I was looking at Youngster's ability, and was curious about the wording. "Friendly TIE fighters". Does a TIE/fo count as a friendly TIE fighter? What about the TIE Special Forces? Are they friendly TIE fighters? If someone knows, I'm curious.

Yes to all.

Does a TIE/fo count as a friendly TIE fighter?

Yes, because of this FAQ entry:

“Youngster” can use his ability in conjunction with TIE fighters as well as TIE/fo fighters.

What about the TIE Special Forces?

Possibly, but probably not. Unless I'm missing something (which is quite possible, I've been away from the forums for a few months) there's nothing that indicates a TIE/sf Fighter can be treated as a TIE Fighter (or TIE/fo Fighter ) by anything other that ship-type restricted upgrades (Rules Reference, pg. 20).

While the FAQ for "Youngster" implies that ship-type restricted abilities should be treated the same as ship-type restricted upgrades, it's not explicit about it. So if planning for a tournament, as always, I recommend asking your TO beforehand, because their word is final.

Does a TIE/fo count as a friendly TIE fighter?

Yes, because of this FAQ entry:

“Youngster” can use his ability in conjunction with TIE fighters as well as TIE/fo fighters.

What about the TIE Special Forces?

Possibly, but probably not . Unless I'm missing something (which is quite possible, I've been away from the forums for a few months) there's nothing that indicates a TIE/sf Fighter can be treated as a TIE Fighter (or TIE/fo Fighter ) by anything other that ship-type restricted upgrades (Rules Reference, pg. 20).

While the FAQ for "Youngster" implies that ship-type restricted abilities should be treated the same as ship-type restricted upgrades, it's not explicit about it. So as always, I recommend asking your TO beforehand, because their word is final.

Why "probably not?" The same question was asked about the TIE/fo, and that's been clarified. It seems more than likely the TIE/sf will fall into the same ruling as it's ship-type includes the words "TIE" and "Fighter" just like the TIE/fo does.

The TIE/sf is absolutely a TIE fighter.

For the exact same reason a TIE/fo is.

Does a TIE/fo count as a friendly TIE fighter?

Yes, because of this FAQ entry:

“Youngster” can use his ability in conjunction with TIE fighters as well as TIE/fo fighters.

What about the TIE Special Forces?

Possibly, but probably not . Unless I'm missing something (which is quite possible, I've been away from the forums for a few months) there's nothing that indicates a TIE/sf Fighter can be treated as a TIE Fighter (or TIE/fo Fighter ) by anything other that ship-type restricted upgrades (Rules Reference, pg. 20).

While the FAQ for "Youngster" implies that ship-type restricted abilities should be treated the same as ship-type restricted upgrades, it's not explicit about it. So as always, I recommend asking your TO beforehand, because their word is final.

Why "probably not?" The same question was asked about the TIE/fo, and that's been clarified. It seems more than likely the TIE/sf will fall into the same ruling as it's ship-type includes the words "TIE" and "Fighter" just like the TIE/fo does.

Because I'm pessimistic

The TIE/sf is absolutely a TIE fighter.

For the exact same reason a TIE/fo is.

Those reasons were:

-almost the same ships in game (same role, almost identical stats and dials etc.)

-Tie/FO oficially got "fighter" in name - so its technically Tie Fighter

Now please enlighten us where those reasons apply to TIE SF?

The TIE/sf is absolutely a TIE fighter.

For the exact same reason a TIE/fo is.

Those reasons were:

-almost the same ships in game (same role, almost identical stats and dials etc.)

-Tie/FO oficially got "fighter" in name - so its technically Tie Fighter

Now please enlighten us where those reasons apply to TIE SF?

Double check the ship-type, it's TIE/sf Fighter (I had to double check this myself when I saw the original question), which is why I said ship-type restricted upgrades for "TIE Fighter" definitely work. The only question is if abilities are treated the same way (they ought to be, but like I said before, I'm being pessimistic).

The TIE/sf is absolutely a TIE fighter.

For the exact same reason a TIE/fo is.

Those reasons were:

-almost the same ships in game (same role, almost identical stats and dials etc.)

-Tie/FO oficially got "fighter" in name - so its technically Tie Fighter

Now please enlighten us where those reasons apply to TIE SF?

The second reason is spelled out in the rules.

TIE Fighter

TIE/FO Fighter

TIE/sf Fighter

All have the complete "TIE Fighter" words in their names. All can benefit from anything which specifies "TIE Fighter only".

Its not rocket science.

The relevant rules passage:

Rules ref, page 20, Ship Type only.

-almost the same ships in game (same role, almost identical stats and dials etc.)

Omega Leader disagrees with you.

*Asks if TIE/fos and TIE/sfs are TIE Fighters, causes massive debate* Top kek

**** i looked only at store page. The aren't listed as "fighter" there. Right cards says "fighter".

-almost the same ships in game (same role, almost identical stats and dials etc.)

Omega Leader disagrees with you.

Well he is the exception with the role, but statwise thats still almost old Tie. Zeta and the rest of the pack are still filling its niche nicely.

Its not rocket science.

The relevant rules passage:

Rules ref, page 20, Ship Type only.

Its not rocket science.

The relevant rules passage:

Rules ref, page 20, Ship Type only.

Would that be the rules passage that is discussing attaching upgrades to ships rather than anything more general?

No, it also applies to for instance ships docking on the Gozanti, which an /fo can do whereas a TAP cannot.

https://www.reddit.com/r/XWingTMG/comments/40trk7/tiefo_youngerster_interaction_tie_adv_prototype/

I'm just going to quote myself from the Gozanti carrier and ships thread:

Rules Reference p20, under "Upgrade Cards":

Ship-type only: This upgrade can only be equipped to a ship of the specified type. If the ship’s type includes the entirety of the restricted type, it can equip that upgrade. For example, a TIE/fo fighter can equip an Upgrade card restricted to “TIE Fighter only.”

