No such things as cold dice - aka. making your own luck

By Green Knight, in Star Wars: Armada

Inb4 Dras

Dras should totally reply to this thread. Minimum 2000 word count.

Statistically abysmal. That is what they call me.

First off, I want to give Green Knight the props he deserves for writing the piece. It makes a lot of sense, to be sure.

But it is from a single point of view – and that point of view is the Empire, where they have all of the dice modification you could ever want.

Seriously. Darth Vader. Spend a token, reroll your pick. Man, that's such a wonderful ability... I wish my Rebels could take that... No.....

Instead, there are other forms of luck-fixing that has to be explored – and the Rebellion seem to be very reactive in that department. They have the raw chaos of Lando – just add more chaos and luck, and you'll be fine – or they remove the hazards of failure somewhat from the game (Rieekan, and to a point Mon Mothma.)... But they lack serious dice-fixing.

Its a 'feature', I am told. Vader, Screed, they're all about being able to turn a regular attack into a ruthless beatdown. A simple victory into a crushing one. It certainly fits the imperial theme, but it leaves the rebellion out in the cold... You know you have issues when your best dice is the most fickle dice, you have the most of the most fickle dice, and the only upgrade you can take to fix those dice en-masse is Veteran Gunners.

Seriously. Veteran Gunners. Not only is it a moderately priced card at 5 points, it occupies a Gunnery Team Slot, that only 3 Rebel Ships actually have... Did I mention it was the Gunnery Team slot, where your wide arcs oftenmost want you to be taking actual Gunnery Teams and just playing double-or-nothing with your luck chances... And thirdly, its everything. Get a slightly-above-average roll? Well, now you better decide on wether you take it and go for broke, or just throw everything out to chance it all with lady luck...

Urgh. That recurrent theme again. The Rebellion is a force designed to rely on luck. Not on luck fixing, but raw chaos of luck. And there are times when that luck will favour you.. Fortun Fortes Advat, and all that jazz... But the dice will be cold on you. It happens.

You won't be statistically abysmal like me, but they will go cold at times. You need to see the bigger picture on what luck-based play will get you, and focus on the ways where you can die-fix as a Rebel.

So, let us move on to that. In the vein of openness and such, we;ll explore it anyway, even though I consider it somewhat of a misdirection of sorts... Some dice mitigation is okay, but its not the Rebel THING.

Starting off, Bomber Command. We need it. We need it like a precious. Your Standard X-Wing has a Red Die, statistically the worst for a bomber – sure, it has the chance of throwing 2 damage up, but the misses and accuracy result really makes it difficult to see the effect some times. Furthermore, Bomber command, even a single, is affording Y-Wings, B-Wings and Scurrgs a reroll on the portion of the die that misses.

Toryn Farr. We really need to be including here more often, too – because Blue Dice are your Backup. An, if you love B-Wings and Scurrgs, then even more so. Mostly, Toryn allows you to achieve parity with Imperial Squadrons. The Great variety of them have swarm built in (stupid Imperial Dice-Fixing), which is just free rerolls to them. Toryn in the area grants that to you, which allows you fighters which are otherwise tougher and meaner, to get the job done just as reliably as your imperial opponent, who starts to then see that speed and lightness are not necessarily boons. Her main strength is the fact that she is a bubble effect (although not an extensive one), and that a lot of your nitty-gritty game relies on Blue Dice... Blue dice are for Anti-Squadron, both from Squadrons and from Ships... Blue Dice are for Counter... Always for counter... Blue dice are for mid-range damage against ships, or for fishing that accuracy, which can mean the difference between good luck and bad luck against a ship where you're rolling damage but are giving them their choice of defence tokens...

Turbolaser Reroutes.

Here's the other staple Rebel Die-fixer... No matter what, yo can turn a bad red die into an awesome red die at Range for the cost of an Evade. And most of the time, that's great – but you need to weight that in the actual damage application overall... Even if a MonCal cruiser could fit it, it probably wouldn't, because that additional damage is made up for through sheer amounts of dice being rolled... But the CR90 Corvette or Nebulon B will love it, because their die pools are so small, that a bad roll can mean nothing – and something, anything is better than nothing... period...

But that is really it, when it comes to luck mitigation for the Rebellion. There is so little precious else that can really be used... Concentrate Fire Tokens (and additional dice brought on by Concentrate Fire Dials) are an assistance, and Rebels are the kings of Token Shenanigans... Such things as the RaymusTantive gives out 2 tokens a turn if it wants, to other people... CommsNets are important for shuffling around those tokens to the places they want – but really, when it comes down to it, a single die reroll is hardly die-fixing... Its playing to the Luck.

