Again, I have no idea about what church denomination is involved, or your faith... but you might also want to consider how you will treat The Force, which is really what makes Star Wars different from every other sci-fi setting.

The Force is REALLY vague as regards the religious and spiritual elements, but Good and Evil are presented as powerful and seductive forces, that pull and push at heroes and antagonists alike.

Again, this may not even be an issue, but I know some people get upset at things like Harry Potter or The Hobbit for having magical elements, or D&D having clerics and gods. Maybe best to consider that ahead of time if you think it might be an issue.

Okay, my 2$....

Shouldnt that be a ‎£ or some other weird foreign squiggly thing?

(:

The subject of 'violence' is a tricky one, and there's no easy answers. But I saw Star Wars in 1977 as a seven year old girl, and I understood that fighting and death were things that happened. The movies don't dwell on these, but you can't just ignore that the fate of Alderaan was a Very Bad Thing. Luke returns home to find his house and elders aflame. Ben dies, sacrificing himself in battle so the others can escape. Luke's childhood friend Biggs is killed by Vader. The themes of sacrifice and risk are present right from the start. In all honesty, if the kids involved aren't old enough to see the original movies, I would advise against role-playing Star Wars. Luke in the cave at Dagobah, Jabba's death at Leia's hands, Han being frozen in carbonite, Vader's redemption and death... I think all that stuff is too near the core of the films to ignore. This is a great lesson for kids who are ready for it - that 'doing the right thing' is tough and has consequences - but if the kids aren't ready for it (and you have to gauge that) I would recognise it and maybe play something a bit less intense?

WARNING - wildly off topic incoming

Man, I feel bad for the kid. Now you should raise your child as you see fit and I'm not advocating that kids sit down and watch Friday the 13th or Robocop (despite me sneaking into - or occasionally brazenly getting my mom to take me - to all kind of R Rated movies) or anything, but cutting out every single instance of violence in your life is just insanity. That means all your video games consist of Tetris and all your movies consist of romantic comedies. Even family shows like Doctor Who or shows with a positive futuristic message like the old school Star Trek have a certain measure of aggression on the protagonist or antagonist part.

Star Wars is about as positive a message as you can get - power of love, strength of conviction, doing what's right and so on, and the violence is 98 percent bloodless and harmless (Ponda Baba and the Wampa not withstanding).

That kid is going to grow up hating his parents.

This idea is what I'm brewing to potentially side-step the no violence edict I've been given as GM by a teenage player's parents.

We can assume droid may talk among themselves at the water cooler, as you do. Sure, some may have their memory wiped, but we know droids have personalities and other emotional/mental-like quirks.

When Amidala passed away from a broken heart, very few people witnessed it. Droids who cared for her in labor would have been some of the finest available for her, given her station, despite the sudden galactic government coup. Would these droids have checked all vital statistics for her? I think it's a reasonable outcome. What about her babies? Would they have gotten a medical scan? Could Obi-Wan have requested a midichlorian count of the children? If this could be even rumored history, and we expect that at least one droid didn't have its memory fully cleared (or passed along this story before it did), we have our hook:

The PCs are on a mission to end this Galactic Conflict by returning R2D2 and C3P0 to their rightful owner - Darth Vader. As mechanics, they won't be keen on the Force, nor interested in the Rebellion who stole droids in the first place. Are you telling me Vader WOULDN'T want 3P0 back in his service (or at least out of the hands of known rebels)? If we accept the Skywalker Paradigm, and think that Princess Leia is working with her known Dark Lord father and has the droids on loan, they need to get back to Vader at some point. They're priceless heirlooms. A gold-plated protocol droid built by the Galactic King as a child should surely bring about some attention among technicians, like droid techs.

The Gadgeteer has a bounty hunting licence...signed by Darth Vader himself, citing, "No Disintegrations." Vader - not the kid's parents - want NO violence because something may happen to his daughter (with 3P0 around) or Luke (with R2 around). Even when the Wookiee roared as his best friend was lowered into freezing carbonite, Vader forcibly lowered Fett's rifle (to avoid hitting Leia by accident, and/or his droid?).

Do I ever expect the characters to encounter Vader? No- this is all the backstory and buy-in we need. Will the PCs flip once they have R2 or 3P0? Well, even finding those two droids should take a long, long time. I expect a comedy of errors with enough movie references of where they JUST missed either one of the droids when the visit their location clues. We get an over-the-top patron (Vader), let the PCs juggle with disobeying his orders of no violence (which will loom more for the group than a parental request, I assure you! Angry Vader > angry parents in player's minds), revisit iconic scenes and stories from the movies, and have lots of scrap to play with at evacuated battle scenes (with some droid survivors- no one ever considers droids, said 3P0). This encourages ion weaponry, or tools as weapons in a pinch. Self-preservation as violence is something to discuss with the player's parents.