FAQ p12, next to "Youngster":

“Youngster” can use his ability in conjunction with TIE fighters as well as TIE/fo fighters.

The first explains how the ship type name matching rule works, with the specific example that TIE/FO Fighters count as TIE Fighters. The Youngster clarification makes it clear that this rule is supposed to be used for ship-type-specific effects in general, not just for cards that are restricted in which ship types can equip them.

The fact that the FAQ specifically mentions that TIE/FO Fighters count as TIE Fighters for Youngster's ability but doesn't mention TIE/SF Fighters doesn't indicate anything other than that the TIE/SF wasn't out yet when that FAQ entry was written.

Both TIE/FO Fighters and TIE/SF Fighters count as "TIE Fighters" for all purposes.

A quick search (which I also failed to do) would've given us our answer, found here :

In response to your rules question:


Rules Question:
Hi Frank, does Youngster work with TIE/SF? Best Regards


Yes. Any ship with "TIE" and "fighter” in its name works with “Youngster’s” ability.

Thanks for playing,

Frank Brooks
Associate Creative Content Developer
Fantasy Flight Games


This score is settled.

I had however sent my own question on the subject, and received a similar answer today:

In response to your rules question:


Rules Question:
Are ship-type ability restrictions treated the same as ship-type upgrade restrictions? I.e. if the ship's type includes the entirety of the restricted type, but is not an identical match, can the ability affect it? E.g. can "Youngster" use his ability with TIE/sf Fighters? The FAQ entry specifies that it works with TIE/fo Fighters, which implies that the answer is yes. However, I have failed to find an explicit ruling on ship-type restricted abilities, so this could be viewed as an exception rather than the rule.


Yes, the ship-type restrictions apply throughout. So any future “TIE" and “fighter” would work with “Youngster’s” ability.

Thanks for playing,

Frank Brooks
Associate Creative Content Developer
Fantasy Flight Games

Making it clear not just for "Youngster" and TIE Fighters , but also for any future ship-type restricted abilities.

Its not rocket science.

The relevant rules passage:

Rules ref, page 20, Ship Type only.

Would that be the rules passage that is discussing attaching upgrades to ships rather than anything more general?

No, it also applies to for instance ships docking on the Gozanti, which an /fo can do whereas a TAP cannot.

https://www.reddit.com/r/XWingTMG/comments/40trk7/tiefo_youngerster_interaction_tie_adv_prototype/

Oh, I agree from multiple rulings that it so far applies to ship names wherever they appear on a card.

I'm just pointing out that being snarky and pointing to a rules reference page isn't justified when said rules reference page doesn't back one up.

when said rules reference page doesn't back one up.

But that page does back it up. Since that is the rules that FFG uses to base everything else upon. While it doesn't explicitly state it, it is the foundation for the ship name rules. It defines what the phrase ship-type means.

Oh, I agree from multiple rulings that it so far applies to ship names wherever they appear on a card.

I'm just pointing out that being snarky and pointing to a rules reference page isn't justified when said rules reference page doesn't back one up.

Yeah, you also need the Youngster + TIE/FO FAQ ruling.

But that page does back it up. Since that is the rules that FFG uses to base everything else upon. While it doesn't explicitly state it, it is the foundation for the ship name rules.

You can make a reasonable assumption that that is how future rulings will go, but FFG have had at least one oppotunity, probably more, to write in the FAQ that anywhere a ship is referred to you apply those rules, and haven't.

Yeah, you also need the Youngster + TIE/FO FAQ ruling.

Even the Youngster FAQ entry doesn't say "use the same rules as applying ship-type upgrades"; it just says TIE Fighters work too. Frank said so in the email above, but that mysteriously didn't make it into the FAQ, much like the Gonk ruling didn't.

You can make a reasonable assumption that that is how future rulings will go

It's not an assumption, it's a defined key word/phrase. It defines the term ship-type. The only assumption here is that FFG will follow their own RAW unless they change them.

The reason that given key word/phrase is in the upgrades section, is because that's the most logical place to put it since so many upgrades have some sort of ship-type limit.

But just because it's in the upgrade section doesn't mean it doesn't apply to other situations that involve the phrase ship-type.

but that mysteriously didn't make it into the FAQ

Maybe they don't consider it worth putting into the FAQ because they consider it to be a settled issue. Because the RAW is actually quite clear on the matter.

It's not an assumption, it's a defined key word/phrase. It defines the term ship-type.

...

But just because it's in the upgrade section doesn't mean it doesn't apply to other situations that involve the phrase ship-type.

Youngster doesn't involve the phrase "ship-type".

Youngster doesn't involve the phrase "ship-type".

Just because the term isn't used there doesn't mean the term doesn't apply as a concept. Besides the rules that Younger follows is the same as the Ship-type so there's no reason to assume it would work differently.

Just because the term isn't used there doesn't mean the term doesn't apply as a concept.

Great. It defines a term, and the term isn't used anywhere else, but still feel free to apply the term wherever. Biggs's card says X-Wing so I'm going to put him in a T-70 X-Wing because that's a ship-type.

Besides the rules that Younger follows is the same as the Ship-type so there's no reason to assume it would work differently.

No, the rules that Youngster follows is that it works with TIE fighters and it works with TIE F/O fighters. They could've said "it works with anything containing TIE and fighter"... but they didn't .

They could've said "it works with anything containing TIE and fighter"... but they didn't .

Because it didn't need to be said.

But that's the end of it for me. I'm not going argue an absurd point with someone who seems more interested in arguing then a reasonable discussion of the rules.