I just came across a situation that I need to resolve and wanted to get some input from you guys on how you would handle said situation.

A while ago there's been a tournament in a city nearby. They made videos and put them online. One video caused quite a stir because you can see one player doing 2 things that are difficult to argue as not cheating. I knew the player because he's a regular at our own tournaments and always does very well. I chose to take no action because the incident didn't take place at our venue and I was not involved at all but I decided to keep an eye out for him.

Recently we had a tournament in my venue where I was TO. One guy made videos and when I faced the player in question we chose to record our match (not because I was suspicious but because it was an interesting match). Today I got the recordings and took a look at our match. It was a very close match and when things started to get tight I noticed something. One turn he moves his first ship and then I move my ship. The dial of his second ship however lies open. Then while I am distracted he quickly takes the dial and switches it to a maneuver he then quickly executes.

Now it can be argued that he just simply forgot to set a maneuver for his ship and while realizing his mistake he entered the maneuver. Mistakes happen, no biggie. But the way he resoved the situation botheres me. He didn't tell me so we could resove the situation together. He purposefully made something he clearly knew was against the rules.

Comes next turn: His Jumpmaster is on his last hull and trying to flee. He does a white move (therefore not triggering K4 Security Droid) and takes a TL as an action. I want to move my ship and he tells me to wait. Then he decides to take a Fokus, thereby taking a second action. At the time I didn't realize the mistake but while watching the video I realized that he couldn't have gotten that 2nd action.

Now again it can be argued that it was just a mistake, he thought to get a TL from his K4. But I'm not sure. He has a tendency to make "mistakes" when things are going against him.

Now there's the question on how to handle the situation. TOs, I would love to hear your input!

(and just to be clear: I don't intend to have any personal gain from this situation. I won the match, so I can't get a higher rinking or better prizes. For arguments purposes it should make no difference that I was the player who was paired against him. The discussion should be solely based on how to handle a player who is willing to cheat)

The second one is easier to answer. If you generally do green maneuvers (triggering K4), one can argue that you are doing stuff out of habit. Much like when I want to make sure to take my FCS Target Lock, I put the Token in my hand so I remember to place it during the shooting phase. If caught and called out that K4 shouldn't have triggered, then you just remove the focus token, as the Target Lock was the first action.

On to changing maneuvers. If he didn't say anything (because there is NOTHING in the rules that says you can't look at your maneuver dial that has been placed) and you suspect him changing his maneuver dial, then call the TO. As the TO in that situation, I would let the action slide (unless it was video taped and we could see a replay). If we can't, I would keep an eye on the situation. If we can, and see him changing his dial, then I would kick him out. As a note of consideration, when I do wish to check my dial (which is a good thing to do, especially if during the movement phase they are moved around to make room for maneuvers and such) or to remember which ship to activate first, I always let my opponent know what I am doing. I would say that I am "looking at my dial".

Also, since you didn't say what his two actions were from the other tourney....... They have no bearing on the current event.

Finally, and this sucks. The latest FFG rules update specifically states that Judges/TO's when NOT doing their official duties are spectators. Which means, unless I observe the player cheating, I say nothing. If they break the rules (IE have a stress, damaged engine (hard turns red) and do a hard turn and no one catches) I won't say anything. Multiple tokens, I won't say anything. However, when observing table(s) and I see someone changing their dial after the maneuver phase starts, then I will do something. Now, if I was called to your table over a rules violation or suspected cheating, yes I would oberseve the play, but as a TO/Judge and not a spectator as I was called to the table.

Tar and feather him

Now there has come up a third situation. In the last turn he has a chance to kill my ship with a good shot. He does a perfect move to get into range 1 of my ship to shoot at me. He doesn't however flip over his dial so I can see if he really dialed the move he made.

Again like the situation with the TL token we don't know if he actually wanted to cheat. Maybe he really dialed in the correct move, maybe he really just took the TL because he was automatically thinking about his K4 droid. But after seeing him rotating his dial, you can't help but wonder. He has shown that he's ok with bending the rules and if things are going against him, he's willing to cheat. And that's what it will be like from now on. Whenever I'm playing against him, I will have to be carefull about his actions and I will always wonder if he does something while I'm looking away. And whenever he will be playing somebody else I will have to wonder if he will capitalize on their carelessness.

Now I have a situation where I'm not just a spectator. I have a video that clearly shows how he rotates his dial after the other ships have moved. What should I do about it?

Tell him how it is.

Show him the suspicious moves on the video And warm him that he is now being watched closely and that Any weird or suspicious situation in the future will earn him DQ, loss of match or outright bank from tournaments you TO

The first one was a clear violation of the rules.

The rules clearly state if you're going to pick up your dial, you have to inform the other player you're doing so. Also the rules are clear that if you don't set a dial for a given ship...

