Do what the card says. Don't do what the card doesn't say.
The card does not say to make up rules which magically make a maneuver substep no longer a maneuver substep.
I agree with the first part. Do what the says. It says to move a step to happen after another step that comes after the maneuver is complete. It doesnt say to make the other step part of executing the maneuver.
That step being a necessary part of the maneuver that the maneuver cannot end without.
Do what the card says. Don't do what the card doesn't say.
The card does not say to make up rules which magically make a maneuver substep no longer a maneuver substep.
I agree with the first part. Do what the says. It says to move a step to happen after another step that comes after the maneuver is complete. It doesnt say to make the other step part of executing the maneuver.
That step being a necessary part of the maneuver that the maneuver cannot end without.
Once again we'll have to disagree. A maneuver ends after the clean up step. PA does NOT say to move that step.
Sure, it looks cool on paper. It's still a 32 point ship that will die instantly to Torp Scouts or Dengar
Yes Dengar is a risk but then he is to most ships. Nien is no more vulnerable to Dengar than anyone else.
I disagree. Nien pretty much needs to joust, as his T70 is no Interceptor or TIE Adv Prototype (even with Push and Vectored Thrusters). The T70's greens are, by comparison, terrible, which means you can only move like an interceptor/inquisitor when you're ending your movement at R1 of Dengar to pitch that stress. But if you do that, Dengar hasn't moved yet, which means when he does move he's very likely either getting out of Nien's arc or bumping Nien. Thus, Nien is looking at having to joust with Dengar or play the long-distance chase game, and both can be disasters.
Unlike Palp Aces or X7s, Nien lacks the defense to weather Dengar long enough to do enough damage to be worth 30+ points. Nien also lacks auto-thrusters (if you go the Vectored Thrusters or Integrated Astromech route), which means he eats damage a lot faster against Dengar, especially with only two agility and no Palp or Evade token insurance. Inq, Fel, and X7 Ryad all effectively get 3 Actions a turn, to spread amongst repositioning, defense, and offense (backed usually by Palps insurance). Nien has to pick from only two actions a turn assuming he's got PtL, and if he's repositioning he's getting a mediocre offensive roll. If Nien takes autothrusters, he's bypassing Vectored Thrusters which only allows him to Boost with PtL, greatly reducing his maneuverability, though he'll tank a bit longer. Either way, he's far less efficient than the similarly costed Inq, Fel, and Ryad.
Unlike Torp Scouts, Party Buses, VCXs, or even TLT Ys, Nien doesn't hit hard enough to do reliable damage to Dengar. Even if Nien does F+TL every turn (somehow not needing to reposition to maintain shots or avoid counterattacks) he's only likely to get 1 damage through per attack assuming he rolls well. As opposed to a similarly costed Torp Scout that can bank on forcing through two damage per torp, even during a turn where Dengar has popped Countermeasures+Glitter (turns where Nien and his allies are probably going to forgo attacking or end up doing no damage anyways).
If Nien is built to Stress Control with R3A2+Snap Shot, Dengar doesn't care about the stress at all. And if Nien is triggering Snap Shot when Dengar moves, odds are Dengar also has Nien in arc, which means Nien throws two dice against 2+LoneWolf and then is going to eat a 4-Die+LW counterattack and a 4-Die+LW+F normal attack. That alone might wipe Nien off the board even before he makes his regular attack (if Dengar doesn't counter on the Snap and waits, Nien will probably end up having to forgo his own attack to not eat the 4+LW+F return attack. It'll be difficult for Nien to set up future Snap Shots against Dengar again because on turns it may be viable Dengar is as likely to just bump Nien, which doesn't hamper Dengar much at all (he bypasses Snap Shot and the Regular attack and still gets his full action suite from Manaroo or Glitter + LW).
For these reasons, I actually think Nien is a lot worse off against Dengaroo than Palp Aces, X7s, Torp Scouts / Party Buses, and VCXs.are.
You are going after the wrong ship. Dengars friend really does care about stress, and makes dengar care a lot about his stress as well.
I really don't think it's that easy for Nien Nunb with PtL+VT to catch Manaroo. Dengar will be happily flying right at Nien's face, and Nien will have a hell of a hard time catching or keeping up with Manaroo while also taking unanswered attacks from Dengar. Since Manaroo will be running, Nien will not being shedding stress via his pilot ability while chasing. This means he's stuck with Green moves, which are not nearly as fast or tight as they are for Inq/Fel (who are fast and maneuverable to run down Manaroo if so inclined). Going after Manaroo first is great if you have ships that are mobile enough to do it, but I don't think Nien is.
Manaroo can also just block Nien with ease if she feels like it, then next turn she can run away and Nien is left doing either a T-Roll or K-Turn without being able to clear his stress from it. After that he's capping at a 3-Speed to shed his stress and by that point Manaroo is gone again.
My favorite part of all your posts is how the person flying the thing you say is strong is flying flawlessly and the person flying the thing you say is weak is flying like a sack of potatoes.
On top of that take your post, you are explaining a theoretical engagment with your full 100points against a single ship in the rebel fleet absolutly ignoring the rest of the fleet to make your points. If dengar is chasing nien who is chasing manaroo then he is point at the rest of your fleet who is shooting his ass off. ideally dengar is aiming at ships that are not shooting at him if you are facing him, what you described is exactly what you want to happen. Forcing dengar to deal with a threat to manroo is 100% what you want to happen.
You're right. Nien is hard counter to Dengaroo. Hooray, the reign of Dengaroo is coming to an end thanks to HotR and Nien Nunb!!!!!!!!
The trick here is the whole range one thing. Getting an enemy ship in your arc at range 1 is hard.
That said, I cannot believe how much decimators will hate this!
Mara Jade - useless.
Rebel captive - useless.
Goodbye, Oicun!
The trick here is the whole range one thing. Getting an enemy ship in your arc at range 1 is hard.
That said, I cannot believe how much decimators will hate this!
Mara Jade - useless.
Rebel captive - useless.
Goodbye, Oicun!
That's why Pattern Anlyseris glued to Nien numb. Red move, then boost into range 1, THEN take stress from PTL, red move, or whatever.