Countdown: "During the compare results step you may suffer 1 damage to cancel all dice results"

Hit determination comes after compare results.

This means my Stealth Device is intact as I was never hit?

This mean Gunner gets to shoot me twice if I cancel the dice?

edit: There's a few easy ones like any "on hit" card will not proc its "on hit" effects .

• ion cannon
• tractor beam
• gunner
• stealth device
• flechette torpedo
• advanced homing missile
• xx-23 s-thread tracers
• ruthnessness
• Shadowcaster title.

The special cases are as follows:

• Lt Blount (Rebel Z-95): He always hits so he will proc his missile ammo.

Open questions:

• Rexler Brath : Is Rexler the source of the damage, or did Countdown self-harm?
• Wampa : There is a timing question.

I'll edit this as more arrive.

If all hit results were cancelled, then the attack does not hit. The attscker may use gunner, and the Defender keeps Stealth Device.

If all hit results were cancelled, then the attack does not hit. The attscker may use gunner, and the Defender keeps Stealth Device.

Agreed. Still wouldn't be super surprised if they FAQ'd the timing to make it resolve after the hit/miss determination, but as written this is true.

If all hit results were cancelled, then the attack does not hit. The attscker may use gunner, and the Defender keeps Stealth Device.

Agreed. Still wouldn't be super surprised if they FAQ'd the timing to make it resolve after the hit/miss determination, but as written this is true.

I hope that they don't. I think it's a more interesting ability as is.

If they dont, it also dodges all "If this attack hits" effects such as Ion weapons, Tractor, Adv Homing Missiles, Tracers, or Ruthlessness to name a few.

Which on one token means a tractor did damage, but he didnt negate your attack by making you hit a rock.

during the compare results cancel ALL dice. so no dice, no hit and no evade. so this attack has NO HITS. the suffering 1 damage is a penalty and not a hit. otherwise they would call it hit.... lol

If they dont, it also dodges all "If this attack hits" effects such as Ion weapons, Tractor, Adv Homing Missiles, Tracers, or Ruthlessness to name a few.

Which on one token means a tractor did damage, but he didnt negate your attack by making you hit a rock.

No it doesn't. Lt. Blount still will "hit" Countdown which could trigger effects. Of course Blount is the exception to may "if the attack hits" issues.

It is certainly an interesting ability and it seems to trigger during the compare step.

Now a more interesting point could be would this trigger before or after Wampa's ability triggers? I'm guessing Wampa goes first which would making using Countdown rather foolish as Wampa already cancels the attack so cancelling defense as well for damage and Stress would be illogical.

Wampa happens at the start of the Compare Results, while Countdown doesnt specify.

Therefore, it will conflict and come down to initiative. However it would be in Wampa's interest to not use his ability unless his crit was about to be evaded, because Countdown would also take a stress if he used his own ability to negate that crit, while Wampa would just give him the damage and no stress.

Wampa would either dish out a crit, or a facedown + stress. He shouldnt even attempt to use his ability if the crit was going to go through. Remember, this is after defense is rolled, so Wampa knows its going to go through or not.

If "Countdown" triggers during Compare Results, then initiative decides between "Countdown" and "Wampa".

If "Countdown" triggers during Modify Attack Dice, then "Wampa" never gets a chance to resolve.

I believe "Countdown" triggers during Compare Results. If it triggered during Modify Attack Dice, then it skips portions of the timing chart. Also, the player with "Countdown" should want to wait until compare results, in case you roll enough evade for the attack to miss.

Wampa happens at the start of the Compare Results, while Countdown doesnt specify.

Therefore, it will conflict and come down to initiative.

I'm not sure that I agree that "at the start" is the same timing as "during".

Wampa happens at the start of the Compare Results, while Countdown doesnt specify.Therefore, it will conflict and come down to initiative.

I'm not sure that I agree that "at the start" is the same timing as "during".

True. There are other abilites that specify the start or end of a phase with the purpose of determining a sequence.

Wampa happens at the start of the Compare Results, while Countdown doesnt specify.Therefore, it will conflict and come down to initiative.

I'm not sure that I agree that "at the start" is the same timing as "during".

True. There are other abilites that specify the start or end of a phase with the purpose of determining a sequence.