If a player forgets to place a maneuver dial next to a ship, but tells his opponent he is ready to begin the round, once play has proceeded to the first ship (a dial has been revealed, a maneuver has been executed, etc.), he may no longer place a dial. Instead, when that ship activates, the player’s opponent chooses the maneuver that ship will perform.

So whether he forgot to set a dial or not, he can't change it after the fact and was breaking the rules.

I have a video that clearly shows how he rotates his dial after the other ships have moved. What should I do about it?

I'd ban him from the store if that's an option and let other TO's in the area know that he's a cheater and they should ban him as well.

If you're feeling merciful you could come up with something that will let him earn his way back in again, but if someone is a cheater they'll always cheat, so it's not just the game with you, it's every game.

Now there has come up a third situation. In the last turn he has a chance to kill my ship with a good shot. He does a perfect move to get into range 1 of my ship to shoot at me. He doesn't however flip over his dial so I can see if he really dialed the move he made.

This one in particular is very clear: the rules say you have to show what move is on your dial before you execute it. A lot of people don't remember to flip the dial til after, but you still should get the chance to see it before you move on.

This one in particular is very clear: the rules say you have to show what move is on your dial before you execute it.

Without trying to sound harsh against the OP, but this is exactly why cheaters get away with stuff so often. Because people won't call them on it.

Finally, and this sucks. The latest FFG rules update specifically states that Judges/TO's when NOT doing their official duties are spectators. Which means, unless I observe the player cheating, I say nothing. If they break the rules (IE have a stress, damaged engine (hard turns red) and do a hard turn and no one catches) I won't say anything. Multiple tokens, I won't say anything. However, when observing table(s) and I see someone changing their dial after the maneuver phase starts, then I will do something. Now, if I was called to your table over a rules violation or suspected cheating, yes I would oberseve the play, but as a TO/Judge and not a spectator as I was called to the table.

This is a untenable interpretation of that section of the event rules. You can not honestly be suggesting that FFG is forcing you as a Marshall/Judge to watch player break the rules, essentially cheat in some situations, and do nothing unless called over to the table by the players opponent. You are a Marshall/Judge at all times, even when not actively requested at a table. FFG has asked you to communicate to the players when you are "off the clock" for whatever reason, be it taking a break or rotating off for the day. They have not asked you to sit in the corner unless called to a table.

The rules tell Marshalls and Judges to communicate to players when they aren't currently on duty. Observing games to correct rules errors (upholding the events integrity), and spotting possible cheating/stalling/other unsporting conduct is absolutely a Marshall/Judge actively preforming his or her duties.

This is a untenable interpretation of that section of the event rules.

I think you could make an argument that if a marshal sees something wrong, they can't always correct it. For example if both players forget the stress from Rebel Captive... I think you could make an argument that a judge can't interject. I don't think this is a good rule but it does seem to be what the tournament doc says.

But that is not the same thing as seeing someone cheat or cases of bad sportsmanship. A judge that see's someone cheating and doesn't stop them shouldn't be a judge.

This is a untenable interpretation of that section of the event rules.

I think you could make an argument that if a marshal sees something wrong, they can't always correct it. For example if both players forget the stress from Rebel Captive... I think you could make an argument that a judge can't interject. I don't think this is a good rule but it does seem to be what the tournament doc says.

But that is not the same thing as seeing someone cheat or cases of bad sportsmanship. A judge that see's someone cheating and doesn't stop them shouldn't be a judge.

I concur.

I'm also uneasy about spectators not being allowed to remind people about mandatory gamestate things like crit effects or missed rebel captives. If a thing is optional, I'll keep my mouth shut even if it's a no brainer choice, but if it's mandatory I think people (spectators and judges) really ought to be able to remind both parties about it.

This is a untenable interpretation of that section of the event rules.

I think you could make an argument that if a marshal sees something wrong, they can't always correct it. For example if both players forget the stress from Rebel Captive... I think you could make an argument that a judge can't interject. I don't think this is a good rule but it does seem to be what the tournament doc says.But that is not the same thing as seeing someone cheat or cases of bad sportsmanship. A judge that see's someone cheating and doesn't stop them shouldn't be a judge.

If caught in the normal timing of the ability why should a Marshall not instruct player's to properly execute the rules? Should a Marshall not saying anything if they watch a player pick up an extra green dice against an Inquisitor shot?

Is the Marshall watching someone forget Rebel Captive or the Inquisitor's ability or are they watching someone attempt to cheat in doing those things. The only difference between cheating and not cheating in those situations is intent, which a Marshall can only guess at.

but if it's mandatory I think people (spectators and judges) really ought to be able to remind both parties about it.

I agree, they should. But here's what the latest tournament docs say...

