I know r2 d2 is better for her but i had fun with her using bb8, dial in green manoeuvre, barrel roll from bb8 PTL for TL, green manoeuvre removes stress, take focus action.

Repeat as required

Works best against lower ps pilots but can get her into some good positions to use that rear arc

And it STILL SUCKS!

Not really, but I wanted to have the last word.

it is true though, for the relative meaning of "suck"

bb-8 is stupid good fun, but r2-d2 is simply essential to winning dice trades. No amount of barrel rolling shenanigans is going to win you late games against large base ships or defenders

Running her with Esege and Biggs today, Im looking forward to seeing how it goes, Esege has recon specialist so Norra can get a focus easy from him if I keep a good formation. And Esege has the new seismic torpedo with extra munitions so some fun to be had there

A lot of people say R2D2 on Norra would be awesome.... but does it really help in the 4 attack dice meta? I mean, just think of TorpScouts or other evil enemies.

Is R2D2 on Norra even powerful enough to stay alive?

A lot of people say R2D2 on Norra would be awesome.... but does it really help in the 4 attack dice meta? I mean, just think of TorpScouts or other evil enemies.

Is R2D2 on Norra even powerful enough to stay alive?

do you just never run into empire then?

and yes it helps, as long as you're not facing torp scouts specifically (which is the extent of the so called "4 attack dice meta"). Brobots can't really hash it v the ps advantage and the lack of **** given about ig-88bs ability (1 agi)

in addition, if r2d2 won't save you literally no other astromech will

so we're back to defaulting to r2d2

A lot of people say R2D2 on Norra would be awesome.... but does it really help in the 4 attack dice meta? I mean, just think of TorpScouts or other evil enemies.

Is R2D2 on Norra even powerful enough to stay alive?

Biggs is going to be there and that allows a turn or two at least to give you time to soften up and take out some of your opponent ships.

Plus, with Nora and biggs you still have enough pts for another decent ship. Not everything is a 4 dice meta. Besides biggs will take the blunt of it anyway, leaving you still a good chance to take a ship off the board, and if your lucky enough biggs may live an extra turn.

In the build I posted on the previous page, you have 2 ships that will open with two four dice attacks (I am counting Nora ability there since it has good potential) plus biggs. If your against uboats, your a higher PS than generics and could very well take one off the board before it shoots. If your against dengar, again biggs messes up his targeting priority. He'll have to shoot at biggs, then with his return fire, you just don't let him take his second shot at Biggs. Biggs doesn't shoot, but he's still alive.

After biggs is dead, you still have two decent tanky ships that can do some good dmg. At this point you hopefully did enough dmg and regen a shield along with Nora ability to be able to be used on defense means she can become quite difficult to kill. Especially if it comes down to 1 on 1

Not every list has 4 dice attacks. Don't scoff at shield regeneration. Underestimate it and you'll lose for sure

Edit

Anyways I can't help if you think it's a terrible ability. You really dont see the potential. Seems no matter what is said your mind is set.

An ability that has great potential to do 4 hits, 5 at range 1 is an very good ability.

Plus it also has very good consistent dmg output.

R2d2 just helps keep it on the board that much longer.

I don't know what else you could ask for without making a ship over powered.

What is a good ability?

A good ability should be helpful at all times. It should be there, even if you could not get an action or something went terribly wrong.

Some perfect examples: Wedge Antilles always reduces the agility of his target, Horton Salm may always reroll blanks on range 2-3.

It's also great, if an ability changes a bad game effect into something unseful

Examples: Soontir Fel always gets a free focus when he receives a stress token, Keyan Farlander can even use stress as a kind of focus so whenever he fires he can get rid of a stress token

These are good abilites! Of course there are many more, but I wanted to give you just a few examples.

So what's wrong with the ability of Norra Wexley?

The problem is, that you actually need 2 actions to make her ability work in the first place.

Yes, I know she CAN be very strong, if everything works well. She MIGHT have a 4 dice attack then (or get an additional focus evade).

But what about stress? What if you can not use Push the Limit? What if you need another action like roll, boost or whatever?

Please keep in mind that a lot of competetive builds seem to have a "should always work" factor in them.

And that's exactly the reason why I think that Norra has got a terrible ability.

Even if everything works perfectly.. you still have to "trade" your Target Lock, which might be important and useful for dice modification against an additional die, which shows a focus result.

