My tournament win less then a month ago with guri begs to differ on the viability concerns.

But I agree, a little help on the price would be an appreciated but not necessary buff.

I think I have been taken out of context. Winning at a local tournament is one thing, the Viper seen in a top 16 cut is a totally different story.

I just barely missed Top 16 with a Starviper at my Regionals in 2015. I had a great match up, but my red dice just couldn't roll hits. I had Xizor and 5 Headhunters and I couldn't even knock a Decimator down to half hull in something like 7 rounds of shooting at it. Even my opponent said he "almost felt bad for me".

The only other game I lost was one with a Tie Phantom because I made a terrible mistake and I hate Tie Phantoms. I had the tools to win, but made a bad mistake.

I think the ship is worth keeping. I don't understand the constant whining about an X-Wing fix (because it received one), but this ship was DOA like (arguably) the TIE Advanced and the Defender;

I absolutely disagree that this ship was DOA when it came out. I flew it with 5 Z-95's and did very well. There were threads of a few guys in the UK placing in top tables at events there. I learned how to defeat Fat Turrets with it, which were big at the time. In a small event with some very good players (who won regionals), I was able to beat them with it, but lost to my first game vs. Bro Bots. I learned how to play vs. Bro Bots and went to my Regionals. My last game had my dice go horribly cold. If they were average, I would've made Top 16 at my event. I think that people thought it was DOA and never bothered to try it. TLT's then killed it, though.

I don't agree that people didn't bother to try it. I think people were _very_ excited for it when it first came out, and it never quite managed to work. I mean yes- there are some one-off victories for it, but the generics cost too much, and the named pilots are a bit too fragile for what they offer. Guri, for instance, costs as much as Onyx Squadron + X7 has fewer shields, and has no access to evade. Guri's PS isn't high enough to take advantage of her action bar for arc dodging, and she doesn't have enough (good) green to make her a reliable enough PTL user to get more than one action anyway.

Fearlessness may actually work really well with her ability, though.

I'm not saying that the 'Viper is a bad ship. It has a great concept and is an interesting bundle of stats. But! It needs either a price drop or an increase in action efficiency or a way to become more survivable than it currently is. Or some combination.

I'm picking up the Star Viper to get the Autothrusters, but I have no use for the ship so will probably Ebay it. What else is worth keeping out of it? I play as Imperials but also have some rebels if that makes a difference.

If this is your first Star Viper, I'd keep the whole thing. I have a strong sense that in the next year or so FFG will roll out a fix for the Star Viper and you'll want to have at least 2 of them. Also the model itself is really pretty.

If you're heck-bent on not playing as Scum, I'd keep Autothrusters, Accuracy Corrector (Which are great on low PS TIE Advanced). Ion Torpedoes and Calculation are also good in certain niches (Ten Numb). And Hull Upgrade might be worth hanging onto. Oh, and as mentioned, the Inertial Dampeners could be interesting on Sabine's Masterpiece- or the updated Falcon that's rolling out!

Ok, so basically, if you don't want to ever play Scum, I'd keep everything but the model and the pilot cards.

I don't agree that people didn't bother to try it. ... doesn't have enough (good) green to make her a reliable enough PTL user to get more than one action anyway.

To me, I think these two sentences sum it up. When people found out that you couldn't really PTL with the Starviper, they gave up on it. I rarely saw many people besides me even try out the Starviper. People think you have to have PTL on the ship to make it be worthwhile. I don't think you should ever put PTL on this ship. It's not built for it. I think too many people are just stuck on PTL being a requirement for a ship being good or not. I found Xizor with VI and FCS to be absolutely fine when surrounded with Z-95's. The first round might not have gotten a lot of modification on dice, but it picked up after that.

Prince and the New Power Generation (which is what my list got nick named) destroyed Fat Turrets and Bro Bots with ease. That was a lot of what was around in those days. Blockage was the secret vs. Fat Turrets and Flechette Torpedo was the secret vs. Bro Bots and Arc Dodgers.

The Starviper is the best pure fighter in the game. It out-flies both the TIE fighter and the X-wing. It out guns the TIE Fighter, and has more ways to avoid damage than the X-wing (and the TIE Fighter for the matter). Many complain about the cost... but at a base cost of 25 points you're getting a lot! 3 attack, 3 evade, 1 shield, 4 hull, an AMAZING dial (that 1 white turn is brutal!), barrel-roll, boost (hello autothrusters), and a torpedo slot.

