I would read it the player must use a focus token if able.

Therefore he is blocked from using Accuracy Corrector (which makes him unable to spend a focus token), until he spends a focus token.

Is there any kind of precedent for this?

I.e anything that overrules the general rule that a player with multiple effects that share the same timing trigger can be resolved in any order?

It comes down to you being able to spend a focus at the start of the attack. It says you MUST spend it if you are able too.... And at a point in the attack you are able to.

It's the equivalent to your mum telling you you must go down the shops to pick up some milk. And you saying I'm sorry I can't do that because since you told me to do that I've flushed the door keys down the lavvy.

There really is no kind of precedent for this card. has any card before said, you must spend a token in this period of the game. It's terribly vague, and could be read a variety of ways.

As soon as he enters the "attacker modifies attack dice" step, he is able to spend a focus token. And since HSCP "says you MUST spend it if you are able too.... And at [that] point in the attack you are able to."

The difference is that in one case you are still able to spend the focus afterwars (Taking a TL) in the other you are not...

The question is can you find a precedence for it going either way?

The difference is that in one case you are still able to spend the focus afterwars (Taking a TL) in the other you are not...The question is can you find a precedence for it going either way?

The precedent is for the attacker being allowed to activate abilities in the order of his choice. And HSCP doesn't make any reference to breaking that rule. Some would even argue that it takes it into account by saying "if able".

The difference is that in one case you are still able to spend the focus afterwars (Taking a TL) in the other you are not...

The question is can you find a precedence for it going either way?

Yes.

Rules reference page 8 bullet #4

• If multiple abilities resolve at the same time, the player with initiative chooses which of his abilities to resolve and resolves them in the order of his choosing. Then the opposing player does the same for his own abilities

and FAQ Page 19 section 5 - first question.

Q: If a player has multiple effects that resolve at the same time, can he resolve them in any order?

A: Yes

Then FAQ Page 3 - errata on Accuracy Corrector (emphasis mine):

“When attacking, during the “Modify Attack Dice” step, you may cancel all of your dice results. Then, you may add 2 results to your roll. Your dice cannot be modified again during this attack.”

And finally the card text of HSCP (again emphasis mine)

When attacking with a primary weapon, the defender must spend 1 focus token if able.

When defending, the attacker must spend 1 focus token if able.

So the current rules say that the attacker can resolve their dice mods in any order of their choosing, and that Accuracy Corrector sets up a condition where you are not able to spend focus tokens (or any other dice mods) to further modify your dice.

HSCP says that you are only obliged to spend a focus token if you are able to.

As you are not able to as you have used AC, then you don't have to - indeed you would be breaking the rules if you did

OK, seriously, this discussion is just going in circles. There's no merit to both sides restating their positions at each other forever.

Can we stick a pin in it until we get an official answer?

The difference is that in one case you are still able to spend the focus afterwars (Taking a TL) in the other you are not...

The question is can you find a precedence for it going either way?

Yes.

Rules reference page 8 bullet #4

• If multiple abilities resolve at the same time, the player with initiative chooses which of his abilities to resolve and resolves them in the order of his choosing. Then the opposing player does the same for his own abilities

and FAQ Page 19 section 5 - first question.

Q: If a player has multiple effects that resolve at the same time, can he resolve them in any order?

A: Yes

Then FAQ Page 3 - errata on Accuracy Corrector (emphasis mine):

“When attacking, during the “Modify Attack Dice” step, you may cancel all of your dice results. Then, you may add 2 results to your roll. Your dice cannot be modified again during this attack.”

And finally the card text of HSCP (again emphasis mine)

When attacking with a primary weapon, the defender must spend 1 focus token if able.

When defending, the attacker must spend 1 focus token if able.

So the current rules say that the attacker can resolve their dice mods in any order of their choosing, and that Accuracy Corrector sets up a condition where you are not able to spend focus tokens (or any other dice mods) to further modify your dice.

HSCP says that you are only obliged to spend a focus token if you are able to.