A judge’s responsibilities include assisting players to resolve disputes and answering questions regarding the game’s rules. When a judge is not actively performing judge duties, he or she is a spectator and should communicate this change in status clearly.

The same text is in the section for Marshal, it says that a spectator...

Spectators must not disturb an ongoing game, and cannot provide any input or assistance to players during their games.

Again, not that I agree with this, but it seems that per the x-wing tournament regulations v121 a Judge or Marshal can't get involved in a match unless asked. Although it does say that a Marshal determines if unsporting conduct has occurred, and I'd say that cheating is covered under that. So a Marshal at least can act if he/she sees cheating, without being asked.

This is a untenable interpretation of that section of the event rules.

I think you could make an argument that if a marshal sees something wrong, they can't always correct it. For example if both players forget the stress from Rebel Captive... I think you could make an argument that a judge can't interject. I don't think this is a good rule but it does seem to be what the tournament doc says.

But that is not the same thing as seeing someone cheat or cases of bad sportsmanship. A judge that see's someone cheating and doesn't stop them shouldn't be a judge.

I concur.

I'm also uneasy about spectators not being allowed to remind people about mandatory gamestate things like crit effects or missed rebel captives. If a thing is optional, I'll keep my mouth shut even if it's a no brainer choice, but if it's mandatory I think people (spectators and judges) really ought to be able to remind both parties about it.

Spectators are not currently allowed to do that. Marshall/Judges absolutely should be doing that.

The only difference between cheating and not cheating in those situations is intent, which a Marshall can only guess at.

Not really, because in both cases both players are aware of what's going on, or can point out the mistake after the fact.

It takes both players agreement if even only implicit for a ship not to get a stress after shooting someone with rebel captive on it.

Now again, I do think that spectators should be able to point out missed mandatory effects, but the rules don't seem to agree with me on that.

This is a untenable interpretation of that section of the event rules.

I think you could make an argument that if a marshal sees something wrong, they can't always correct it. For example if both players forget the stress from Rebel Captive... I think you could make an argument that a judge can't interject. I don't think this is a good rule but it does seem to be what the tournament doc says.

But that is not the same thing as seeing someone cheat or cases of bad sportsmanship. A judge that see's someone cheating and doesn't stop them shouldn't be a judge.

I concur.

I'm also uneasy about spectators not being allowed to remind people about mandatory gamestate things like crit effects or missed rebel captives. If a thing is optional, I'll keep my mouth shut even if it's a no brainer choice, but if it's mandatory I think people (spectators and judges) really ought to be able to remind both parties about it.

Spectators are not currently allowed to do that. Marshall/Judges absolutely should be doing that.

I know That's why I don't do it, even though I think I should be able to.

I think it's a bad call.

As a player, I'm more than happy if people remind me about something mandatory that we've both forgotten, like a Rebel Captive, ionisation, weapons failure, major hull breach, damaged cockpit etc etc etc. I'm usually at least a little frazzled at a tourney and realising I've missed things like this in a timely way makes me feel way better than being reminded about them after the fact and having to work out how to fix it.

This is a untenable interpretation of that section of the event rules.

I think you could make an argument that if a marshal sees something wrong, they can't always correct it. For example if both players forget the stress from Rebel Captive... I think you could make an argument that a judge can't interject. I don't think this is a good rule but it does seem to be what the tournament doc says.

But that is not the same thing as seeing someone cheat or cases of bad sportsmanship. A judge that see's someone cheating and doesn't stop them shouldn't be a judge.

I concur.

I'm also uneasy about spectators not being allowed to remind people about mandatory gamestate things like crit effects or missed rebel captives. If a thing is optional, I'll keep my mouth shut even if it's a no brainer choice, but if it's mandatory I think people (spectators and judges) really ought to be able to remind both parties about it.

Spectators are not currently allowed to do that. Marshall/Judges absolutely should be doing that.

I know That's why I don't do it, even though I think I should be able to.

I think it's a bad call.

As a player, I'm more than happy if people remind me about something mandatory that we've both forgotten, like a Rebel Captive, ionisation, weapons failure, major hull breach, damaged cockpit etc etc etc. I'm usually at least a little frazzled at a tourney and realising I've missed things like this makes me feel way worse than being reminded about them after the fact and having to work out how to fix it.

I understand why the rule exists. Marshalls/Judges are in positions in which they are suppose to be both impartial and experts on the rules. A Spectator does not have to be either of those things.

Therefore you run the risk of a Spectator not knowing the boundaries of what would be essentially coaching, telling a player about an optional rule they missed, as opposed to mandatory things. A Marshall/Judge should know the difference and thus is is a position to intercede.

Furthermore a Spectator is not in a position to grant a time extention if a rules debate pops up as a result of their clarification. Whereas a Marshall/Judge would be.

