You appear to be using a mobile device. Click here to open the mobile-friendly Squadron Browser.X

Tools

Saved Squadrons

Colonel Vessery + Juke + TIE/x7 (35)

When attacking, immediately after you roll attack dice, you may acquire a target lock on the defender if it already has a red target lock token.

Juke (2)

TIE/x7 (-2)

Countess Ryad + Push the Limit + TIE/x7 + Twin Ion Engine Mk. II (36)

Push the Limit (3)

TIE/x7 (-2)

Twin Ion Engine Mk. II (1

We're should the 29 points go

His Obviousness Mr Omega Leader (OL + Juke + Comm Relay)

or His Other Obviousness The Palp Shuttle (Lambda + Palpatine)

No need to say thank you, cheers!

Vess with VI is much, much better, if you ask me and it saves you a point. He should have Target Lock+Focus and VI helps him not get PS-killed by all the other Defenders - well worth not having Juke, imo.

29 points is the exact number of points needed for a Palp Shuttle.

Other than that, you're looking at a pocket-ace, i.e. a Tie/sf or Valen Rudor or a Tie/x7 Delta Sq. Pilot.

Defenders are costed in such a way that squeezing more than two into a list means you're hurting for PS/ability on at least 1 of them. I would go with the Palp Shuttle (Commonwealth Defenders) or go nuts and throw a Sigma (Phantom) into the mix:

Sigma Sq. Pilot (25)

- Stygium Particle Accelerator (2)

- Collision Detector (0)

- Intelligence Agent (1)

----- 27 points -----

You can bump Intel Agent to Kallous, but a PS 3 Phantom may well be a better blocker than Jouster.

Palp Shuttle is 29 points and makes the Defenders so tanky så the PS is not so important i think, have just won a turnement with that build

Or you can try Omega Leader wuth juke, Comm Relay and Stealth devise is tanky to against 1v1 so he need to survive to the endgame

100% disagree dropping Juke on Vessery, in the current meta.

PS war isn't a thing yet, and I've been running, almost exclusively, the following list for the past three months or so:

OL, Juke, Comm Relay

Vessery, Juke, x7, Twin Ion Engine MK II (Since the Shadowcaster dropped)

Jendon, Palpatine, Title

While I did something a bit different with my shuttle (it was to shut down Countermeasures on Dengaroo, and to make sure OL ALWAYS entered combat fully tokened), I think the OL and Vess builds aren't all the different.

Juke won me FAR more games, hands down, than VI would. Juke is almost always useful (even zero agility ships get Defense Rolls @ range 3 or when obstructed). In many, many games, VI would have been a complete and utter waste.

Now, in a list that can't feed Vessery TLs reliably, maybe Vessery will need VI, so he goes before his Target Locking friends spend their locks. Omega Leader and a titled shuttle don't have that issue.

For higher PS ships, they wasted their focus and took a MEAN punch from Vessery. For lower/more cautious PS, they had to use the tokens on defense, which works fine too.

Ryad with PtL is an excellent TL feeder for Vessery. Your third ship could be a number of things, but you won't find better options than Omega Leader or a Palp Shuttle. Omega Leader has the bonus of having everything you need included in the TIE/fo expansion pack, if you don't own Palp.

Agree to disagree. I've always been a sucker for higher PS.

I think the current meta you refer to is non-existent, by the way, after the last FAQ. Everyone is waiting to see where the chips fall and while that happens, I'd rather reposition later and shoot sooner.

A defender. Specifically, a Delta/x7. And then mk2 on Vess.

In the current meta with Black One on the horizon and a number of scary PS9s and 10s, OL is feeling a bit shut out, and I genuinely don't think a Palpmobile will contribute as much to the fight as a third /x7. With the added toughness the shields give you and the bump protection that /x7 gives you, you don't need him as much to guarantee survival as you do with Soontir and Inq, and a third Defender contributes a lot more to the shooting of things.

Agree to disagree. I've always been a sucker for higher PS.

I think the current meta you refer to is non-existent, by the way, after the last FAQ. Everyone is waiting to see where the chips fall and while that happens, I'd rather reposition later and shoot sooner.

Not really. You're not going to see a surge of high PS ships yet. If anything, high PS hunters are making a come back (TLTs will see some play again).

You'll see some Poe, when Heroes drops, but VI isn't going to help you there. When Wave X drops, then the meta will feel a real shift.

And, honestly, Vessery does fine against higher PS -- Defenders may be predictable in inexperienced hands, but that doesn't make them less lethal, and it really doesn't make them that much easier to dodge (sure, you may see a perfect 4k coming, but that doesn't mean you're going to be able to DO anything about it).

