Copenhagen seems to show to me what the meta would look like if Bombing Kwings have not come in force in a lot of areas as of late, and if Dengaroo isn't as prevalent in your area as in others (this is just judging from the lists posted here). x7 list are an incredibly difficult match up for nearly everything, and I do think it is a little stronger than it should be, but at least they struggle against bombs. Rough part is the other Imperial staples struggle even worse against bombs.

Thats true. K-wing bombers are the only real strong counter to the Defenders. There are also lists that are evenly matched against Defenders (like Parattanni, Bobattanni, Fangaroo or other Mindlinks, TLT Kannan, 4 TLT, scum 2 big ships with Party Bus etc) but only against bombers with Sabine crew Defenders are in really weak spot.

Actually, there is another list that does very well against Defenders (and most Imperial Aces, too): Fickle's 2 ARCs plus Biggs. Braylen as the stressmule double stresses a defender (or other ace); Norra then kills it. Biggs then dies. Repeat next round = 2 dead, or nearly so, defenders and Braylen damaged. This leaves Norra with regen vs the one remaining Imperial ship, which Norra will beat even if it takes a couple of rounds.

Even in the hands of a noob like me, I was able to beat every defender I faced without much trouble in a regional with 130 players.

Mind you, that list struggles badly against Old Fenngaroo since the stressing has little effect and only Norra does much damage.

meh havn't lost to Fenn yet

stress does a lot by denying red moves and Biggs denies five dice in your face

but yeah, havn't had much issue killing defenders without hard countering green dice. Without palp, they're actually not as bad as ye old aces in that regard

Problem with Defenders competition within the Empire mentioned above (Whisper, Carnor Jax etc) is that - as Kdubb mentioned - they die even faster against all Defender-counters around, than Defenders themselves. Let's face it: x/7 is the Cancer.

Problem with Defenders competition within the Empire mentioned above (Whisper, Carnor Jax etc) is that - as Kdubb mentioned - they die even faster against all Defender-counters around, than Defenders themselves. Let's face it: x/7 is the Cancer.

I won't go so far as to say it's a cancer, because without it -- as you point out -- many of the counters that people are running would still work quite well against other imperials. It's just that a lot of cards have targeted agility and defenders have that AND health. They've become the most efficient ship in that point range to the point where the question becomes "Is that better than an X7 defender?" I've started running imperial lists without them and those lists do a couple of things differently (and in fact hit some of those defender counters harder), but overall they still probably aren't quite as good as just running defenders. In a recent Mynock podcast, hearing top players say that they don't miss Palp when they run a third defender is telling.

Problem with Defenders competition within the Empire mentioned above (Whisper, Carnor Jax etc) is that - as Kdubb mentioned - they die even faster against all Defender-counters around, than Defenders themselves. Let's face it: x/7 is the Cancer.

I won't go so far as to say it's a cancer, because without it -- as you point out -- many of the counters that people are running would still work quite well against other imperials. It's just that a lot of cards have targeted agility and defenders have that AND health. They've become the most efficient ship in that point range to the point where the question becomes "Is that better than an X7 defender?" I've started running imperial lists without them and those lists do a couple of things differently (and in fact hit some of those defender counters harder), but overall they still probably aren't quite as good as just running defenders. In a recent Mynock podcast, hearing top players say that they don't miss Palp when they run a third defender is telling.

I've thought that since /x7s first became a thing. Palp is grand when he's protecting Soontir's fragile butt, but he's rarely contributing wildly effectively against top players OTHER than his dice mod. But when the butt he's protecting isn't anywhere near as fragile, having another reasonably well-modified gun on target, especially one that has the agility and repositioning to block effectively, is more valuable.

I'd take a Delta over Palp alongside two /x7s any time.

Problem with Defenders competition within the Empire mentioned above (Whisper, Carnor Jax etc) is that - as Kdubb mentioned - they die even faster against all Defender-counters around, than Defenders themselves. Let's face it: x/7 is the Cancer.

