There's decades of collective GMing experience on this board, and we'd really like to help.

Aww. Sorry to hear that.

But if you ever need help, we're more than happy to help you.

You know, RPGs and kids are funny things. Role-playing is one of these things like dating or having your first beer... kids mature at different ages and respond differently to others.

I've run games for 10-11 year olds who have instantly grasped the concept that they are supposed to play nice and work together. And for grown adults who still couldn't grasp that concept.

Please don't let it sour you, to the hobby or the game. Maybe give it another try down the line, see if they might be more receptive to it then.

RPGs can be great aids to teaching life lessons sometimes, or working things out in a safe, pretend environment.

Hugs,

Marcy

Adding to Brad's edit, feel free to PM me, as well.

So, our players have been talking out of game about their characters and possibilities. I encourage and expect this planning, especially given their history as friends. Together, they decided that they will play themselves as alien species in Star Wars, and legitimize that idea by having at least one starting yellow die in Mechanics to tie their party together. This approach seems logical, at least, and makes my job easier than merely suggesting "you meet in a tavern..." We agree to use the pay for Technician jobs found in Special Modifications, plus whatever the next adventure will bring.

We already acknowledged how we will add Jawas from the Unofficial Species files, and I printed the jazzy pdf I found on this forum. We have the Edge of the Empire Core Rules and two other Edge career books (Technician, Colonist). I have my dice app and we have one set of narrative dice. Since we disallowed electronic devices at the table aside from my cell phone to take parental calls/emergencies, having the dice app on it helps. Pencils? Check. Paper? Check. (Homemade) Pizza (In the oven)? Check. So far, so good, right?

We have a starting time, an ending time, and a series of really staged encounters to test dice pools and build understanding. These players are teens who play video game rpgs more than the traditional variety, but my son has access to a lot of our game books so is no stranger to rpgs (or even LARPs). Everyone began snacking and talking while the pizza cooled. The players began rolling the dice just to guess how they might work.

None of these things were a problem. In fact, I think the players handled themselves very well for the opening of a new weekly game. I printed out the house rules, and read them, too. At this point, I'm feeling like a proud mamma and good GM and hostess.

Wait...they will be more to share. I just wanted to highlight some of the very good things that started us on a good path.

So far, so good it sounds like. But man, I do hate cliffhangers! (:

I'll preface this post with a voting request:

1. Do you allow careers and species from books you (collectively) don't own, but are in fact official FFG species?

2. Do you allow unofficial species, most likely drawn from the Unofficial Species Menagerie?

A player revealed a new copy of Stay on Target. He immediately professed to wanting a Chadra-Fan, who would get at least one yellow die in Mechanics per the party agreement. He also made sure everyone knew Chadra-Fan are genetically smarter than their chosen species. The book was passed around, and care taken to avoid pizza cheese or grease stains. However, one page ripped (less than a quart of an inch, but damage was done) as a player tried to turn a page while another reached and pulled the book to them. This was an accident, but set the stage for future drama. I was happy to see that the other parents are willing to chip-in on gaming resources! The player wasn't too distraught over the small tear that he immediately fixed with clear tape from his backpack.

Not to be outdone, enter the Verpine player. He drew from OggDude's Character Generator, and impolitely suggested how we're chumps for buying books. He also shared his notes how Ugnaughts are also mechanically-inclined but we didn't know it. The air filled with doubts over what possible species could be played.

Closing Session 0, the kid who accidentally ripped offered to buy a new book for the other player. Since it was a small tear, they agreed to wait and a new book will be bought with lessons learned about grabbing books. I thought this was handled very well, but still felt nauseated about any ripped pages in a book.

So, what to do about different species from different sources? Can you weigh-in on what reasonable options exist if we allow Edge of the Empire careers, and any species, who would (easily) start play with at least one yellow die in Mechanics?

As far as I can tell, this includes all Technicians and the Gadgeteer specialization regarding career choices but am I missing any? What species would also work? Is it official (source?) or unofficial? Yeah, Humans could work with anything, but the players don't want to be too human if they are rpg'ing even as themselves.