Stop thinking about the Starviper as an interceptor. It does not need, nor should you put PTL on it. It is also not a jouster like the Defender or B-wing. The Starviper is about control. It blocks lanes, forces the action where it is best for you, and dishes out punishment. Learning to fly this ship will serve you well.

Just keep autothrusters

Isn't it easier to just find the AutoThrusters through an online vendor and just buy them?

They were £7 each. So it would have saved me £3, so I reckon I can make more than £3 from selling it.

The Starviper is the best pure fighter in the game. It out-flies both the TIE fighter and the X-wing. It out guns the TIE Fighter, and has more ways to avoid damage than the X-wing (and the TIE Fighter for the matter). Many complain about the cost... but at a base cost of 25 points you're getting a lot! 3 attack, 3 evade, 1 shield, 4 hull, an AMAZING dial (that 1 white turn is brutal!), barrel-roll, boost (hello autothrusters), and a torpedo slot.

Stop thinking about the Starviper as an interceptor. It does not need, nor should you put PTL on it. It is also not a jouster like the Defender or B-wing. The Starviper is about control. It blocks lanes, forces the action where it is best for you, and dishes out punishment. Learning to fly this ship will serve you well.

I learned to fly the ship and then I realized you can do what it does in far more efficient ships.

The Starviper is the best pure fighter in the game. It out-flies both the TIE fighter and the X-wing. It out guns the TIE Fighter, and has more ways to avoid damage than the X-wing (and the TIE Fighter for the matter). Many complain about the cost... but at a base cost of 25 points you're getting a lot! 3 attack, 3 evade, 1 shield, 4 hull, an AMAZING dial (that 1 white turn is brutal!), barrel-roll, boost (hello autothrusters), and a torpedo slot.

Stop thinking about the Starviper as an interceptor. It does not need, nor should you put PTL on it. It is also not a jouster like the Defender or B-wing. The Starviper is about control. It blocks lanes, forces the action where it is best for you, and dishes out punishment. Learning to fly this ship will serve you well.

I learned to fly the ship and then I realized you can do what it does in far more efficient ships.

What scum ship can do what it can more efficiently?

I'll venture that NO ship can do everything the Starviper is capable of at 25 points. I understand the gripe; because it does not have a common EPT or System slot it can fall victim to the luck of the dice. I'm personally glad the X-wing community feels the way they do about Starvipers. When I play them competitively I've only lost one game. Glad not to see them on the other side of the table.

Starvipers at PS1 are the best blocker of the entire game. Problem is that they get block+firepower+hulls and you are paying al of those things.

Maybe you want just a block, so you run a Bynare pirate.

Guri is an engine for Attanni Mindlink.

Xizor needs something to be THE public enemy n1. His ability works in that way, but him is...meh. I love the Prince, but have to admit it: is not so dangerous.

He have an ability that trigger when they shoot at him. But why I have to shoot at him? 3 attack dice, a fire control system, and..?

I was addicted to VI, but recently I'm trying new ways and I found PS9 not needed with him. He don't need to shoot first, because he can share his damage. And normally, a list with him present some good blockers, so you can try to block other aces.

Vigo are useless.

The Starviper is my favourite and first ship, and I love it. I run 4 of them and they works well. But yeah, this ship needs something unique. Not evade tokens (scyks), not fire twice (btl Y-wing), and not something turning these in aces (protectorate).

They need something new. Unique. Some backwards movements, or something tha improve their block power, or some else.

PS: strange to say, but they carry Torpedoes pretty well. Proton+Guidance kick hard with some crits. At ps1, you can avoid autothrusters (you don't need protection) ad you will fire something without shield.

The Starviper is the best pure fighter in the game. It out-flies both the TIE fighter and the X-wing. It out guns the TIE Fighter, and has more ways to avoid damage than the X-wing (and the TIE Fighter for the matter). Many complain about the cost... but at a base cost of 25 points you're getting a lot! 3 attack, 3 evade, 1 shield, 4 hull, an AMAZING dial (that 1 white turn is brutal!), barrel-roll, boost (hello autothrusters), and a torpedo slot.

Stop thinking about the Starviper as an interceptor. It does not need, nor should you put PTL on it. It is also not a jouster like the Defender or B-wing. The Starviper is about control. It blocks lanes, forces the action where it is best for you, and dishes out punishment. Learning to fly this ship will serve you well.

I learned to fly the ship and then I realized you can do what it does in far more efficient ships.

