SO using the magic of Excell I decided to take a look at how many points pre squadron command you spend. Keep in mind this is only fleet point value / squadron value. This doesn't take into consideration anti-squadron firepower value upgrade slots, titles or other things. Also didn't include Wave 5 because we don't have all the values for both retrofits. So somethings that have been rather obvious (such as flotillas having a low point per squadron command) but some other things interesting (Such as VSD1 beeing cheaper than ISD1 or indicator lacking in squadron value).

So first the Rebels from cheapest to most expensive points per squadron command

• GR-75 Medium 9
• GR-75 Combat 12
• Assault Frigate Mk2B 24
• MC80 Command Cruiser 26.5
• Nebulon-B Escort Frigate 28.5
• MC80 Assault Cruiser 38
• CR-90 Corvette B 39
• Assault Frigate Mk2A 40.5
• CR-90 Corvette A 44
• MC80lib Star Cruiser 48
• Nebulon-B Support Frigate 51
• MC80lib Battle Cruiser 51.5
• MC30c Torpedo Frigate 63
• MC30c Scout Frigate 69

And here are the Imperials

• Gozanti Class Cruiser 11.5
• Gozanti Class Assault Carrier 14
• Victory I Class Star Destroyer 24&1/3
• Imperial Class Star Destroyer I 27.5
• Gladiator SD I 28
• Victory II Class Star Destroyer 28&1/3
• Imperial Class Star Destroyer II 30
• Gladiator SD II 31
• Raider Corvette Class I 44
• Interdictor Suppression Refit 45
• Interdictor Combat Refit 46.5
• Raider Corvette Class II 48

So while Rebels have some of the lowest squadron values they also have some of the most expensive squadron values. Imperials tend to all have on average rather low values after to flotillas with the difference being less than a full point. When you get to the other half the Imperials end up with better squadron values.

Always thought gladiators are criminally underused as carriers.

Always thought gladiators are criminally underused as carriers.

Not sure there's a actually a law against not using them as carriers.

Probably should be.

Always thought gladiators are criminally underused as carriers.

Not sure there's a actually a law against not using them as carriers.

Probably should be.

They can take flight controllers and fighter coord teams.

Inverse assault frigate. Great as a carrier, great as a brawler, not pretending to be a long range fighter.

I just love gladiators.......... My favourite ship.

Always thought gladiators are criminally underused as carriers.

Not sure there's a actually a law against not using them as carriers.

Probably should be.

They can take flight controllers and fighter coord teams.

Inverse assault frigate. Great as a carrier, great as a brawler, not pretending to be a long range fighter.

How about a GSD-II FC/FCT pushing around Valen "the Grin" and two YV-666?

You can use Gladiators to command squadrons on those off turns where it's still setting itself up for the pounce (turn 2 if you're going for a cautious approach) and it's okay. The main issue is its battery armament is very strong but very limited and so commands and upgrades that don't help it bring that to bear make it a sub-par ship as it doesn't have the jack-of-all-trades profile (like an Assault Frigate) that allows it to do a bit of everything competently. I have a very hard time believing a Gladiator with Flight Controllers and Fighter Coordination Teams (at Squadrons 2, remember) would be nearly as effective as one with Ordnance Experts and Engine Techs in the same slots.

I'm sure eventually Imperials will get a ship that can rock the Flight Commander+Fighter Coordination Teams combination well but I imagine we'll be waiting until at least wave 6 for that.

Glad I, wuluff, flight controllers, 3 tie interceptors.

Its an alpha monster

Glad I, wuluff, flight controllers, 3 tie interceptors.

Its an alpha monster

With the 3 TIE Interceptors, maybe. But the Gladiator itself isn't going to be nearly as effective as a more conventional Gladiator.

You can run a VSD-I with Expanded Hangars and Flight Controllers for 15 more points and it can command 4 fighter squadrons at a time without Wulff (you can add Wulff if you really want to bring it to 5) and that VSD is happy to hang back, provide some longer-ranged dice support, and command squadrons without really making any compromises on what it wants to do.