My son is writing about his experiences for a high school vo-tech assignment. He takes a lot of notes, and some interesting insights. For example, he hopes the game will be an easier example of multicultural togetherness than we see on our mainstream media channels. If an alien can work well with another alien, why can we all just get along? I'm excited to see his final draft.

With the species question up in the air, he offered other players their choice of a jawa he pre-made for each of the technician careers and gadgeteer. He really put a lot of thought into these characters, as shown by his inclusion of Survival as a skill for some crafting checks (p 76 Special Modifications) that built on his higher Cunning. One player made a Chadra-Fan and everyone watched how he made his selections and offered this thoughts. This was a fun experience!

With some character examples, we ran some very staged encounters. I'm talking: "The assassin droid you were tracking is at the spaceport with its back to you. What do you do?" No real backstory, no real consequences, just dice rolling and interpretations. We had a sales check (Negotiation) for spare parts, an Utinni! check (of course!), and two combat scenarios (close and ranged). We didn't do anything with piloting or astrogation yet.

A player accidentally dropped dice off the table. Kids laughed and started the show. Every time, dice fell off the table for this kid. One player commented how fallen dice shouldn't count, and it was wasting too much time. What- 10 seconds? Still, I decided to put a new house rule to a vote. Should heroic dice that fall onto the floor NOT count? (Am I at an unfair advantage because of the app?)

The kids voted Yes, dice won't count. After some serious arguing, we amended this house rule to all re-rolls of fallen dice if someone bumped the table or knocked them off intentionally. How do you handle fallen dice? This ate up 30 minutes of discussion and dice were actually THROWN at a player in anger. I guess he got some revenge over his book being ripped!

The dust settled, and play resumed.

Both of those initial questions really boil down to GM preference. I would, however, say that it behooves the group to have access to at least one copy of the material. I'm personally fine with unofficial species as long as they're in the USM or vetted by me/GM.

Given the circumstances of your group, I'd keep a tight rein on any trash talk. ("Yes, Oggy's character generator is a great tool. But, no, we're not chumps for buying the books. The software does not include the information on the talents and such.") That would include a reminder that, while there may be some fictional friction between the characters, their characters are intended to work cooperatively as a group.

So far, not the crisis I was imagining, just maybe a need to occasionally nudge them back onto the gaming path.

To answer one point... I've been gaming for 30+ years. The rule at every table I've ever gamed at is that dice that fall on the floor don't count. That's for a variety of reasons; dice often won't be flat and will be "cocked" so it's hard to tell what the result was, going in a dark spot is also hard to read, it's hard to say if the die was bumped by accident or on purpose when looking for it, and so on. It's easier just to reroll. If you roll on the table and it ends up in a spot where it's cocked (like leaning against something) that also leads to a reroll rather than people guessing which side is up.

If a player habitually drops a die, whether on purpose or by accident, we usually grab a box (like a shoebox or some kind of lid) for them to roll in. It's rare but it happens. Miraculously after a session of that the player usually has no problem with drops the following session.

The next day, I got a phonecall and visit by two different parent sets.

"Why did you rip my son's new book?"

"Why did so-and-so throw stuff at my son?"

"Why did you let my son drink caffeine (specifically, Coca-Cola)?"

Whoah...okay. I explained away the book rip as an accident, and how an offer was made to replace it but was held for a later buy. I explained how the dice throw was a one-time emotional blow-up, and that nobody was hurt and apologies given. I reminded both parents how their kids know each other for a good near-decade, and that some general horse-play is to be expected by teens with these connections and history. These explanations seemed to suffice.

Coca-Cola? Since when was this a problem, having witnessed the boy swish gallons of Code Red while playing video games at our house (HE brought his own caffeinated beverage). They explained how they were considering joining a new church, and that caffeine was not allowed. To each their own, and I can only respect what I know about a situation. In the future, we can drink caffeine-free root beer or ginger ale or water. I wished them well on their spiritual journey, and added how I can only help if I know what to expect or other family rules. They added how swearing and a list of very expected other social vices won't be tolerated in the game. "...and no violence." I thought they meant the dice-throwing incident, but they further clarified how we shouldn't be teaching kids to kill. I tried to differentiate between violence and killing, to no avail.

