When using To the Limit , must it be played immediately after a special action is performed, or just later during the models activation?

Eg:

1. A rRoyal Guard model is activated. Its player uses Urgency to gain 7 movement points. It uses those movement points. The player now plays To the Limit (the Royal Guard has performed the special action from Urgency ). The Royal Guard now has two actions remaining and its player uses Pummel to attack a target twice. Immediately after resolving Pummel , the Royal Guard is stunned due to To the Limit .

2. More simply a model could Move, spend movement, Urgency , spend movement, To the Limit , Attack, become stunned.

Are these legal moves? Spending movement points are not an action; but does spending them cause a break in timing that prevents To the Limit from being used?

Further, many cards state "after..." in their triggering condition. This is not a keyword and so is ambiguous. Should these always be treated as an immediate interrupt after the trigger? Common sense makes play time obvious for some cards (like Opportunistic ) and non-obvious for others (like To the Limit ). I couldn't find anything in the RRG which clarified this point.

The trigger point is after, which means immediately after. If you perform any ability (including spending movement points) that does not have the same trigger, you are giving up activating the ability with the trigger.

1. Does work. You can't normally spend movement points between the special action and To the Limit, but Urgency gives movement points as part of a special action, and thus those movement points must be spent immediately as an interrupt and any unspent mp's are lost. You are thus spending the movement points inside the special action, so Urgency hasn't been resolved until the movement points have been spent or lost.

2. Depends on what the "spend movement" comprises of. You can't spend movement points between the special action and To the Limit, because it won't be "after resolving a special action" anymore. If they are the movement points from Urgency, see 1.

If you have more than one ability with the same trigger, you resolve them in the timing resolution order. In effect after resolving an ability you will still be at the original trigger point.

The trigger point is after, which means immediately after. If you perform any ability (including spending movement points) that does not have the same trigger, you are giving up activating the ability with the trigger.

1. Does work. You can't normally spend movement points between the special action and To the Limit, but Urgency gives movement points as part of a special action, and thus those movement points must be spent immediately as an interrupt and any unspent mp's are lost.

Really ? I thought you had to use those movement points immediatly only when you earned them outside your activation or you had to move X space when the special action told you to (like Gaarkhan charge). And it seems this is not the case in that scenario.

Movement points gained outside of your activation or as part of a special action must be spent immediately or lost.

Urgency is a special action giving movement points. In fact, I think it is the only special action giving movement points Edit: It used to be the only special action giving movement points.

Charge is using Move X spaces, not movement points. Move X spaces must be performed immediately because there is no move x spaces pool to save them into, not because it is part of a special action.

That's right. So, what about Urgency ? Following those rules, you wouldn't need to spend those movement points you just earned right away after activating Urgency . And thus, To the Limit would be the next step, then Stun. What do you think ?

Urgency is a special action giving movement points.

Movement points received out of your activation or as part of a special action need to be spent immediately or be lost. They do not go to the movement point pool.

Thus the movement points received from Urgency must be spent immediately or be lost. The movement points received from Urgency must be spent during Urgency.

When the Urgency special action finishes, the figure has already spent the movement points from Urgency. The figure can now use To the Limit, because a special action was resolved (immediately before).

Movement points can be spent before or after performing an action. If movement points are gained as part of a special action, they must be spent immediately during that action.

Urgency is a special action giving movement points.

Movement points received out of your activation or as part of a special action need to be spent immediately or be lost. They do not go to the movement point pool.

Thus the movement points received from Urgency must be spent immediately or be lost. The movement points received from Urgency must be spent during Urgency.

When the Urgency special action finishes, the figure has already spent the movement points from Urgency. The figure can now use To the Limit, because a special action was resolved (immediately before).

Movement points can be spent before or after performing an action. If movement points are gained as part of a special action, they must be spent immediately during that action.

Ok thank you for quoting that rule ! Really clear now

(dind't catch the " or as part of a special action" part the first time)

Thanks for the clarifications, I had missed the section under Actions. That clears up a bunch of associated questions I had.

I think the rule that special action movement points have to spent as part of the action is one of the rules most easily overlooked (and it is likely no coincidence that Urgency and To The Limit are the cards I've had to reeducate people on the most often as a TO). It does give you some interesting choice when playing, mind you, but I think the game had been more transparent without this exception to the movement rules in general.

Urgency is a special action giving movement points. In fact, I think it is the only special action giving movement points

Others are Vader's Finest (Skirmish Upgrade) and Hit and Run (Command Card).

Oh and 501st Training (Reward - Bunker Buster). Couldn't recall the name or origins of this one at first, but obviously mirrors the skirmish upgrade in the same expansion (Stoormtrooper figure pack).

Can you use urgency to run up to a door. Second action open door. Then to the limit to attack?

Im asking more because of the "after" vs. "immediately after" idea. Because you did a special action in your activation. And you took a second action. Then played to the limit. All the conditions to be able to play the limit are met unless it's immediately.

I'm only asking because this is a different situation than the other two. And it came up today.

Interact isn't a special action, so no.

The trigger of To the Limit is after resolving a special action . If you perform any ability which has a different trigger *) , you pass up on the trigger.

*) including spending movement points like I mention in the second post

Yeah that's what I was guessing off what you said earlier. But I just want to know why "after" is limited to "immediately after" instead of "anytime this activation after you have done a special action you can play (to the limit)"?

I really just want to know the precedent for it I guess. Or the precise reason why "after" is defined one way instead of the other.

You could ask the opposite: is there any case when "before" isn't "immediately before" or any case when "after" isn't "immediately after"?

It would be very unwieldy to be able to use "before declaring an attack" abilities anytime before the attack. How much before? Can it be during the previous round? Previous mission?

How much after could "after" be? Next round? Next mission? Next campaign?

So, the reason is probably memory effects. The game usually does not require you to remember things that matter. The game uses tokens to remember things. (There's one obvious exception though: the once per round effects of heroes -- heroes cannot exhaust parts of their hero sheets, so 'exhaust' cannot be used with the once per round abilities.)

With a bit of digging you can find precedents for abilities or mission rules that use "if you performed X during your activation", Like Vinto's Shot on the Run.