I found the current situation in Cthulhu CCG LCG whateverCG extremely discouraging.

No major tournament, not even online one. Zero Servitor support. Extremely delayed releases.

No deckbuilding either, as I've yet to see a functioning innovative deck posted since Ron's worlds decklists.

This said I think current game development and management has some big responsibilities on this situation.

The shift from 4x to 3x bound to happen when (likely in 2011 given the current extremely timely schedule...) pretty much stiffled any deckbuilding purpose: why deckbuild at 4x when it is bound to get 3x? Not all decks can survive the change seamlessy.

The current extremely ambiguous position on post-LCG format (now, for one, I am willing to bet diamonds to donuts pre-LCG sets will get the same Highlander shafting AGoT took, or even worse, considering how many bad decisions came from current dev team, but an official statement has yet to happen), as even direct inquiries about it are answered with: "I am sorry, but I can not release that information until it goes public. There will be an announcement about it very soon." (the very soon is really funny, since the mail I am quoting is from Nov 7), is crushing any kind of trading, since none in his right mind would trade for duds (future highlander or cycled out cards), future devalued cards (imagine paying now cash for an high price card like DOA or Shiny Trap -well, shiny trap of the old days, now it is really devalued since the high mark- and having it printed in the Core Set) or future bans.

So no gaming, no sense in deckbuilding and no trading. The three core aspects of CCGs are being null and voided by this game management.

Way to go.

Rant: the forum is still crap and current releases are way below acceptable quality.

I agree with everything you said, carioz.

Carioz said:

Yes it is. And if you turn to look at what's happening in Game of Thrones, you see all the hard truths which I feel are on the way to Cthulhu, when FFG decides to officially announce it.

Carioz said:

Yes, yes, and yes. No major Tournament and, more importantly, no Organized Play Program. Based on GoT, seeing the OPP will not make people much happier, but some would be relieved to see the future laid out to them, so they could decide to continue with the game or not.

Servitors haven't heard anything since they were accepted to become Servitors. The Servitor board is gone with the new forum shift, but there was no activity there anyway because FFG told us nothing.

And at this point, my confidence in a January release for the Coreset, is shaky at best.

As far as deckbuilding, I haven't even picked up a deck since GenCon. I've barely even looked through the cards, let alone felt any urge to play a game with them.

Carioz said:

I share a similar opinion: look to Game of Thrones and see your future. Look to the FFG Holiday Sale and see your future. If old sets were going to be active, there would be no reason to offer them at such discounted prices. Notice that all the old Game of Thrones sets are also on sale. Not the GoT Coreset, not the Chapter Packs- not even a little discount on them, because they are making money for the company and viable for the future. The old sets are cluttering up the warehouse and the sale is a way to clear out the space.

FFG is taking the game in a new direction and I'm not even saying that it is a bad thing. But a lot of loyal players who have been here pre-LCG are going to be upset and disappointed. A lot of them will leave. And a lot of this could have been avoided if things had been done differently, in my opinion. The silent treatment is not the answer.

Carioz said:

Yes. I fear they may have crippled the game irreparably. 4+ months is a long time to leave things up in the air. Many people probably found other things to spend their time and money on.

Hastur said:

Sorry to single out just phrase in your response but this is the real dealbreaker for me. I am not even making a case on Ap 5 & 6 having at most 2 interesting cards out of 40.

But deckbuilding right now feels so empty: I don't even know if the interaction I found will be valid in 2 months. At least a clear stance: we are highlandering classic (ugh), we are dropping it, split format à la vintage in Magic: the Gathering, dropping it entirely, whatever. At least I would have a reason to fire up the deckbuilder.

And no new decks means no playing. It gets kinda boring after the billionth time to play the same exact matchup.

I am really new to this game and I agree with everything y'all have said.I started playing in July or Aug. The local servitor sat me down and we did a demo. while I am not a mythos fan I loved the game mechanics. Then I get told that there is going to be a core set comming out in Sept. to kinda balance out the fact that I wont have the cardpool the servitor does.

Well I am impatient and bought all of the commons and uncommons from everything I can and am now regretting it. I have been pushing so hard with this game ,even more than the servitor, to get people interrested and now I am looking like a huge jerk. I don't like being seen as a Noob. FFG Has done nothing to support you older players. As for the newer players, well I can't say they have done much at all to encourage them.