Many major causes are rooted in some elements that could otherwise be (mis)construed as high fantasy or otherwise unrealistic, illogical yet deeply held beliefs when held up to societal scrutiny. So, Vader wants his droids back. The backchannel information route to even know these are his droids is suggestive of a good droid tech or slicer, or bounty hunter known for reacquiring droids without violence. This also suggests all players having access to Mechanics, because they may be the last line of defense in rebooting either droid.

We'd begin immediately following the Battle of Yavin.

Would this idea float, do you think?

To all of this, add three guys wanting a date with a young lady whose affections are already spoken-for.

Was this young lady involved in the game, in proximity to where the game was being played, or elsewhere but nevertheless the centerpoint of some pre-existing tension among the three guys?

Some people do hold extreme beliefs that make it hard to cope with. I recall many years ago holding a sponsored 24 hour roleplaying game in aid of a well known and well respected charity. One person refused to sponsor us because he thought roleplaying was evil (fine, whatever he thinks it's his view), and also then refused to have anything to do with that charity (which he had in the past), on the grounds that roleplaying could raise funds for it!

There is a big difference between glorified violence and violence that has consequences, in my view. Pretending that violence doesn't exist helps no one.

Personally in my current campaign my Verpine has so far managed to find a way out of all combat encounters without violence!

If their beliefs are such that their child cannot be exposed to reality, then I'm afraid their child is in a very tough spot, and one that may be impossible to help them with. I wish too we lived in a world without hate and violence, but we don't, and anything I believe will not change that.

Shouldnt that be a ‎£ or some other weird foreign squiggly thing?

(:

In Britland, we say 'my two pence'. But hey, I'm on a Forum for an American company, so I talk American. (I still refuse to spell it 'armor' though!

Star Wars is about as positive a message as you can get - power of love, strength of conviction, doing what's right and so on, and the violence is 98 percent bloodless and harmless (Ponda Baba and the Wampa not withstanding)..

Absolutely - more callow films would have seen Luke kill Vader rather than redeem him. That blew my mind at 14.

But as you say... Star Wars isn't sanitised either. Bad Things happen, even to good people. Even Ewoks get killed trying to do the right thing.

The films are GREAT films for young adults, but they're not Flanderised either. And that's a good thing.

Again, I have no idea about what church denomination is involved, or your faith... but you might also want to consider how you will treat The Force, which is really what makes Star Wars different from every other sci-fi setting.

The Force is REALLY vague as regards the religious and spiritual elements, but Good and Evil are presented as powerful and seductive forces, that pull and push at heroes and antagonists alike.

Again, this may not even be an issue, but I know some people get upset at things like Harry Potter or The Hobbit for having magical elements, or D&D having clerics and gods. Maybe best to consider that ahead of time if you think it might be an issue.

Initially, the Force would have its own extensive rules, and I wanted to avoid so much depth at start of the game. Given players' experiences, this may have been overwhelming. Plus, nobody asked to play a Jedi.

With the sudden church demands set by one parental group, I'm happy to avoid further ire by discussing "morality" at the gaming table.

Darlin', your advice is worth two bucks! Mwah!!

Was this young lady involved in the game, in proximity to where the game was being played, or elsewhere but nevertheless the centerpoint of some pre-existing tension among the three guys?

I'm female. I'm a GM, a human who identifies as a gamer above everything else.

And I've played all my life among mostly guys. Hormones happen, especially when you're young.

Not gonna say I'm Playmate material, but I look okay if you like hipster/gamer girls. I'm not short of offers or banter from players, who don't always know how to deal with their emotions. (Or use deodorant)

So it's a good thing to know how to deal with this early on You have to set boundaries and make sure things are comfortable for the female players too. I'm incredibly easy-going but some guy-stuff can make girls nervous. Sugar and spice and all things nice, don'cha know.

Shouldnt that be a ‎£ or some other weird foreign squiggly thing?

(:

In Britland, we say 'my two pence'. But hey, I'm on a Forum for an American company, so I talk American. (I still refuse to spell it 'armor' though!

/ducks

Initially, the Force would have its own extensive rules, and I wanted to avoid so much depth at start of the game. Given players' experiences, this may have been overwhelming. Plus, nobody asked to play a Jedi.