What scum ship can do what it can more efficiently?

I'll venture that NO ship can do everything the Starviper is capable of at 25 points. I understand the gripe; because it does not have a common EPT or System slot it can fall victim to the luck of the dice. I'm personally glad the X-wing community feels the way they do about Starvipers. When I play them competitively I've only lost one game. Glad not to see them on the other side of the table.

The binayre pirate for the points does what the PS1 does but brings more blocking power through taking up more space, more survivability and more firepower, particularly against targets more reliant on beef. I don't really consider getting through 3 unmodified green dice to be particularly difficult. Even if you really need boost+br to block, the PS1 fang is a lot more cost-effective.

I say this as someone who has actually won a tournament with a starviper, with TLTs around. The lack of evade action is really rough and the low PS hurts as well.

....this ship was DOA like (arguably) the TIE Advanced ....

Absolutely wrong...nothing was DOA in Wave 1 at the time. As a Wave 1 ship, the TIE Advanced and Vader were exceptionally good in a meta of 1-2 green dice for rebels.

Edit: Guri has been a great scum ace while they were establishing themselves as a faction...the unique title was a challenge for wider use

....this ship was DOA like (arguably) the TIE Advanced ....

Absolutely wrong...nothing was DOA in Wave 1 at the time. As a Wave 1 ship, the TIE Advanced and Vader were exceptionally good in a meta of 1-2 green dice for rebels.

Edit: Guri has been a great scum ace while they were establishing themselves as a faction...the unique title was a challenge for wider use

Guri is the best starviper but she's still not that good. Virago is a surtax to get a system slot which was a bizarre design choice and even if it wasn't a unique title it would not make the generics good.

I would say that if you are buying ships just for their cards. I would take at least a few and make some terrain with them. Or even better pass them off to that poor kid at the local game store so he can have some more fun. Who knows what that may bring

Lol at my store guy forget his autothrusters for the tournament. None of us brought extra stuff as we usually only show up with our lists and that's it. So he buys a star viper, opens it up, takes the autothrusters, puts the rest on an open table, and tells us anyone else can have whatever we want from it for free. No one takes anything else and at the end of the tournament another guy throws it in the garbage and we are all like this is where it belongs lol.

since this is turning into a Starviper is good/bad thread I'm going to add my 2 cents

the Starviper is one of the best ships in the game however it is one of the steepest learning curves.

I fly Guri a lot with Lone Wolf, title, Sensor Jammer, Autothrusters. 39 points that solo many lists like 4 TLT Y-Wings, Swams any turret heavy list and any other kind of list full of low PS ships. when ever I put her in my lists she is often the last ship to be targeted after all others have been destroyed and this is where she really shines

as has been said above the Alex has said the it is 2 points over costed and I can agree with that but is we got the 2 point reduction all it would do is let me add gliterstim to my build it does not need anything to "fix" the ship as it is not broken the stats are where they are meant to be

If a "fix" is to come to help other play this awesome ship that would be great but I do worry which slot it will take up the only one I don't use is the torp slot. I do know these ships had Buzz Droids in the EU so maybe that could be something like Seismic Torpedo make it free for the starviper and its an attack they can do as an action firing sabotage droids at an opponents ship with a Boba Crew like ability

as for the OP original question Autothrusters and Accuracy Corrector

I think the ship is worth keeping. I don't understand the constant whining about an X-Wing fix (because it received one), but this ship was DOA like (arguably) the TIE Advanced and the Defender; even the A-Wing, TIE Interceptor, Y-Wing, etc. received bumps up the ladder to make them usable. The three ships that absolutely need a fix are the Punisher, Scyk and the Starviper. Their pilot abilities are cool, but they neeeeeeeeeds something. Maybe a Scum Veterans pack?

Guri coming in at almost 40 points is waaaay too much for a PS 5 ace. I love the Viper, it just isnt competitive on a tournament scene. I bought 2, I would love them to be useful, but the title being a unique doesnt help things any.

For what it's worth, I've gone undefeated in 2 local tournaments in a row with Guri, Palob, Manaroo. I've also never lost a practice game with it either. Something like 12-0 with it now, though the final table in the second tournament was decided by final salvo, which was awesome.

The starviper is my favorite ship in the game. It's not easy to use, but properly supported, it's amazing. Guri always feasts for me.

Interesting. I would like to subscribe to your newsletter. i.e. What is the list please?