It looks like FFG is weeding out the older player to cultivate the newer players that know nothing. There is a lot of history in this game that even I am not aware of and the friendships that the game has developed in the older players is something to be cherished. Yet every day I see more and more of the old guard fading and becomming more and more disenfranchised. This is a shame. I have posted a few other things along this same topic but i felt it needed to be said from a new player perspective.

This new player 100% supports the views of the older players and I enourage the other new players to rally behind these guys and demand that FFG not leave them for dead. The older players are what makes this game IMO. They are so full of info and insight that to lose them from the gaming community would be a sin. The Older players are what supported CoC and FFG this long and we should now rally behind them and support them in this time of frustration. The older player are not to be forgotten and left behind but we shoul dcarry them on our shoulders into this new era of CoC.

If there are any other New players that support this view please respond in kind. We may not be able to really do anything but we can make our voices heard.

You guys are bummin' me out.

Well, one possible point of light is that a bunch of stuff was just released about the Mutant Chronicles OP, so hopefully that means that the other games still needing it (like CoC and AGoT) will be getting it soon.

And by soon, I really think that we need them in time to kick off the new year.

New year like 2010? Possible. New year like 2009? Unlikely

While I agree with most in Carioz's post, I've really kind of thrown in the towel. No matter how hard we rant, no matter how everyone is saying CoC needs new designers and playtesters, no matter how bad the new cards are, no matter what, it has been seen that FFG won't change a thing. They will continue doing things with their own style. Right now, I'm just waiting to see what happens.

And the thing about building new decks... I know the feeling.

PS. Liked the Shocking Transformation article, Carioz.

Carioz said:

We've been quite spoiled before, with the Servitor Program. To put things in perspective: I tried, with a couple of friends to run a Friday Night Magic leage for Magic: the Gathering some years ago. Being a large game, it was easy to get the turnout to do this. So, when we tried to set it up, we had to jump from hoop to hoop to make sure our leage was recognized, and to get some promo's from Wizards. So, being a nice and enthousiastic bunch, we jumped and jumped until our feet got sore; But the result? None. We never got one promo. Our little playgroup was deemed uninteresting to the Grand Magi at Wizards of the Coast, and their representatives in the Netherlands. Extremely disappointing.

In perspective, the Servitor Program was handled great. Our group got immediatly recognized, no questions asked. It was a breath of fresh air.

To create further perspective; The Stahleck tournament brought great prizes, even though it did had some formats that wheren't officially recognized. Thorondor went above his Servitor calling on that one; Taking action himself to create a prize pool of cool Cthulhu swag.

As for deck building: Rons deck broke the game. Consitantly winning on turn 2 is bad for the game as a whole. There are a couple of ways to fix this though.

- Embracing the power creep, bringing out more ridiculous cards to break the game even further.

- Banning and/or rotation or split formats.

You yourself whined about both solutions. You yourself complained about fearing "new cards that practically force you to play them" or "when a split format comes, I'll quit." - Well, I didn't see you think of a good alternative. And then there is this gem:

Carioz said:

When there is no tournament program to speak of, like you complained, then the shift from 4x to 3x is moot. Since FFG doesn't come to your kitchen table and smack you over the head for having 4 copies of a single card in your deck.

It doesn't seem like you don't know what you want. On one side you want a tournament program, and a way to fix the format to encourage a new approach in deckbuilding, but on the other side you don't want change at all, because it forces a new approach in deck building. Do you want to keep that cake around on your kitchen table, or do you want to eat it? Or is there a magical alternative you have been holding out on?

Carioz said:

It's not a CCG, not anymore. Like many good CCG's that are too deep and strategic and quirky for the general public, it just didn't sell well enough. Producing a CCG is very expensive; A lot of time goes into making new cards, new art, development and keeping things consistant and balanced.

While it certainly is not ideal by a long shot, I'm glad there still is new product to look forward to, to use with my old cards. Yes, the white borders thing sucks, the new card back thing sucks too, but FFG could have easily called quits on this game. And it's not like your old cards are magically disappearing...

Carioz said:

QFT!

I'll try to keep the answer short as I've yet to figure out if the time out thingie is a feature or not.

First thing. I am a competitve gamer. I like to win. I am not interested in beer and pretzel games. I often lose, but try to build better decks and to get better. This is not some kind of manifesto, but the perspective I am looking at the game from.