I won't go so far as to say it's a cancer, because without it -- as you point out -- many of the counters that people are running would still work quite well against other imperials. It's just that a lot of cards have targeted agility and defenders have that AND health. They've become the most efficient ship in that point range to the point where the question becomes "Is that better than an X7 defender?" I've started running imperial lists without them and those lists do a couple of things differently (and in fact hit some of those defender counters harder), but overall they still probably aren't quite as good as just running defenders. In a recent Mynock podcast, hearing top players say that they don't miss Palp when they run a third defender is telling.

I've thought that since /x7s first became a thing. Palp is grand when he's protecting Soontir's fragile butt, but he's rarely contributing wildly effectively against top players OTHER than his dice mod. But when the butt he's protecting isn't anywhere near as fragile, having another reasonably well-modified gun on target, especially one that has the agility and repositioning to block effectively, is more valuable.

I'd take a Delta over Palp alongside two /x7s any time.

I prefer palp because i can then use my 28 points as a big base blocker and a VERY potent 4 die gun. With a target lock and the palp I won't typically use on defense, dropping a full load of hits and a crit palped in has won me so many games. The shuttle likely only gets one shot to change the game, might as well use it.

And if you go after the shuttle? I'm already winning.

Bump.

More regionals results and lists please. I know not a few have gone by in the last two weeks.

http://imgur.com/9p2XGEP

That's Seattle 110 players Calen has kanan biggs zeb jp has galaxy note 7 Andrew has 4 tlt lyle vess ryad ol I've got 4 bandits 2 with tracer and gc and 2 golds with plasma em gc and abt.

Krakow stream shows a Miranda/Corran list beating a tri-defender list (swarm leader variant).

A Kanan Miranda list is doing well in top8 at the Utah regionals.

Can we take a moment from our x7 hate to appreciate the fact that #4 was a quartet of Ion Warthogs?

That is just a thing of beauty right there.

AND YOU FLY OFF THE BOARD! YOU FLY OFF THE BOARD! EVERYONE OFF THE BOARD!....

Utah final is totally uninteresting. Exactly what you would expect.

x7 vs Dengaroo.

Congrats to the players though!

http://imgur.com/9p2XGEP

That's Seattle 110 players Calen has kanan biggs zeb jp has galaxy note 7 Andrew has 4 tlt lyle vess ryad ol I've got 4 bandits 2 with tracer and gc and 2 golds with plasma em gc and abt.

Had a blast yesterday, and went 4-2 (800 MOV, 27th overall) with a list consisting of Omega Leader (Juke, Comm), Duchess (Adaptability, title, LWF), Maarek Stele Defender (x7, Juke) and Wampa.

Everyone who faced me got a bonus piece of prize support: the unofficial Duchess alt-art pilot card .

Utah final is totally uninteresting. Exactly what you would expect.

x7 vs Dengaroo.

Congrats to the players though!

Where are you seeing results?

Utah final is totally uninteresting. Exactly what you would expect.

x7 vs Dengaroo.

Congrats to the players though!

Where are you seeing results?

He was in attendance.

The winner was Vessery, Ryad and the PS6 Generic Defender. They all had crackshot and x7.

Utah final is totally uninteresting. Exactly what you would expect.

x7 vs Dengaroo.

Congrats to the players though!

Where are you seeing results?

He was in attendance.

The winner was Vessery, Ryad and the PS6 Generic Defender. They all had crackshot and x7.

I see it in a post below.

Utah final is totally uninteresting. Exactly what you would expect.

x7 vs Dengaroo.

Congrats to the players though!

Where are you seeing results?

He was in attendance.

The winner was Vessery, Ryad and the PS6 Generic Defender. They all had crackshot and x7.