So, umm...now what? NO VIOLENCE? Ever done it? With technicians, it might work, especially as they all kind of stink at combat as a group. The multi-goo gun works as a 'weapon' and may side-step the request. How would you respond to such a request? I got as far as generic Stormtroopers can fire a blaster weapon at the characters, but maybe they could have a way to run away instead of fight. Is there a (non-violent) trap-setting mechanics specialization? Maybethe Force would work well, but that's a new direction, too. Please help with this request!

My son is writing about his experiences for a high school vo-tech assignment. He takes a lot of notes, and some interesting insights. For example, he hopes the game will be an easier example of multicultural togetherness than we see on our mainstream media channels. If an alien can work well with another alien, why can we all just get along? I'm excited to see his final draft.

With the species question up in the air, he offered other players their choice of a jawa he pre-made for each of the technician careers and gadgeteer. He really put a lot of thought into these characters, as shown by his inclusion of Survival as a skill for some crafting checks (p 76 Special Modifications) that built on his higher Cunning. One player made a Chadra-Fan and everyone watched how he made his selections and offered this thoughts. This was a fun experience!

With some character examples, we ran some very staged encounters. I'm talking: "The assassin droid you were tracking is at the spaceport with its back to you. What do you do?" No real backstory, no real consequences, just dice rolling and interpretations. We had a sales check (Negotiation) for spare parts, an Utinni! check (of course!), and two combat scenarios (close and ranged). We didn't do anything with piloting or astrogation yet.

A player accidentally dropped dice off the table. Kids laughed and started the show. Every time, dice fell off the table for this kid. One player commented how fallen dice shouldn't count, and it was wasting too much time. What- 10 seconds? Still, I decided to put a new house rule to a vote. Should heroic dice that fall onto the floor NOT count? (Am I at an unfair advantage because of the app?)

The kids voted Yes, dice won't count. After some serious arguing, we amended this house rule to all re-rolls of fallen dice if someone bumped the table or knocked them off intentionally. How do you handle fallen dice? This ate up 30 minutes of discussion and dice were actually THROWN at a player in anger. I guess he got some revenge over his book being ripped!

The dust settled, and play resumed.

Aha! Dice.

Dice rolls can frustrate even grown players. I've been in groups where even seasoned players get frustrated at the simplest of dice situations. (BTW...I'm in the "dropped dice get rerolled" camp, too.) But, I'd make it clear that throwing anything at another player is unacceptable and can result in revocation of one's invitation to the group.

I'll preface this post with a voting request:

1. Do you allow careers and species from books you (collectively) don't own, but are in fact official FFG species?

2. Do you allow unofficial species, most likely drawn from the Unofficial Species Menagerie?

1) I own all the books, but hypothetically, if I didnt, I still would have no issue with someone bringing in a species (or career) from another book. I think it's a good idea to have that book on hand, in case we had to look something up, but me not having it doesn't necessarily ban it from the table.

2) I wouldn't have any issue with this. The Unofficial Menagerie is pretty well balanced and playtested, so I don't see them as too crazy. I'd allow it.

**edit**

Okay, after thinking of my answer and your situation, I think I might - in this one instance - disallow Menagerie and aliens not from books at the table - at least untll you get your legs under you. Mature adults might be able to handle the chaos of bringing in all kinds of sources and police themselves for getting too off the rails. A bunch of people learning the system? Yeah, that's probably a bad idea.

Not to be outdone, enter the Verpine player. He drew from OggDude's Character Generator, and impolitely suggested how we're chumps for buying books. He also shared his notes how Ugnaughts are also mechanically-inclined but we didn't know it. The air filled with doubts over what possible species could be played.

As a 30 year gamer, let me assure you that it is not a actual proper gaming book until it has been baptized with Mountain Dew.