Juke, like the x7 title, also doesn't mind if you bump. I'm a big fan of pulling unexpected maneuvers, such as flying into my own/enemy ships, because I'm getting the Evade, which will trigger Juke.

Like I said, I'd VI Vessery if it was an issue of Target Locks being spent too early. Though I'd still probably alter the list to find a different way to solve that. VI helps against very specific lists, and helps to mitigate things if you're bad at predicting your enemy. It doesn't do half the work Juke can (and will, w/ the x7).

^ All good points. Thanks for sharing your thought process.

^ All good points. Thanks for sharing you though process.

Haha sorry for the spiel. I've just been really, really enjoying my list, and having great success with it, so I'd really like to see someone else benefiting from it.

For what it's worth, VI absolutely has its space, and I didn't mean to sound as if I thought you were wrong. Those games when VI makes a difference are what makes X-Wing feel exciting -- Vessery getting his shot off first can almost be as good as that one time you barrel roll-dodge arcs.

I think both VI and Juke are situational. When they are applicable, you are really glad to have them, but when they do nothing, you will feel disappointment. Juke costing an extra point makes the negative feeling (well, only when it applies, obviously) slightly more acute.

On Defenders, I've never felt Pilot Skill to be important. You have to fly them a little differently than other ships. You want to put them on 'lanes' where they can always get their k-turns and you don't want those lanes to be the same if running more than one defender. This increases arc coverage and makes the need to move last much less important. The only exception is Dash. Dash will run circles around low PS defenders AND he has the firepower to end them, with or without their X-7 benefit. So if you see a lot of Dash, then VI on Vess makes a lot of sense (I think there's an argument for VI in a heavy PS 8 meta too----and metas do vary a lot locally).

Juke is better the higher your Pilot Skill is (kind of a catch22 since you can't take both! Unless your an a-wing....) Juke is also bad against anything that generates lots of focus or has a way to convert eyeballs to better results, such as: Manaroo (or anyone) w/ rec spec, Dengaroo (or anyone with over-clocked), an atanni mindlink list (sometimes, not always), Soontir Fel, agent kallus, Chiraneau, Jyn & Rey crew, moldy crow, palob, etc. Juke can struggle against multiple high PS shooters (they take your evade away ). And Juke can also be bad against an opponent who is really good at blocking (not for denying your evade token, but denying your ability to shoot at the target you want).

Juke is awesome in a squad that includes Carnor Jax, however (or in a squad where you have at least 2 or 3 jukers).

So in my mind, I think both are a bit too situational and therefore neither are particularly great (except as mentioned, VI on Vess for dealing with Dash). YMMV of course!

I don't agree that Juke is all that situational, but the local meta concession is probably one that can't be understated.

I haven't seen a Soontir Fel in months. The only thing you offer as an issue that I HAVE seen, would be Manaroo, as part of Dengaroo. But my list has other ways around Dengaroo, so it's not a personal issue.

I'm surprised we haven't seen more Double VCXs & a Y, especially after MajorJuggler ran the list during on of our League nights. They don't care terribly much about Juke, either.

The thing is, when VI works, it's still not 100%. You still have to be able to react to the enemy's movement, which, honestly, a single barrel roll isn't likely to pull off. Dash is a specific requirement for VI, and honestly something I'd look into, if I was going to run my list post-Black One title, as Dash has gotten more popular (with a VCX, of course). Juke actively changes how people play -- unless they're able to horde Focus, which isn't a common ability, and those that CAN aren't meta relevant (for the most part), they have to make decisions about which action to take, and when to spend said focus.

Even a high PS enemy, with a single focus, has to decide if they want to save it for defense, and they KNOW they're going to need it to counter Juke.

I've only been arc dodged by Dash in recent memory. And I've only lost one of those matches. When Kanan Dash is getting shot by Vessery, he REALLY wishes he had Kyle on board.

As to Upgrade cost, that's another point that I don't think sways the argument enough -- you either have it or you don't. Then your decision for upgrade is easy (... But probably Crackshot over VI, heh). My specific list, which has absolutely engendered my opinion, is willing to put a stupid amount of points into a Lambda -- an extra point for Juke on Vess is very much worth it, and I can actively point to several games where Juke on Vessery has won me games (not solely, as flying is important, and sans Juke could have still ended in slower victories). It's hard for most ships to deal with 3-4 hits AND Juke, and Vessery doesn't have that much of an issue maximizing his Red Dice.

In terms of higher PS stripping the Evade... I'll actually let it ride and take the damage, assuming there are no crits I can avoid. I do the same with Omega Leader.

But we can all agree Vessery is one bad %^&*

I'd pick him over any of the others - unless Ryad was a higher PS.