The version I've been running is:

32: Manaroo, Attanni Mindlink, unhinged astro, K4 droid

30: Palob, Attanni, TLT, Intel agent, cloaking device

38: Guri, Attanni, Virago, Sensor Jammer, Autothrusters

Once I get my hands on the shadowcaster, I'll be dropping that Intel agent for BMST. It's an incredibly fun list to fly due to the mental gymnastics that Attanni ML requires. It doesn't look like much damage but the ability to cause massive traffic jams while still getting full dice mods makes its mid-game presence strong.

The vast majority of my battles haven't been particularly close, most often Manaroo loses half her points. I've had some awesome nail biters but there's usually one or two "gotcha moments" per game where the opponent does something silly like target locking Manaroo, or boosting into range 1 to set up procket shot, only to have Palob shatter their dreams over his knee.

Who were you planning to pop the BMST on?

Guri awful, xizor is awful. Starvipers are just plain awful. Wish they weren't though. Unfortunately they're just 20 dollar auto thruster packs.

Who were you planning to pop the BMST on?

Not sure, I'll play around with it. Depends on who needs their action the least. Probably Guri because she's tough to kill early, so Soontir can't hope to knock out the BMST quickly and get back to his shenanigans.

Guri awful, xizor is awful. Starvipers are just plain awful. Wish they weren't though. Unfortunately they're just 20 dollar auto thruster packs.

I think all the people in this thread saying wonderful things about it disagree.

One thing I'll add is that if you are going to sell off the model make SURE the buyer knows it will NOT be including those upgrades you keep. A good number of StarVipers are purchased just to get those upgrades (or to fill out a collection) and if the expansion is not complete some may feel you are stealing from them.

For what it's worth, I've gone undefeated in 2 local tournaments in a row with Guri, Palob, Manaroo. I've also never lost a practice game with it either. Something like 12-0 with it now, though the final table in the second tournament was decided by final salvo, which was awesome.

The starviper is my favorite ship in the game. It's not easy to use, but properly supported, it's amazing. Guri always feasts for me.

Ok, first off. We just became friends. Second, I fly the exact same thing. (Although I may be dropping palob and some of Manaroos upgrades to squeeze in the new mandalorian ship). Third, I too, have flown this list in local tourneys and practice games with equal succes. My dad calls the list "can't hit (Guri) can't tl (manaroo) can't focus (palob)" lol

For those of you saying the Starviper is useless, I just wanna say yall don't know how to upgrade/fly it. Sure, it's a bit expensive, but my Guri is totally worth it. She can eat 4 torps from U boat swarms and keep fighting. She can stress with a sloop on the first engagement, and remain stressed for the rest of the game but still start each combat phase with 2-3 focus and a tl, and she's single handedly taken on an 8 tie swarm and lived. (I flew Manaroo off the map before engagement and palob died forster round) There's plenty of ships I don't fly because I fail at flying them, but I'll never say they are too useless to ever lose. Maybe someone somewhere has figured out how to use a bwing or a Kirahxzyabfvfbsb fighter effectively. Ok, rant over lol

(Sorry, but the Starviper is my bae, I get triggered when ppl say it's ****. I've shown my local store how powerful it can be already, and I'll keep preaching it's usefulness to the rest of you till I see this thing win a regional! XD )

I don't recall seeing any star vipers in any regional or national top list. While I do see people here state with certainty that the star viper is good, saying ive done well in local tournaments imo is not enough evidence to say some like myself to think otherwise.

People tend to fly less too meta lists at those events Unlike what you would see at a regional event. (yes there are some, but in a lot of cases not as many) I know if I had 2-3 spring kit tournaments I could go to, I'd fly more original lists as a test to myself (a luxury I don't have) and also they tend to have fewer players (8-16 for example)

Now having a star viper list make top cut in a regional or national event would be something to brag about. These events tend to have 30-100+ players, so to me that's the true test. How many dengaroo, palp aces, triple uboats, ghosts and biggs etc builds you have to beat? A lot more than what you'd see at a local event

I can take an original list to a summer kit tournament, a tie punisher and some bombers or something. Even if I won, I don't think that would mean the punisher is a good ship, and doesn't need a fix. However if I could do it at a regional with 60 players and beat out top meta lists, then I think you'd also see other players doing similar builds

I'm not saying it's a bad ship, but the argument some use as to why it's a good ship isn't enough evidence imo. It can be fun, but it's still a long ways off to being competitive imo. Just like bombers. Fun to fly, but not something your going to revolve a list around at regions. At least in its current state