As you are not able to as you have used AC, then you don't have to - indeed you would be breaking the rules if you did

AC does not prevent you from spending focus tokens, only modifying dice. You can spend a focus token to modify zero dice. Theoretically, if I had a focus token, AC, and R4 agro equipped. I could roll for attack, cancel results and add two hits with AC, then spend my focus token to gain a TL. I am allowed to spend a focus token to modify nothing, just like I am allowed to spend a TL to reroll nothing. Unless the card/ability specifically says you cannot spend focus tokens, like Carnors, then you are able.

The difference is that in one case you are still able to spend the focus afterwars (Taking a TL) in the other you are not...

The question is can you find a precedence for it going either way?

Yes.

Rules reference page 8 bullet #4

• If multiple abilities resolve at the same time, the player with initiative chooses which of his abilities to resolve and resolves them in the order of his choosing. Then the opposing player does the same for his own abilities

and FAQ Page 19 section 5 - first question.

Q: If a player has multiple effects that resolve at the same time, can he resolve them in any order?

A: Yes

Then FAQ Page 3 - errata on Accuracy Corrector (emphasis mine):

“When attacking, during the “Modify Attack Dice” step, you may cancel all of your dice results. Then, you may add 2 results to your roll. Your dice cannot be modified again during this attack.”

And finally the card text of HSCP (again emphasis mine)

When attacking with a primary weapon, the defender must spend 1 focus token if able.

When defending, the attacker must spend 1 focus token if able.

So the current rules say that the attacker can resolve their dice mods in any order of their choosing, and that Accuracy Corrector sets up a condition where you are not able to spend focus tokens (or any other dice mods) to further modify your dice.

HSCP says that you are only obliged to spend a focus token if you are able to.

As you are not able to as you have used AC, then you don't have to - indeed you would be breaking the rules if you did

AC does not prevent you from spending focus tokens, only modifying dice. You can spend a focus token to modify zero dice. Theoretically, if I had a focus token, AC, and R4 agro equipped. I could roll for attack, cancel results and add two hits with AC, then spend my focus token to gain a TL. I am allowed to spend a focus token to modify nothing, just like I am allowed to spend a TL to reroll nothing. Unless the card/ability specifically says you cannot spend focus tokens, like Carnors, then you are able.

In your example, you would need to spend your focus token before you used accuracy corrector. You could spend it even if there were no focus results but you would need to spend it before using Accuracy Corrector.

AC does not prevent you from spending focus tokens, only modifying dice. You can spend a focus token to modify zero dice. Theoretically, if I had a focus token, AC, and R4 agro equipped. I could roll for attack, cancel results and add two hits with AC, then spend my focus token to gain a TL. I am allowed to spend a focus token to modify nothing, just like I am allowed to spend a TL to reroll nothing. Unless the card/ability specifically says you cannot spend focus tokens, like Carnors, then you are able.

According to the FAQ, if you are prohibited from modifying dice you may not spending a token to do so. When you are prohibited from modifying you are also prohibited from modifying zero dice.

In your example, you would need to spend your focus token before you used accuracy corrector. You could spend it even if there were no focus results but you would need to spend it before using Accuracy Corrector.

WWHSD has it right.

You can spend a focus token to modify 0 dice.

Garven Dreis FAQ entry

A ship may spend a focus token during an attack even if there are 0 (focus) results to change ( including an attack where no dice are rolled , such as when a ship has a faceup Blinded Pilot Damage card [original Damage deck]).

You cannot spend a focus token if you are disallowed from modifying dice.

Omega Leader FAQ entry

If “Omega Leader” has an enemy ship locked, when that ship attacks or defends against “Omega Leader,” that ship cannot resolve abilities that would modify dice, even 0 dice, such as Keyan Farlander’s ability.

I'm still waiting for an argument, any argument, to support the opinion that your forced to spend your focus token before using Accuracy Corrector when attacking a ship with Hotshot Co-Pilot.

How did I not think of this example before?

Captain Kagi

When an enemy ship acquires a target lock, it must lock onto your ship if able

That wording is very similar to Hotshot Co-Pilot!

