Is it the norm to run multiple big ships our 3 ship squads of just aces. do people ever have use more ships in a games I always try to run 4 ships with one ace and 3 friends. I feel less up grads more ships better. So is better to have more large ship's and not take small ships any more. Been watching lots of battle reports with mostly large ships

Mostly depends how much scum you're playing. Most imperial lists include 0-1 large ship where that one is the emporer.

Its just shocking how small ships are being pushed out of playing

Its just shocking how small ships are being pushed out of playing

Blame Engine Upgrade and power creep. It's difficult to justify playing ships with less than N hull+shields when ships are pushing 3-5 red dice and all the mods.

And then there's Zuckuss, who can help delete most Rebel and Scum small bases in one shot.

Its just shocking how small ships are being pushed out of playing

They really aren't! TLT Y-Wings, TIE Defenders, the various top Imperial Aces, K-Wings, and more are absolutely tier-1 ships.

The battle reports you are watching are very likely using specifically tuned upgrade combinations. It has less to do with big or small and more to do with ...what specific combinations of ships and upgrades they want to fly with.

For example...it's not important that the shuttle is big...it's important that it's a cheap way to use the emperor.

Another example...it doesn't matter that omega leader is small...it matters that he works really well using com relay and juke for upgrades.

Sometimes a certain playstyle is looking for several upgrades at a time and all you have points left over for is a small guy with no or few upgrades.

Hopefully that helps.

Various recent cards have made green dice less reliable (Tractor beams, Zuckuss, Tail gunner). None of these cards are particularly game-breaking but they are cheap enough to be thrown into squads quite easily (especially Zuckuss).

This has had the effect of making hull and shields more reliable than high agility. Even a zero-agility Ghost can be counted on to take a fair amount of punishment before it goes down, something that cannot always be said of small based ship.

It happens in a lot of wargames that the effect of certain upgrades is to squeeze out balanced abilities in favour of all-or-nothing approaches. Tie Defenders, Soontir and Phantoms max out on survivability. Rebels with their middling agility tend out lose out and so focus on big ships instead. It helps that the Falcon is both iconic and fairly playable. Outrider and Ghost are also pretty good and you can fit both into a 100 point list.

58 Dash Rendar (36), PTL (3), Kanan (3), HLC (7), Outrider title (5), EU (4)

42 Lothal Rebel (35), Hera (1), Han Solo (2), FCS (2), Autoblaster Turret (2)

I agree that I have a hard time flying a 2-3 ship list. It just seems like too much of a gamble to me. I prefer heavy hitter and mini swarms or at least 4 ships of a specific kind. Then again, I don't do competitive anymore, so it's probably OK.

I love to use dash but I never understood how his title card works

I love to use dash but I never understood how his title card works

Let's break this down. So let's say you're flying Dash Rendar with NO upgrades. Dash Rendar has a primary weapon value of 2. That means that he will roll 2 dice to attack at ranges 2-3, and 3 dice to attack at range 1 because primary weapons get +1 die at range 1. Additionally, this primary weapon is a turret. That means you can fire at enemies even if they are outside of the printed firing arc on the ship token. Overall, this isn't a very impressive attack.

Now let's add a cannon. We'll add a Heavy Laser Cannon. Now Dash Rendar can fire with a 4-dice attack at ranges 2-3! The problem with the Heavy Laser Cannon is that it is not a turret weapon, so it can only be fired out of the forward-facing firing arc printed on the ship token (base) of Dash Rendar. This isn't a bad deal. You get a powerful cannon shot if you line up arcs, while still threatening ships that try to dodge your heavy weapon. But you could do better than this!

Now let's add the title. First thing that happens when you equip the title to a ship that already has a cannon upgrade is that you lose the ability to fire your primary weapon as long as your cannon is still equipped. In most situations, that means you will never be able to fire with your primary weapon because there are relatively few ways to discard a cannon upgrade. Next thing that happens, is that you get a special ability allowing you to fire your cannon outside of your arc. Now you can have a 360-degree range of fire for a 4-dice attack! That's huge! But there is a drawback. The Heavy Laser Cannon is only range 2-3. If an enemy ship gets into range 1 of Dash, Dash cannot shoot it because the title disables the primary weapon that can shoot at range 1-3, and the Heavy Laser Cannon can only fire at range 2-3. But this really isn't so bad because Dash has the barrel roll action. This allows Dash to move his ship sideways, getting out of range-1 of enemy ships so that he can fire his Heavy Laser Cannon at them, even outside of his firing arc.

