6 dice? Meh...

When Fenn can roll 7 dice at range 1, then we'll talk.

(Keyan with advanced torpedoes, opportunist. Plus a Jan Ors HWK flying around somewhere.)

That's 7 dice at range 1, pretty hard to line up I'll grant you... But also extremely likely to produce 6+ hits.

Disclaimer: I know the above build is terrible, but the possibility of unreasonable amounts of dice in a single attack has existed for a while; Fenn doesn't bring anything we haven't seen before in terms of how many dice he can throw, he just doesn't have to jump through as many hoops as usual to get there.

(forgot Finn only works on primaries... Fixed now.

Still 7 dice; not too shabby)

Fenn Rau is scary. So I flew PS10 Rey. He didn't get a shot all game. The best moment was 3 banking into his arc, so I decided to turn around and boost out of it again.

PTL Norra with Shara on her wing is unimpressed with your 6-hit attack. Maybe if you could regenerate...

(Tallonbane) was on a perfectly average ship, and one of the very few 5att at that time. Even 4def at range 3, but only against primaries.

I'm not sure that's true, honestly. It has a stat line and dial that put it on par with the X-Wing, and it's 1 point cheaper. The problem is that the X-Wing is about a point and a half over costed. The Kihraxz doesn't have nearly the customization options the X-Wing does to make up for its inefficiency, and it lacks the solid reposition ability to help Tallonbane get the most from his ability. I think Vector Thruster will help him get more play. But he's not quite good enough yet.

(Tallonbane) was on a perfectly average ship, and one of the very few 5att at that time. Even 4def at range 3, but only against primaries.

I'm not sure that's true, honestly. It has a stat line and dial that put it on par with the X-Wing, and it's 1 point cheaper. The problem is that the X-Wing is about a point and a half over costed. The Kihraxz doesn't have nearly the customization options the X-Wing does to make up for its inefficiency, and it lacks the solid reposition ability to help Tallonbane get the most from his ability. I think Vector Thruster will help him get more play. But he's not quite good enough yet.

Kihraxz has Illicits and hard-1. And many of the astros are rather poor...

Agreed that he should have had more repositioning or -better- his pilot ability should have worked with and esp against(!) secondaries as well.

Vector thrusters occupies the mod slot (no guidance e.g.) and is already 2pts more, that's the problem here.

Talonbane does have illicit slots and hard 1s. He has to pay a whole lot for action economy and will never really be good defensively which makes him an extremely expensive missile that will die to a stiff breeze.

Fenn is a lot better designed for that. He's still not that durable, but he has a significantly better chance than Cobra. The Protectorate starfighter came with upgrades and pilots that rewarded getting into someone's grill and exchanging shots which is really interesting in an ace design.

Talonbane does have illicit slots and hard 1s. He has to pay a whole lot for action economy and will never really be good defensively which makes him an extremely expensive missile that will die to a stiff breeze.

Fenn is a lot better designed for that. He's still not that durable, but he has a significantly better chance than Cobra. The Protectorate starfighter came with upgrades and pilots that rewarded getting into someone's grill and exchanging shots which is really interesting in an ace design.

I see Fenn in the same vein as Carnor. He is great when not being shot at. Sure he can dodge but I have had plenty of experiences with the likes of Fel rolling all blanks and going down, not likely to happen, but still not cool when it does. Whats my point? PTL Fenn is great as an arc dodger and not as a jouster. I do not want to trust in the green die gods to save me from a crit that potentially take him out of the game. I use the CP title as a saving grace rather than something to be relied upon. The other Protectorates are more likely jouster candidates than Fenn, but I guess that plays into his top tier Ace role as he can do it all.

(...) That's not power creep. If those new elements routinely outperform older elements on the table (ie, in tournament settings) then THAT would be power creep.

Regarding the example discussed: Fenn Rau with his dial (+ even counting secondaries) vs Talonbane with his dial.

Talonbane wasn't very good at his time. It would be hard not to make a better PS9 ace.

He was on a perfectly average ship, and one of the very few 5att at that time.

Wow, Talonbane was perfectly average? I didn't realize that perfectly average meant "never showed up in a cut at a Regional, National, or Continental event across the entire planet in two year's worth of tournaments...

Wow, I'd hate to see what "merely average" or "below average" meant...

(...) That's not power creep. If those new elements routinely outperform older elements on the table (ie, in tournament settings) then THAT would be power creep.

Regarding the example discussed: Fenn Rau with his dial (+ even counting secondaries) vs Talonbane with his dial.

Talonbane wasn't very good at his time. It would be hard not to make a better PS9 ace.

He was on a perfectly average ship, and one of the very few 5att at that time.

Wow, Talonbane was perfectly average? I didn't realize that perfectly average meant "never showed up in a cut at a Regional, National, or Continental event across the entire planet in two year's worth of tournaments...

Wow, I'd hate to see what "merely average" or "below average" meant...

Ironically I would not be surprised if he is going to show up at least in regionals in the coming 2 months °_^

6 dice? Meh...

When Fenn can roll 7 dice at range 1, then we'll talk.

(Keyan with advanced torpedoes, opportunist. Plus a Jan Ors HWK flying around somewhere.)