Lando is the ultimate in playing to the Luck, but its in a defensive basis... Discard him, make the enemy Reroll... Know what this means... Know when to use it... Know when you're dead anyway and its too late... Personally, I find Lando great when the enemy is throwing Red and Blue dice at you... Black Dice, well, they're probably mitigated ot all hell and showing all Hit/Crits, but you can lessen that impact. But better than lessening an impact is removing any impact at all – and Lando can do that with reds and blues, because the Accuracy (and blanks) re rolled to in the defence stage usually mean nothing... Of course, there are upgrades, but upgrades preclude other upgrades, and we should not get caught in minutiae...

Foresight/Admonition

A form of luck mitigation – now we're talking about mitigating the enemy's luck... Both are priced at 8 points, because both of them – through their own medium – generally equate to the same thing – One enemy Die removed at the appropriate range. The Range of Admonition is everywhere. It doesn't matter, long or short, it allos you to trade that token for 1 damage die mitigation... And that is a Die of Damage, not just a point of Damage.

The same can be said of Foresight when it is at long range (or Medium with Mon Mothma)... It is allowing you to remove 1 additional die above and beyond what you would normally be removing due to your evade token.

Walex Blissex, in his infinite favor, returns to you those Defense Tokens you spend... What the Empire would do to take this man back into the fold... Effectively giving a MonCal Cruiser the ability to brace 4 shots is something that should not be overlooked... Don't do it once well, do it twice... I'll get to that in a minute.

Yavaris – What's better to play the odds than to just throw something TWICE... That's what the Rebellion Does. Don't do it the first time well, just do it average TWICE... Now, abuse all of the token shenanigans and the Fighter Commander / Fighter Coordination Team combo to get everything in position, and then either Win Twice as Big, or Lose Twice as Big!

Oh, Fighter Commander / Fighter Coordination Team, how you've been a boon already – mitigating weaknesses that allow strength to be brought to bear. Its a shame that we will still be reliant on purchasing Imperial Interdictors to abuse the combination, since only half of it comes in the Pelta. This is a dirty trick, a shenanigan the Empire can use, but to nowhere near the effect... The Nose Punch list I won a local tournament with shows that – yes, you can do your own shenanigan with it, but it relies on its own gimmick to perform...

With the Rebels and luck, Seriously, this is what gets me the most... Don't tell them the odds, just let them roll a bunch of times. They may never get one solid, average, simple setup all game. But will have wild swings of luck forward and backward. Because that is what the rebels do... That is what the Rebels are.

They're taking on a giant monolithic organization of turbo-lasers and hull plating. Backed up by solid reliability. The empire's greatest strength is about being solid, standard and reliable, without having massive swings of luck for and against. What poor or good luck you have is reflective of the game you have played and the positioning you have, because you have the tools to iron out the wrinkles in the luck curve.

The Rebellion however, is far more seat-of-the-pants, and the first thing a prospective Rebellion player must do, is come to terms with this. You simply cannot meet and match the empire on Dice mitigation. You cannot. You can try, and you will find you come up horridly under-matched. I wilfully admit, I did this for a long time. I sought the dice fixing and luck mitigation qualities for my Rebellion fleet, feeling that, “if I could just get Average luck, I'd be on to something...”

Its an entrapping layer of play. It is always better, in my opinion, to mitigate a weakness than to build a strength, because of the way diminishing returns plays out... But this is one exception to that case – you cannot mitigate the Rebellions luck-based system. You can't. Not by playing Rebels. Not by playing them in a way that capitalizes on any of their strengths.

No, you need to roll the odds. You need to take Lady Luck by the arm and sweep her off her feet. You need to **** the aces and the eights... Because you don't do it once well, you do it twice...

Leverage every **** dirty trick you have... And now, the Pelta has given us 3 more Dirty Tricks to leverage... A Dirty trick, in this instance, is something the empire just can't do, and you should do it... leverage those bonuses, leverage those tricks – learn the wonder of the Force Multiplier, and when they should be applied, and where. “All Fighters Form on Me.” would be the death of Independance, they cried... But nay, it was soon shown to stack, and now, you can have Speed 5 B-Wings... People were already happy using Speed Four B-Wings, but 5 is Even better... Now you can catapult OVER fighter Screens and be in place. Now you can think one turn in advance, instead of where you need to be three turns in advance.

Because B-Wings themselves are basically 1.5 Y-Wings duct-taped together... Their offensive output and points cost is expected... They just shed a lot of hull to not be “heavy”... They fit the Rebellion theme of don't do it once well, do it twice!... Don't rely on one bomb die.. Have Two! Even if they are mismatched. TWO!

Dice DO run hot and cold.

Even in his Article, although Green Knight states that “Dice do not run cold” in the title, he fails to bring that conclusion on board by the end. In fact, he emphatically states that dice DO run cold at times. That's the nature of luck. Armada has lots of way to mitigate luck through strategy, through positioning, through favourable matchups and all, but when it comes down to it, you still need to throw dice to ultimately win games. And when you have to throw dice, you surrender yourself to lady luck and her entropic embrace...

The question becomes, how do you handle that?

Do you look to the Empire, and ways to Mitigate that...

