I just don't like facing Scum. I always play rebels, my wife always plays Imperials, we mostly play against each other. I know rebels and imperials inside and out and I know how to beat them.

But every time I play against Scum, it just feels like I'm facing this ridiculously efficient and overpowered combination of upgrades on a bunch of ships that just don't feel remotely Star Wars-y to me, and that I don't have enough knowledge or experience to overcome.

I know the best answer is to get some Scum ships and play them at home with my wife, but the only ships that I'd want to have on my shelf from the Scum faction (Firespray, Shadow Caster, K-fighter) aren't the ships that are causing me problems.

I just don't like facing Scum. I always play rebels, my wife always plays Imperials, we mostly play against each other. I know rebels and imperials inside and out and I know how to beat them.

But every time I play against Scum, it just feels like I'm facing this ridiculously efficient and overpowered combination of upgrades on a bunch of ships that just don't feel remotely Star Wars-y to me, and that I don't have enough knowledge or experience to overcome.

I know the best answer is to get some Scum ships and play them at home with my wife, but the only ships that I'd want to have on my shelf from the Scum faction (Firespray, Shadow Caster, K-fighter) aren't the ships that are causing me problems.

100% Vassal or tabletop simulator for this. There are loads of guides and you can build a scum list, try it out and fly against stuff you need practice against. All for much cheaper than in real life!

Corran Horn. The jerkiest of jerk ships.

None.

I am looking forward to play everything. Now I should theoretically be cautious about dangaroo, but I can't help it, I do find it exiting to fly against lists which are especially challenging, So I like to fly against those especially.

There is still one thing I don't like to fly against, but that is not ship specific, it lists who are objectively bad builds (Stuff like Vader with predator, title and FCS) . It just not satisfying to fly against those, if you win it's shallow, if you lose it's depressing.

While I enjoy the challenge of flying against a well crafted, home-brew list, I despise many of those who run Meta staples. Both they and everyone around them knows that they only brought it to win, and that takes the fun out of the game. You beat me 3 times in a row? Great, now do that again without your $150 Palpatine (Let's face it, that's what buying the Raider is for). Here's and example:

If you bring Palp aces or jumpmasters (any variants) to a tournament and have 50 games under your belt, you will - always - do better than you would if you brought any non-meta staples. They're packed with so many redundancies that even if a Palpatine backed Soontir was aught at range 1 of an 8 TIE swarm, he wouldn't suffer any damage. How ridiculous is that? By playing with meta lists you're saying "I'm willing to pay for my victories."

Every now and then I'll set my ships down at a tournament and wait for my opponent's placement, take a look at their list and think "wow, I've never seen anything like that, and wow is it going to be hard to beat..." Its those kinds of lists that really keep me going. They invigorate the Meta and make the game worth playing. Here's an example:

Keyan Farlander (29)

Heavy Laser Canon (7)

Opportunist (2)

Horton Salm (25)

Twin Laser Turret (6)

R4-D6 (1)

Veteran Instincts (1)

Biggs Darklighter (25)

R2 Astromech (1)

Total: 99 pts.

I ran a variant of this to victory in two local tournaments. Even though I have literally never found HLC + opportuninst online before, I gave it a shot, and lo and behold, its a monster. Once I get a Rebel Transport I'll be swapping Horton for Wes with VI + BB8 to get bettor Opportunist triggers.

So sure, go ahead and copy Meta staples. Just do it knowing that you're not the one winning. Its the list.

Oddly, I don't want to see a Tie Phantom in my opponents list. For some reason it psyches me out, I assume anyone willing to fly a phantom in a competitive setting is awesome at flying them (wether that's true or not). So far there is still nothing in the game as frightening as a well flown phantom to me.

Oddly, I don't want to see a Tie Phantom in my opponents list. For some reason it psyches me out, I assume anyone willing to fly a phantom in a competitive setting is awesome at flying them (wether that's true or not). So far there is still nothing in the game as frightening as a well flown phantom to me.

I made that experience as well, everytime I bring my Phantom to the table people freak out. And everytime I lose

Takes practice to master that little ship, but it is a tons of fun to learn to fly already.

Wow, this was a pleasant surprise. Of course there are people who are sick of what ever the meta might be t the time, but there was a lot more variety in the hips we don't like to see than I would have expected.

. How ridiculous is that? By playing with meta lists you're saying "I'm willing to pay for my victories."

....

I ran a variant of this to victory in two local tournaments. Even though I have literally never found HLC + opportuninst online before, I gave it a shot, and lo and behold, its a monster. Once I get a Rebel Transport I'll be swapping Horton for Wes with VI + BB8 to get bettor Opportunist triggers.

Oh. So if i buy a raider I'm paying to win but when you buy a transport you'll be, uh. Doing something else.