I see it in a post below. The minor twist on it was that it was a Swarm Leader variant. Still shows that best imperial platform/points is the X7

Think you might be looking in the wrong place Alex. The x7 lists at the Utah regional were pretty traditional with Crack, Juke or PTL. They also had a stream, and also a post on the forums here. A couple of these might be slightly off but I will edit in info as I get correct info in to me.

#1 Seed - Paul Davis

Fenn Rau - Title, Autothrusters, Mindlink

Asajj Ventress - Latts, Mindlink

Manaroo - Mindlink

100 pts

#2 Seed - Josh Bean

Countess Ryad - Crackshot, x7

Col. Vessery - Crackshot, x7

Glaive Squad - Crackshot, x7

100 points

#3 Seed - Curtis Liddiard

Kanan - R2D2 Crew, Rey, FCS, Anti Pursuit Lasers, TLT

Miranda - TLT, Homing missile, C3P0 munitions, Long Range Scanners

99 points

#4 Seed - Justin Kresh

Col Vessery - Juke, Engine mk 2, x7

Countess Ryad - PtL, Engine mk 2, x7

Delta Squad - x7

100 points

#5 Seed - Eric Taylor

Dengar - Lone Wolf, Zuckuss, Countermeasures, Glitterstim, Overclocked R4, Punishing One

Manaroo - PtL, Recon Spec, Engine, Feedback, Painbot

96 Points

#6 Seed - Eric Grant

Norra Wexley (41) - ARC-170

Push The Limit (3), Kyle Katarn (3), R2-D2 (4), Alliance Overhaul (0), Vectored Thrusters (2)

Nera Dantels (33) - B-Wing

Deadeye (1), Collision Detector (0), Extra Munitions (2), Proton Torpedoes (4), Guidance Chips (0)

Gold Squadron Pilot (26) - Y-Wing

Twin Laser Turret (6), R3-A2 (2)

#7 Seed - Jimmy Kelly

Inquisitor - PtL, Title, Autothrusters

Wampa

Omega Leader - Juke, Comm Relay

Omicron Pilot - Palpatine, Collision detector

100 points

#8 Seed - Dennis Rusin

IG 88 B - Veteran Instincts, Title, Autothrusters, Glitterstim, FCS, HLC

IG 88 C - Veteran Instincts, Title, Autothrusters, Glitterstim, FCS, HLC

100 points

____________

Final was Josh against Eric. Josh won. And I will say, despite the final being between the games two most popular archetypes, the overall variety in the top 8 was great.

Utah final is totally uninteresting. Exactly what you would expect.

x7 vs Dengaroo.

Congrats to the players though!

Where are you seeing results?

He was in attendance.

The winner was Vessery, Ryad and the PS6 Generic Defender. They all had crackshot and x7.

I see it in a post below. The minor twist on it was that it was a Swarm Leader variant. Still shows that best imperial platform/points is the X7

Think you might be looking in the wrong place Alex. The x7 lists at the Utah regional were pretty traditional with Crack, Juke or PTL. They also had a stream, and also a post on the forums here. A couple of these might be slightly off but I will edit in info as I get correct info in to me.

#1 Seed - Paul Davis

Fenn Rau - Title, Autothrusters, Mindlink

Asajj Ventress - Latts, Mindlink

Manaroo - Mindlink

100 pts

#2 Seed - Josh Bean

Countess Ryad - Crackshot, x7

Col. Vessery - Crackshot, x7

Glaive Squad - Crackshot, x7

100 points

#3 Seed - Curtis Liddiard

Kanan - R2D2 Crew, Rey, FCS, Anti Pursuit Lasers, TLT

Miranda - TLT, Homing missile, C3P0 munitions, Long Range Scanners

99 points

#4 Seed - Justin Kresh

Col Vessery - Juke, Engine mk 2, x7

Countess Ryad - PtL, Engine mk 2, x7

Delta Squad - x7

100 points

#5 Seed - Eric Taylor

Dengar - Lone Wolf, Zuckuss, Countermeasures, Glitterstim, Overclocked R4, Punishing One