I agree, but as I said, it's best to consider it ahead of time.

And 'morality' of the usual type will happen even in non-violent games. 'If I don't stop to fight these bad people, will good people get hurt? Which is worse?'

True, no GM plan survives contact with the players, but thinking ahead can be helpful, especially when dealing with kids and overly-fretful parents

To all of this, add three guys wanting a date with a young lady whose affections are already spoken-for.

Was this young lady involved in the game, in proximity to where the game was being played, or elsewhere but nevertheless the centerpoint of some pre-existing tension among the three guys?

She lives in town. She is in class with three of the boys at once, and with my son in another class. To hear her name as a classmate isn't unusual because they share some many classes and the classes aren't super-huge.

However, her relationship orientation would exclude all players from having a date with her. Yeah, this was a difficult topic and part of the really bad time we experienced as ...well, teenage boys interested in a young lady who won't return their affections because of her attractions elsewhere. Insert disgusting jokes made by some of the boys and you can see how I had my hands full as a mother, mother/parent figure, and woman who thinks inclusively.

EDIT: No, she's not part of the group. For her sake, at least two players would have to elevate their maturity to avoid conflicting beliefs about her ability to be attracted to someone not named them. Thankfully, my son and her are friends and study-buddies two years ago, so he got to see a totally different side to her than her looks.

Would this idea float, do you think?

Well, I guess we know what side of the "Do I follow Cannon" fence you come down on.

Oh sure, I could nit-pick ideas - personally I think that Vader was pretty much of the "I killed Anakin" mindset and anything from his old life (like his first droid) he probably wouldn't care about. However for what you are trying to do - engage a bunch of teenagers who love Star Wars - I think that's a great premise.

I don't know if you had it in the cards, but I would certainly have Vader himself personally hand out the mission to the group at the game's start. If you're going to buck the trend of "Keep the Main Heroes of the Movies at arms length", go big, man!

However, her relationship orientation would exclude all players from having a date with her. Yeah, this was a difficult topic and part of the really bad time we experienced as ...well, teenage boys interested in a young lady who won't return their affections because of her attractions elsewhere. Insert disgusting jokes made by some of the boys and you can see how I had my hands full as a mother, mother/parent figure, and woman who thinks inclusively.

EDIT: No, she's not part of the group. For her sake, at least two players would have to elevate their maturity to avoid conflicting beliefs about her ability to be attracted to someone not named them. Thankfully, my son and her are friends and study-buddies two years ago, so he got to see a totally different side to her than her looks.

I was super-lucky to have cool parents back in 1987.

Your kids are super-lucky to have you

Would this idea float, do you think?

Well, I guess we know what side of the "Do I follow Cannon" fence you come down on.

I think it works fine. Good idea they can all get behind.

I'm 47; changing canon is advanced stuff, not recommended for those new to gaming. Start little and take baby steps.

Okay, my 2$....

Shouldnt that be a ‎£ or some other weird foreign squiggly thing?

(:

The subject of 'violence' is a tricky one, and there's no easy answers. But I saw Star Wars in 1977 as a seven year old girl, and I understood that fighting and death were things that happened. The movies don't dwell on these, but you can't just ignore that the fate of Alderaan was a Very Bad Thing. Luke returns home to find his house and elders aflame. Ben dies, sacrificing himself in battle so the others can escape. Luke's childhood friend Biggs is killed by Vader. The themes of sacrifice and risk are present right from the start. In all honesty, if the kids involved aren't old enough to see the original movies, I would advise against role-playing Star Wars. Luke in the cave at Dagobah, Jabba's death at Leia's hands, Han being frozen in carbonite, Vader's redemption and death... I think all that stuff is too near the core of the films to ignore. This is a great lesson for kids who are ready for it - that 'doing the right thing' is tough and has consequences - but if the kids aren't ready for it (and you have to gauge that) I would recognise it and maybe play something a bit less intense?

WARNING - wildly off topic incoming

Man, I feel bad for the kid. Now you should raise your child as you see fit and I'm not advocating that kids sit down and watch Friday the 13th or Robocop (despite me sneaking into - or occasionally brazenly getting my mom to take me - to all kind of R Rated movies) or anything, but cutting out every single instance of violence in your life is just insanity. That means all your video games consist of Tetris and all your movies consist of romantic comedies. Even family shows like Doctor Who or shows with a positive futuristic message like the old school Star Trek have a certain measure of aggression on the protagonist or antagonist part.