Now, if that "doughnut hole" makes you feel uncomfortable, you do have options like "Mangler" Cannon. "Mangler" Cannon is range 1-3, so you can still shoot at enemies at range-1. The trade-off is that "Mangler" Cannon is only a 3-dice attack instead of a 4-dice attack. But compared the the primary weapon value of 2 on the YT-2400, it's not too bad of a choice.

To summarize:

By equipping the Outrider title and a cannon upgrade,

1) You cannot make primary weapon attacks

2) Your cannon may target enemies outside your firing arc.

Does that clarify things at all?

See I thought cannon was already 360 so I was confused like I always thought y wing can shot 360 also so I I don't need a different gun

See I thought cannon was already 360 so I was confused like I always thought y wing can shot 360 also so I I don't need a different gun

For primary weapons, you have to look a the primary weapon value on the card. If it has an arrow in a circle around the number, it means that ship can fire its primary weapon outside of arc. As with Dash, that doesn't mean that secondary weapons (missiles, torpedoes, cannons, etc.) can also be fired outside of arc unless the upgrade card specifically says they can.

For the Y-wing, there is no circular arrow on the primary weapon value, so its primary weapon may only be fired within the forward-facing firing arc. Turret upgrades begin with the "Attack:" header, indicating that they are secondary weapons, and a clarification in parentheses "(even a ship outside your firing arc)." That clause is what allows turret upgrades to fire outside of the ship's firing arc. It is conceivable for a turret weapon to be released in the future that does NOT allow you to fire outside of your firing arc, because it isn't the upgrade that grants that ability, but the statement on the upgrade card. In fact, we already see with the BTL-A4 title that the ability to fire a turret secondary weapon outside of firing arc can be restricted or removed.

It seems to me that you learned to play the game from watching videos where people were using all sorts of crazy upgrades. This can easily lead to misunderstandings about the rules. I recommend you go back to the starter rules and read through those carefully while playing with ships and upgrades just from the starter set. As you encounter difficulties or questions, consult the most recent FAQ. If you still can't find an answer to your questions, visit the rules subforum and ask a question there. Above all, try not to make assumptions. Don't think you can do something in the game just because you think the ship should be able to. Read cards carefully and only do what they tell you to do.

Dash has cannon on top so I thought a Cannon card just replace what it had I guess I really do miss interpreting a lot of rule our understand them different like how to me y has a turret so it can shot 360

A Y-wing can buy a turret upgrade card which will give it the ability to fire 360-degrees but only with that turret, not with its main weapon. Turret upgrades are shown by the icon below.

I ship with this icon does not have a turret by default but it is allowed to purchase a turret upgrade card. A turret upgrade card may attack in 360-degrees instead of the ship's normal attack (there are a few exceptions but we won't worry about them now).

This is a Dorsal Turret. It costs 3 points (in addition to the ship it is mounted on). It can attack 360-degrees. It attacks with 2 attack dice. It can only attack at Range 1 or 2 (not Range 3 like primary weapons). It gets a bonus attack dice at Range 1.

But the y wing always had a turret any how I just thought they started doing red circle thing so ever one new what ships had turret guns. Like dash ship has 2 main guns one gun fires toward other is turret gun that shoot 360 both gun use 2 dice for a attack but I can switch out turret gun to a have cannon leting me shoot a different guns

Dash does have a turret - as shown by the circle around his attack value. This only applies when he is firing his primary weapon though.

Cannon upgrades can only be fired out of the primary firing arc, as per the rulebook. The Outrider title allows this rule to be broken.

The manual, both the quick start manual and the rules reference, explain all of this in detail.

Have you read the manual?