But look, Captain Kagi has a FAQ entry that states:

If an enemy ship equipped with Fire-Control System is at range to acquire a target lock on Captain Kagi and attacks a ship other than Captain Kagi, the target lock provided by Fire-Control System must be acquired on the defender, not Captain Kagi.

Holy cow!

If we use the same arguments that some people proposed regarding HSCP and AC...

Fire Control System "breaks" Captain Kagi!

You can't use FCS if Captain Kagi is in range because it makes an illegal game state!

I'm sure everyone can see the incredible parallels to be drawn between Captain Kagi / Fire Control System, and Hotshot Co-Pilot / Accuracy Corrector !

AC does not prevent you from spending focus tokens, only modifying dice. You can spend a focus token to modify zero dice. Theoretically, if I had a focus token, AC, and R4 agro equipped. I could roll for attack, cancel results and add two hits with AC, then spend my focus token to gain a TL. I am allowed to spend a focus token to modify nothing, just like I am allowed to spend a TL to reroll nothing. Unless the card/ability specifically says you cannot spend focus tokens, like Carnors, then you are able.

According to the FAQ, if you are prohibited from modifying dice you may not spending a token to do so. When you are prohibited from modifying you are also prohibited from modifying zero dice.

In your example, you would need to spend your focus token before you used accuracy corrector. You could spend it even if there were no focus results but you would need to spend it before using Accuracy Corrector.

WWHSD has it right.

You can spend a focus token to modify 0 dice.

Garven Dreis FAQ entry

A ship may spend a focus token during an attack even if there are 0 (focus) results to change (including an attack where no dice are rolled, such as when a ship has a faceup Blinded Pilot Damage card [original Damage deck]).

You cannot spend a focus token if you are disallowed from modifying dice.

Omega Leader FAQ entry

If “Omega Leader” has an enemy ship locked, when that ship attacks or defends against “Omega Leader,” that ship cannot resolve abilities that would modify dice, even 0 dice, such as Keyan Farlander’s ability.

I'm still waiting for an argument, any argument, to support the opinion that your forced to spend your focus token before using Accuracy Corrector when attacking a ship with Hotshot Co-Pilot.

Or put more simply - the rules say you can spend a focus ( or TL) to MODIFY zero dice.

Thus it is a dice modification and therefore blocked by AC

Edit.

It is technically correct ( the best kind of correct) to say that AC does not block you from spending focus tokens after you have used it.

If there was an upgrade card that said something along the lines of:

"When attacking, you may spend a focus token to [do-something-other-than-modify-your-attack-dice]" then AC would have no effect on this.

AC just blocks you from modding dice - even zero of them - but it does not block you from spending tokens for other non-dice mod related effects

@Funckleton:

But as long as we don't have a way to spend a focus which isn't a dice mod, I won't be needlessly confusing people with that example.

AC does not prevent you from spending focus tokens, only modifying dice. You can spend a focus token to modify zero dice. Theoretically, if I had a focus token, AC, and R4 agro equipped. I could roll for attack, cancel results and add two hits with AC, then spend my focus token to gain a TL. I am allowed to spend a focus token to modify nothing, just like I am allowed to spend a TL to reroll nothing. Unless the card/ability specifically says you cannot spend focus tokens, like Carnors, then you are able.

According to the FAQ, if you are prohibited from modifying dice you may not spending a token to do so. When you are prohibited from modifying you are also prohibited from modifying zero dice.

In your example, you would need to spend your focus token before you used accuracy corrector. You could spend it even if there were no focus results but you would need to spend it before using Accuracy Corrector.

WWHSD has it right.

You can spend a focus token to modify 0 dice.

Garven Dreis FAQ entry

A ship may spend a focus token during an attack even if there are 0 (focus) results to change ( including an attack where no dice are rolled , such as when a ship has a faceup Blinded Pilot Damage card [original Damage deck]).

You cannot spend a focus token if you are disallowed from modifying dice.

Omega Leader FAQ entry

If “Omega Leader” has an enemy ship locked, when that ship attacks or defends against “Omega Leader,” that ship cannot resolve abilities that would modify dice, even 0 dice, such as Keyan Farlander’s ability.

