How does new FAQ impact on Dengaroo?

This list seems pretty optimal (it made US nats finals)

Dengar + Punishing One + Lone Wolf + R5-P8 + Glitterstim + Plasma Torpedoes + Zuckuss + Counter-Measures
Manaroo + Feedback Array + Push the Limit + Unhinged Astromech + Engine Upgrade + Recon Specialist

seems pretty untouched by the FAQ. other lists that were not so viable before FAQ could bother this list now right?

thoughts?

Ahem, it's called Managar.

The list will not be affected by any rule

Well by itself it's untouched as far as I can tell, but if Rebel Regen returns I think it could give Dengaroo a headache I think.

I'm curious to see what happens with list selection in general now.

If you accidentally set a red maneuver on one of the ships while stressed your opponent doesn't set your dial.

Dengar can use those Plasma Torpedoes to ignore Biggs.

Those are the two changes that I see directly affecting the list the most.

I suspect it gets a nice boost not having torp boats to contend with but on the other hand I think taking torp-boats also relieves some of the pressure on a lot of other builds so we'll have to see if dengaroo dominates that much.

I havan't seen anyone run that syle Dengaroo for months, most people switched to the top 8 Dengaroo at Origins. It got help by the FAQ because it's worst matchup was 3 U-boats/2 U-uboats and a bus. It's only real preditor now is a well flown Commonwealth Defenders.

No, Dengaroo survive the FAQ mayhem unscathed, and I think it's good that it did. Dengaroo is pretty tough sometimes, but when it comes down to it, you've got 2 ships, 20 hull points, and nothing defends with more than 2 dice. That means that if you fly it against a howlrunner swarm, yes, one of the ties might die each round, but no matter what, Dengar wont last more than 2 or 3 rounds, leaving the other player with 4 or 5 TIE fighters to kill Manaroo with...

Dengaroo is a nice idea. It's how jumps were meant to be flown (obviously what the designers had in mind with Manaroo, since she is Dengar's fiance), and much better matches the jumpmaster vibe than U-Boats did... But I don't think Dengaroo was ever ridiculously OP. It seems like just another option for a nice way to fly a pretty cool ship. I'm glad FFG didn't nuke it with their last FAQ!

Well by itself it's untouched as far as I can tell, but if Rebel Regen returns I think it could give Dengaroo a headache I think.

I'm curious to see what happens with list selection in general now.

Dengar would love to see regen return. Zuckuss means poe and Miranda aren't blocking much incoming fire, and those hit points vanish with alarming speed when the other guy opens with a torpedo and then double taps with primary. One shield per turn just isn't enough.

Well by itself it's untouched as far as I can tell, but if Rebel Regen returns I think it could give Dengaroo a headache I think.

I'm curious to see what happens with list selection in general now.

Dengar would love to see regen return. Zuckuss means poe and Miranda aren't blocking much incoming fire, and those hit points vanish with alarming speed when the other guy opens with a torpedo and then double taps with primary. One shield per turn just isn't enough.

True for Miranda, but Poe with Autothrusters takes less damage, and he can flee to regen whereas Miranda has to fight to regen.

Well by itself it's untouched as far as I can tell, but if Rebel Regen returns I think it could give Dengaroo a headache I think.

I'm curious to see what happens with list selection in general now.

Dengar would love to see regen return. Zuckuss means poe and Miranda aren't blocking much incoming fire, and those hit points vanish with alarming speed when the other guy opens with a torpedo and then double taps with primary. One shield per turn just isn't enough.

I'm not so sure...

Zuckuss can help push through damage, but any player worth his salt will split his ships up and run away to regen one whilst the other chips away. Remember Dengar only double taps on something shooting at him in arc. I wouldn't be doing so knowing time is on my side if i run away to regen.

No, Dengaroo survive the FAQ mayhem unscathed, and I think it's good that it did. Dengaroo is pretty tough sometimes, but when it comes down to it, you've got 2 ships, 20 hull points, and nothing defends with more than 2 dice. That means that if you fly it against a howlrunner swarm, yes, one of the ties might die each round, but no matter what, Dengar wont last more than 2 or 3 rounds, leaving the other player with 4 or 5 TIE fighters to kill Manaroo with...