Why only a focus? Why didn't they give her a fourth die, which would have been awesome? It would not be super strong anyways, because there are many ships out there, which fire with 4 dice all the time (Phantoms, Ghosts, Torpedo Uboats)

She would have been rather strong & useful then. And we would be able to use her Elite Skill Slot for something else than Push the Limit then.

Honestly... a lot of people seem to love her right now, because it's a new ship with great looks and an interesting combination of slots (crew & astromech together).

But after a while I think Norra will be used a lot less than the Stressmule or some other ARC builds.

A lot of people say R2D2 on Norra would be awesome.... but does it really help in the 4 attack dice meta? I mean, just think of TorpScouts or other evil enemies.

Is R2D2 on Norra even powerful enough to stay alive?

Do you even Biggs bro?

Norra + Biggs = Snap?

Not sure OP appreciates the power of added results.

To use her ability Norra needs both a focus token and a target lock, so her ability is competing with using both of those tokens to modify.

At first glance Norra's ability might seem weak. The chance of a focused die returning a hit is 0.75 : 0.25 or 3 to 1. Focus + Target Lock is a colossal 15 to 1, and this is for a single die.

Thing is, Norra adds a result. The chance of three hits becomes the chance of four hits, the chance of two hits becomes the chance for three and the chance of missing becomes the chance of one hit. Blanking out becomes impossible.

Effectively instead of rolling three dice with Focus + Target Lock you're rolling four dice with Focus which is almost always more powerful.

If that didn't make sense, here's one of my charts.

Here we're comparing the chance of each outcome on the attack dice between Focus + Norra's ability and normal Focus + Target Lock.

• At Range 1, using Norra instead of normal modification exchanges slightly worse (we're talking a few percent) chances for a 30% chance of five hits which is impossible for four dice with F+TL.
• At Range 2 and Range 3 Norra's ability outperforms using the tokens normally almost ¹ universally: on top of that she has a 42% chance of 4 hits which is impossible for three dice with F+TL.

¹ The chance of 1 hit or missing is 1.12% for F+TL and 1.56% for F+Norra. We're talking less than half a percent here.

What is a good ability?

A good ability should be helpful at all times. It should be there, even if you could not get an action or something went terribly wrong.

Some perfect examples: Wedge Antilles always reduces the agility of his target, Horton Salm may always reroll blanks on range 2-3.

It's also great, if an ability changes a bad game effect into something unseful

Examples: Soontir Fel always gets a free focus when he receives a stress token, Keyan Farlander can even use stress as a kind of focus so whenever he fires he can get rid of a stress token

These are good abilites! Of course there are many more, but I wanted to give you just a few examples.

So what's wrong with the ability of Norra Wexley?

The problem is, that you actually need 2 actions to make her ability work in the first place.

Yes, I know she CAN be very strong, if everything works well. She MIGHT have a 4 dice attack then (or get an additional focus evade).

But what about stress? What if you can not use Push the Limit? What if you need another action like roll, boost or whatever?

Please keep in mind that a lot of competetive builds seem to have a "should always work" factor in them.

And that's exactly the reason why I think that Norra has got a terrible ability.

Even if everything works perfectly.. you still have to "trade" your Target Lock, which might be important and useful for dice modification against an additional die, which shows a focus result.

Why only a focus? Why didn't they give her a fourth die, which would have been awesome? It would not be super strong anyways, because there are many ships out there, which fire with 4 dice all the time (Phantoms, Ghosts, Torpedo Uboats)

She would have been rather strong & useful then. And we would be able to use her Elite Skill Slot for something else than Push the Limit then.

Honestly... a lot of people seem to love her right now, because it's a new ship with great looks and an interesting combination of slots (crew & astromech together).

But after a while I think Norra will be used a lot less than the Stressmule or some other ARC builds.

A good ability is not something that is always active. As a player you'll never improve if you don't change the way you look at this game. Some abilities may only get used a couple of times a game. Some more than others, but its not about abilities but also about how you fly it.

If you think Nora has a terrible ability than you really need to change the way you view this game. If you don't you wont improve your game at all

Wedge ability does 0 good when he has no shot. Against arc dodgers what good is his ability if they are boosting and barrel roll out of his arc? Is it good when hes dead? Yes it works so long as he's shooting, but honestly, wedge does not scare me, I've beaten him in tournaments, vassal, and casual games. If wddges ability was so good then why don't we see him in more top spots?