More our less I just interpretation is different

But the y wing always had a turret any how I just thought they started doing red circle thing so ever one new what ships had turret guns. Like dash ship has 2 main guns one gun fires toward other is turret gun that shoot 360 both gun use 2 dice for a attack but I can switch out turret gun to a have cannon leting me shoot a different guns

That's ... an innovative interpretation.

More our less I just interpretation is different

I'm not going to mince words: your interpretation of the rules isn't just different -- it's wrong.

On page 7 of the TFA core set learn-to-play booklet, under Attack Restrictions: "An enemy ship can be attacked only if it is inside the attacker’s firing arc and within range."

On page 11 of the TFA rules reference, under Firing Arc: "A ship’s primary firing arc is used for all attacks, including secondary weapon attacks, unless specified otherwise."

Nowhere on any Y-wing card does it specify that it can fire outside of its primary firing arc. Therefore, a Y-wing may only fire on enemy ships using its primary firing arc. When you equip an Ion Cannon Turret, it tells you that you can make a specific kind of attack (3 dice, range 1-2) and that if the attack hits, you must cancel all dice results and deal 1 damage and 1 ion token. The Ion Cannon Turret upgrade card lets you make that specific kind of attack even if the target is outside your firing arc. You don't get to choose to fire your primary weapon out of arc just because you equipped a turret upgrade.

On page 19 of the TFA rules reference, under Turret Primary Weapons: "Some ships use a turret as their primary weapon. Each of these ships has a unique primary weapon icon, and each ship token shows a circular red arrow around the token’s center as a reminder. When attacking with a turret primary weapon, a ship may target an enemy ship inside or outside its firing arc.

Why the hell would the y wing not have a standard turret.

Why the hell would the y wing not have a standard turret.

Because it doesn't. Don't assume what a ship can and can't do based on the physical model. The rules don't work like that.

What ever it has a turret idk why ffg wouldn't let it have one but that just dumb

What ever it has a turret idk why ffg wouldn't let it have one but that just dumb

Because the ship in lore has a turret; and the mini is based on the original model for ANH.

Furthermore, you can take a turret for the Y-Wing, you just have to pay for it as an upgrade.

Again - as many of us have said multiple times - game mechanics override lore/fluff etc. everytime.

Okay, listen.

The rules are not there to be interpreted, like if they were coffee grounds, or tarot cards.

You must follow the rules as close to the letter as possible, because the whole game (costs, dials, statlines, etc) is balanced around the rules. You don't need to interpret them. You need to do what they tell you to do. "Do what the rules say, and don't do what the rules don't say."

Forget about your misconceptions and prejudices. The game is designed in a way that you can equip your ships in many different ways. It's one of the core fundamentals in the game!

In this game, a Y-wing has a primary "dual laser" weapon and MAY equip a turret if you pay for it (and astromech, and torpedoes). That is why it has a turret icon in the upgrade bar.

There is not a single standard Y-wing, but many different models. Some of them had turrets that could shoot all around, some of them had the turret fixed on forward position that allowed the whole ship to be manned by a single pilot.

This game allows you to use either of those models of Y-wing by giving you the choice of what to equip on it, instead of releasing different ship models that you need to buy separately.

When you choose not to equip anything, you can think on that as you taking away the standard the turret, astromech, and torpedoes, to make it more streamlined or whatever. In that case, the ship costs 18 points and only has the frontal, arc based, primary laser cannons, for the cheapest Gold Squadron Pilot.

If you want to go with the standard BTL-S3 model in the lore, that had not only the frontal lasers, but also an ion turret, an R2 Astromech, and full load of proton torpedoes, then you need to equip those cards and pay for their cost. In that case, it costs 18 for the base ship, plus 5 for the ion turret, plus 1 for the R2, plus 4 for each of the two proton torpedoes, totaling 18+5+1+4+4 = 32 points for the cheapest pilot.

You really need to read the manual closely. Every section. The advanced rules too (the ones that explain how upgrades work and are equipped) instead of just making everything up yourself in your head, and then go to the forums claiming that you don't get why people in the videos equip and play like that.

double post