In my very humble opinion, the best thing is to confront him when you notice the issue. It's easy to make mistakes and even easier to notice after the fact on video.

I've had only two games recorded and noticed several mistakes. In one, I gave one of my defenders an evade after a one bank... even using it to juke my opponent's evade ! On the other one, I forgot I had an evade and took the damage, leaving the evade unspent...

When this occured, in both instances, the games were already so one-way that I don't think it really changed anything (and I also noticed some mistakes from my opponents).

Anyway, this just to highlight that one can make a mistake without trying to cheat... But if you confront him on the spot, you'll see if he reacts as someone who made a mistake (apologising and letting you choose how to sort the situation) or someone who did it on purpose (probably denying everything).

This is a untenable interpretation of that section of the event rules.

I think you could make an argument that if a marshal sees something wrong, they can't always correct it. For example if both players forget the stress from Rebel Captive... I think you could make an argument that a judge can't interject. I don't think this is a good rule but it does seem to be what the tournament doc says.

But that is not the same thing as seeing someone cheat or cases of bad sportsmanship. A judge that see's someone cheating and doesn't stop them shouldn't be a judge.

I concur.

I'm also uneasy about spectators not being allowed to remind people about mandatory gamestate things like crit effects or missed rebel captives. If a thing is optional, I'll keep my mouth shut even if it's a no brainer choice, but if it's mandatory I think people (spectators and judges) really ought to be able to remind both parties about it.

I disagree. Spectators should never say anything about the game to the players that are playing it. If a spectator interrupts a game to point out something that they believe to be mandatory and they are wrong about it, they just caused a delay in the game and caused a distraction for the people playing. As a spectator, if you see something janky going on and you really feel like it needs correcting, let a TO know what your concerns are so that they can monitor the match.

Tell him how it is.

Show him the suspicious moves on the video And warm him that he is now being watched closely and that Any weird or suspicious situation in the future will earn him DQ, loss of match or outright bank from tournaments you TO

THIS.

If somebody has bad habits, that intentionally or unintentionally break the rules - they need to be aware of it.

From the OP, it sounds like there were questionable actions at a different venue on video and after review - more problems at the tournament he was the TO of.

This is a game with little plastic space ships, but the allure of special prizes makes it tempting to some to fudge the rules in their favor.

A private conversation is the best first approach to avoid embarrassment and drama, but if he continues, you must remove him from events in the interest of fair play.

Spectators should never say anything about the game to the players that are playing it.

I see yours and ScottieATF point and you both make a great case. I guess the question is how much do you expect the avg person watching a game to know about the rules. I'd like to think most of them know how something like Rebel Captive works or how many dice you can roll. But I can see that may not be true and can lead to a slippery slope.

But the problem is that Judges and Marshals are supposed to behave as spectators unless they're effectively invited to interject into a game. Which I just don't think is a good idea.

If somebody has bad habits, that intentionally or unintentionally break the rules - they need to be aware of it.

Unintentionally breaking the rules can be a bad habit, sloppy play or just not understanding the rules correctly. Flipping a dial after you move your ship is technically breaking the rules, but one that most people don't care about as long as you flip the dial before moving on to the next ship. Hell I've moved a couple ships and then realized I didn't flip any dials, then flip them. In casual games this isn't a big deal but is still not the correct way to play.

A private conversation is the best first approach to avoid embarrassment and drama, but if he continues

Someone who cheats, and based on the story so far, what's happening is in fact cheating deserves no such mercy. Now I'd not start blasting his name over facebook myself, since I wasn't there and don't know both sides... But if I was and did, and both knew and could prove he was cheating I'd embrase the hell out of him because that's the least he deserves.

Spectators should never say anything about the game to the players that are playing it.

I see yours and ScottieATF point and you both make a great case. I guess the question is how much do you expect the avg person watching a game to know about the rules. I'd like to think most of them know how something like Rebel Captive works or how many dice you can roll. But I can see that may not be true and can lead to a slippery slope.

But the problem is that Judges and Marshals are supposed to behave as spectators unless they're effectively invited to interject into a game. Which I just don't think is a good idea.

There's a similar line in the section on the Judges:

"When a marshal is not actively performing his or her duties, he or she is a

If you see something. Say something.

I'm reading that as saying that a Judge that is taking a break and watching a match needs to let people know that he isn't watching the game as part of his duties and is just a spectator.

That seems like a distinction without a difference. Can marshals really take a break? If they're taking a break and see someone cheating and/or doing something wrong, can't they simply put their marshal/judge hat back on and then deal with it?

It may be just what you say, but that seems like a pointless thing to include in the rules.

If I was inadvertently doing something wrong I'd want someone to tell me.