Star Wars is about as positive a message as you can get - power of love, strength of conviction, doing what's right and so on, and the violence is 98 percent bloodless and harmless (Ponda Baba and the Wampa not withstanding).

That kid is going to grow up hating his parents.

Yeah, I never expected to go all out for blood and gore, but the actual definition of 'violence' is what hangs in the balance. How much self-preservation is violence? How much use of others' resources constitutes violence? I'm waiting to hear back from the parents on these and similar questions.

On another note, I wish the parents, church, or someone would instill self-advocacy in the boy. He could easily have declined the cola, knowing it was against his parents' wishes or his new church.

In fact, I'm not even 100% sure the family has converted to a new religion, just that they are checking out a new one. All of this may go away if some goes awry during their church meetings or deeper doctrine are unaccepted by the family.

Would this idea float, do you think?

Well, I guess we know what side of the "Do I follow Cannon" fence you come down on.

Oh sure, I could nit-pick ideas - personally I think that Vader was pretty much of the "I killed Anakin" mindset and anything from his old life (like his first droid) he probably wouldn't care about. However for what you are trying to do - engage a bunch of teenagers who love Star Wars - I think that's a great premise.

I don't know if you had it in the cards, but I would certainly have Vader himself personally hand out the mission to the group at the game's start. If you're going to buck the trend of "Keep the Main Heroes of the Movies at arms length", go big, man!

I'm inclined to consider Six Degrees of Kevin Bacon Darth Vader. ZING- both droids were with Jawas on Tatoonie. Anakin was from the same place. Anyone want to play a Jawa? Check. Ugnaughts were on Cloud City, as were both droids at the same time at one point. So was Vader. Anyone want to play an Ugnaught? Check. Half of the party is beginning to evolve! Throw in any kind of droid, and we could see similar parity. 3/4 of the party, and we surprisingly easily match the 'Mechanics 1+' guideline, even without necessarily BEING technicians (although many of those specializations would work quite well).

So...Jawa and Ugnaught are drawn from the Unofficial Species Menagerie. Droid is in the CRB. The last player will want a Chadra-Fan to justify the purchase and after the headaches that book momentarily (almost literally) absorbed.

A Gadgeteer makes sense to begin looking at careers, and has the license needed to pull/push storyline hooks.

A droid tech seems like a necessity, too, but that's okay.

From the Edge CRB, Spec Mods, and Far Horizons (and Stay on Target now, I guess, but don't want to have to juggle Duty vs Obligation), any suggestions? I'll likely present the players with pre-generated characters, and discuss how these were built after they get more experience points, and allow small rebuilds if wanted.

Yeah, I never expected to go all out for blood and gore, but the actual definition of 'violence' is what hangs in the balance. How much self-preservation is violence? How much use of others' resources constitutes violence? I'm waiting to hear back from the parents on these and similar questions.

On another note, I wish the parents, church, or someone would instill self-advocacy in the boy. He could easily have declined the cola, knowing it was against his parents' wishes or his new church.

In fact, I'm not even 100% sure the family has converted to a new religion, just that they are checking out a new one. All of this may go away if some goes awry during their church meetings or deeper doctrine are unaccepted by the family.

These are all great questions. RPGs can be a good environment to answer them in a safe, controlled environment. They can teach all kinds of lessons and skills, as well as being fun.

These kids will have to deal with these issues soon enough in school or real-life environments. It looks like you're addressing them in a sensible way.

On another note, I wish the parents, church, or someone would instill self-advocacy in the boy. He could easily have declined the cola, knowing it was against his parents' wishes or his new church.

More likely, he was rebelling.

Were I him, I would not have told you about my parents prohibition, and drank all the soda I wanted. Going to your house may be one of the few reliefs he can can get from his parents. But confronting his parents is a smarter idea.

On another note, I wish the parents, church, or someone would instill self-advocacy in the boy. He could easily have declined the cola, knowing it was against his parents' wishes or his new church.

More likely, he was rebelling.

I wouldn't doubt this.

In this case, I would be forthright. You would like to have the child to come over to participate (I assume), but you can't bend over backwards for every want and desire of somebody else -- the line must be drawn somewhere. Let them know that you're playing Star Wars , and if they don't want him attending, then that is their decision. If the kid is a close friend of the rest, you can maybe try to involve them in other activities and the like to make up for missing game night.

But root beer is better than cola anyway.

On another note, I wish the parents, church, or someone would instill self-advocacy in the boy. He could easily have declined the cola, knowing it was against his parents' wishes or his new church.