Abilities like vessery is strong, but again his ability sucks if he's the only ship on the board. Kill his support ship first, then what? What about ryad? Your not using his ability every round. Is Hans ability good if you roll all hits? Your also using Horton salm as an example? How often do you see Horton in play? The odd casual game, but very very rarely in competitive. There's a reason for that. He sucks. I suggest you rethink your argument if Horton is part of your argument.

Lots of ships require 2 actions to be very good. By your standard soontir fel is terrible, because he uses ptl and most times he's using two actions to be very useful. He is usually boosting and barrel rolling to get out of arc and only gets 1 focuz. Geez what a terrible ability. Also if he gets another stress he's dead in the water The Inquisitor ability must not be very good either, since it only works well when hes not at range 1, and again he's usually running ptl. Marinda ability is only half useful when she has no shields Seriously I can go on and on.

Again your dead wrong about competitive builds always having a "should work factor" What special abilities does triple uboats have? They have no pilot ability. Bbbbz? Again all generics. 3 bounty hunters?crackshot swarm? These builds are just a few of the Generics builds that have done well over the years, with no special pilot abilities. 4b and a z have no ability at all. Just 5 ships with a lot of hp, and red dice

Good lord man, the last thing we need right now is giving more and more ships 4 native red dice. as of now we have the ghost, phantom, and soon Kylo shuttle.

You have to think outside the box. Don't expect everything to be perfect. It sounds like you just want over powered abilities. Some abilities may active more than others, but if you think that's what makes a pilot great, again your wrong, and vessery is a good example as to why. When hes the last ship standing, he's not that great,but in a squad feeding him target locks, he's a beast.

Nora ability is good. It's not just because it's a new ship. With ptl, her dial with a lot of greens, and her ability along with r2d2 makes for a very deadly ship, and that's exactly what you need in the late game in this game. If you cannot see that, then that's up to you. To improve as a player you have to think outside the box. Being able to roll consistent red dice is what wins you games. Her ability makes her very consistent. Tail gunner is also very nice on her. With the title it's not something I want to get behind.

The majority here disagree with you, so either your a person who can't admit when their wrong, or just very stubborn, or maybe your just trolling

Edit

Also wedge ability is uselessif he's against a decimator or ghost, or even something with 1 agility. Not going to make a big difference. Also her ability is "always active" (as you put it) if she has a target lock and focus, and stress hurts a lot of builds. Fel, coran, aggressors, etc etc.

Your completely wrong

It's always a great idea to begin a response with words like "you are completely wrong".

Just like... EVERYTHING I said right there was without ANY logic

A good ability is not something that is always active. As a player you'll never improve if you don't change the way you look at this game. Some abilities may only get used a couple of times a game. Some more than others, but its not about abilities but also about how you fly it.

Then I am wondering why in other cases people seem to praise upgrades and skills so much, which always work.

C3PO Crew for example... isn't it great to have an evade, even while getting blocked?

A lot of good players seem to know, that your enemy is going to block you or stress your ships. Your ships should be able to deal with that in one way or another.

Lots of ships require 2 actions to be very good. By your standard soontir fel is terrible, because he uses ptl and most times he's using two actions to be very useful. He is usually boosting and barrel rolling to get out of arc and only gets 1 focuz. Geez what a terrible ability. Also if he gets another stress he's dead in the water The Inquisitor ability must not be very good either, since it only works well when hes not at range 1, and again he's usually running ptl. Marinda ability is only half useful when she has no shields Seriously I can go on and on.

Actually I was using Soontir Fel as a positive example myself. Please read my post

He is great because he can use a lot of actions... whatever actions he likes. But he doesn't need these actions to actually use his ability. His ability is always active.

So if he get's stressed, he gets a focus, which means he will be able to use this token during his attack or defense rolls.

