Vassal vs TTS - which one and why?

By MonkeyInSpace, in X-Wing

Vassal has two advantages: A larger community and it's free.

If you don't mind skipping on a small ship (the price of TTS on the very common 50% sale is about the same) and you're going to be mostly playing with friends, definitely go for TTS. The diffrence between TTS and Vassal is like the diffrence between playing X-Wing and Playing X-Wing with pieces of paper instead of ships.

Technically, TTS uses a flat projection of an abstract 3d representation of make-believe sci-fi ships, but hey, drive your point like you want (the most grating way possible for vassal).

Edited by Mu0n

Vassal updates faster.

I did think it was kind of funny that TTS is using flat cards for some of their ships.

In the end, just get both and decide for yourself.

I don't think anybody has cleared this point out, but everyone is talking in a way that seems like Tabletop Simulator has created, supports, or endorses the "pirated" X-wing modules in any way. Or that the X-Wing module is paid-for.

It is not so. You need to buy TTS itself, and what you get is a platform to play thousands of different community-made boardgames online, or your own.

There are tens of different X-wing "modules" available for TTS, that you can find in the Steam Workshop. (X-Wing Complete Collection, X-Wing table with automated movement, and X-Wing list spawner are just the most popular).

They are made by the community, and have whatever content their creators has put on them. However, the contents is not really provided by the creators of those modules, or installed onto the player's computer at any moment. They are just internally linked and downloaded on the fly while the user plays.

This has one good implication and one bad one. The module creator isn't distributing copyrighted material, only links. In most countries, that is not illegal. On the other hand, those links point at Pastebin and other volatile online sites, where they can just vanish suddenly one day for whatever reason, and there is nothing the player can do except wait for someone to replace them.

That is not something Mu0n's module for Vassal suffers from. Once you download his module, you have all the content in your computer, and it will be still there until you decide to remove it.

Perhaps I am wrong, but TTS doesn't support replays at all. You cannot record your game, or replay some recorded game. I understand that is one of the reasons Vassal is more popular among the pros, because it allows them to quickly review and share games.

Vassal suffers of GIMPitis: its multiwindow interface without any kind of clever z-sorting is atrocious for most people's UI sensibilities nowadays. Its multitude of keyboard shortcuts allow increased productivity with it, at a cost of a learning curve most people don't want to climb. Most of it could be rethought so that stuff not used at a particular moment (the chat, the dice roller, the player hands ) would fade out until it is moused-over, or something like that, leaving the contested sector window be fullscreen and making most of the screen real estate. However, that isn't going to happen, because they are design flaws inherent to Vassal, and not to Mu0n's module, and the Vassal community certainly shares that "Our way or the highway" attitude of many community projects.

Edited by Azrapse

I manage with one monitor.

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Its wierd how much I'm enjoying looking at other people's setups. I like to have my laptop plugged into a 21" monitor with the map, chat and dice and then the 2 player hands on my laptop screen. My laptop's only 13.3" though so I've always found the map to be a bit smaller than I would like (for playing purposes - watching logs is fine) when it's not plugged in.

The angles are also life like so you won't get thrown off like Vassal.

What do you mean?

The angles are also life like so you won't get thrown off like Vassal.

What do you mean?

Vassal's view is directly above the table, TTS is a 3D view of whatever angle you feel comfortable with just like in real life where you can move and see different angles. I've heard many of the "pro" guys on podcasts say how Vassal and in person gaming can be difficult to adjust. I've found the same thing, but with TTS I haven't had the problem. I'm surprised some of the "pro" guys haven't switched over yet, but I think that's more of knowing the people that create Vassal and not wanting to change to what they've already been accustomed to.

The angles are also life like so you won't get thrown off like Vassal.

What do you mean?

Vassal's view is directly above the table, TTS is a 3D view of whatever angle you feel comfortable with just like in real life where you can move and see different angles. I've heard many of the "pro" guys on podcasts say how Vassal and in person gaming can be difficult to adjust. I've found the same thing, but with TTS I haven't had the problem. I'm surprised some of the "pro" guys haven't switched over yet, but I think that's more of knowing the people that create Vassal and not wanting to change to what they've already been accustomed to.

For the top tier players, I think watching games back and the larger Vassal community are more important. Personally I'd say my movement has got better with Vassal since I've learnt to judge things in base lengths and range rulers.

I think the evaluation of distances on vassal works kind of like how memory works.

It's easier to remember a bunch of phone numbers if you also try to remember the names that go with them and you invent a fictive story attached to those people. Learning the numbers by themselves is way harder. Putting stuff into relation with stuff is what clinches it.

Learning to judge template distances with absolute ship base lengths both in the perspective view of a real table top and associate the same situation to how it projects into the top down view of vassal makes you work harder, but you get a better, more solid payoff when the effort cost has been paid.

I think the evaluation of distances on vassal works kind of like how memory works.

It's easier to remember a bunch of phone numbers if you also try to remember the names that go with them and you invent a fictive story attached to those people. Learning the numbers by themselves is way harder. Putting stuff into relation with stuff is what clinches it.

Learning to judge template distances with absolute ship base lengths both in the perspective view of a real table top and associate the same situation to how it projects into the top down view of vassal makes you work harder, but you get a better, more solid payoff when the effort cost has been paid.

Do people still learn phone numbers?

Do people still learn phone numbers?

Yes.

Edited by Mu0n

Do people still learn phone numbers?

Yes.

Show off :P

Show off :P

I don't learn phone numbers.

TTS for me, it was easy to setup and I can go from building a first time list to playing in less than 5 minutes.
The nice graphics, auto moving and bumping can actually have you going through a game faster than real life.

TTS seems way more appealing but I understand the comments about lack of community - I got to grips with the mechanics but so far I have been unable to find a game. I might have to give Vassal another go, there is just something so clunky and non-intuitive about it for me

TTS for me. It's just so super easy to set up a game and play. It's a shame there's a cost associated, but IMO it's worth it.

Tried Vassal, then bought TTS (some sale on Steam package of 4 licenses, cost split between 4 ppl).

Since I started using TTS, never looked back.