Or do you look to the Rebels, grin, and say, “So, Double or Nothing?”

I didn't read this because its very large but I liked it cuz you picked up the gauntlet.

Inb4 Dras

Dras should totally reply to this thread. Minimum 2000 word count.

Statistically abysmal. That is what they call me.

First off, I want to give Green Knight the props he deserves for writing the piece. It makes a lot of sense, to be sure.

But it is from a single point of view – and that point of view is the Empire, where they have all of the dice modification you could ever want.

Seriously. Darth Vader. Spend a token, reroll your pick. Man, that's such a wonderful ability... I wish my Rebels could take that... No.....

Instead, there are other forms of luck-fixing that has to be explored – and the Rebellion seem to be very reactive in that department. They have the raw chaos of Lando – just add more chaos and luck, and you'll be fine – or they remove the hazards of failure somewhat from the game (Rieekan, and to a point Mon Mothma.)... But they lack serious dice-fixing.

Its a 'feature', I am told. Vader, Screed, they're all about being able to turn a regular attack into a ruthless beatdown. A simple victory into a crushing one. It certainly fits the imperial theme, but it leaves the rebellion out in the cold... You know you have issues when your best dice is the most fickle dice, you have the most of the most fickle dice, and the only upgrade you can take to fix those dice en-masse is Veteran Gunners.

Seriously. Veteran Gunners. Not only is it a moderately priced card at 5 points, it occupies a Gunnery Team Slot, that only 3 Rebel Ships actually have... Did I mention it was the Gunnery Team slot, where your wide arcs oftenmost want you to be taking actual Gunnery Teams and just playing double-or-nothing with your luck chances... And thirdly, its everything. Get a slightly-above-average roll? Well, now you better decide on wether you take it and go for broke, or just throw everything out to chance it all with lady luck...

Urgh. That recurrent theme again. The Rebellion is a force designed to rely on luck. Not on luck fixing, but raw chaos of luck. And there are times when that luck will favour you.. Fortun Fortes Advat, and all that jazz... But the dice will be cold on you. It happens.

You won't be statistically abysmal like me, but they will go cold at times. You need to see the bigger picture on what luck-based play will get you, and focus on the ways where you can die-fix as a Rebel.

So, let us move on to that. In the vein of openness and such, we;ll explore it anyway, even though I consider it somewhat of a misdirection of sorts... Some dice mitigation is okay, but its not the Rebel THING.

Starting off, Bomber Command. We need it. We need it like a precious. Your Standard X-Wing has a Red Die, statistically the worst for a bomber – sure, it has the chance of throwing 2 damage up, but the misses and accuracy result really makes it difficult to see the effect some times. Furthermore, Bomber command, even a single, is affording Y-Wings, B-Wings and Scurrgs a reroll on the portion of the die that misses.

Toryn Farr. We really need to be including here more often, too – because Blue Dice are your Backup. An, if you love B-Wings and Scurrgs, then even more so. Mostly, Toryn allows you to achieve parity with Imperial Squadrons. The Great variety of them have swarm built in (stupid Imperial Dice-Fixing), which is just free rerolls to them. Toryn in the area grants that to you, which allows you fighters which are otherwise tougher and meaner, to get the job done just as reliably as your imperial opponent, who starts to then see that speed and lightness are not necessarily boons. Her main strength is the fact that she is a bubble effect (although not an extensive one), and that a lot of your nitty-gritty game relies on Blue Dice... Blue dice are for Anti-Squadron, both from Squadrons and from Ships... Blue Dice are for Counter... Always for counter... Blue dice are for mid-range damage against ships, or for fishing that accuracy, which can mean the difference between good luck and bad luck against a ship where you're rolling damage but are giving them their choice of defence tokens...

Turbolaser Reroutes.

Here's the other staple Rebel Die-fixer... No matter what, yo can turn a bad red die into an awesome red die at Range for the cost of an Evade. And most of the time, that's great – but you need to weight that in the actual damage application overall... Even if a MonCal cruiser could fit it, it probably wouldn't, because that additional damage is made up for through sheer amounts of dice being rolled... But the CR90 Corvette or Nebulon B will love it, because their die pools are so small, that a bad roll can mean nothing – and something, anything is better than nothing... period...

But that is really it, when it comes to luck mitigation for the Rebellion. There is so little precious else that can really be used... Concentrate Fire Tokens (and additional dice brought on by Concentrate Fire Dials) are an assistance, and Rebels are the kings of Token Shenanigans... Such things as the RaymusTantive gives out 2 tokens a turn if it wants, to other people... CommsNets are important for shuffling around those tokens to the places they want – but really, when it comes down to it, a single die reroll is hardly die-fixing... Its playing to the Luck.