Dengaroo is a nice idea. It's how jumps were meant to be flown (obviously what the designers had in mind with Manaroo, since she is Dengar's fiance), and much better matches the jumpmaster vibe than U-Boats did... But I don't think Dengaroo was ever ridiculously OP. It seems like just another option for a nice way to fly a pretty cool ship. I'm glad FFG didn't nuke it with their last FAQ!

Maybe that list, but a Dengaroo with stim/overclocked+countermeasure will laugh against a swarms tie first engagement.

Well by itself it's untouched as far as I can tell, but if Rebel Regen returns I think it could give Dengaroo a headache I think.

I'm curious to see what happens with list selection in general now.

Dengar would love to see regen return. Zuckuss means poe and Miranda aren't blocking much incoming fire, and those hit points vanish with alarming speed when the other guy opens with a torpedo and then double taps with primary. One shield per turn just isn't enough.

True for Miranda, but Poe with Autothrusters takes less damage, and he can flee to regen whereas Miranda has to fight to regen.

From my experience, t70s with regen, they rarel last more than 3-4 atracks from Dengar. T70s are not maneuvrable enough to usually avoid an arc in arc opening salvo. This means you are eating Plasma torp (shields gone at a minimum) and then you either don't shoot, or get tagged by the revenge shot (and possibly the Painbot). Even if you didn't shoot, next round you're at 1 shield and stil in range of Dengar, possibly even at range 1.

True for Miranda, but Poe with Autothrusters takes less damage, and he can flee to regen whereas Miranda has to fight to regen.

If poe is running from dengar, dengar is winning. Infinite focus, lone wolf, and countermeasures means poe burns faster than dengar, and poe will have a real hard time getting those thrusters to trigger consistently.

It doesn't, but Dengaroo has its weaknesses - stress control on Manaroo in particular neuters large parts of it, and Zuckuss affects low-agility ships a lot less than high-agility ships. It's good, but I'd personally say it's on a balance with other top-tier lists at the moment, and without Scouts there are a lot more of those.

Dengaroo has been dead for a while. It can't beat Defenders, Arcs or Shadow Casters let alone any of the stuff that might now return (quad TLT, anyone?).

ive been out of competitive play for some time, although i try my best to keep up from afar. what is that origins list made up of?

ive been out of competitive play for some time, although i try my best to keep up from afar. what is that origins list made up of?

Dengar with OCR4 instead of Painbot, so it practically has infinite Focus.

Dengaroo has been dead for a while. It can't beat Defenders, Arcs or Shadow Casters let alone any of the stuff that might now return (quad TLT, anyone?).

Given on Defenders (but then the whole Scum faction struggles against Defenders IMO), but Arcs and Shadow Casters aren't that huge of an issue.

ARCs: the FAQ made Dengaroo's matchup vs ARCs singificantly easier IMO. Dengar can now sidestep Biggs with the opening Plasma Torp, and revenge shots sidestep Biggs anyway. You can hit the most dangerous ARC with a Plasma Torp, and then just keep it in your firing arc (not terribly difficult with the ARC's dial) and let it kill itself with revenge shots.

Shadow Caster: the Shadow Caster is a ship with a comparable price tag to Dengar, but weaker both in defense and offense. I don't really see how a Shadow Caster on its own can make unsolvable problems for Dengaroo.

Dengaroo got even stronger since one of its hardest match ups were u boats and they are now dead and gone. Dengaroo is going to be just fine epecially the new version that will be appearing very soon...

ive been out of competitive play for some time, although i try my best to keep up from afar. what is that origins list made up of?

Dengar with OCR4 instead of Painbot, so it practically has infinite Focus.

Dengaroo has been dead for a while. It can't beat Defenders, Arcs or Shadow Casters let alone any of the stuff that might now return (quad TLT, anyone?).

Given on Defenders (but then the whole Scum faction struggles against Defenders IMO), but Arcs and Shadow Casters aren't that huge of an issue.

ARCs: the FAQ made Dengaroo's matchup vs ARCs singificantly easier IMO. Dengar can now sidestep Biggs with the opening Plasma Torp, and revenge shots sidestep Biggs anyway. You can hit the most dangerous ARC with a Plasma Torp, and then just keep it in your firing arc (not terribly difficult with the ARC's dial) and let it kill itself with revenge shots.

Shadow Caster: the Shadow Caster is a ship with a comparable price tag to Dengar, but weaker both in defense and offense. I don't really see how a Shadow Caster on its own can make unsolvable problems for Dengaroo.

