How to beat the classic double Lothal + Y-wing list

2x Lothal + autoblaster + fire control system (one with Hera and Chopper)

1x Y-wing with autoblaster + R4-D6

It has so much hit points to work through. 40 points is a lot. And then the double autoblaster from a large ship radius blocking complete range 1.

Crits. Not a lot of shield and a lot of hull means a lot of room for nasty crits.

Dash might be decent. You can range control against them so that they can't really use their autoblasters, and that y wing isn't realistically going to hit Dash at any range but 1. The lothals are also PS 3 and fairly slow, so there is a decent chance that Dash can arc-dodge them entirely. I think this match would still depend on Dash's wingman though. For instance, if it was Dash+Ghost vs double lothals + y-wing I'd favor Dash in that match.

FCS instead of accuracy corrector? Huh. Ummm...why? It's not like Hera's ability is particularly powerful to risk downgrading, and that guaranteed-2-unblockable-damage every turn from either ship is...*oof*

It's rough.

FCS instead of accuracy corrector? Huh. Ummm...why? It's not like Hera's ability is particularly powerful to risk downgrading, and that guaranteed-2-unblockable-damage every turn from either ship is...*oof*

It's rough.

FCS instead of accuracy corrector? Huh. Ummm...why? It's not like Hera's ability is particularly powerful to risk downgrading, and that guaranteed-2-unblockable-damage every turn from either ship is...*oof*

It's rough.

FCS is much better for your primary attack than Acc. Corrector, and TL+Focus should get you 2 hits on the autoblasters more often than not. Also cheaper.

Against low agility, high HP lists, Autoblaster+Accuracy Corrector doesn't get asmuch work done as the 4 die primary with FCS+Focus. Autoblaster+Accuracy Corrector is doubling down against things that the Autoblaster Turret is already strong against while making yourself weaker to the things that don't mind Autoblasters so much.

FCS instead of accuracy corrector? Huh. Ummm...why? It's not like Hera's ability is particularly powerful to risk downgrading, and that guaranteed-2-unblockable-damage every turn from either ship is...*oof*

It's rough.

FCS is much better for your primary attack than Acc. Corrector, and TL+Focus should get you 2 hits on the autoblasters more often than not. Also cheaper.

The last guy I played at the NC regionals was running double VCX with accuracy corrector, and some upgrade that lets you attack at the end of the round. So 4 guranteed hits per round. Double arc means 8 hits per round. He had enough left over for a cheap blocker A-wing to. 4 auto hits per round trumps FCS any day of the week.

FCS instead of accuracy corrector? Huh. Ummm...why? It's not like Hera's ability is particularly powerful to risk downgrading, and that guaranteed-2-unblockable-damage every turn from either ship is...*oof*

It's rough.

FCS is much better for your primary attack than Acc. Corrector, and TL+Focus should get you 2 hits on the autoblasters more often than not. Also cheaper.

The last guy I played at the NC regionals was running double VCX with accuracy corrector, and some upgrade that lets you attack at the end of the round. So 4 guranteed hits per round. Double arc means 8 hits per round. He had enough left over for a cheap blocker A-wing to. 4 auto hits per round trumps FCS any day of the week.

FCS instead of accuracy corrector? Huh. Ummm...why? It's not like Hera's ability is particularly powerful to risk downgrading, and that guaranteed-2-unblockable-damage every turn from either ship is...*oof*

It's rough.

FCS is much better for your primary attack than Acc. Corrector, and TL+Focus should get you 2 hits on the autoblasters more often than not. Also cheaper.

The last guy I played at the NC regionals was running double VCX with accuracy corrector, and some upgrade that lets you attack at the end of the round. So 4 guranteed hits per round. Double arc means 8 hits per round. He had enough left over for a cheap blocker A-wing to. 4 auto hits per round trumps FCS any day of the week.

Dudes list better be good, it's well over 100

FCS instead of accuracy corrector? Huh. Ummm...why? It's not like Hera's ability is particularly powerful to risk downgrading, and that guaranteed-2-unblockable-damage every turn from either ship is...*oof*

It's rough.

FCS is much better for your primary attack than Acc. Corrector, and TL+Focus should get you 2 hits on the autoblasters more often than not. Also cheaper.

The last guy I played at the NC regionals was running double VCX with accuracy corrector, and some upgrade that lets you attack at the end of the round. So 4 guranteed hits per round. Double arc means 8 hits per round. He had enough left over for a cheap blocker A-wing to. 4 auto hits per round trumps FCS any day of the week.

Dudes list better be good, it's well over 100

Acutally not, Because I was incorrect about him using an A-wing, because the only way to double tap is the docked ghost with phantom. So drop the A-wing and you get:

98 points

PILOTS

Lothal Rebel (40)

VCX-100 (35), Accuracy Corrector (3), Autoblaster Turret (2)

“Zeb” Orrelios (18)

Attack Shuttle (18), Phantom (0)

Lothal Rebel (40)

VCX-100 (35), Ghost (0), Accuracy Corrector (3), Autoblaster Turret (2)

Leaves you 2 points for an iniative bid or crew for something if you wanted. 6 auto hits per round if you fly in formation to. Not a perfect list, and FCS definitely has its uses, but this particular list is still quite nasty.

Edit; I'm blind

Btw i also agree with fcs. Ac is nice if you only only face ace lists, and nothing more. At a tournament you will likely face all kinds of lists, where your 'guaranteed 6 hits at range 1' doesn't get you anywhere. Suppose you meet another double ghost build with fcs instead? Who's dead then?