Lando is the ultimate in playing to the Luck, but its in a defensive basis... Discard him, make the enemy Reroll... Know what this means... Know when to use it... Know when you're dead anyway and its too late... Personally, I find Lando great when the enemy is throwing Red and Blue dice at you... Black Dice, well, they're probably mitigated ot all hell and showing all Hit/Crits, but you can lessen that impact. But better than lessening an impact is removing any impact at all – and Lando can do that with reds and blues, because the Accuracy (and blanks) re rolled to in the defence stage usually mean nothing... Of course, there are upgrades, but upgrades preclude other upgrades, and we should not get caught in minutiae...

Foresight/Admonition

A form of luck mitigation – now we're talking about mitigating the enemy's luck... Both are priced at 8 points, because both of them – through their own medium – generally equate to the same thing – One enemy Die removed at the appropriate range. The Range of Admonition is everywhere. It doesn't matter, long or short, it allos you to trade that token for 1 damage die mitigation... And that is a Die of Damage, not just a point of Damage.

The same can be said of Foresight when it is at long range (or Medium with Mon Mothma)... It is allowing you to remove 1 additional die above and beyond what you would normally be removing due to your evade token.

Walex Blissex, in his infinite favor, returns to you those Defense Tokens you spend... What the Empire would do to take this man back into the fold... Effectively giving a MonCal Cruiser the ability to brace 4 shots is something that should not be overlooked... Don't do it once well, do it twice... I'll get to that in a minute.

Yavaris – What's better to play the odds than to just throw something TWICE... That's what the Rebellion Does. Don't do it the first time well, just do it average TWICE... Now, abuse all of the token shenanigans and the Fighter Commander / Fighter Coordination Team combo to get everything in position, and then either Win Twice as Big, or Lose Twice as Big!

Oh, Fighter Commander / Fighter Coordination Team, how you've been a boon already – mitigating weaknesses that allow strength to be brought to bear. Its a shame that we will still be reliant on purchasing Imperial Interdictors to abuse the combination, since only half of it comes in the Pelta. This is a dirty trick, a shenanigan the Empire can use, but to nowhere near the effect... The Nose Punch list I won a local tournament with shows that – yes, you can do your own shenanigan with it, but it relies on its own gimmick to perform...

With the Rebels and luck, Seriously, this is what gets me the most... Don't tell them the odds, just let them roll a bunch of times. They may never get one solid, average, simple setup all game. But will have wild swings of luck forward and backward. Because that is what the rebels do... That is what the Rebels are.

They're taking on a giant monolithic organization of turbo-lasers and hull plating. Backed up by solid reliability. The empire's greatest strength is about being solid, standard and reliable, without having massive swings of luck for and against. What poor or good luck you have is reflective of the game you have played and the positioning you have, because you have the tools to iron out the wrinkles in the luck curve.

The Rebellion however, is far more seat-of-the-pants, and the first thing a prospective Rebellion player must do, is come to terms with this. You simply cannot meet and match the empire on Dice mitigation. You cannot. You can try, and you will find you come up horridly under-matched. I wilfully admit, I did this for a long time. I sought the dice fixing and luck mitigation qualities for my Rebellion fleet, feeling that, “if I could just get Average luck, I'd be on to something...”

Its an entrapping layer of play. It is always better, in my opinion, to mitigate a weakness than to build a strength, because of the way diminishing returns plays out... But this is one exception to that case – you cannot mitigate the Rebellions luck-based system. You can't. Not by playing Rebels. Not by playing them in a way that capitalizes on any of their strengths.

No, you need to roll the odds. You need to take Lady Luck by the arm and sweep her off her feet. You need to **** the aces and the eights... Because you don't do it once well, you do it twice...

Leverage every **** dirty trick you have... And now, the Pelta has given us 3 more Dirty Tricks to leverage... A Dirty trick, in this instance, is something the empire just can't do, and you should do it... leverage those bonuses, leverage those tricks – learn the wonder of the Force Multiplier, and when they should be applied, and where. “All Fighters Form on Me.” would be the death of Independance, they cried... But nay, it was soon shown to stack, and now, you can have Speed 5 B-Wings... People were already happy using Speed Four B-Wings, but 5 is Even better... Now you can catapult OVER fighter Screens and be in place. Now you can think one turn in advance, instead of where you need to be three turns in advance.

Because B-Wings themselves are basically 1.5 Y-Wings duct-taped together... Their offensive output and points cost is expected... They just shed a lot of hull to not be “heavy”... They fit the Rebellion theme of don't do it once well, do it twice!... Don't rely on one bomb die.. Have Two! Even if they are mismatched. TWO!

Dice DO run hot and cold.

Even in his Article, although Green Knight states that “Dice do not run cold” in the title, he fails to bring that conclusion on board by the end. In fact, he emphatically states that dice DO run cold at times. That's the nature of luck. Armada has lots of way to mitigate luck through strategy, through positioning, through favourable matchups and all, but when it comes down to it, you still need to throw dice to ultimately win games. And when you have to throw dice, you surrender yourself to lady luck and her entropic embrace...

The question becomes, how do you handle that?

