While this is a tweak to the actually mecanics of rhe game abd so i don't expect it to actually be implemented, I'd like to hear your thoughts on these changes to the force dice and the light and dark paragons

Okay the force dice as we know have eight blips of force for both light and dark.

I think this should be changed because, as I've eard reading through the forums, one uses the dark side blips. This should be change to something more akin to the lore of light and dark with light being more passive, aka. Paragon perks, and dark being more direct, aka. More blips on the dice. I sugest this to actually make using the force abit more fluid, as i got paragon class 3 after 7 games, and less relient on other actions and micomangement on the gms part, cause that make the game less fun for them.

The way force blips are currently split on the dice, 7:5, is good but how much they give is what im going to change so that the darkside has three double blips cause i would actually consider using those and taking away one of lightside's double blips, making the dice in favour of the darkside.

To balance though the light side would need some more paragon perks either aspects of force powers or stats boosts making the darkside lightside dynamic of the force more akin to that of the lore and movies being that of Now or Later

TL;DR:

Force dice: black (3 double 4 single). light (2 double, 3 single)

And better light side paragon perks

Thoughts?

P.s. on phone bad writing

It was intentional that there isn't much difference. Dark Force-users can take a little less strain, a few more wounds, and get a minor penalty to the destiny pool. Paragons can take a little more strain and get a minor bonus to the destiny pool. There are more faces with dark side pips, but there are often more light pips when they show up. The split of the double pips is the now versus later aspect.

Making the dark side pips both more numerous and stronger would, I suspect, be more unbalancing than you think. Even if the Paragon benefits could compensate, it would make the middle ranges of morality much less a viable option. You might say that that's what you want, and that Force-users shouldn't be neutral, but not every Jedi is a Paragon.

I know that sticking movie characters into the game mechanics is usually a recipe for things not fitting, but... look at RotJ Luke. He's definitely not a Paragon; the most obvious incident would be him Force Choking the Gamorreans, but his general dubiousness is hardly limited to that. Given everything, I'd put his Morality around 50 at best—probably lower, since he was in very real danger of a fall.

My point is, "pick a side" leads to people... doing just that. But even Anakin ran around being dubious for quite a while before he actually fell. By penalizing the middle, I think you'll miss out on a lot of interesting concepts, no matter what side they'd end up on in the end.

You can make whatever houserules you want—if this would make it more fun for your and your players, great! But, to my eyes, it'd be bad for both game balance and the narrative.

Yeah, the dice were deliberately designed the way they were.

The dark side is quicker (more faces have dark pips) but NOT stronger (only one dark side facing has 2 pips, rest only have 1 pip). Meanwhile, the light side is generally stronger (most facings have 2 pips) but a neophyte Force user still has trouble making and maintaining that connection (less frequent) and thus is more prone to draw upon their emotions.

It's also very much intentional that a neophyte Force user (Force Rating 1) is going to struggle with using the Force, and needs to decide just how important it is to have a Force power take effect. It's also part of the game's balance; by making Force power activation not be 100% reliable, it keeps Force users from overshadowing the muggles in the party. Frankly, it seems there are more "mixed-parties" that have characters from all three core rulebooks as opposed to groups that are purely Force users, and FFG admitted at the onset (when the EotE Beta was released) that all three books were designed as being part of a larger whole, with GMs having the option to pick and chose which elements of the "Star Wars experience" they wanted to bring to the table.

The practical effect of this change will be that every PC goes dark side since that's the only way to effectively make use of force powers, and making use of force powers is kinda the point of playing a force sensitive in the first place.

It's challenging, sometimes, to remember that game mechanics don't exist in isolation. We often run across a feature or mechanism that we don't particularly care for and want to change. Sometimes, though, doing so has unintended consequences and repercussions. I believe that the distribution of dark side pips, Conflict, and the Morality system are all tied together and that tinkering with any one aspect may affect the other two.

That being said, we game to have fun. If you & your players enjoy tinkering with game mechanics, or if the current system makes you unhappy for whatever reason, then I hope you achieve the resolution you're looking for. Personally, I'm inclined to leave things the way they are. I also think your GM was rather stingy with Conflict if you reached Paragon - which could easily be a campaign focus - after only seven session.

One of the thing I like to point out is that Dark side pips cost 1 to 6 conflict each depending what you use them for, I personally believe that a lot of people don't and only apply 1 per pip across the board.

I sugest this to actually make using the force abit more fluid, as i got paragon class 3 after 7 games, ...

aka, the March to Paragon. But if you change the distribution...