Gimme both.

But we can all agree Vessery is one bad %^&*

I'd pick him over any of the others - unless Ryad was a higher PS.

Gimme both.

The only reason that I didn't love Ryad, when I tried flying her recently, is that she didn't have Juke :x

It's possible the problem is me.

I'll probably start running Ryad, if Black One really becomes a thing. I've already got to hang up Omega Leader, now that TLTs are likely to come back.

Juke is super viable. I'm just giving you a hard time because I think Vess is better at PS 8 than 6

Other reasons I don't like Juke:

- Requires an evade token to activate

- Manaroo

- Recon Specialist

- Poe

- Attanni Mindlink

- Kallus

- Rey crew

- Jyn crew

- Luke Skywalker pilot (lol)

- It's not Veteran Instincts

- Requires an evade token to activate What self-loving x7 leaves home without them!?

- Manaroo Manaroo is awful no matter what you're doing. Juke is still great for when she passes her tokens to Dengar. And if she doesn't, YAY! No tokens on Dengar! (Assuming Dengaroo, of course)

- Recon Specialist Meh, Kanan has zero agility anyways (and I haven't seen Rec Spec on anything else recently, barring a Sabine Shadowcaster)

- Poe Juke might actually cause him to spend the focus, actually. Though it's not quite as effective, sure. And New Poe is going to make me put Vessery and OL away

- Attanni Mindlink Depends, usually lists use AM to support NOT having to take redundant actions. Also, the first one in the chain is still only sitting on one focus.

- Kallus Never seen him competitively, but folks in my area fear Phantoms.

- Rey crew Yep, but she's not a part of this meta, which is why I was being specific to this meta.

- Jyn crew Yep, but above

- Luke Skywalker pilot (lol) Who? Never heard of him.

- It's not Veteran Instincts Bah, my Vessery will just block yours. And it's not like PS8 is super popular... oh.

- Requires an evade token to activate What self-loving x7 leaves home without them!?

- Manaroo Manaroo is awful no matter what you're doing. Juke is still great for when she passes her tokens to Dengar. And if she doesn't, YAY! No tokens on Dengar! (Assuming Dengaroo, of course)

- Recon Specialist Meh, Kanan has zero agility anyways (and I haven't seen Rec Spec on anything else recently, barring a Sabine Shadowcaster)

- Poe Juke might actually cause him to spend the focus, actually. Though it's not quite as effective, sure. And New Poe is going to make me put Vessery and OL away

- Attanni Mindlink Depends, usually lists use AM to support NOT having to take redundant actions. Also, the first one in the chain is still only sitting on one focus.

- Kallus Never seen him competitively, but folks in my area fear Phantoms.

- Rey crew Yep, but she's not a part of this meta, which is why I was being specific to this meta.

- Jyn crew Yep, but above

- Luke Skywalker pilot (lol) Who? Never heard of him.

- It's not Veteran Instincts Bah, my Vessery will just block yours. And it's not like PS8 is super popular... oh.

It's times like these I wish I played Vassal! XFD

so here's what I think from the conversation

vessery 35

x-7 -2

vi 1

36

ryhad 34

x-7 -2

ptl 3

mk 2 ion engine thing 1

37

omega leader 21

juke 2

comm relay 3

stealth device 3

29

total 102

Is this viable and where should I cut two points

Never mind bellow is the real one

So here's what I'm thinking

Vessery 35

X-7 -2

Vi 1

34

Ryhad 34

X-7 -2

Ptl 3

Twin ion engine thing 1

36

Omega leader 21

Juke 2

Comm relay 3

Stleath device 3

29

Total 99 is this competive and were should I put the last point thanks

If you're taking 2 PS 8 ships, just leave it as is. You'll want a 1 point bid so you can give away initiative when facing other PS 8's, and take initiative for better rock placement when not.

If it were me though, I'd much rather have a Delta w/ X-7 rather than Omega Leader. A lot of people like him, but I find he hits like a wet noodle except on the rare occasion he gets lucky and rolls well (even with Juke).

Ultimately, Palp in a shuttle is the 'most competitive' option (and also a 'netlist' if you give Vess Juke)

To be honest I'm not running palp or another defender because I don't have enough money I still think my list is pretty competitive still thought right als should I have juke or vi

2 defenders and Omega Leader is very strong. Best of luck!

To be honest I'm not running palp or another defender because I don't have enough money I still think my list is pretty competitive still thought right als should I have juke or vi

If you want more damage and to mess with your opponent, Juke.

If you want more "presence" and the ability to react to more ships on the board, Veteran Instincts.

It's up to you.

Don't sweat not having cards. You'll get them, borrow them, or live without them. Just have fun.