Do you look to the Empire, and ways to Mitigate that...

Or do you look to the Rebels, grin, and say, “So, Double or Nothing?”

I didn't read this because its very large but I liked it cuz you picked up the gauntlet.

#TL;DR

Interesting, A Swedish Green Knight. I know another Green Knight (his handle in planets.nu), who lives near Örebro. He's not, himself, Swedish, but he lives there.

Glad you got some good games in here in Östersund, always good to have you here!

I met Mikael...

(Channeling Shaggy)
Brought a big ball of Rhymer - Wasn't me.
Ozzel was his commander - Wasn't me.
Speed three, goin' too fast - Wasn't me.
400 points, go-in' last- Wasn't me.

M'wanted, Outposts; Positions - Wasn't me.
Too few upgrade additions - Wasn't me.
Roll blanks on my black dice - Wasn't me.
Even when BCCs lemme roll twice.

:ph34r:

And, no it really wasn't me, though I do hope to visit Sweden (and my other Green Knight friend) sometime next summer.

Anyway, regarding Dras as his whining about his poor Rebels not getting to modify dice. Puh-leeze!! I don't think Rebels have anything to complain about. They're strongly represented at Regionals, and winning in even greater proportions (75%) than showing up (58%).

Don't gimme no boo-hoo Dras! :P

Anyway, regarding Dras as his whining about his poor Rebels not getting to modify dice. Puh-leeze!! I don't think Rebels have anything to complain about. They're strongly represented at Regionals, and winning in even greater proportions (75%) than showing up (58%).

Don't gimme no boo-hoo Dras! :P

That was kind of where I was going at the end, and what I've resolved myself...

Fixing the Dice, like Votes in the Senate, is for the Empire...

The Rebels can, and should be a little more Happy-Go-Lucky with things... Accepting, appreciating, and ultimately, using the tools they do have at their disposal, rather than trying to emulate the Empire.

Interesting, A Swedish Green Knight. I know another Green Knight (his handle in planets.nu), who lives near Örebro. He's not, himself, Swedish, but he lives there.

Glad you got some good games in here in Östersund, always good to have you here!

I met Mikael...

(Channeling Shaggy)

Brought a big ball of Rhymer - Wasn't me.

Ozzel was his commander - Wasn't me.

Speed three, goin' too fast - Wasn't me.

400 points, go-in' last- Wasn't me.

M'wanted, Outposts; Positions - Wasn't me.

Too few upgrade additions - Wasn't me.

Roll blanks on my black dice - Wasn't me.

Even when BCCs lemme roll twice.

:ph34r:

And, no it really wasn't me, though I do hope to visit Sweden (and my other Green Knight friend) sometime next summer.

Anyway, regarding Dras as his whining about his poor Rebels not getting to modify dice. Puh-leeze!! I don't think Rebels have anything to complain about. They're strongly represented at Regionals, and winning in even greater proportions (75%) than showing up (58%).

Don't gimme no boo-hoo Dras! :P

Norwegian actually. We just sneak across the border for some Armada fun.

You need to see dras's rolls in person to really appreciate bad luck. .. no, check that. ... black cat,broken mirror, hats on the bed, Friday the 13th, salt spilling BAD LUCK!!! even the rerolls are bad. .. it's as if all the chain letters go to dras to die. .. :(

It really is astonishing!

Interesting, A Swedish Green Knight. I know another Green Knight (his handle in planets.nu), who lives near Örebro. He's not, himself, Swedish, but he lives there.

Norwegian actually. We just sneak across the border for some Armada fun.

Hm, I hear that the EU wants to do something about all you refugees from non-Armada-Regionals-playing nations.

You may have to be put in a camp in Turkey. I hope you prefer döner to lutefisk.

You need to see dras's rolls in person to really appreciate bad luck. .. no, check that. ... black cat,broken mirror, hats on the bed, Friday the 13th, salt spilling BAD LUCK!!! even the rerolls are bad. .. it's as if all the chain letters go to dras to die. .. :(

It really is astonishing!

f57c1547866c202a2fb9f58a26b9833b.jpg

Good.

I main rebels.

I don't need dice modification other than 2 BCC.

And toryn.

And H9.

And sometimes leading shots.

But other than that, we don't need no stinkin dice modification.

Edited by Eggzavier

Nah this is how you rebels:

Expanded Launchers

Enhanced Armanents

Ackbar

Rapid Reload

Spinal Armanent

Adar Tallon

Yavaris

Jainas Light

and

Sensor Teams

So no dice modification then?

(Except sensor teams)

Nah this is how you rebels:

Expanded Launchers

Enhanced Armanents

Ackbar

Rapid Reload

Spinal Armanent

Adar Tallon

Yavaris

Jainas Light

and

Sensor Teams

A large number of those add dice to the pools.

And here I thought quantity over quality was the Imperial doctrine.

And here I thought quantity over quality was the Imperial doctrine.

Shame they can't say the same about Regional Wins now, eh?