To create further perspective; The Stahleck tournament brought great prizes, even though it did had some formats that wheren't officially recognized. Thorondor went above his Servitor calling on that one; Taking action himself to create a prize pool of cool Cthulhu swag.

As for deck building: Rons deck broke the game. Consitantly winning on turn 2 is bad for the game as a whole. There are a couple of ways to fix this though.

- Embracing the power creep, bringing out more ridiculous cards to break the game even further.

- Banning and/or rotation or split formats.

You yourself whined about both solutions. You yourself complained about fearing "new cards that practically force you to play them" or "when a split format comes, I'll quit." - Well, I didn't see you think of a good alternative.

When there is no tournament program to speak of, like you complained, then the shift from 4x to 3x is moot. Since FFG doesn't come to your kitchen table and smack you over the head for having 4 copies of a single card in your deck.

It doesn't seem like you don't know what you want. On one side you want a tournament program, and a way to fix the format to encourage a new approach in deckbuilding, but on the other side you don't want change at all, because it forces a new approach in deck building.

I'm glad there still is new product to look forward to, to use with my old cards.

On a side note I had to write this in notepad, quote a random message and then edit. I guess El Senor Forum has still some troubles.

So, some card theoretically forces you to play attachments? Isn't that why you keep a DOA at hand? Our a nifty Greg/T-Man combo or something?

And what is stopping you from starting your own 4x vintage league? Sure, it's a disappointment Wizards didn't greenlight my FNM (which is a beer and pretzels tournament format...) but that didn't stop me from going to an Ice Age Block Sealed Deck tourney last week (with the most horrible templating I've ever seen on any cards, too.)

I understand -some of- your complaints, but I don't see you taking any action in making things work out better. Hey, I just saw Stahleck 2009 announced. At least that is the kind of attitude to keep your game moving forward, instead of complaining how others just won't do anything...

Marius said:

So, some card theoretically forces you to play attachments? Isn't that why you keep a DOA at hand? Our a nifty Greg/T-Man combo or something?

actually when i emailed paul the other month about when ffg might start with tourneys again cause i planned on running some in the mean time with extra promos and stuff that me and another guy had laying around he actually sent me a few promos and stuff. nothing we havent seen before but i guess he was willing to help me try to kick start our little group, since that was my intention of doing my own thing for the time being. i didnt get any date on when new tourneys would start but oh well.

we already switched to the 3x cause we know that will be certain, otherwise its all good. we have a game this saturday and since two(half, we arent a big group) of the players are new this week we are doing a poor mans deck. no point making them chase rares and all, cause who knows what coreset format will be. but its commons, uc, and asylum packs. i think its a good way to balance the decks for where we are right now.

so maybe instead of doing nothing, try to do something and let ffg know your plans.

PearlJamaholic said:

I have tried doing as you said and organize groups and tourneys. FFG simply will not support smaller venues. Every month since Aug. I have tried to get things together and now CoC is a laughing stock at our store because of all of the delays and the lack of support. FFG has done so horribly in supporting the Servitor in my area that he has quit and now I can't even sign up for Servitorship. All of our prize support was bought by the players via Draft or entry Fee. We have done this without FFG support and now have lost a lot of people who were genuinly interested.

The tournament sceen is indeed frozen and not just in my area. Playing for fun with friends is ok once in a while for most, but they want to play tourneys,win prizes and get recognition for a job well done. Honestly why should they try and play a tourney if there is no official recognizable reward? If it honstly doesnt matter what they do what makes people even want to try? It doesn't matter if i reach into my own pocket and give out 100$ prize, yay they get more cards but other than that what does it gain them? Nothing nifty or cool that others can't easily get. No promos or prizes of anykind noting their status or skill. FFG isn't expressing any interrest in the players or the tournament sceen so why should anyone express interrest in CoC?

It's hard to see your meta sicken and vaporize while you

did everything you could to nurture it. It's plain infuriating

when it's largely due to the missteps and lack of support

of the game's parent company. I and many others unfortunately

have shared this experience with you. I hope there is good news

around the corner for us all. The Organized Play Program could

be a very nice recruiting element. I will remind FFGs that news of

the format status and any rotated sets is vital information for

all current and future players and should be made available

asap.