Based on the Omega Leader-HLC precedent: A ship that attacks with HLC must change its crits into hits. Locked by and attacking Omega Leader it is prevented from doing so and has to keep the crits.

Now M9-G8 says "You may chose one attack die, the ship must reroll it", which is the same wording as HLC and refers to the attacking ship. This is mostly important for Snapshot shenanigans that won't work with M9-G8. I've seen a few people talk about this, but I don't believe, based on whats already in the game, that its possible.

I'd be happy to be corrected, but I am afraid the case is quite clear.

If Omega Leader has the attacking/defending ship locked, the opposing ship cannot modify any Dice, nor make OL modify his Dice with a few exceptions (like Crack shot). So yeah, agree that M9G8 won't work on him.

Although, the way Palpatine was ruled might suggest otherwise...

It's really pretty simple.

"You" refers to the ship the effect is targeting (who omega leader has locked, the ship snap shot is on). Modification that comes from a different source (M9-G8, Palp) should work.

This, incidentally, is why Omega Leader works against Zuckuss crew. If it was Omega Leader modifying his dice (because Zuckuss told him to reroll them), then Zuckuss would work. However, the ruling is that choosing another ships dice to reroll count as modification on the part of the ship that had Zuckuss crew attached. The same reasoning shows that M9-G8 should work on snap shot.

Edit: ok, maybe here's a better way to think about it. Rerolling dice is not dice modification, CHOOSING dice to reroll is dice modification. If a ship is the one choosing the dice to reroll, THAT ship is doing the modification.

Eh...rerolling dice IS a dice mod (explicitly).

Selecting dice to reroll is a part of that modification

At least given the precedent set by zuckuss/r7 etc

R7/Zuckuss/etc. count as dice modification on the part of the ship they are on, despite the player not physically rerolling dice. The common denominator for what counts as dice modification in the case of rerolls is choosing which dice to reroll (I'm spending a target lock and rerolling these dice, you must reroll those dice, etc.).

Edit: right. I think it's the essential part though. People are getting confused because sometimes the ship physically rerolling is not the ship that is modifying the dice. It's easier to think about choosing as the modification. Unless there's something that breaks that logic, then I stand corrected.

Does Palpatine work against OL?

Yep! Per the FAQ. Unless Omega Leader has the ship with Palpatine locked.

Yep! Per the FAQ. Unless Omega Leader has the ship with Palpatine locked.

Well then, it sounds like the same rule should apply here.

It's really pretty simple.

"You" refers to the ship the effect is targeting (who omega leader has locked, the ship snap shot is on). Modification that comes from a different source (M9-G8, Palp) should work.

M9-G8 doesn't do the modification himself though (where Palp does).

M9 forces the targeted ship to re-roll.

So to me, M9 does not circumvent Omega Leader.

So as I read it, Palpatine modifies a dice - fine, he's doing the modifying and is not the one who's locked by OL.

M9 however, is not the one doing the modifying. M9 is doing the choosing - The attacker is the one doing the modifying. Thus if the attacker is locked by OL, he can't modify.

That's how I read it.

Yeah that's kind of how I read it. It's still the ship locked by OL modifying their Dice, M9G8 isn't doing the modifying, like Palp is from another ship.

If that's the case, Zuckuss (crew) and R7 should work against Omega Leader

Well the reasoning for why R7 Astro doesn't work based on the faq is because the upgrade originates from the defender, not because of who is rolling the dice. Based on that I think it's reasonable to say if the ship m9g8 is targeting is not OL or OL is not attacking m9g8 then the modification should be okay, similar to how palpatine works.

As far as snapshot is concerned I would not know if this works though

If that's the case, Zuckuss (crew) and R7 should work against Omega Leader

If that's the case, Zuckuss (crew) and R7 should work against Omega Leader

Why would Zuckuss work if the ship he was on is target locked by OL?

According to the same logic that says M9-G8 isn't doing the modifying, the ship rerolling the dice is. If that's the case, Omega Leader is modifying his dice, not the ship with Zuckuss. Omega leader doesn't stop himself from modifying dice, so if that logic holds Zuckuss should work against him.