So, umm...now what? NO VIOLENCE? Ever done it? With technicians, it might work, especially as they all kind of stink at combat as a group. The multi-goo gun works as a 'weapon' and may side-step the request. How would you respond to such a request? I got as far as generic Stormtroopers can fire a blaster weapon at the characters, but maybe they could have a way to run away instead of fight. Is there a (non-violent) trap-setting mechanics specialization? Maybethe Force would work well, but that's a new direction, too. Please help with this request!

The next day, I got a phonecall and visit by two different parent sets.

"Why did you rip my son's new book?"

"Why did so-and-so throw stuff at my son?"

"Why did you let my son drink caffeine (specifically, Coca-Cola)?"

Whoah...okay. I explained away the book rip as an accident, and how an offer was made to replace it but was held for a later buy. I explained how the dice throw was a one-time emotional blow-up, and that nobody was hurt and apologies given. I reminded both parents how their kids know each other for a good near-decade, and that some general horse-play is to be expected by teens with these connections and history. These explanations seemed to suffice.

Coca-Cola? Since when was this a problem, having witnessed the boy swish gallons of Code Red while playing video games at our house (HE brought his own caffeinated beverage). They explained how they were considering joining a new church, and that caffeine was not allowed. To each their own, and I can only respect what I know about a situation. In the future, we can drink caffeine-free root beer or ginger ale or water. I wished them well on their spiritual journey, and added how I can only help if I know what to expect or other family rules. They added how swearing and a list of very expected other social vices won't be tolerated in the game. "...and no violence." I thought they meant the dice-throwing incident, but they further clarified how we shouldn't be teaching kids to kill. I tried to differentiate between violence and killing, to no avail.

So, umm...now what? NO VIOLENCE? Ever done it? With technicians, it might work, especially as they all kind of stink at combat as a group. The multi-goo gun works as a 'weapon' and may side-step the request. How would you respond to such a request? I got as far as generic Stormtroopers can fire a blaster weapon at the characters, but maybe they could have a way to run away instead of fight. Is there a (non-violent) trap-setting mechanics specialization? Maybethe Force would work well, but that's a new direction, too. Please help with this request!

No violence.

In a game called Star WARS.

Is this request solely for their child's character, or do they expect it to cover the campaign as a whole?

Even the whimsical Freemaker Adventures mentioned earlier contained combat and cartoony violence. And, being frank, I was part of a group that included a player who created a pacifist character, who had trouble finding ways to integrate the character into the group's action. After 2 sessions, he quit. After 3, half of the remaining group quit, with the campaign being scrapped and a new one started.

Knowing players will read this forum at some point, I have judiciously cut some personal conflicts and chose to focus on game play issues only. As a parent, more obviously in communication with other gaming parents, I think I can handle jokes in poor taste and emotional outbursts like swearing (in and out of game), among other things. Was there more to these events than I've shared? Yes, but I don't want to embarrass any kids more than what I have illustrated as game play decisions.

To all of this, add three guys wanting a date with a young lady whose affections are already spoken-for. That was a powder keg behind all of these incidents, aside from the new church angle, I think.

I allow all books (I own them all, but if I didn't I wouldn't have a problem with allowing them. FFG is good about species balance).

I also recommend getting a dice tray and requesting your players roll in to that. It prevents frustration when rolled dice get mixed up in the loose pile of unrolled dice or accidentally falling off the table.

The no violence angle. It can be done, but some players enjoy combat and it could bore some of the other party members. I'll defer to some of the old school players on that one.

I also recommend getting a dice tray and requesting your players roll in to that. It prevents frustration when rolled dice get mixed up in the loose pile of unrolled dice or accidentally falling off the table.

Yeah, a dice tower like this might be the solution to a great many rolling issues.

Everything for the Jawa got printed, so we can access it. I can copy-paste stuff from OggDude's character generator for ugnaughts or other species so we can reference them if needed. I won't have a spiffy template for the look, but if there is a formatting link...?

I also recommend getting a dice tray and requesting your players roll in to that. It prevents frustration when rolled dice get mixed up in the loose pile of unrolled dice or accidentally falling off the table.