Ever since Fighter Coordination Teams came out I see these "ermagerd Gladiator carriers maybe?" mini-discussions about once a month and yet the proponents of the idea never actually seem to run them in their real games. I don't see Gladiators set to be mediocre carriers at the expense of being black dice monsters in tournaments or in tournament list write-ups, either.

Just dotting to say I love my Tarkin GSD carriers, and lately even Ozzel GSD carriers.

Always thought gladiators are criminally underused as carriers.

Well Gladiators tend to be the more expensive carriers as far as Star Destroyers go. What is surprising is how expensive Raiders and MC30s are. Well at least the Raider has the double anti-squadron dice but the Shrimp has abandoned the squadron game all together.

I feel like a comprehensive list should include the variants that can have EHB equipped. And how much that improves some by

Rebel Transport == 9 per

Rebel transport w/ EHB == 7.67 per

A Glad with fct and fc can also trigger mauler for a double tap, it's meeeaaan

A Glad with fct and fc can also trigger mauler for a double tap, it's meeeaaan

Actually the little caveat on FCT is that the squadron has to be "unengaged".

A Glad with fct and fc can also trigger mauler for a double tap, it's meeeaaan

Actually the little caveat on FCT is that the squadron has to be "unengaged".

Yeah if you want that Mauler double-tap you have to use Chiraneau, who is just a little more expensive.

Snip, you clearly havent been to the uk.

Vaders Glads

Faction: Galactic Empire

Points: 397/400

Commander: Darth Vader

Assault Objective: Advanced Gunnery

Defense Objective: Fire Lanes

Navigation Objective: Dangerous Territory

Gladiator I-Class Star Destroyer (56 points)

- Wulff Yularen ( 7 points)

- Flight Controllers ( 6 points)

= 69 total ship cost

Gladiator I-Class Star Destroyer (56 points)

- Commandant Aresko ( 7 points)

- Flight Controllers ( 6 points)

= 69 total ship cost

[ flagship ] Imperial I-Class Star Destroyer (110 points)

- Darth Vader ( 36 points)

- Flight Controllers ( 6 points)

- X17 Turbolasers ( 6 points)

= 158 total ship cost

1 "Howlrunner" ( 16 points)

1 "Mauler" Mithel ( 15 points)

1 Black Squadron ( 9 points)

1 Valen Rudor ( 13 points)

6 TIE Fighter Squadrons ( 48 points)

It's worth pointing out that Lambda Shuttles, at whatever points cost they end up getting, will probably become the cheapest way to activate squadrons, for a small number of squadrons. If you want to activate a horde of TIEs, you should command them the old fashioned way. But if you just want to move some Vader & Friends around, you can activate them with half the Squadron Value if you do so by way of the Relay keyword.

A Glad with fct and fc can also trigger mauler for a double tap, it's meeeaaan

Actually the little caveat on FCT is that the squadron has to be "unengaged".

Yeah if you want that Mauler double-tap you have to use Chiraneau, who is just a little more expensive.

Fct - damage

Intel move - damage

Shoot

Best case, but still

Snip, you clearly havent been to the uk.

Vaders Glads

Faction: Galactic Empire

Points: 397/400

Commander: Darth Vader

Assault Objective: Advanced Gunnery

Defense Objective: Fire Lanes

Navigation Objective: Dangerous Territory

Gladiator I-Class Star Destroyer (56 points)

- Wulff Yularen ( 7 points)

- Flight Controllers ( 6 points)

= 69 total ship cost

Gladiator I-Class Star Destroyer (56 points)

- Commandant Aresko ( 7 points)

- Flight Controllers ( 6 points)

= 69 total ship cost

[ flagship ] Imperial I-Class Star Destroyer (110 points)

- Darth Vader ( 36 points)

- Flight Controllers ( 6 points)

- X17 Turbolasers ( 6 points)

= 158 total ship cost

1 "Howlrunner" ( 16 points)

1 "Mauler" Mithel ( 15 points)

1 Black Squadron ( 9 points)

1 Valen Rudor ( 13 points)

6 TIE Fighter Squadrons ( 48 points)

I do seem to remember the UK nationals were won by a glad carrier list this year.