Zuckuss does not work against Omega Leader. Therefore, M9-G8 should work if on a ship not locked by omega leader.

Hmm, that's a fair point I suppose!

The crux of this argument is who is doing the modifying. The argument for it working is that the ship modifying the dice is the one M9-G8 is aboard. If this is the case, the M9-G8 would work against Omega Leader unless G8's ship and Omega Leader had each other target locked, and OL was attacking G8's ship.

Edit: To make this clearer, let's use names. Jess Pava and Poe are facing off against Omega Leader. Jess has M9-G8, and has target locked Omega Leader while Omega Leader has target locked Poe. The question here is whether or not M9-G8 can force OL to recollection an attack die when he is attacking Poe. If Jess is doing the modifying, she can, because OL's ability is irrelevant to her right now. If Poe is the one doing the modifying, he can't, because of OL's ability.

Yep! Per the FAQ. Unless Omega Leader has the ship with Palpatine locked.

AND is attacking or being attacked by it.

For completeness' sake.

Its simple

If M9-G8 has omega leader target locked, and Omega Leader doesnt have M9-G8 Target locked and attacking a different ship M9-G8 is worded in such a way that he falls under the precedent created by palpatine. If Omega leader has M9-G8 target locked and M9-G8 has omega leader target locked and Omega Leader is attacking M9-G8 then M9-G8 doesnt work.

The crux of this argument is who is doing the modifying. The argument for it working is that the ship modifying the dice is the one M9-G8 is aboard. If this is the case, the M9-G8 would work against Omega Leader unless G8's ship and Omega Leader had each other target locked, and OL was attacking G8's ship.

Edit: To make this clearer, let's use names. Jess Pava and Poe are facing off against Omega Leader. Jess has M9-G8, and has target locked Poe, while Omega Leader has also target locked Poe. The question here is whether or not M9-G8 can force OL to recollection an attack die when he is attacking Poe. If Jess is doing the modifying, she can, because OL's ability is irrelevant to her right now. If Poe is the one doing the modifying, he can't, because of OL's ability.

If Jess has locked Poe, it would be Poe that could be rerolling a die, not Omega.

There is a notable difference in the wording on Palpatine and M9-G8 that makes the two cards work differently.

M9-G8: "... you may choose 1 attack die. The attacker must reroll that die."

Palpatine: "Once per round, you may change a friendly ship's die result..."

If M9-G8 is being used to force a reroll on another friendly ship that is locked by and attacking Omega Leader, M9-G8 is specifically trying to make the attacker reroll the die and Omega Leader still prohibits it. Palpatine can do it from another ship because he's the one doing the modification, but not M9-G8 because he's not the one modifying.

Also I don't think you can use M9-G8 to modify a Snap Shot attack because Snap Shot features the word "cannot" and that makes it absolute.

Again: the ship with Zuckuss and R7 is the one modifying the dice. Who physically rerolls the dice is irrelevant. Same with M9-G8. Palp is used as a comparison because it's an example of modifying an ally's dice.

Cannot is absolute, but is qualified by "you" meaning the ship with snap shot. Would you say that an opponent could not modify your dice when using snap shot?

Exactly the logic I entertained Rick, but apparently another OL-related ruling has put that seemingly obvious logic into doubt... there's another thread similar to this (focused more on Snap Shot implications) which quotes which ruling (I can't remember it off the top of my head).

Edit: ok, maybe here's a better way to think about it. Rerolling dice is not dice modification, CHOOSING dice to reroll is dice modification. If a ship is the one choosing the dice to reroll, THAT ship is doing the modification.

What I believe you are saying is that the step of physically picking up the dice and casting them onto the table (careful not to use "reroll") is already past the step where you're deciding 'who' is doing the mod.

By selecting a die/dice to mod, the source of the rule has already established itself as the 'you' enacting it by commencing the mod process - thus who physically completes the mechanical task becomes kind of irrelevant (until the task is done).

While I now see a lawyer-istic way to justify the ruling, I still don't think it's best choice for clarity in the long run.

Haha yes, that is what I meant. Thank you for putting it better than I could.