Yeah, a dice tower like this might be the solution to a great many rolling issues.

Since these players go to a vocational technical school, I'd bet they could build something like this for our group! Thanks!

I'll preface this post with a voting request:

1. Do you allow careers and species from books you (collectively) don't own, but are in fact official FFG species?

2. Do you allow unofficial species, most likely drawn from the Unofficial Species Menagerie?

1. I own at least one copy of every book that FFG has published for this game, except the original EotE Beta. I do have copies of the Beta books for the other two games.

So, this question isn’t that relevant for me. However, the rule that I’ve seen suggested by others is that if a player wants a race that isn’t in the main books the group already has, then they need to bring a copy of said book to the game.

2. Allowing stuff out of USM is very case-by-case for me. Generally, I’m inclined to consider doing so, but a great deal depends on the overall situation and how well the character concept fits into the group. I’ve actually run a couple of species from USM as PCs of my own in games that I played, and I think they worked well. But your mileage most definitely is likely to vary.

A player accidentally dropped dice off the table. Kids laughed and started the show. Every time, dice fell off the table for this kid. One player commented how fallen dice shouldn't count, and it was wasting too much time. What- 10 seconds? Still, I decided to put a new house rule to a vote. Should heroic dice that fall onto the floor NOT count? (Am I at an unfair advantage because of the app?)

In every game I’ve been in, there has always been at least one guy that is always dropping dice off the table. This is true for every game I’ve ever played in the past 35 years — not just Star Wars.

Our rule has always been that dice that roll off the table get re-rolled, and some GMs have insisted that the entire set of dice have to be re-rolled as opposed to just the one(s) that fell off the table.

Same for dice that happen to land against some other object on the table and are “cocked”.

Having a dice tray was huge in helping us avoid rolling off the table. I highly recommend it. Otherwise, always reroll what falls off.

I would only allow rules from books we have and from what online resources we can agree on. I would not recommend drawing only from OggDude's generator. It's a great tool, but it shouldn't replace having the book.

Would stun setting help offset the violence worry? What if you made droids the only enemies? I love going sessions without violence, but having none whatsoever? Could be tough.

Yeah, OggDude’s generator is specifically designed so that it can’t really replace the books.

There’s plenty of stuff that is left out of the program to avoid high likelihood of copyright issues. If you have the books, then the material provided by OggDude’s generator is fine and gives you just enough information to know where you can go look in the books for more details. But without the books, it is much less useful.

Moreover, OggDude’s generator is also designed to let you do whatever you want to do, without necessarily actually following the rules. It doesn’t stop you from spending thousands and thousands of XP that you don’t have. It doesn’t stop you from spending thousands and thousands of credits you don’t have. In some areas, certain things may not be visible to you until you’ve satisfied the appropriate pre-requisites, but even that’s not a given.

IMO, OggDude’s generator is fine for a GM to use.

It can also be fine for an experienced player to use — but only if the player is careful to follow all the appropriate rules provided by their GM and gets guidance or approval for everything they do with the generator.

I wouldn’t let an inexperienced player use it, at least not without the guidance from a GM who is very familiar with the tool and can help keep honest players honest.

but they further clarified how we shouldn't be teaching kids to kill.

You could also try the approach that while violence does happen, the very core of the saga - Vader's fall and redemption - was resolved by Luke refusing to resort to violence, by choosing to do the right thing.

(Although you might want to avoid mentioning that mere seconds after renouncing his evil ways, Anakin then assassinates the head of state by throwing him into a reactor)

Okay, my 2$....

It sounds like you have the preparation and the GMing really well covered. You couldn't have done more.

Things like whether to use non-official sources, or how to read dropped dice, are a matter for each table. You have to make your own rulings on these, and it appears that you're doing just fine there.

The only thing I might point out here is that if you have a group of all-techs, the players might tread on each other's toes and it seems they are already trying to outdo each other. The benefit of having different classes is that each excels at their own thing, and it lets everyone get their turn in the spotlight - one does the diplomacy and talking, one is good at tech, one is great at fighting or piloting, etc. It stops the characters being too competitive and encourages the need to work together - in games and in real life, everyone contributes something different.

