Imagine this list:

Chirpy w/Emperor and Kylo Ren

Patrol Leader w/Vader

**** list is nearly unstoppable.

Wording on "I'll show you the dark side" should read 'If a ship were to be dealt a faceup critical damage card'. Otherwise, why play anything else, especially rebels. Shields are completely useless.

Kylo Ren is only 3 points. Sorry, I've never really been one to complain about anything in this game, as I love this game, but at this point, why even play? I find it hard to not see that as an autowin. You could even take the Emperor out of the list and fill it with 8 points of something else and it would still be devastating to anything it comes up against.

Ugh. Sorry guys, this is the first time I've actually felt like I've wanted to just not play the game anymore. I want to play competitively, but I also want to be competitive with lists other than something like the above, and I want to be competitive with all factions. I love Defenders now, ARC's, the new Heroe's box set, even the original Xwing (fingers crossed a good fix comes out with Rogue One), the Protectorate fighter...I seriously love playing with all the ships because I've always found a way to be competitive with all of them...but now...when a single 3 point card can trigger a through shield effect practically every round...well...what hope is there in playing anything else...

Counter points

1.) it takes an action to use

2.) vader crew card won't work since it is after an attack not during an attack

3.) the condition card is unique so you can only have 1 out at a time meaning you have to be careful who you target.

this is hardly an auto-win list

Palpatine, Manaroo, Zuckuss, TLT, x7, and the regen droids all set a pretty high bar for the top tier of Xwing card abilities. Maybe Kylo Ren is up there. But I have a very hard time believing he is strong enough to push the power curve beyond where the above listed upgrades have already pushed it. Also remember he takes an action, which is a really, really big hang up.

And as a side anecdote (note I am not saying Kylo Ren is perfectly fine from this single experience), I have played against Kylo Ren RAC with support Vader (pilot) with a janky Rebel list (Horton, Ashoka, Ten Numb), and I took the victory pretty handily. Dice may have been in my favor, but point being Kylo was hardly an "auto win". He landed a blinded pilot on Ten in a vital round, and put Horton to PS 0 even, but it still did not deter my list from performing as I intended it to.

Your proposed "fix" would render the card basically useless at 3 points.

Also, this is just a nitpick, but this discussion is pretty much already being had in the thread where you were originally informed this is in fact how it does work. The discussion would have been fine to continue there.

The other reply is also useful but I just want to add that there are a couple hard counters already in the game to Kylo's ability. Determination makes a ship completely immune to the ability and Integrated astromech lets you get rid of the worst of it. There are probably more.

The other reply is also useful but I just want to add that there are a couple hard counters already in the game to Kylo's ability. Determination makes a ship completely immune to the ability and Integrated astromech lets you get rid of the worst of it. There are probably more.

Anything that prevents actions will do exceptionally well. Good old fashioned blocking, stress control, and Conner Nets are all things. And the Rebels can even wrap all three up in a single package.

These over the top Kylo threads are becoming unbearable.

The other reply is also useful but I just want to add that there are a couple hard counters already in the game to Kylo's ability. Determination makes a ship completely immune to the ability and Integrated astromech lets you get rid of the worst of it. There are probably more.

Anything that prevents actions will do exceptionally well. Good old fashioned blocking, stress control, and Conner Nets are all things. And the Rebels can even wrap all three up in a single package.

I made a big thread about this 2 days ago.

Yes, denying actions can help. But at high PS, he will get to attack at least once, and he is very likely to get a blinded Pilot or damaged Cockpit through. And then Braylen will not be able to shoot/stress twice in a row. Action denying should work well enough against Kylo though.

The problem is that Palpmobile lists are totally able without much change to deal with Kylo, while Rebel Aces get hosed yet again. That is what i find pretty sad. Rebels need to play Biggs/Ghost /TLT/Stress stuff again to deal with this while Empire can play the same stuff as always.

I didn't call for a nerf rightaway, but i would have preferred if his ability did not circumvent shields. Maybe make him cost 1-2 only but don't kill the rebel meta only weeks after Torpscouts are finally gone!

I didn't call for a nerf rightaway, but i would have preferred if his ability did not circumvent shields. Maybe make him cost 1-2 only but don't kill the rebel meta only weeks after Torpscouts are finally gone!

If Kylo crew had cost 2 points and the condition didn't go through shields he'd be yet another crew that doesn't ever hit the table.

Rule name: Knock off whiny ***** syndrome.

Kylo, not you guys.

I didn't call for a nerf rightaway, but i would have preferred if his ability did not circumvent shields. Maybe make him cost 1-2 only but don't kill the rebel meta only weeks after Torpscouts are finally gone!

If Kylo crew had cost 2 points and the condition didn't go through shields he'd be yet another crew that doesn't ever hit the table.

If Kylo cost 0 points and didn't go through shields, he wouldn't be worth the slot. Picking a good crit for an action is a bad use of that action which could be used to focus or target lock and get MORE hits and crits.

I didn't call for a nerf rightaway, but i would have preferred if his ability did not circumvent shields. Maybe make him cost 1-2 only but don't kill the rebel meta only weeks after Torpscouts are finally gone!

If Kylo crew had cost 2 points and the condition didn't go through shields he'd be yet another crew that doesn't ever hit the table.

If Kylo cost 0 points and didn't go through shields, he wouldn't be worth the slot. Picking a good crit for an action is a bad use of that action which could be used to focus or target lock and get MORE hits and crits.