And here I thought quantity over quality was the Imperial doctrine.

Shame they can't say the same about Regional Wins now, eh?

SHOTS FIRED

Most of them missed, but inexplicably we still won...

Quite funnily, I downed a Vader carrying ISD this Sunday by OE'ing 3 black hits into 3 black hit/crits. Granted, it was going down anyway after a Yavaris double tap, tremendously helped by a torryn/bcc Bright hope.

So yeah, make your own luck. Because even when you don't need it, it feels good.

Edit: that gunnery team Vader ISD I also had Leading shots, and failed to take down two nebulons at point blank range after two rerolls on each : one lacked the damage, the other one lacked the accuracies :D .

Edited by Gowtah

One of mantras that I have found to make life in blank dice hell easier to accept is that everyone rolls average eventually. The most important reason to do that though is the second you start to blame the dice you lose focus on what you could have actually controlled to help you win the game, like overall tactics and movement strategy. Armada is nice because at least there are a lot of dice mod upgrades but try to look at your play before you blame the dice no matter how bad the dice decide to hurt you.

One of mantras that I have found to make life in blank dice hell easier to accept is that everyone rolls average eventually. The most important reason to do that though is the second you start to blame the dice you lose focus on what you could have actually controlled to help you win the game, like overall tactics and movement strategy. Armada is nice because at least there are a lot of dice mod upgrades but try to look at your play before you blame the dice no matter how bad the dice decide to hurt you.

How Quaint.

Someone who has never watched me roll dice. :D

One of mantras that I have found to make life in blank dice hell easier to accept is that everyone rolls average eventually. The most important reason to do that though is the second you start to blame the dice you lose focus on what you could have actually controlled to help you win the game, like overall tactics and movement strategy. Armada is nice because at least there are a lot of dice mod upgrades but try to look at your play before you blame the dice no matter how bad the dice decide to hurt you.

How Quaint.

Someone who has never watched me roll dice. :D

One of mantras that I have found to make life in blank dice hell easier to accept is that everyone rolls average eventually. The most important reason to do that though is the second you start to blame the dice you lose focus on what you could have actually controlled to help you win the game, like overall tactics and movement strategy. Armada is nice because at least there are a lot of dice mod upgrades but try to look at your play before you blame the dice no matter how bad the dice decide to hurt you.

How Quaint.

Someone who has never watched me roll dice. :D

Don't worry. Eventually you'll have a game where you roll nothing but hit/crits and it will be glorious. The 100 games leading up to that might be a little painful though.

... 100 ?

Keep counting.

One of mantras that I have found to make life in blank dice hell easier to accept is that everyone rolls average eventually. The most important reason to do that though is the second you start to blame the dice you lose focus on what you could have actually controlled to help you win the game, like overall tactics and movement strategy. Armada is nice because at least there are a lot of dice mod upgrades but try to look at your play before you blame the dice no matter how bad the dice decide to hurt you.

You clearly weren't around for the game where I rolled THIRTY blacks straight without a single hit/crit to proc my APTs, then Adar/Yavaris Luke turned around and rolled three in a row to kill my MC30 and CR90 (Structural+carrier ram) in the next two activations.

Sometimes, there's nothing you could have done better and the dice really did lose you the tournament.

I'm so happy I started this thread.

I feel MUCH better now :P

There are a number of people in my environment who get way too upset at their bad dice. It would be balanced if they also got elated by their dice when these are good, but they seem to focus on the bad. As a result, they tend to sour the atmosphere a bit.

Inb4 Dras

Dras should totally reply to this thread. Minimum 2000 word count.

Statistically abysmal. That is what they call me.

First off, I want to give Green Knight the props he deserves for writing the piece. It makes a lot of sense, to be sure.

But it is from a single point of view – and that point of view is the Empire, where they have all of the dice modification you could ever want.

Seriously. Darth Vader. Spend a token, reroll your pick. Man, that's such a wonderful ability... I wish my Rebels could take that... No.....

Instead, there are other forms of luck-fixing that has to be explored – and the Rebellion seem to be very reactive in that department. They have the raw chaos of Lando – just add more chaos and luck, and you'll be fine – or they remove the hazards of failure somewhat from the game (Rieekan, and to a point Mon Mothma.)... But they lack serious dice-fixing.

Its a 'feature', I am told. Vader, Screed, they're all about being able to turn a regular attack into a ruthless beatdown. A simple victory into a crushing one. It certainly fits the imperial theme, but it leaves the rebellion out in the cold... You know you have issues when your best dice is the most fickle dice, you have the most of the most fickle dice, and the only upgrade you can take to fix those dice en-masse is Veteran Gunners.

Seriously. Veteran Gunners. Not only is it a moderately priced card at 5 points, it occupies a Gunnery Team Slot, that only 3 Rebel Ships actually have... Did I mention it was the Gunnery Team slot, where your wide arcs oftenmost want you to be taking actual Gunnery Teams and just playing double-or-nothing with your luck chances... And thirdly, its everything. Get a slightly-above-average roll? Well, now you better decide on wether you take it and go for broke, or just throw everything out to chance it all with lady luck...