Manaroo - PtL, Recon Spec, Engine, Feedback, Painbot

96 Points

#6 Seed - Eric Grant

Norra - details missing

Nera - details missing

Gold Squad - stressbot, TLT

#7 Seed - Jimmy Kelly

Inquisitor - PtL, Title, Autothrusters

Wampa

Omega Leader - Juke, Comm Relay

Omicron Pilot - Palpatine, Collision detector

100 points

#8 Seed - Dennis Rusin

IG 88 B - Veteran Instincts, Title, Autothrusters, Glitterstim, FCS, HLC

IG 88 C - Veteran Instincts, Title, Autothrusters, Glitterstim, FCS, HLC

100 points

____________

Final was Josh against Eric. Josh won. And I will say, despite the final being between the games two most popular archetypes, the overall variety in the top 8 was great.

Must have had it mixed up with the Krakow stream?

Eric Grant's list

(100)

Norra Wexley (41) - ARC-170

Push The Limit (3), Kyle Katarn (3), R2-D2 (4), Alliance Overhaul (0), Vectored Thrusters (2)

Nera Dantels (33) - B-Wing

Deadeye (1), Collision Detector (0), Extra Munitions (2), Proton Torpedoes (4), Guidance Chips (0)

Gold Squadron Pilot (26) - Y-Wing

Twin Laser Turret (6), R3-A2 (2)

A Kanan Miranda list is doing well in top8 at the Utah regionals.

Thanks, almost had it, his dice were just too hot for me! Had a great time though

Utah guys was there any 4 TLT lists about?

Not that I know of, the guy who always brings four only brought two this time

For the Toulouse Regional (South of France, january 7-8), the results I remenber from this Weekend :

Final
Teroch/Fenn/Manaroo ("val") vs Teroch/Fenn/Manaroo ("Yannick"). Hadn't time to stay until the end of the match and I just remember one of the list (val) :
- Old Teroch w/ VI, title AT.
- Fenn, PtL w/ title, AT.
- Manaroo w/ recon Spe, unhinged Astro, PtL

The other list =>
#3 list "grozrikgaraz" :
- Kanan Jarrus w/ Rey (crew), Recon spe, Autoblaster turret, AC, APL, title
- Zeb w/ Chopper (crew), title
- ORS w/ Jan Ors, Hera (crew), Smuggling comp', Slicer Tools, Title (segnor's loop)

#4 list "Erelone" :
- Old Teroch w/ PtL, title, Stealth Device.
- Fenn w/ PtL, title, AT.
- Manaroo w/Adaptability, Feedback Array, (and forgot 1/2 others cards)

Eric Grant's list

(100)

Norra Wexley (41) - ARC-170

Push The Limit (3), Kyle Katarn (3), R2-D2 (4), Alliance Overhaul (0), Vectored Thrusters (2)

Nera Dantels (33) - B-Wing

Deadeye (1), Collision Detector (0), Extra Munitions (2), Proton Torpedoes (4), Guidance Chips (0)

Gold Squadron Pilot (26) - Y-Wing

Twin Laser Turret (6), R3-A2 (2)

Y-Wing without BTL-A4?

Eric Grant's list

(100)

Norra Wexley (41) - ARC-170

Push The Limit (3), Kyle Katarn (3), R2-D2 (4), Alliance Overhaul (0), Vectored Thrusters (2)

Nera Dantels (33) - B-Wing

Deadeye (1), Collision Detector (0), Extra Munitions (2), Proton Torpedoes (4), Guidance Chips (0)

Gold Squadron Pilot (26) - Y-Wing

Twin Laser Turret (6), R3-A2 (2)

Y-Wing without BTL-A4?

Yes. He decided that the flexibility of a turret was more valuable than a double stress in the current meta. Can't say I disagree either.