It's worth pointing out that Lambda Shuttles, at whatever points cost they end up getting, will probably become the cheapest way to activate squadrons, for a small number of squadrons. If you want to activate a horde of TIEs, you should command them the old fashioned way. But if you just want to move some Vader & Friends around, you can activate them with half the Squadron Value if you do so by way of the Relay keyword.

Not unless you still need to use your squadron value to activate those squadrons through relay. Ie. You can activate a squadron through relay for a further reach on you command, but it still costs a squad command.

Snip, you clearly havent been to the uk.

Vaders Glads

Faction: Galactic Empire

Points: 397/400

Commander: Darth Vader

Assault Objective: Advanced Gunnery

Defense Objective: Fire Lanes

Navigation Objective: Dangerous Territory

Gladiator I-Class Star Destroyer (56 points)

- Wulff Yularen ( 7 points)

- Flight Controllers ( 6 points)

= 69 total ship cost

Gladiator I-Class Star Destroyer (56 points)

- Commandant Aresko ( 7 points)

- Flight Controllers ( 6 points)

= 69 total ship cost

[ flagship ] Imperial I-Class Star Destroyer (110 points)

- Darth Vader ( 36 points)

- Flight Controllers ( 6 points)

- X17 Turbolasers ( 6 points)

= 158 total ship cost

1 "Howlrunner" ( 16 points)

1 "Mauler" Mithel ( 15 points)

1 Black Squadron ( 9 points)

1 Valen Rudor ( 13 points)

6 TIE Fighter Squadrons ( 48 points)

I remain thoroughly unconvinced. The Gladiators with no reliable means of delivering their black dice are especially problematic.

It's got:

• Three activations
• No Engine Techs on the Gladiators
• Small bid for first
• No Demolisher
• 101 points spent on squadrons that are only good at killing other squadrons as well as a bunch of other points spent on upgrades to make your fighter-killing squadrons even better at killing other squadrons
• No anti-flotilla tech beyond "hopefully Vader's rerolls can luck me into an Accuracy."

This kind of fleet would get eaten alive where I play. Maybe it would do well in your meta, but I'm really curious what kind of meta that looks like for those downsides to not be big problems.

Again, my main issue and it's a big issue is the things that take Gladiators from "circumstantial/in a pinch" carriers to "kind of all right, sure" carriers are upgrades that occupy the slots they use to be reliable destroyers (Ordnance Experts, Engine Techs, some kind of helper officer). Points spent making Gladiators less likely to "Gladiate" to make them mediocre carriers feels like points very poorly spent. At the very least you could always just throw Flight Commander + Fighter Coordination Teams+Expanded Hangar Bays on the Interdictor - it's not great, but at least the Interdictor is a slower support ship and so tacking "carrier" on to what it can do doesn't come at such a high opportunity cost.

If anyone out there wants to prove me wrong for raining on the fun parade, go place in the top 4 at a Regional event with Gladiator carriers. Show us how it's done. Nothing succeeds like success and all that.

It's worth pointing out that Lambda Shuttles, at whatever points cost they end up getting, will probably become the cheapest way to activate squadrons, for a small number of squadrons. If you want to activate a horde of TIEs, you should command them the old fashioned way. But if you just want to move some Vader & Friends around, you can activate them with half the Squadron Value if you do so by way of the Relay keyword.

Not unless you still need to use your squadron value to activate those squadrons through relay. Ie. You can activate a squadron through relay for a further reach on you command, but it still costs a squad command.

Oh, man. I was assuming that the Lambda was a pocket Expanded Hangar Bay. But you're right that it could be a pocket Boosted Comms (and does extend the range regardless of whether it also makes things more efficient). I guess all that the Lambda did was let your ISD activate one Lambda and three other squads a little farther away, I'd be disappointed unless the Lambda itself was worth doing anything with. I guess it depends on what the Strategic keyword does.

I guess it depends on what the Strategic keyword does.

It appears to allow you to move nearby squadrons to within distance 1 of it at a certain point... Kind of like, "Form on my Wing"

Very negative Snipa, you appear to have a closed mind.

Uk nationals was won by glad carriers

Well Gladaitor 1 still have cheaper Squadron points than a Victory II. If you go down to the cheaper retrofit you might lose on volley but will gain more space for squadrons.