I really think it is a mistake in wording and donesn't meant to bypass shields. Waiting for the FAQ.

I didn't call for a nerf rightaway, but i would have preferred if his ability did not circumvent shields. Maybe make him cost 1-2 only but don't kill the rebel meta only weeks after Torpscouts are finally gone!

If Kylo crew had cost 2 points and the condition didn't go through shields he'd be yet another crew that doesn't ever hit the table.

If Kylo cost 0 points and didn't go through shields, he wouldn't be worth the slot. Picking a good crit for an action is a bad use of that action which could be used to focus or target lock and get MORE hits and crits.

I really think it is a mistake in wording and donesn't meant to bypass shields. Waiting for the FAQ.

I fear not as the wording of abilities like Maarek and Boba is different to this one. I also initially thought it would not bypass shields, but it seems it does.

everytime I hear something about kylo, he's on the deci

so really, it's the **** PWT mechanic that's the problem. Oh well, you'll probably dodge more damage with EU than with Kylo's two blinded pilots anyway

also if you're flying stress Braylen and you're not flying Biggs, you have only yourself to blame. If he's landing blinded on your ARC, you just got straight outplayed

I didn't call for a nerf rightaway, but i would have preferred if his ability did not circumvent shields. Maybe make him cost 1-2 only but don't kill the rebel meta only weeks after Torpscouts are finally gone!

If Kylo crew had cost 2 points and the condition didn't go through shields he'd be yet another crew that doesn't ever hit the table.

Yup, and i would have less of a problem with that as we get such a ton of crew that rarely sees play. Changing the game is part of each new wave, but i don't like that it's again hitting the same kind of ship that just recovered after something had to be netfed!

I don't mind the idea of it bypassing shields, but I don't think the crit should count against the hull - rather, the card should be discarded when it would normally be turned face down, or at the end of a subsequent round...

..."fluffily", surely it should be a 'force-effect' against the pilot, not physical damage to the craft ?

I don't mind the idea of it bypassing shields, but I don't think the crit should count against the hull - rather, the card should be discarded when it would normally be turned face down, or at the end of a subsequent round...

..."fluffily", surely it should be a 'force-effect' against the pilot, not physical damage to the craft ?

Which would be fine if half the cards didn't remain face up forever.

I'm almost inclined to agree with you though - I wouldn't object and I don't think it would affect him much, if the ship took the effects of that crit without it being applied, rather than taking the crit as damage. Being able to front load a nasty crit is the real benefit of Kylo crew. Kylo pilot is more about the target-priority bits..

everytime I hear something about kylo, he's on the deci

so really, it's the **** PWT mechanic that's the problem. Oh well, you'll probably dodge more damage with EU than with Kylo's two blinded pilots anyway

It's also extremely easy (too easy) to get the crit on someone if you have Chiraneau, Gunner, Mercenary Copilot.

However Kylo could also get very interesting in a Bomber Squadron. Him on a Tie/Shuttle accompanied by lots of Proton Torpedoes for example. But i guess it's just so much easier on a PWT ship.

Nobody complains anymore about PWTs as such though, and nobody complains about The Kylo piloted Upsilon Shuttle that actually gives you the condition without even taking an action!

Wouldn't it be easier to just take Kylo as the pilot of the Upsilon Shuttle, take the title, FCS and Targetting Synch along side Omega Ace?

Omega Ace only fires crits, Kylo is rolling four, maybe five dice at people with a focus and sometimes a target lock plus handing out stress. Still got some points left afterwards.

I don't mind the idea of it bypassing shields, but I don't think the crit should count against the hull - rather, the card should be discarded when it would normally be turned face down, or at the end of a subsequent round...

..."fluffily", surely it should be a 'force-effect' against the pilot, not physical damage to the craft ?

Which would be fine if half the cards didn't remain face up forever.

Which is partly what I meant by discarding at the end of a subsequent round...so those that remain face-up only stay in effect for a set number of rounds...as though Kylo can't remain concentrating on the one pilot

Wouldn't it be easier to just take Kylo as the pilot of the Upsilon Shuttle, take the title, FCS and Targetting Synch along side Omega Ace?

Omega Ace only fires crits, Kylo is rolling four, maybe five dice at people with a focus and sometimes a target lock plus handing out stress. Still got some points left afterwards.

You have to get through green dice

Kylo pilot only works when shot; difficult to control and still needs to be triggered by damage

More likely we'll be seeing crew alongside high ps squishier things like backdraft and ATC vader

Has everyone forgotten Determination exists?

Rebel aces (except Norra) aren't stapled to their EPTs like Imperials are. With PS becoming less of an issue, you could easily swap out VI for Determination on Poe (and even then you can bump up to 9 if you really want the PS).

Imagine this list:

Chirpy w/Emperor and Kylo Ren

Patrol Leader w/Vader

**** list is nearly unstoppable.

I'm sure Tie swarm players will disagree with you once they've stopped laughing.

Also, could someone double check to see how many Pilot crits there are in a deck? I mean, you can reach the point where there are no more crits for you to give out with him.

Dont want to play x wing anymore over an unreleased card you haven't even tested?

Can i have your stuff? PM me.

Also, could someone double check to see how many Pilot crits there are in a deck? I mean, you can reach the point where there are no more crits for you to give out with him.

8. 2 Blind, 2 Stunned, 2 Damaged Cockpit, 2 Shaken Pilot (New) or Injured Pilot (Old).