That's 7 dice at range 1, pretty hard to line up I'll grant you... But also extremely likely to produce 6+ hits.

Disclaimer: I know the above build is terrible, but the possibility of unreasonable amounts of dice in a single attack has existed for a while; Fenn doesn't bring anything we haven't seen before in terms of how many dice he can throw, he just doesn't have to jump through as many hoops as usual to get there.

(forgot Finn only works on primaries... Fixed now.

Still 7 dice; not too shabby)

Saw a Fenn go for a beautiful joust the other day, managed to guess the range and everything, it was pure Range 4 to 1 perfection. Even people on other tables were nodding their approval, likening the greatness to the Heaver Manoeuvre of 2014 and why wouldn't they? Fenn Rau, a pilot of the shiny newness, resplendor in title and fearlessness, what could possibly halt this freight train of power creep?

With his mind focused and target lock, the fire storm cometh. . a rain of six solid hits slammed home, the gods themselves took notice of this unprecedented destruction. . .

Kanan, with his shields obliterated in the maelstrom of laser fire. . . returned his vengeance with an auto blaster. . scoring a mere two success hits.

With all ships exhausted, wounded and looking to anew their onslaught. . the docked Phantom fires his autoblaster, two hits. . .

And with that, the sector was briefly made brighter as the nothingness of space claimed yet another fool. Enraged, Old Terech goes for the throat, hoping to avenge his fellow comrade in aims, his voice roared throughout the comm channel, "For Mandalore------!!".

Luckily for Manaroo, who was now on the other side of the asteroid field, screams do not carry through the dark void of space. . for the warcry was cut short by the silent pew pew of the autoblaster double tap. .

As the green beacon on Manaroo's radar faded into nothing, even hope was lost for he/she (not sure) accepted the fate that a primary weapons wouldn't breach the hull of a recon spec / Jan Ors combo . . Not when Biggs was still alive. .

So it is with this tale that we all remember that for every valiant tale song in the glory halls, there is one whispered in death. For every heroic escape, there is a unexpected loss, for every triumphant victory, a saddening defeat.

I prefer by far that ships die quickly than that ships never die (looking at you Soontir Fel).

Agreed, but I cannot fly him well enough to get the hate; wish I could. I don't like facing him in the hands of an expert, but you must give them props; I'm FAR more impressed with a skilled pilot winning with a glass cannon than a novice like me smashing good players with missle U-boats; they deserve crap in their Halloween bag. Who knows, if FFG stops with their recent growing Aces negativity, maybe I'll get enough table time to fly him well, maybe....I hope.

Saw a Fenn go for a beautiful joust the other day, managed to guess the range and everything, it was pure Range 4 to 1 perfection. Even people on other tables were nodding their approval, likening the greatness to the Heaver Manoeuvre of 2014 and why wouldn't they? Fenn Rau, a pilot of the shiny newness, resplendor in title and fearlessness, what could possibly halt this freight train of power creep?

With his mind focused and target lock, the fire storm cometh. . a rain of six solid hits slammed home, the gods themselves took notice of this unprecedented destruction. . .

Kanan, with his shields obliterated in the maelstrom of laser fire. . . returned his vengeance with an auto blaster. . scoring a mere two success hits.

With all ships exhausted, wounded and looking to anew their onslaught. . the docked Phantom fires his autoblaster, two hits. . .

And with that, the sector was briefly made brighter as the nothingness of space claimed yet another fool. Enraged, Old Terech goes for the throat, hoping to avenge his fellow comrade in aims, his voice roared throughout the comm channel, "For Mandalore------!!".

Luckily for Manaroo, who was now on the other side of the asteroid field, screams do not carry through the dark void of space. . for the warcry was cut short by the silent pew pew of the autoblaster double tap. .

As the green beacon on Manaroo's radar faded into nothing, even hope was lost for he/she (not sure) accepted the fate that a primary weapons wouldn't breach the hull of a recon spec / Jan Ors combo . . Not when Biggs was still alive. .

So it is with this tale that we all remember that for every valiant tale song in the glory halls, there is one whispered in death. For every heroic escape, there is a unexpected loss, for every triumphant victory, a saddening defeat.

TL;DR

Don't be stupid and joust a ship that has an autoblaster that shoots twice....

These do not point to the failings of Fenn, but to the imbeciles who don't think about what they are about to attack.

(...) That's not power creep. If those new elements routinely outperform older elements on the table (ie, in tournament settings) then THAT would be power creep.

Regarding the example discussed: Fenn Rau with his dial (+ even counting secondaries) vs Talonbane with his dial.

Talonbane wasn't very good at his time. It would be hard not to make a better PS9 ace.

He was on a perfectly average ship, and one of the very few 5att at that time.

Wow, Talonbane was perfectly average? I didn't realize that perfectly average meant "never showed up in a cut at a Regional, National, or Continental event across the entire planet in two year's worth of tournaments...

Wow, I'd hate to see what "merely average" or "below average" meant...

Get your reading glasses, before posting caustic:

"He was on a perfectly average ship ".

Edit: And remember that refers to the time of wave 7. Before IA and a lot of other things.