Avoiding Biggs isn't all that good there, since Norra just regens the entire shot while Braylen isn't exactly what Dengaroo has to worry about much.

Well by itself it's untouched as far as I can tell, but if Rebel Regen returns I think it could give Dengaroo a headache I think.

I'm curious to see what happens with list selection in general now.

Dengar would love to see regen return. Zuckuss means poe and Miranda aren't blocking much incoming fire, and those hit points vanish with alarming speed when the other guy opens with a torpedo and then double taps with primary. One shield per turn just isn't enough.

True for Miranda, but Poe with Autothrusters takes less damage, and he can flee to regen whereas Miranda has to fight to regen.

Poe with Autothrusters and Sensor Cluster can really handle Dengaroo I think, especially if he's at half points.

ive been out of competitive play for some time, although i try my best to keep up from afar. what is that origins list made up of?

Dengar with OCR4 instead of Painbot, so it practically has infinite Focus.

Dengaroo has been dead for a while. It can't beat Defenders, Arcs or Shadow Casters let alone any of the stuff that might now return (quad TLT, anyone?).

Given on Defenders (but then the whole Scum faction struggles against Defenders IMO), but Arcs and Shadow Casters aren't that huge of an issue.

ARCs: the FAQ made Dengaroo's matchup vs ARCs singificantly easier IMO. Dengar can now sidestep Biggs with the opening Plasma Torp, and revenge shots sidestep Biggs anyway. You can hit the most dangerous ARC with a Plasma Torp, and then just keep it in your firing arc (not terribly difficult with the ARC's dial) and let it kill itself with revenge shots.

Shadow Caster: the Shadow Caster is a ship with a comparable price tag to Dengar, but weaker both in defense and offense. I don't really see how a Shadow Caster on its own can make unsolvable problems for Dengaroo.

Avoiding Biggs isn't all that good there, since Norra just regens the entire shot while Braylen isn't exactly what Dengaroo has to worry about much.

EDIT: Unless you mean Norra loses all shields (possibly also 1 hull), doesn't fire back in order not to take a revenge shot on hull and then runs away for 3 turns regenerating, unable to shoot back at Dengar for fear of a revenge shot, while also staying in range 1 of Biggs in order to make Dengar's primary atrack unusable against her?

If Norra runs away, Dengar will catch her abd kill her. If Norra stays near Biggs, Dengar can have both in arc, which gives you 3 losing options: 2 of your ships don't shoot or Norra/Biggs is eating a revenge shot

ive been out of competitive play for some time, although i try my best to keep up from afar. what is that origins list made up of?

Dengar with OCR4 instead of Painbot, so it practically has infinite Focus.

Dengaroo has been dead for a while. It can't beat Defenders, Arcs or Shadow Casters let alone any of the stuff that might now return (quad TLT, anyone?).

Given on Defenders (but then the whole Scum faction struggles against Defenders IMO), but Arcs and Shadow Casters aren't that huge of an issue.

ARCs: the FAQ made Dengaroo's matchup vs ARCs singificantly easier IMO. Dengar can now sidestep Biggs with the opening Plasma Torp, and revenge shots sidestep Biggs anyway. You can hit the most dangerous ARC with a Plasma Torp, and then just keep it in your firing arc (not terribly difficult with the ARC's dial) and let it kill itself with revenge shots.

Shadow Caster: the Shadow Caster is a ship with a comparable price tag to Dengar, but weaker both in defense and offense. I don't really see how a Shadow Caster on its own can make unsolvable problems for Dengaroo.

Well for one thing, its not a single shadowcaster vs dengar. Its a shadowcaster plus the other 50+ points in your list vs just dengar. Then just manaroo if/when dengar dies. Or the faster shadowcaster goes for manaroo first and leaves you against just a neutered dengar. And if its ketsu, dengars infinite focus and lone wold become way less useful on defense.

Well for one thing, its not a single shadowcaster vs dengar. Its a shadowcaster plus the other 50+ points in your list vs just dengar. Then just manaroo if/when dengar dies. Or the faster shadowcaster goes for manaroo first and leaves you against just a neutered dengar. And if its ketsu, dengars infinite focus and lone wold become way less useful on defense.

I agree. I didn't mean to say that Dengaroo auto-wins vs. Shadow Casters or that it has a huge disadvantage. Just that IMO 'Dengaroo can't beat Shadow Casters' is simply untrue.