The non-human species angle is a good one for kids, and as you mention, can encourage working together and teaching good life-lessons they can carry over into real-life.

Things like books getting damaged? That happens unfortunately. But it would be good to set some rules for this, about taking care and looking after other people's property. I'm not necessarily suggesting 'you break it, you pay for it', but considering these days most kids have expensive smartphones and gadgets, it's not a bad lesson to teach that you should be careful with other people's belongings.

Finally, a moment of temper aside (and that happens to adults too!) it reads to me like most of your problems are caused by inter-parental politics. And I'm honestly not qualified to enter that minefield. But I used to be a teacher, and I learned this - every child is different - even at the same ages, they have different maturity, different home experiences, different mental attributes and different expectations. Add to that the pressure of other parents and you really do have a potentially fraught situation.

The subject of 'violence' is a tricky one, and there's no easy answers. But I saw Star Wars in 1977 as a seven year old girl, and I understood that fighting and death were things that happened. The movies don't dwell on these, but you can't just ignore that the fate of Alderaan was a Very Bad Thing. Luke returns home to find his house and elders aflame. Ben dies, sacrificing himself in battle so the others can escape. Luke's childhood friend Biggs is killed by Vader. The themes of sacrifice and risk are present right from the start. In all honesty, if the kids involved aren't old enough to see the original movies, I would advise against role-playing Star Wars. Luke in the cave at Dagobah, Jabba's death at Leia's hands, Han being frozen in carbonite, Vader's redemption and death... I think all that stuff is too near the core of the films to ignore. This is a great lesson for kids who are ready for it - that 'doing the right thing' is tough and has consequences - but if the kids aren't ready for it (and you have to gauge that) I would recognise it and maybe play something a bit less intense?

I don't know how old they are or how mature, you're the best judge of that, but again - if they can't watch the movies, they really shouldn't be playing the game. You might be able to do a 'Caravan of Courage' type adventure where nobody dies, but I would imagine that most kids who are into Star Wars will want a bit of pulp action, and that involves fighting.

With the other parents, I'd suggest having a talking session where you all sit down, have a coffee and discuss your expectations, and how exposed the kids should be to these elements. We're not talking about letting them watch Tarantino or Game of Thrones, but the Star Wars films are intended to have an emotional punch, and were written for young adults rather than young children. The game is also pitched at that level, and some of the adventures contain elements that are intended to be frightening or upsetting. Star Wars doesn't wallow in nastiness like many modern genres, but neither is it sanitised. And that's why we love it. Ideally, discuss all this with the other parents. Kids have to grow up sometime - the world and other media is full of upsetting things like war and danger. To some degree, learning about these things in small doses in a contained environment can actually help prepare them for the real world.

Also, I'll add that I played with Star Wars toys and had no problem shooting stormtroopers, and I'm a sensitive sort who is easily upset by violence. I understood at ten that I had to kill some of the monsters in D&D if I wanted to protect others, that I couldn't always get my own way, and that sometimes, sacrifices had to be made.

I think you seem a very cool and balanced person - you're actually in a really good position to set something up and create the kind of game that everyone will enjoy.

Marcy

Thanks for your collective encouragement and suggestions! I really think Marcy nailed the point about inter-parental conflicts. I went to the fruit market with a mug of cinnamon apple cider and thought about the 'no violence' clause.

Despite what I knew about those folks, their interest in a new church (or revisiting an older church, whatever past affiliations might have been) changes some variables. In their religious texts, are there no examples of violence? Do members of their church not serve in military due to their beliefs? In addition to caffeine, are there other explicit prohibitions? I'll do some investigation on general church edicts, and call the parents later tonight with an outline for their consideration. Frankly, and waaay off topic, I don't care who or what anyone chooses as their spiritual journey as long as they don't hurt me, themselves, or anyone else as a result. End religion discussion by saying that I respect their choice to be free as much as they respect my choices, too. I really don't think it'll be a problem, but the newness of their sudden zeal is the curve ball for which I'm unprepared.