More likely, he was rebelling.

Were I him, I would not have told you about my parents prohibition, and drank all the soda I wanted. Going to your house may be one of the few reliefs he can can get from his parents. But confronting his parents is a smarter idea.

I thought something similar may be happening, which explains his lack of reference to what would be a pretty big lifestyle change for him. I typically ask our houseguests to consider this like a second home, and to raid the fridge or cabinets as they want. I only ask that they offer the last of whatever is left to anyone else who may not have had any yet, and to write down that item on our fridge-based magnet message board for the next grocery trip. It's not like I force-fed (pun!) him cola!

For the boys, I know our house is a refuge from daily stress. They come over frequently, even everyday (it seemed) during summer when not in school. I think some of the anger over books, dice throws, etc. was because they know each other so well, and do consider our house a secondary home away from home.

Not to mention, being that the Coke/caffeine thing is, indeed, a change, and the parents hadn't informed you, how, exactly, did they expect you to know of the change? Even without any other influencing factors, these are teenagers, for whom advising you of such a change is somewhere around item #52836 on their list of priorities.

There's a part of me, maybe a wrong part of me (you help decide), that wants to add some degree of minimal violence in the game. It's not like Mother Theresa said, "I don't want hunger and poverty, so I stay away from it." She confronted those ills head on. Her strength of character may be different than my players', but I wonder if I may be missing a motherly teaching moment:

We can't control what others do with their freedom of choice, but we can be responsible for our own actions in response to others' real or perceived behaviors. Isn't censorship a milder form of violence, too?

I'm talking about finding war reports on a slicing encounter (if we have a slicer), without even invoking real harm on players. What do you do about a threat of violence? Do you, as a party, try to stop it? If not, are you a guilty contributor to said expected violence? No blasters draw, no gore, but tons and tons of potential "violence."

Does this make me a bad mom or person?

There's a part of me, maybe a wrong part of me (you help decide), that wants to add some degree of minimal violence in the game. It's not like Mother Theresa said, "I don't want hunger and poverty, so I stay away from it." She confronted those ills head on. Her strength of character may be different than my players', but I wonder if I may be missing a motherly teaching moment:

We can't control what others do with their freedom of choice, but we can be responsible for our own actions in response to others' real or perceived behaviors. Isn't censorship a milder form of violence, too?

I'm talking about finding war reports on a slicing encounter (if we have a slicer), without even invoking real harm on players. What do you do about a threat of violence? Do you, as a party, try to stop it? If not, are you a guilty contributor to said expected violence? No blasters draw, no gore, but tons and tons of potential "violence."

Does this make me a bad mom or person?

Not at all.

That's not violence, that's conflict, and drama/storytelling depends upon conflict.

Does this make me a bad mom or person?

Absolutely not. You're a level headed newbie GM who seems to have a handle on the hobby.

You know, the more I think about it, the more I see these parents as a Jack Chick tract come to life:

(Or this is the reality and I've been playing in the wrong groups all these years. Why have I not gotten the REAL Dark Spells by now!)

WAY OFF TOPIC:

My son came home from school today with some sad news. The girl, whom we referenced briefly in this thread as a romantic interest by some of the other teenager boys who play in our game, had violence visited on her IN SCHOOL. She was choked from behind by another student (not any of our players) with his hands, and sexual orientation insults levied at her.

...but no violence in our rpg, right?

I'm going into fixer/compassion mom mode right now. Seeing this act at lunch has upset my son, and he needs me. Can you please help me with these things over the next day?

1) Is there a spiffy template I can download to cut and paste ugnaught species stuff from the USM, like was done with the Jawa pdf? My google-fu is lacking today, so a link or message with link is appreciated. Having a hand-held source to consult is far easier and doesn't need invoke OggDude's character generator any more than needed for these new players who already have a tons of directions into which they could go.

2) A droid, a jawa, an ugnaught and a chadra-fan are the go-to species. Add droid tech and gadgeteer. Can someone make some suggestions on other specializations to round out the party, please? Add general direction (like, bump the droid's AG to 4, or chandra-fan's INT to 5, etc etc)?

3) Send the girl and my son and me some mental well wishes. I mean, (expletive expletive expletive) here we are, chatting about minimizing violence in games, and this stuff happens in real life. To-freakin'-day! I don't know if the other players, who are also students, saw any of this hate choke happen. I'm going to be sick, and foresee wine in my late night future...

EDIT: Add some compassion for the choker. He's obviously not his best self, either. Sheesh...