Urgh. That recurrent theme again. The Rebellion is a force designed to rely on luck. Not on luck fixing, but raw chaos of luck. And there are times when that luck will favour you.. Fortun Fortes Advat, and all that jazz... But the dice will be cold on you. It happens.

You won't be statistically abysmal like me, but they will go cold at times. You need to see the bigger picture on what luck-based play will get you, and focus on the ways where you can die-fix as a Rebel.

So, let us move on to that. In the vein of openness and such, we;ll explore it anyway, even though I consider it somewhat of a misdirection of sorts... Some dice mitigation is okay, but its not the Rebel THING.

Starting off, Bomber Command. We need it. We need it like a precious. Your Standard X-Wing has a Red Die, statistically the worst for a bomber – sure, it has the chance of throwing 2 damage up, but the misses and accuracy result really makes it difficult to see the effect some times. Furthermore, Bomber command, even a single, is affording Y-Wings, B-Wings and Scurrgs a reroll on the portion of the die that misses.

Toryn Farr. We really need to be including here more often, too – because Blue Dice are your Backup. An, if you love B-Wings and Scurrgs, then even more so. Mostly, Toryn allows you to achieve parity with Imperial Squadrons. The Great variety of them have swarm built in (stupid Imperial Dice-Fixing), which is just free rerolls to them. Toryn in the area grants that to you, which allows you fighters which are otherwise tougher and meaner, to get the job done just as reliably as your imperial opponent, who starts to then see that speed and lightness are not necessarily boons. Her main strength is the fact that she is a bubble effect (although not an extensive one), and that a lot of your nitty-gritty game relies on Blue Dice... Blue dice are for Anti-Squadron, both from Squadrons and from Ships... Blue Dice are for Counter... Always for counter... Blue dice are for mid-range damage against ships, or for fishing that accuracy, which can mean the difference between good luck and bad luck against a ship where you're rolling damage but are giving them their choice of defence tokens...

Turbolaser Reroutes.

Here's the other staple Rebel Die-fixer... No matter what, yo can turn a bad red die into an awesome red die at Range for the cost of an Evade. And most of the time, that's great – but you need to weight that in the actual damage application overall... Even if a MonCal cruiser could fit it, it probably wouldn't, because that additional damage is made up for through sheer amounts of dice being rolled... But the CR90 Corvette or Nebulon B will love it, because their die pools are so small, that a bad roll can mean nothing – and something, anything is better than nothing... period...

But that is really it, when it comes to luck mitigation for the Rebellion. There is so little precious else that can really be used... Concentrate Fire Tokens (and additional dice brought on by Concentrate Fire Dials) are an assistance, and Rebels are the kings of Token Shenanigans... Such things as the RaymusTantive gives out 2 tokens a turn if it wants, to other people... CommsNets are important for shuffling around those tokens to the places they want – but really, when it comes down to it, a single die reroll is hardly die-fixing... Its playing to the Luck.

Lando is the ultimate in playing to the Luck, but its in a defensive basis... Discard him, make the enemy Reroll... Know what this means... Know when to use it... Know when you're dead anyway and its too late... Personally, I find Lando great when the enemy is throwing Red and Blue dice at you... Black Dice, well, they're probably mitigated ot all hell and showing all Hit/Crits, but you can lessen that impact. But better than lessening an impact is removing any impact at all – and Lando can do that with reds and blues, because the Accuracy (and blanks) re rolled to in the defence stage usually mean nothing... Of course, there are upgrades, but upgrades preclude other upgrades, and we should not get caught in minutiae...

Foresight/Admonition

A form of luck mitigation – now we're talking about mitigating the enemy's luck... Both are priced at 8 points, because both of them – through their own medium – generally equate to the same thing – One enemy Die removed at the appropriate range. The Range of Admonition is everywhere. It doesn't matter, long or short, it allos you to trade that token for 1 damage die mitigation... And that is a Die of Damage, not just a point of Damage.

The same can be said of Foresight when it is at long range (or Medium with Mon Mothma)... It is allowing you to remove 1 additional die above and beyond what you would normally be removing due to your evade token.

Walex Blissex, in his infinite favor, returns to you those Defense Tokens you spend... What the Empire would do to take this man back into the fold... Effectively giving a MonCal Cruiser the ability to brace 4 shots is something that should not be overlooked... Don't do it once well, do it twice... I'll get to that in a minute.

Yavaris – What's better to play the odds than to just throw something TWICE... That's what the Rebellion Does. Don't do it the first time well, just do it average TWICE... Now, abuse all of the token shenanigans and the Fighter Commander / Fighter Coordination Team combo to get everything in position, and then either Win Twice as Big, or Lose Twice as Big!