All of this is true but as Vineheart goes one to point out it may not matter so much. The dice should be known when that step comes around and without any Shields to hide behind the crit that Wampa would need to cancel could be landing a Face-up card regardless unless Countdown is used; then the question could be if Wampa gets the option to go first does he make sure a card lands on Countdown or does he let Countdown decide between taking the crit and being "hit" by the attack or does it cancel the dice results and take damage and stress.

It reminds me a little of the Bossk dilemma when the crit his attack generates could land for a face-up card or if it should be split to produce two face-down cards instead. When shields are in play the answer is pretty obvious as two hits can take out more shields but when going straight to hull there is some question.

Moved to OP. This msg is safe to delete (if you're a mod and you're reading this).

So let's list what this card interacts with:

Any "on hit" card such as:

• wampa
• ion cannon
• gunner
• stealth device
• flechette torpedo
• Lt Blount (Rebel Z-95)
• tractor beam
• advanced homing missile
• xx-23 s-thread tracers
• ruthnessness

Any others? I'll edit as they pop up.

Look at all the missiles and torps, there are a bunch more.

Also, Shadow Caster title.

Stealth device says IF YOU ARE HIT BY AN ATTACK.....

getting damage from an astroid or bomb etc is not getting hit by an attack. so far is clear

now whe can debate if countdown is hit BY the attack, because he suffers damages, or DUE to an attack, because he gets a penalty....

let me know what you think......

Stealth device says IF YOU ARE HIT BY AN ATTACK.....

getting damage from an astroid or bomb etc is not getting hit by an attack. so far is clear

now whe can debate if countdown is hit BY the attack, because he suffers damages, or DUE to an attack, because he gets a penalty....

let me know what you think......

There's no debate, he's categorically not hit by the attack. All the dice are cancelled before the step where the hit would occur, and the hit only occurs if uncancelled [boom] or [kaboom] result remain.

The only exception is Blount, who always hits regardless of this.

What if the damage card was dealt after an attack by Rexler? Is he able to flip it face up with a focus or not?

What if the damage card was dealt after an attack by Rexler? Is he able to flip it face up with a focus or not?

It would be a guess as it's an unprecedented situation, but my best guess would be yes. It's still damage dealt by your attack.

But they could legitimately rule either way.

What if the damage card was dealt after an attack by Rexler? Is he able to flip it face up with a focus or not?

It would be a guess as it's an unprecedented situation, but my best guess would be yes. It's still damage dealt by your attack.

But they could legitimately rule either way.

I don't think they could rule either way. It actually seems pretty clear cut. Countdown cancels all the dice but suffers 1 damage, thus dealing a damage card (unless he has a shield upgrade), and that would provide an opportunity for Rexler to trigger. Rexler doesn't have a " hit by the attack " restriction. All he needs is a damage card to be dealt, and if Countdown does that to himself, it's a freebie for Rexler.

What if the damage card was dealt after an attack by Rexler? Is he able to flip it face up with a focus or not?

It would be a guess as it's an unprecedented situation, but my best guess would be yes. It's still damage dealt by your attack.

But they could legitimately rule either way.

I don't think they could rule either way. It actually seems pretty clear cut. Countdown cancels all the dice but suffers 1 damage, thus dealing a damage card (unless he has a shield upgrade), and that would provide an opportunity for Rexler to trigger. Rexler doesn't have a " hit by the attack " restriction. All he needs is a damage card to be dealt, and if Countdown does that to himself, it's a freebie for Rexler.

The question is whether the damage is done by Rexler's attack, or by Countdown. It could be argued either way.

Hmm.

I would consider Wampa's ability to resolve before Countdowns. Per the timing chart, "resolve abilities that occur at the start of the compare results step" is the first thing that happens in the step. Then hits/evades/crits are cancelled (as normal) this for me is the window when Countdown's ability can trigger essentially the "official" point at which you are taking more than 1 damage. We know we can see this as soon as everythings been rolled and modified but this is the point in time that it becomes official. So during this time point is when Countdown can "Suffer 1 damage to cancel all dice and receive a stress token".

For this specific interaction, as written "at the start" is before "during".

For Rex.... "after you perform an attack that deals one damage to the defender"... so, horribly, the question is... Is Countdown "suffering" 1 damage to ignore the rest (he takes 1 damage from the attack) or is he the source of the damage, rather than the attack.

IMHO put that in bold to avoid/mitigate any sniping... Countdown is effectively taking 1 damage from the attack to avoid the rest, rather than he is causing the damage to himself, so Rexler's ability would trigger.