Norras ability is more stiff than fel


Trade off is the potential +1 damage over max and guaranteed +1 evade when enabled

The only time you don't use it is when you dun goofed (bumped so soonts would likewise be ******) or when you need to VT roll

In which case you ptl a lock for a following turn, using the immense value of r2d2 to set up a position of power further down the line

Like fel, whose ability is actually really weak without ptl, norra is a "more than a sum of her parts" kinda deal

The ability is bleh until enabled by a combination of upgrades that make her an incredible presence on the table


If you just look at the ability in a vacuum...yeah it is shite. Hell, if you had either norra or fel in ships they piloted in canon, ie Y and X (after his intercepting days) you'd have some horribly underwhelming pilots. Fortunately, the bigger picture exists



Norra, from experience, is highly competitive


Will she make worlds, though? Nope. And not because her great ability somehow sucks, but rather for the,same reason we don't see much in the way of rebel Regen anymore


Though withtorpp scouts seemingly calming the **** down, Norras your best bet v dengaroo. Yeah the single turn of countermeasures isn't great (except it doesn't matter a whole lot because you have Biggs anyway), but it's only 1 turn and then you're free to tailgun the bugger down


Plus, unlike the other Regen ships, zuckuss isn't the worst when you only got 1 agi anyway

Not sure what the OP wants. This is a game of dice. FFG will never release a ship that rolls 4 dice and converts them all to hits. Accuracy corrector is about as good as you will get for guaranteed hits.

Norra adding a focus result is HUGE! Brobots with HLC and FCS plus focus can sometimes only muster 3 hits. Norra is cranking out 3 hits easy, and 4 hits on occasion. Roll 3 dice with a focus token and as long as two are not blanks, you have 3 hits! That is really really good. There is no rerolling a blank to a blank (i.e. Brobots and FCS). Norra, with a TL, gets her eyeball EVERY...SINGLE...TIME.

Norra's only problem is she is in a 1 agility ship and therefore needs Biggs until a couple enemy ships are off the table cause anything with two dice can put damage into her.

Not sure what the OP wants. This is a game of dice. FFG will never release a ship that rolls 4 dice and converts them all to hits.

Are you sure? What about Uboats before they got nerfed?

No... seriously I know what you mean. But that wasn't what I was asking for. Of course it would be completely stupid to have a ship which always gets 4 hits. I never said I wanted anything like that.

I am just not so happy with a pilot, which should be the best rebel pilot of the current wave.

Neither was I, when she was spoiled. Hell, apart from the hypnotic model, I was sorta uninspired by the ARC in general

Then I put her on the table and she started carrying games

While I would be loved it if the arc just had a straight 3 die primary, Norras kind of as powerful as we could hope for

Any more and she just becomes THE meta, instead of simply slapping the meta around (well, Palp aces and x7s and dengaroo anyway). She's just that good (if you basically autowin 1v1 against even imp aces, you're pretty dang Skippy)

Neither was I, when she was spoiled. Hell, apart from the hypnotic model, I was sorta uninspired by the ARC in general

Then I put her on the table and she started carrying games

While I would be loved it if the arc just had a straight 3 die primary, Norras kind of as powerful as we could hope for

Any more and she just becomes THE meta, instead of simply slapping the meta around (well, Palp aces and x7s and dengaroo anyway). She's just that good (if you basically autowin 1v1 against even imp aces, you're pretty dang Skippy)

I also love the model a lot. I mean.. it looks fantastic! I want to fly it.

The base stats of this ship look nice, too. I hope you are right, fickle. I really want this ship to work, especially with Norra Wexley.

then just put her on the table (r2-d2, tailgunner, Vectored thrusters and PTL with Biggs in tow) and practice

her raw capabilities are absolutely not a concern, she can absolutely hang with the best once you've figured out the oddity of the small base aux ARC

Before fickle gets here: the title alows you to turn a focus into a crit out the back, and with its dial Norra can easily make PTL work. Plan a conservative maneuver, get Target Lock and Focus, and toss on a Tail Gunner to make it hit a little harder.

Not bad by any means.

You haven't noticed that FDG lurves the ARC 170, have you. (And I mean this from other threads, not this one to which he has contributed positively.)

Then I am wondering why in other cases people seem to praise upgrades and skills so much, which always work.

C3PO Crew for example... isn't it great to have an evade, even while getting blocked?

A lot of good players seem to know, that your enemy is going to block you or stress your ships. Your ships should be able to deal with that in one way or another.

3PO works great until someone rolls up ahead of you with tailgunner and now your 1 evade ship doesnt get to roll a die so they cant guess and 3PO is effectively not working

My opponent used PtL Norra and Shara to tear apart my TIE swarm in barely 3 turns last night. It was ugly. Norra was, thanks to Shara and her Weapons Engineer, able to essentially bring 5 dice to bear on a TIE unfortunate enough to get stuck at R1 of her primary arc. Yeah, she's terrible.