I have a question now that this (Omega Leader) has come up. As the FAQ claims that forcing a player to reroll his own dice is modifying (see the mentions of Elusiveness and R7 in Omega Leader's entry), doesn't it mean that if Omega Leader is attacking/defending against a ship he has locked with Hot Shot Copilot on board that he can't be forced to spend the focus as that's the same as being forced to modify his own dice and is thus prohibited?

Edited for clarity

Agreed. Probably kart if the reason why the card says "if able" at the end I reckon.

AC does not prevent you from spending focus tokens, only modifying dice. You can spend a focus token to modify zero dice. Theoretically, if I had a focus token, AC, and R4 agro equipped. I could roll for attack, cancel results and add two hits with AC, then spend my focus token to gain a TL. I am allowed to spend a focus token to modify nothing, just like I am allowed to spend a TL to reroll nothing. Unless the card/ability specifically says you cannot spend focus tokens, like Carnors, then you are able.

According to the FAQ, if you are prohibited from modifying dice you may not spending a token to do so. When you are prohibited from modifying you are also prohibited from modifying zero dice.

In your example, you would need to spend your focus token before you used accuracy corrector. You could spend it even if there were no focus results but you would need to spend it before using Accuracy Corrector.

WWHSD has it right.

You can spend a focus token to modify 0 dice.

Garven Dreis FAQ entry

A ship may spend a focus token during an attack even if there are 0 (focus) results to change ( including an attack where no dice are rolled , such as when a ship has a faceup Blinded Pilot Damage card [original Damage deck]).

You cannot spend a focus token if you are disallowed from modifying dice.

Omega Leader FAQ entry

If “Omega Leader” has an enemy ship locked, when that ship attacks or defends against “Omega Leader,” that ship cannot resolve abilities that would modify dice, even 0 dice, such as Keyan Farlander’s ability.

I have a question now that this (Omega Leader) has come up. As the FAQ claims that forcing a player to reroll his own dice is modifying (see the mentions of Elusiveness and R7 in Omega Leader's entry), doesn't it mean that if Omega Leader is attacking/defending against a ship he has locked with Hot Shot Copilot on board that he can't be forced to spend the focus as that's the same as being forced to modify his own dice and is thus prohibited?

Edited for clarity

I doubt that would be how it's ruled.

But I could see it going that way.

I have a question now that this (Omega Leader) has come up. As the FAQ claims that forcing a player to reroll his own dice is modifying (see the mentions of Elusiveness and R7 in Omega Leader's entry), doesn't it mean that if Omega Leader is attacking/defending against a ship he has locked with Hot Shot Copilot on board that he can't be forced to spend the focus as that's the same as being forced to modify his own dice and is thus prohibited?

Edited for clarity

I do not think so. Unlike r7 the defending player is not modifying the dice. The key on r7 (and the others) is they all specify that you 'choose x dice' to be rerolled. It's the choosing of dice to be rerolled that dictates who is modifying dice. Nothing says omega leader cannot be forced to modify dice, simply that the locked ship cannot modify dice. Hot shot copilot doesn't modify anything, it demands that omega leader do modification.

I'm also confident that if r7 said 'the attacker must reroll all of their attack dice' (no choosing) it would work through omega leader's lock. They key here is modification comes from choosing the dice, which is why m9g8 bypasses leader of m9g8 is not on the locked ship.

Does hot shot co-pilot work on a ship rolling 0 green Dice? Does it force them to spend the focus even though they aren't modifying any Dice?

Does hot shot co-pilot work on a ship rolling 0 green Dice? Does it force them to spend the focus even though they aren't modifying any Dice?

Yes you are allowed to spend a focus to modify 0 dice. See Garven Dreis ruling.

So... Jeez. Seems like a pretty nice crew card on certain builds after all...

I have a question now that this (Omega Leader) has come up. As the FAQ claims that forcing a player to reroll his own dice is modifying (see the mentions of Elusiveness and R7 in Omega Leader's entry), doesn't it mean that if Omega Leader is attacking/defending against a ship he has locked with Hot Shot Copilot on board that he can't be forced to spend the focus as that's the same as being forced to modify his own dice and is thus prohibited?