Oh, Fighter Commander / Fighter Coordination Team, how you've been a boon already – mitigating weaknesses that allow strength to be brought to bear. Its a shame that we will still be reliant on purchasing Imperial Interdictors to abuse the combination, since only half of it comes in the Pelta. This is a dirty trick, a shenanigan the Empire can use, but to nowhere near the effect... The Nose Punch list I won a local tournament with shows that – yes, you can do your own shenanigan with it, but it relies on its own gimmick to perform...

With the Rebels and luck, Seriously, this is what gets me the most... Don't tell them the odds, just let them roll a bunch of times. They may never get one solid, average, simple setup all game. But will have wild swings of luck forward and backward. Because that is what the rebels do... That is what the Rebels are.

They're taking on a giant monolithic organization of turbo-lasers and hull plating. Backed up by solid reliability. The empire's greatest strength is about being solid, standard and reliable, without having massive swings of luck for and against. What poor or good luck you have is reflective of the game you have played and the positioning you have, because you have the tools to iron out the wrinkles in the luck curve.

The Rebellion however, is far more seat-of-the-pants, and the first thing a prospective Rebellion player must do, is come to terms with this. You simply cannot meet and match the empire on Dice mitigation. You cannot. You can try, and you will find you come up horridly under-matched. I wilfully admit, I did this for a long time. I sought the dice fixing and luck mitigation qualities for my Rebellion fleet, feeling that, “if I could just get Average luck, I'd be on to something...”

Its an entrapping layer of play. It is always better, in my opinion, to mitigate a weakness than to build a strength, because of the way diminishing returns plays out... But this is one exception to that case – you cannot mitigate the Rebellions luck-based system. You can't. Not by playing Rebels. Not by playing them in a way that capitalizes on any of their strengths.

No, you need to roll the odds. You need to take Lady Luck by the arm and sweep her off her feet. You need to **** the aces and the eights... Because you don't do it once well, you do it twice...

Leverage every **** dirty trick you have... And now, the Pelta has given us 3 more Dirty Tricks to leverage... A Dirty trick, in this instance, is something the empire just can't do, and you should do it... leverage those bonuses, leverage those tricks – learn the wonder of the Force Multiplier, and when they should be applied, and where. “All Fighters Form on Me.” would be the death of Independance, they cried... But nay, it was soon shown to stack, and now, you can have Speed 5 B-Wings... People were already happy using Speed Four B-Wings, but 5 is Even better... Now you can catapult OVER fighter Screens and be in place. Now you can think one turn in advance, instead of where you need to be three turns in advance.

Because B-Wings themselves are basically 1.5 Y-Wings duct-taped together... Their offensive output and points cost is expected... They just shed a lot of hull to not be “heavy”... They fit the Rebellion theme of don't do it once well, do it twice!... Don't rely on one bomb die.. Have Two! Even if they are mismatched. TWO!

Dice DO run hot and cold.

Even in his Article, although Green Knight states that “Dice do not run cold” in the title, he fails to bring that conclusion on board by the end. In fact, he emphatically states that dice DO run cold at times. That's the nature of luck. Armada has lots of way to mitigate luck through strategy, through positioning, through favourable matchups and all, but when it comes down to it, you still need to throw dice to ultimately win games. And when you have to throw dice, you surrender yourself to lady luck and her entropic embrace...

The question becomes, how do you handle that?

Do you look to the Empire, and ways to Mitigate that...

Or do you look to the Rebels, grin, and say, “So, Double or Nothing?”

Dras toryn is a major factor in this game and she is on the rebels. She gives virtually most of your fleet swarm..... The rebels currently rely a lot on bombers..... Wish they can reroll like no ones business..... Toryn is a game changer. I'd rebels need to rely on luck so much why are the dominating regionals and worlds?

And here I thought quantity over quality was the Imperial doctrine.

Shame they can't say the same about Regional Wins now, eh?

Don't worry, there are PLENTY of Regionals left. The Empire will eventually overtake the Rebels so they can get back to what they are REALLY good at - Whining about how OP the Empire is.

And here I thought quantity over quality was the Imperial doctrine.

Shame they can't say the same about Regional Wins now, eh?

Don't worry, there are PLENTY of Regionals left. The Empire will eventually overtake the Rebels so they can get back to what they are REALLY good at - Whining about how OP the Empire is.

This coming from a guy who played rebels at half his regional appearances this season....

:P

Dras toryn is a major factor in this game and she is on the rebels. She gives virtually most of your fleet swarm..... The rebels currently rely a lot on bombers..... Wish they can reroll like no ones business..... Toryn is a game changer. I'd rebels need to rely on luck so much why are the dominating regionals and worlds?

And my point was, you need to take a 7 point Upgrade and put it in an officer slot, and have it in the right position on the battle field......

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Whereas the Empire Fighters just get it.

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You can do it... But its a chain of things to do just to try to reach parity.

Edited by Drasnighta