned a shield. You'd need to resolve the shield die and as you're about to put the shield token on his card, stop and resolve his ability as you've triggered its before condition.

How are you triggering his before condition (gains 1 or more shields) when you've acknowledged that he's not gaining 1 or more shields?

But he's about to, which is what I said, which is also what the example of his ability in the rules reference says...

I don't think you will be satisfied until you have the exact wording that states that gaining something at max shields is still gaining.

Well... that is how most FAQs and Erratas come to be. This is a permissive rule set. We're not told that ignored shields are still counted as gained shields. As such, we have no permission to treat them the same. If that was the intent, FFG needs to clarify with an FAQ or Errata.

I don't think you will be satisfied until you have the exact wording that states that gaining something at max shields is still gaining.

Well... that is how most FAQs and Erratas come to be. This is a permissive rule set. We're not told that ignored shields are still counted as gained shields. As such, we have no permission to treat them the same. If that was the intent, FFG needs to clarify with an FAQ or Errata.

That is exactly why this topic wont be satisfied until it is added.

Curious to see what you guys make of this.

Let's say I have a First Order Stormtrooper in play. He has 3 shields. It's my turn to perform an action. I choose to Resolve Dice and choose the shield icon. I resolve a single shield die, choosing my Stormtrooper. Given that the Stormtrooper is already a 3 shields, the extra shield is ignored.

Did the Stormtrooper gain a shield? Yes or no.

No, but before the die is fully resolved, it was about to, which per the Rules Reference is when Qui-Gon's ability triggers.

Your example would have it check the status AFTER the shield is gained or not. His ability is BEFORE.

Ok, so you acknowledge that in a situation where a character already has 3 shields, that assigning him another one does NOT cause him to gain a shield. Qui-Gon's ability triggers off gaining a shield. It does NOT trigger off of being assigned a shield. You'd need to resolve the shield die and as you're about to put the shield token on his card, stop and resolve his ability as you've triggered its before condition.

How are you triggering his before condition (gains 1 or more shields) when you've acknowledged that he's not gaining 1 or more shields?

But he's about to, which is what I said, which is also what the example of his ability in the rules reference says...

Yeah, but if he's already at 3, he's NOT about to. If he's at 0 or 1 or 2, then he's about to. If he's at 3, he's not about to. He's about to stay at 3.

When people ask me "What does pedantic mean?" I'm just going to start linking them to threads like this.

I don't think you will be satisfied until you have the exact wording that states that gaining something at max shields is still gaining.

Well... that is how most FAQs and Erratas come to be. This is a permissive rule set. We're not told that ignored shields are still counted as gained shields. As such, we have no permission to treat them the same. If that was the intent, FFG needs to clarify with an FAQ or Errata.

That is exactly why this topic wont be satisfied until it is added.

Which is what I've said multiple times. I'm mainly just bored at work and really don't think there is enough meat in the rules to justify counting ignored shields as gained shields. I'm willing to keep debating until 5PM GMT-5, at which point I'm going to the gym.

When people ask me "What does pedantic mean?" I'm just going to start linking them to threads like this.

Not helpful. If you want to participate, participate. If you want to insult, find some other bridge to hide under.

When people ask me "What does pedantic mean?" I'm just going to start linking them to threads like this.

Not helpful. If you want to participate, participate. If you want to insult, find some other bridge to hide under.

Participate in circular parsing of terms to justify a preconceived conclusion?

No, thanks. I've been around here enough to know better.

I have an idea, though. Why don't you email FFG and, ya know... ask?

Wild thought, I know.

When people ask me "What does pedantic mean?" I'm just going to start linking them to threads like this.

Not helpful. If you want to participate, participate. If you want to insult, find some other bridge to hide under.

Participate in circular parsing of terms to justify a preconceived conclusion?

No, thanks. I've been around here enough to know better.

I have an idea, though. Why don't you email FFG and, ya know... ask?

Wild thought, I know.

Yeah... I emailed them yesterday about this. No response, so I thought I'd bring it up here. I'm fully expecting a response saying that the intent is to allow the ability to work at three shields followed by an Errata or FAQ in the next update.

As it stands, the rules create a weird interaction where characters who are at 3 shields can't gain more. That has the side effect that Qui-Gon's ability can't be triggered if he's already at 3. Based on the comments I'm reading, it seems that most people think his ability triggers off TRYING to give him a shield. NOPE. It triggers off of him actually gaining that shield. The fact that it's a before ability doesn't matter. You still need to fulfill the trigger condition. With a before ability, you'd just pause and resolve the ability before finishing resolving the trigger condition.