Edited for clarity

I doubt that would be how it's ruled.

But I could see it going that way.

I too can see it going either way, which is why I'm asking. I believe it comes down to whether spending a focus token in the dice modification step is considered dice modification in and of itself, or if the modification is simply the result of spending the token. My opinion is that as it's impossible to spend a token in the modification step without modifying dice (modifying 0 dice is still considered dice modification), then spending the token must be dice modification by definition.

I do not think so. Unlike r7 the defending player is not modifying the dice. The key on r7 (and the others) is they all specify that you 'choose x dice' to be rerolled. It's the choosing of dice to be rerolled that dictates who is modifying dice. Nothing says omega leader cannot be forced to modify dice, simply that the locked ship cannot modify dice. Hot shot copilot doesn't modify anything, it demands that omega leader do modification.

I'm also confident that if r7 said 'the attacker must reroll all of their attack dice' (no choosing) it would work through omega leader's lock. They key here is modification comes from choosing the dice, which is why m9g8 bypasses leader of m9g8 is not on the locked ship.

In the FAQ it states the following:

If “Omega Leader” has an enemy ship locked, when that ship attacks or defends against “Omega Leader,” that ship cannot resolve abilities that would modify dice, even 0 dice, such as Keyan Farlander’s ability. Additionally, that ship cannot resolve abilities that cause “Omega Leader” to reroll his dice (such as R7 Astromech or Elusiveness), as these are abilities that modify dice.

I would argue that even if R7 said 'the attacker must reroll all of their attack dice' that Omega Leader would block it as it would still be an ability 'that modifies dice,' which is a general enough phrasing to include both selected and unselected dice. M9-G8 and Palpatine aren't blocked by Omega Leader's ability (unless they're on the ship he's shooting/getting shot by) because the ship that they're on is the one doing the modifying and those ships are able to 'interfere' with attacks they're not directly involved in.

I'll admit to not having rechecked the FAQ entry before making my statement. Given the way it's worded, you're totally correct, selecting vs. not selecting doesn't matter.

I'm still fairly sure hscp won't count as modifying dice though since it just makes him spend a focus token at some point. Spending the focus token will then cause modification but I think being a step removed should be fine.

So I got a reply from Frank on this, and Omega Leader's ability does not affect HSCP because the crew card isn't forcing OL to modify his dice, it simply forces him to spend the token. The token could, in theory, be spent in some way that doesn't modify dice, like Kanan's ability, even though OL's only opportunity to spend focus tokens is for dice in this interaction.

Hotshot Co-pilot is not telling you to “spend 1 focus token to change all focus results to hit results” it is telling you to "spend 1 focus token if able." This effect will most often result in your spending a focus token as a dice modification, but as such this effect is not a defender ability modifying the attacker’s dice (or attacker ability modifying the defender’s dice).

Thanks for playing,

Frank Brooks

Associate Creative Content Developer

Fantasy Flight Games

Hope this means there's an FAQ forthcoming.

So I got a reply from Frank on this, and Omega Leader's ability does not affect HSCP because the crew card isn't forcing OL to modify his dice, it simply forces him to spend the token. The token could, in theory, be spent in some way that doesn't modify dice, like Kanan's ability, even though OL's only opportunity to spend focus tokens is for dice in this interaction.

Hotshot Co-pilot is not telling you to “spend 1 focus token to change all focus results to hit results” it is telling you to "spend 1 focus token if able." This effect will most often result in your spending a focus token as a dice modification, but as such this effect is not a defender ability modifying the attacker’s dice (or attacker ability modifying the defender’s dice).

Thanks for playing,

Frank Brooks

Associate Creative Content Developer

Fantasy Flight Games

OK, to be clear:

This only means that OL is affected by the HSCP.

Accuracy Corrector case is still open.

