I really, really hope the Freerunning talents appear again for non-FS specs. Perfect for a new spy spec, imo.

You know what we really need? A Kung Fu Master. We dont really have a Jackie Chan Career with lots of non-brute strength brawling (Marauder, sure - but that's more of Ivan Drago instead of Bruce Lee), just a little melee - and Freerunning would be a perfect fit with that spec.

I played a Teras Kasi Master in Star Wars Galaxies. I would love, Love, LOVE to have something like this.

So, I just noticed a major hiccup. The description of Manipulate lists nine different control upgrades. The discerning eye can tell that the tree only has seven control upgrades nodes.

Huh. That's a big problem. We should submit that as a question to the devs.

You know, after the book is officially released, that is.

My guess is that either:

A) They doubled up on some nodes when they didn't mean to, or;

2) They decided to take some Control upgrades out, and did it in the tree but forgot to do so in the descriptions.

Either way, clarity is needed!

@Maelora

Not2ndEdition?

I'm no 'insider'... just an old lady who's buried so many of her boyfriends favourite games...

Read between the lines and see what Disney is doing. I think that when there wasn't a new Force Awakens core book, that a 2nd edition (that won't be called that! ) was a certainty.

But here is not the place to speculate, or derail the sterling work my worthy adversary is doing here by sating our Sentinel thirstiness.

Yeah, that's the only problem I can see - there's nowhere to put it. The only thing I could think of is perhaps in a F&D book, but with no force attached to the tree at all (Which would be weird, and you'd be stuck with one less career skill if you were Joe Average and took the tree) . But otherwise yeah, that ship has sailed in the other two lines.

I don't think it will be in a F&D book (alas!) as that line is specifically for the Special Snowflakes only (fans of EoE and AoR see it as a kind of 'containment' for them so they are not messing about in their own favourite line!)

I can't see where else they would put it though.

For whatever reason, FFG seem dead against producing more Universal specs, which would be the perfect place for something like this. I have no idea why as it seems a great idea.

Can you tell us more about the phase-knife? Im just curious what it looks like. Can it Reflect?

Yeah, that's the only problem I can see - there's nowhere to put it. The only thing I could think of is perhaps in a F&D book, but with no force attached to the tree at all (Which would be weird, and you'd be stuck with one less career skill if you were Joe Average and took the tree) . But otherwise yeah, that ship has sailed in the other two lines.

I don't think it will be in a F&D book (alas!) as that line is specifically for the Special Snowflakes only (fans of EoE and AoR see it as a kind of 'containment' for them so they are not messing about in their own favourite line!)

I can't see where else they would put it though.

I think it could work for a Spy spec, since infiltrating often requires a lack of weaponry and the need to make your own body one. Spy TV shows and movies are full of depictions of men and women who are deadly with a minimum of equipment.

Picture of Manipulate: One , two .

So everybody can see what I'm seeing.

I can see what happened. There are actually eight Control upgrades listed - one was listed twice, and one was omitted. The upgrade that lets you increase a vehicle's System Strain Threshold by committing Force dice is listed twice on the second page. The one that doesn't appear in the chart is the one that allows you to use Manipulate to heal strain on droids.

Which, since there's no limit listed, makes sense. Free, unlimited strain recovery for your droid allies? Sure, it's at the cost of your action every round, but still. Although at the worst, if we wanted to fit it in, we could split one of the three two-length upgrades and put it in there. But like I said, let's ask the Devs if that was supposed to be taken out, or if not, where in the tree it's supposed to fit.

Pretty sure any character can make themself a brawler/kung fu guy as things are. High Brawn rating, ranks in the Brawl skill, if you want to go that far get the Marauder spec, narrative flavor for all the cool kung fu moves. If you want a brawling force user, then just use the upgrade for Enhance that adds in your Force rating, buy some blast knuckles and get ahold of that talisman that makes your body have the Cortosis quality.

Can you tell us more about the phase-knife? Im just curious what it looks like. Can it Reflect?

It's described as a knife hilt that produces a "molecular shield" that forms the blade. I think I listed the stats. I mentioned it, but it doesn't require another Force point to return a phase-knife when using it with Saber Throw, just 2 Advantage or a Triumph. It also adds setback to Perception checks to find it, much like holdouts and brass knuckles.

It doesn't mention Reflect either way.

@Maelora

Not2ndEdition?

Nothing confirmed - just fan speculation that once we get all the career books done that there will be a not exactly second edition, but more of a clean up and clarification of some rules (like a better vehicle combat section or clarified cover rules).

Well, if they do that, maybe they can once and for all clarify the whole Cybernetic Leg(s?) debacle.

I just took my queue from Oggdude's Character Generator, that it's 10k for a pair and they only take 1 cybernetic slot to get both legs and the +1 to brawn/agility characteristic.

Nothing confirmed - just fan speculation that once we get all the career books done that there will be a not exactly second edition, but more of a clean up and clarification of some rules (like a better vehicle combat section or clarified cover rules).

And hopefully the fact that Perception & Vigilance in EotE and AoR are completely switched around in FnD in terms of what is active and passive.

Nothing confirmed - just fan speculation that once we get all the career books done that there will be a not exactly second edition, but more of a clean up and clarification of some rules (like a better vehicle combat section or clarified cover rules).

And hopefully the fact that Perception & Vigilance in EotE and AoR are completely switched around in FnD.

Well now I have to look at my EotE and FaD rule books to see the difference.

Odd. Either way a character has to make a perception check to notice the things. Active would make a little more sense. Anything a character passively notices would be things the GM describes in the scenery at the outset or something the PC's add into the story themselves.