2 Dice Primary + 1 for title + 1 for range + Focus from pilot ability = Bye TIE!

Your completely wrong

It's always a great idea to begin a response with words like "you are completely wrong".

Just like... EVERYTHING I said right there was without ANY logic

A good ability is not something that is always active. As a player you'll never improve if you don't change the way you look at this game. Some abilities may only get used a couple of times a game. Some more than others, but its not about abilities but also about how you fly it.

Then I am wondering why in other cases people seem to praise upgrades and skills so much, which always work.

C3PO Crew for example... isn't it great to have an evade, even while getting blocked?

A lot of good players seem to know, that your enemy is going to block you or stress your ships. Your ships should be able to deal with that in one way or another.

Lots of ships require 2 actions to be very good. By your standard soontir fel is terrible, because he uses ptl and most times he's using two actions to be very useful. He is usually boosting and barrel rolling to get out of arc and only gets 1 focuz. Geez what a terrible ability. Also if he gets another stress he's dead in the water The Inquisitor ability must not be very good either, since it only works well when hes not at range 1, and again he's usually running ptl. Marinda ability is only half useful when she has no shields Seriously I can go on and on.

Actually I was using Soontir Fel as a positive example myself. Please read my post

He is great because he can use a lot of actions... whatever actions he likes. But he doesn't need these actions to actually use his ability. His ability is always active.

So if he get's stressed, he gets a focus, which means he will be able to use this token during his attack or defense rolls.

Is 3p0 crew any good against wedge? Or tailgunner? By your standards something like rebel captive is bad. Your not seeing the big picture.

What's your thoughts on vessery, good or bad?

In all honesty if you can't see that, then thats your lose. Your missing out in something that works very well, a great ship, and fun too. All of your examples have been very poor imo az to why it's not that great.

If 3po was so great then why aren't we seeing him more? He was hot for awhile, but really he's not seen as much as before.

I've read all your posts, and tbh none of them hold any value. You also said you need two actions to make her ability work. Most of the time that's what fels doing. His ability is only active if he takes a stress, and like Nora hes usually using ptl. Ptl has become an auto include on fel, just as it has on Nora. That's why he's so good.

You also try to use norra getting a stress as a reason why she's not so good Well that's said for many ships. If fel uses ptl, then gets stressed from r3a2 he's dead in the water, sure he can get a focus for every stress, but if he has 5 stress he's pretty well going to die next round or two. If aggressors get another stress while using ptl, again not looking too good for them. Coran he becomes very predictable etc etc, stress hurts lots of popular builds not just Nora

Plus the fact your using Horton as an example of a good ability? If he's so good where is he in the meta? He's never been all that good since day 1. He's not bad, he has a decent ability, but it's not almighty, but again by your logic he should be top tier.

I don't think I'm a great player, but with multiple store championship wins, multiple tournament wins/rank top 4, and top 8 at regionals (maybe have won if didn't have to leave after making cut). Doesn't always mean I'm Right, but I like to think I have a small clue what I'm talking about.

Tell you what. Use her with biggs. Put ptl, tailgunner, r2d2 on Nora, and r4d6 with integrated astromech on biggs and fill the squad with whatever, then come back and say she's no good. Unless your really terrible at flying it, you should see some pretty good results and maybe will have a different opinion.

As it is now your just going to argue no matter what numbers or logic anyone here gives you. People have even shows Your graphs on the % of her attacks. Your right, and the whole forum is wrong. That's how it seems. I really don't think you've even tried her. If you have, you may have had the wrong upgrades on her. once you give her a few games (and not just one) then come back and present your findings. As it now you have presented no logical reason except for your own opinion, based off what you "think" is a bad ability, which many here has disproven with actual evidence. They have shown you the actual numbers, all you so is argue because it seems your the type of person who thinks his opinion is all there is

You might have been hosed. The title doesn't add a die in the rear arc.

One thing we all seem to have overlooked is that Norra synergies with the tailgun.

Not sure what the OP wants. This is a game of dice. FFG will never release a ship that rolls 4 dice and converts them all to hits.

Are you sure? What about Uboats before they got nerfed?

No... seriously I know what you mean. But that wasn't what I was asking for. Of course it would be completely stupid to have a ship which always gets 4 hits. I never said I wanted anything like that.

I am just not so happy with a pilot, which should be the best rebel pilot of the current wave.

Depends what you mean by best.