That is because: HSCP tells you to spend your token, you have to spend it to modify your dice or use another ability (like Kanan pilot). Forcing to spend is not yet forcing to modify dice, although in most cases this will happen. Therefore OL ability is not working here.

Accuracy Corrector is not allowing you to further modify dice, this means you cannot spend your token on any ability that would modify dice, which means you cannot spend the token, which brings us to the start point.

Example (tournament/competitive game):

Kanan1 (pilot, with HSCP crew) is attacked by enemy ship (Kanan2) at R1 (with HSCP crew) using ABT with AC equipped. Each having 1 focus token.

Kanan1 may spend his focus token at this stage to reduce number of red dice of the enemy and fulfill the requirement of HSCP or keep it for later, to modify zero results of zero green dice rolled (brilliant idea).

Kanan2 has to spend his focus token, but may first decide to use his AC to modify his dice and block any other modifications. This way he will keep it to reduce number of dice thrown by Kanan1 during return fire.

The Question: Can Kanan2 keep his token or is he forced to use it while he is still able to, before moving to resolving AC? Why?

This question is still not answered. Hopefully, FAQ will do that but I am afraid it will only touch the OL interaction as this explains difference between being forced to modify dice and being forced to spend a token, which appears to be two, distinct mechanisms.

This only means that OL is affected by the HSCP.

Accuracy Corrector case is still open.

That is because: HSCP tells you to spend your token, you have to spend it to modify your dice or use another ability (like Kanan pilot). Forcing to spend is not yet forcing to modify dice, although in most cases this will happen. Therefore OL ability is not working here.

If Omega Leader has a TL on Han Solo, and Han Solo has Hotshot Co-Pilot :

• If OL attacks Han, OL is forced to spend a focus token, if able.
• If Han attacks OL, OL is forced to spend a focus token, if able.

Is this everyone's understanding?

This seemed quite obvious to me...

IMO, the only perhaps confusing situation would be if OL was the one with Hotshop Copilot... but that's not currently possible.

Example (tournament/competitive game):

Kanan1 (pilot, with HSCP crew) is attacked by enemy ship (Kanan2) at R1 (with HSCP crew) using ABT with AC equipped. Each having 1 focus token.

Kanan1 may spend his focus token at this stage to reduce number of red dice of the enemy and fulfill the requirement of HSCP or keep it for later, to modify zero results of zero green dice rolled (brilliant idea).

Kanan2 has to spend his focus token, but may first decide to use his AC to modify his dice and block any other modifications. This way he will keep it to reduce number of dice thrown by Kanan1 during return fire.

The Question: Can Kanan2 keep his token or is he forced to use it while he is still able to, before moving to resolving AC? Why?

You made that situation a lot more complicated than needed...

Much simpler:

• Ship A with Accuracy Corrector and a focus token attacks Ship B with Hotshop Co-Pilot.
• Is Ship A allowed to use Accuracy Corrector, thus stopping any further dice modifications and "canceling" HSCP's ability?

My opinion on that is that yes, Accuracy Corrector can be used to "counter" HSCP's ability.

Much like The Inquisitor's ability "counters" Autothrusters.

My Two Cents:

Step 3 of the Combat Flowchart:

3. "Modify Attack Dice" step

- These abilities including adding, changing and rerolling dice results. Dice can be modified multiple times, but each die can be rerolled only once.

i. Defender resolves abilities that modify attack dice

ii. Attacker resolves abilities that modify attack dice

I would argue that a ship attacking another ship (the defender) with HSCP equipped is, in Step 3 part i, being forced by the defender to modify their attack dice by spending their focus token at that time. I say this because HSCP is causing the spending of the focus token and the dice modification and HSCP is equipped to the defender which makes it the defender's ability to resolve. After the Defender's HSCP dice modification ability resolves and forces the attacker to spend their focus token to modify their attack dice it is now the attacker's time to resolve their abilities. At this time they may activate Accuracy Corrector if they choose.

Due to timing windows, and accepting that HSCP is a dice modification ability associated with the ship it is equipped to, the attacker never has the opportunity to trigger Accuracy Corrector before HSCP forces him/her to spend their focus token.