I believe that the distribution of dark side pips, Conflict, and the Morality system are all tied together and that tinkering with any one aspect may affect the other two.

Key point. If you're worried about the "march to paragon", there are a variety of solutions. If you stick with using Conflict and Morality as written, probably the most effective is wait with the Morality roll until after some adventure milestone. IOW, make the roll once every few sessions rather than once per session. That way more Conflict accumulates between rolls, the odds of an increase in Morality go down, and the fewer checks means a longer game period before a paragon status is reached.

This is far simpler than tweaking the die faces, which would really mess up all the other Force-reliant game mechanics.

Or you can toss aside the Morality system entirely...but there are plenty of threads on that already.

If the main concern is to slow the "march to LS Paragon," by far the simplest solution is to simply roll Morality at the end of each adventure, with the caveat that a full adventure should take anywhere from two to three sessions at a minimum to complete.

As whafrog noted, there's a decent number of GMs that have deep-sixed the mechanical aspects of Morality, keeping only the Emotional Strength and Weakness to be used as personality/RP hooks, and their games haven't imploded. Point of fact, the system ran pretty well before the introduction of FaD as EotE and AoR both had Force usage but without Morality. About the only thing missing from shucking Morality is that PCs won't be able to attain LS Paragon or Dark Sider status, which really isn't that huge of a loss, and is something most PCs can survive just fine without being one or the other.

One of the thing I like to point out is that Dark side pips cost 1 to 6 conflict each depending what you use them for, I personally believe that a lot of people don't and only apply 1 per pip across the board.

Good point, and one that I've been guilty of on more than one occasion.

One of the thing I like to point out is that Dark side pips cost 1 to 6 conflict each depending what you use them for, I personally believe that a lot of people don't and only apply 1 per pip across the board.

I don't remember seeing this. Please point out a page number.

One of the thing I like to point out is that Dark side pips cost 1 to 6 conflict each depending what you use them for, I personally believe that a lot of people don't and only apply 1 per pip across the board.

I don't remember seeing this. Please point out a page number.

Page 324, under Bestowing Conflict, last sentence in the paragraph right after the two bullet points about conditions for bestowing Conflict.

One of the thing I like to point out is that Dark side pips cost 1 to 6 conflict each depending what you use them for, I personally believe that a lot of people don't and only apply 1 per pip across the board.

I don't remember seeing this. Please point out a page number.

Page 324, under Bestowing Conflict, last sentence in the paragraph right after the two bullet points about conditions for bestowing Conflict.

Ohhh good catch.

However, keep in mind that paragraph is not saying that that cost is per black pip you use, it's per Conflict-worthy action.

As an example, lying for personal gain is 1 Conflict. If that lie puts other (innocent) people at significant risk, it might earn +3 Conflict, for a total of 4 Conflict for that action. If that lie also included spending 3 black pips on the Influence upgrade that enhances social checks, that's another +3, for a total of 7 Conflict for that action.

So it's not +1 to +5 Conflict per black pip, it's +1 to +5 Conflict to the action being performed, depending on the circumstances. Spending black pips on an action that is going to earn you Conflict anyway will increase the amount you get by 1 per pip as normal, but it doesn't multiply your conflict exponentially.

Yes however the wording also does indicate that each use of a black pip is separate. Otherwise it would have used the plural of the word pip.

So using a double black pip to outright murder a storm trooper in cold blood would be straight up more than 20 conflict. Using influence for personal gain would be about 2-4 per pip on top of any other conflict for the app. It certainly stops the march to paragonship unless you forgo many black pips.

Although I agree its possible that its per act (in fact I favour that personally)

Yes however the wording also does indicate that each use of a black pip is separate. Otherwise it would have used the plural of the word pip.

So using a double black pip to outright murder a storm trooper in cold blood would be straight up more than 20 conflict. Using influence for personal gain would be about 2-4 per pip on top of any other conflict for the app. It certainly stops the march to paragonship unless you forgo many black pips.

Although I agree its possible that its per act (in fact I favour that personally)

No. You would get 12. 2 for using the darkside and 10 for murder. You do not multiply the 2 together.

You at least get 10 for murder and 2 dark side pips plus an additional 5 as per the description on page 324 , so 17, if you apply the additional per action (which is how I think its supposed work). This is described under the intent section.

Usw influence for personal gain you get 2-4 additional conflict. Use it to deliberately to harm someone in cold blood then its 5 additional conflict for the intent. This is on top of the dark side pip use and the conflict for the act as well. This additional conflict makes all the difference when playing.