I've always played Perception as active, and Vigilance as passive, myself.

(And don't ask for rolls unless it's necessary.)

Hopefully this will be cleared up in 2nd Edition!

#MarcyOpenlyTrollingFolks

I really, really hope the Freerunning talents appear again for non-FS specs. Perfect for a new spy spec, imo.

You know what we really need? A Kung Fu Master. We dont really have a Jackie Chan Career with lots of non-brute strength brawling (Marauder, sure - but that's more of Ivan Drago instead of Bruce Lee), just a little melee - and Freerunning would be a perfect fit with that spec.

Does the player have to perform their own stunts though?

You have to remember that brawn isnt just brute strength but is also rolled in with fitness. Its not so much stength and agility its strength, fitness and training that lead to a good martial arts fighter. Agility is as much of a factor in hitting someone with a massive two handed sword as hitting them with your fist, perhaps even more so.

So if you factor these two things into the narrative system brawn is your fitness/strength and talents/skill ranks are the training. So I would say that when you come to ranking Jackie Chan/Jet Li types against Tyson types they have similar Brawn ratings and are at most only 1 apart. This can easily be made up with talents and skill ranks.

For a knight level(or even a starting) Maurader there would be very little difference in the damage you could do if you start with a 1 less brawn.

I've always played Perception as active, and Vigilance as passive, myself.

(And don't ask for rolls unless it's necessary.)

Hopefully this will be cleared up in 2nd Edition!

#MarcyOpenlyTrollingFolks

I have a very...odd interpretation of Perception v. Vigilance. Which is fitting, I guess, because I'm an odd person!

In general, I agree that Perception is active and Vigilance is passive. However, I also call for passive Perception checks when there are fleeting details that one may or may not see, even when not looking, and I'll call for more "active" Vigilance checks to test reaction time against unexpected events.

So...in general, yes, but with some more nuance?

Ooh! Another way I came up with to describe the difference. It's not so much "Active vs. Passive." Instead, Vigilance is used for events whereas Perception is used for people/objects.

What do I mean? Well, if something happens in the environment and you need to see if the characters notice, it's a passive roll - the character's aren't choosing to seek out information, it is coming through their environment. If what's most important is actually knowing that something happened, you'd use Vigilance - the occurrence of the event itself is what's notable. If what's most important is the details of the event - the color of clothing, the description of the object, etc., then you use Perception.

Used actively, someone standing watch is mostly watching for differences in their environment from moment to moment, watching for the little events that indicate something is going to happen, and so uses Vigilance as their skill. Contrasted from a crime scene, the Investigator is looking for little details on the people and objects in the area to get an idea of what occurred. The information is coming from the objects and their condition/spatial arrangement, not from events that are currently occurring, so they use Perception.

Does that make sense?

Not sure where we'll get it in now though? I can't see it in Engineer or even Spy. I wonder how much Not2ndEdition will play with the existing careers?

Yeah, that's the only problem I can see - there's nowhere to put it. The only thing I could think of is perhaps in a F&D book, but with no force attached to the tree at all (Which would be weird, and you'd be stuck with one less career skill if you were Joe Average and took the tree) . But otherwise yeah, that ship has sailed in the other two lines.

Perhaps as a thought exercise, I'll put together a Kung Fu Master tree myself. . . .

Just remember to have the Creative Killer talent. That is totally what a martial artist spec should have.

Honestly, I can totally see Martial Artist being a Spy specialization ... especially when one brings Bruce Lee to mind. Game of Death, after all, is a movie in which Bruce Lee is both well known for AND is playing a spy himself! Chinese Connection, The Big Boss, all these movies see Bruce go "under-cover" to thwart the BBEG. Perfect for spy.

I have a very...odd interpretation of Perception v. Vigilance. Which is fitting, I guess, because I'm an odd person!

In general, I agree that Perception is active and Vigilance is passive. However, I also call for passive Perception checks when there are fleeting details that one may or may not see, even when not looking, and I'll call for more "active" Vigilance checks to test reaction time against unexpected events.

So...in general, yes, but with some more nuance?

Yes, you eloquently put in words what I was thinking!

Just remember to have the Creative Killer talent. That is totally what a martial artist spec should have.

Or as my AOR group calls it, the 'Killing Stormtroopers With A Spoon' talent.

(It's on the Recruit tree, and everyone dreams of killing stormtroopers with kitchen utensils...)

Perception vs Vigilance was summed up nicely on Skill Monkey. Perception is looking for something that is already there, for example noticing the shadow of a figure hiding behind a corner, or spotting that a painting on the wall has cut out eyes and the eyes you see are those of someone hidden behind looking through cut out holes ala Scooby Doo villain style, whereas Vigilance is reacting to something that is about to happen, for example realising that lightning is about to strike, or getting that russle of fur/fabric moving against the wall just before that raging wookie jumps out from behind said corner.

As such perception could be passive or active. Whereas vigilance tends to be almost always passive. This being a narrative system if the situation calls for it or a player can justify it I can see it being used more actively.

Honestly, I can totally see Martial Artist being a Spy specialization ... especially when one brings Bruce Lee to mind. Game of Death, after all, is a movie in which Bruce Lee is both well known for AND is playing a spy himself! Chinese Connection, The Big Boss, all these movies see Bruce go "under-cover" to thwart the BBEG. Perfect for spy.

The Spy already has a martial artist type spec. I honestly hope they do something different with that book than give us another unarmed combat spec for the Spy.