I would also suggest that the wording means the attack has hit as he has "suffered 1 damage" rather than dealt 1 damage to himself (if the later is true then the attack has missed).

Hmm.

I would consider Wampa's ability to resolve before Countdowns. Per the timing chart, "resolve abilities that occur at the start of the compare results step" is the first thing that happens in the step. Then hits/evades/crits are cancelled (as normal) this for me is the window when Countdown's ability can trigger essentially the "official" point at which you are taking more than 1 damage. We know we can see this as soon as everythings been rolled and modified but this is the point in time that it becomes official. So during this time point is when Countdown can "Suffer 1 damage to cancel all dice and receive a stress token".

For this specific interaction, as written "at the start" is before "during".

For Rex.... "after you perform an attack that deals one damage to the defender"... so, horribly, the question is... Is Countdown "suffering" 1 damage to ignore the rest (he takes 1 damage from the attack) or is he the source of the damage, rather than the attack.

IMHO put that in bold to avoid/mitigate any sniping... Countdown is effectively taking 1 damage from the attack to avoid the rest, rather than he is causing the damage to himself, so Rexler's ability would trigger.

I would also suggest that the wording means the attack has hit as he has "suffered 1 damage" rather than dealt 1 damage to himself (if the later is true then the attack has missed).

The attack definitely has not hit. There are no uncancelled hit or crit results remaining. That is the only definition of an attack hitting in the rules (Blount excepted).

What if the damage card was dealt after an attack by Rexler? Is he able to flip it face up with a focus or not?

It would be a guess as it's an unprecedented situation, but my best guess would be yes. It's still damage dealt by your attack.

But they could legitimately rule either way.

I don't think they could rule either way. It actually seems pretty clear cut. Countdown cancels all the dice but suffers 1 damage, thus dealing a damage card (unless he has a shield upgrade), and that would provide an opportunity for Rexler to trigger. Rexler doesn't have a " hit by the attack " restriction. All he needs is a damage card to be dealt, and if Countdown does that to himself, it's a freebie for Rexler.

The question is whether the damage is done by Rexler's attack, or by Countdown. It could be argued either way.

I think the FAQ entry for Boba Fett (crew) is a fairly good indicator.

A ship equipped with Boba Fett can use his ability if the defender was dealt a faceup Damage card from any source during that ship’s attack.

It seems to me that if Rexler attacks, and Countdown opts to use his ability, then that damage card has been dealt as a direct result of Rexler's attack, so I see no reason why Rexler can't trigger his ability. Honestly, I would be very surprised if FFG ruled in the opposite on this one.

Hmm.

I would consider Wampa's ability to resolve before Countdowns. Per the timing chart, "resolve abilities that occur at the start of the compare results step" is the first thing that happens in the step. Then hits/evades/crits are cancelled (as normal) this for me is the window when Countdown's ability can trigger essentially the "official" point at which you are taking more than 1 damage. We know we can see this as soon as everythings been rolled and modified but this is the point in time that it becomes official. So during this time point is when Countdown can "Suffer 1 damage to cancel all dice and receive a stress token".

For this specific interaction, as written "at the start" is before "during".

For Rex.... "after you perform an attack that deals one damage to the defender"... so, horribly, the question is... Is Countdown "suffering" 1 damage to ignore the rest (he takes 1 damage from the attack) or is he the source of the damage, rather than the attack.

IMHO put that in bold to avoid/mitigate any sniping... Countdown is effectively taking 1 damage from the attack to avoid the rest, rather than he is causing the damage to himself, so Rexler's ability would trigger.

I would also suggest that the wording means the attack has hit as he has "suffered 1 damage" rather than dealt 1 damage to himself (if the later is true then the attack has missed).

The attack definitely has not hit. There are no uncancelled hit or crit results remaining. That is the only definition of an attack hitting in the rules (Blount excepted).

Gotta agree with thespaceinvader here. Countdown's ability cancels all dice and with that, any weapon or ability that triggers on " if this attack hits... ", so there's definitely no hit. The fact that a damage card has been dealt is not an indication than an attack as "hit" anywhere in the rules.

As for the timing issue, I'd be willing to bet that the card text will be changed to fall into line with Step 6.i of the timing chart and it will read something like Wampa's changed text, namely " When attacking, at the start of the ‘Compare Results’ step, you may cancel all dice results... "

would the wampa situation come down to initiative?