Thank you all for your answers. The build is FCS not accuracy corrector (the latter is only more useful when a shuttle is docked).

My problem is it is hard to avoid the joust of two giant lothals and the y-wing (which mostly wants to block your k-turns next round). The only weak spot I see is the rear arc at range 2-3. But then they do a 5 k-turn both looking at you with target locks. Asteroids can only barely help here.

I can make good damage, but like I said, the list has so much hitpoints to work through...

Alrighty back to topic. First of; How is this a classic? I have seen it used twice, once on a stream and another at a local tournament?

Secondly, and really back to the topic:
Well, since I have no idea what you like to run, ill just glace over some general topics:

1)You can avoid jousting them head on by bringing big rocks, and deploy them so you only face one of the ghosts, or force them into one side of the playing field where they are really limited in their movement. Asteroid placement is key to lists that wants to joust. If you ever faced triple uboats, the same principle is usable here: Limit the amount of fire on you.

2) Focus fire. It has a lot of HP, that is true.. but once you face only a ghost and a y-wing, it is not that hard. You need to kill 1 ghost in 2-4 rounds of fire, 2 if you have the firepower, 3-4 if you don't and you can avoid getting shot at.
Don't worry about the Y-wing overly much, unless he moves out of position and you can punish him. And yeah.. as mentioned, crits seems to wallop around on ghosts. Whenever I deploy one I draw 2-8 crits per game.. It can be pretty devastating.

3) About the weak arc, it is actually the sides, not the rear. As you say, they just K-turn, so their weakspot is actually their sides. Which also plays into the strength of NOT jousting these buggers.

Thank you all for your answers. The build is FCS not accuracy corrector (the latter is only more useful when a shuttle is docked).

My problem is it is hard to avoid the joust of two giant lothals and the y-wing (which mostly wants to block your k-turns next round). The only weak spot I see is the rear arc at range 2-3. But then they do a 5 k-turn both looking at you with target locks. Asteroids can only barely help here.

I can make good damage, but like I said, the list has so much hitpoints to work through...

Plasma torpedoes are a good opening salvo as they can strip a lot of shields in a hurry. Arc dodging is good to try and keep away from those primaries. Apart from that, you are dealing with lots of hit points behind low agility so you just need to roll as many red dice as possible so swarms would be effective.

If you want to play Empire then something like this might work well.

23 Gamma Squadron Pilot (18), Plasma Torpedoes (3), Extra Munitions (2), Long Ranged Scanners (0)

The Black Squadron ties are PS meaning they can chose their action after the Ghost has moved. This gives them the best chance of Barrel Rolling to dodge arc. Trick shot is there because it is free and may occasionally grant you an extra red dice. The Academy Tie should aim to block the Lothal with Chopper on board where possible as it is more predictable. Even Chopper does not allow his ship to take an action if he bumps.

Is it really a classic build? To me its still new.

Dash seems to be the answer though.

Plasma Torpedoes.

A VCX has no agility: find a way to dump 16 damage into one in a couple of rounds and you significantly even the odds. A four TIE bomber list should be able to achieve that, a TIE swarm can definitely achieve that. BBBBZ could probably too although the B-wing's slow dial is vunerable to the primary. Maybe XXXXZ?

If you alpha down one you should be able to outmaneuver the second: they're not particularly agile unupgraded.

That VCX build is good against low health, poor dials or a very low number of enemy ships: in other words, most of the ships in the current metagame. To fight specifically just discard that "wisdom" and throw as much firepower as you can at it.

To fight it and everything else is a question the people going to Worlds are trying to answer. I have no idea. That's the challenge of the metagame: make something that can fight everything.

Super-Dash (Kanan version) is certainly a possibility as he can dance around at fairly long range trying to avoid arcs while still firing away with 4 dice at 360-degrees. The problem with Dash is that for nearly 60 points, he only brings those 4 red dice which means it will take him a long time to burn through the hull of a much cheaper VCX-100. A VCX with Hera onboard can pull reds all day long which makes it much harder for Dash to predict where those big primary guns are going to be pointing (although Boost + BR gives him good options for arc-dodging). Add in Miranda for regen and ordnance and you might be on to something.

I think the trick to beating this list is to focus on burning down 1 VCX as fast as possible (preferably the one with Hera onboard as it is harder to dodge). Once that happens, it will be harder for the Ghost player to catch higher PS ships in arc.

Plasma Torpedoes.

I like proton torps for the crits.

Crack Swarm. But also mangler cannon and calculation. Anything that can put crits on them can ruin their day. In todays meta if you don't roll more than 4 dice you almost have to have at least one ship which can create crits in your list.

It would be a very tough matchup for my current list.

Gotta kill the one with hera first then try to prevent the other from kturning.

Crack Swarm

What is Crack Shot going to net you against 0 agility?

normally, I love low agility as it takes sh*tty green dice out of the game

but I hate how I spend 7 points on gunner and tailgunner for my ARCs and they end up doing jack ****

against blocks of health; no defenses your best bet is to "PS kill" them (Which is to say, have enough firepower to kill one in two rounds and have higher PS) [kylo ren with blinded pilots will soon make this very VERY easy to accomplish]

in which case I'd have to switch over to proton torp Thane with g-chips (r3-a2 and tactician)

which sucks because gunner Braylen does work against all the defenders you're bound to run into

Crack Swarm

What is Crack Shot going to net you against 0 agility?

oh man

these ******* things have rolled more evades than any of my ships have against them, just by being at range 3 and/or obstructed

if you're me, you're spending all your crackshots probably on the first round of fire