It's always nice to have high standards. For other people.

Hu, I got my raider for free, but you know I pay to win, though only ran palp once since release. Also, I bought two imperial aces back when they came out so I could run 3 RGPs and dark curse. By the time I retired that list it was 97-13 for tournament wins, but then again it was suppose to be terrible cause of all the fat Hans and other turret ships and my interceptors with out AT (wasn't a thing at the time). But I guess I paid to win cause I used something non meta but bought an expansion to win. Guess if you buy anything outside the core you pay to win, well darn.

For lists I don't wanna see? Bombers... Had a scary run in with a K wing player at a tournament today. Had I rolled more hits on the clusters, I'm sure it would of been a much closer game. He got all his clusters to go off on one defender, but I rolled 2 crits and 4 blanks. Local players are picking up bombs more often and they really do work once you learn them. Watched the same bomber player make it so that two IGs did not get a shot till one blew up before he ever got to roll attack or defense dice (outside of mine damage) with it.

Honestly....Dash. Any ship that has a primary objective of running away makes my blood boil.

. How ridiculous is that? By playing with meta lists you're saying "I'm willing to pay for my victories."

....

I ran a variant of this to victory in two local tournaments. Even though I have literally never found HLC + opportuninst online before, I gave it a shot, and lo and behold, its a monster. Once I get a Rebel Transport I'll be swapping Horton for Wes with VI + BB8 to get bettor Opportunist triggers.

Oh. So if i buy a raider I'm paying to win but when you buy a transport you'll be, uh. Doing something else.

It's always nice to have high standards. For other people.

The bigger irony is that Farlander with HLC + Opportunist + Y-Wing + Biggs is nothing new at all, it is rather a classic one. And I am gonna bet it is as well that ace counter list that the mynocks always speaking off, the one which they want to use the second that scouts are gone. A TLT with super mods is the exact thing you would need to push true autothruster and token stacks, while 5 dice are the other way you can do it.

The bigger irony is that Farlander with HLC + Opportunist + Y-Wing + Biggs is nothing new at all, it is rather a classic one. And I am gonna bet it is as well that ace counter list that the mynocks always speaking off, the one which they want to use the second that scouts are gone. A TLT with super mods is the exact thing you would need to push true autothruster and token stacks, while 5 dice are the other way you can do it.

I think the irony lies in the fact that HLC is only found in large ships, opportunist in imperial aces, R4-D6 in the tantive, and TLTs in K-wings. Yet not a single one of those ships is present in that list.

Decimator! I always make stupid mistakes when I am facing the Decimator.

Rebels and scum, they're the reason the galaxy can't have nice things.

The bigger irony is that Farlander with HLC + Opportunist + Y-Wing + Biggs is nothing new at all, it is rather a classic one. And I am gonna bet it is as well that ace counter list that the mynocks always speaking off, the one which they want to use the second that scouts are gone. A TLT with super mods is the exact thing you would need to push true autothruster and token stacks, while 5 dice are the other way you can do it.

I think the irony lies in the fact that HLC is only found in large ships, opportunist in imperial aces, R4-D6 in the tantive, and TLTs in K-wings. Yet not a single one of those ships is present in that list.

Multiple angle irony, especially as farlander is from rebel aces which brings another "useless" A-Wing.

So that's is like $50 for the ace packs, 60 for the transport which brings R4-D6, another 20 for the TLT and 25 for the HLC and 15+35 for Biggs and Horton. Though I am pretty sure he meant R2-D6 as Horton has VI. But hey, at least VI comes from the slave one, which got the HCL as well, might not be useful for anything else for a rebel player, but at least he got two upgrade card

Overall the Farlander Opportunist list is $205. Just like all competitive lists. ;-)

My Palp Aces come $90 for the raider + 15 for soontir + 25 for imp aces + 15 for inquisitor + 20 for autothrusters + 15 for a stealth device (ok 25, buying two stealth device in one pack is more efficient with the slave 1 expansion) + 25 for the lambda shuttle. Overall $205 ($215).

Even more ironic is that my imperial aces list gives me more list options as I can use the TIE/AD now too, get carnor jax and can play that really awesome raider multi-branching campaign as well, I have all the needed ships for that now too. For Standard 300pts epic might be not super competitive, but 3 Interceptors with 2 TIEs and one Lambda, a decent expensive raider + the TAP and maybe Juno a flankers sounds like a decent amount of fun and for sure playable.

edit: And I am not counting the core set on the palp aces list, because I assume the blue core set as standard. Theoretically you could cut the corner and play with the old damage set, but that sounds not like a good plan, considering that you want the new damage deck with aces. So the imperial player does not need a second core set just for his list to run optimal, while the rebel list in this example needs both coresets. Either way, even if we are cutting corners, you still spend those 200 bucks on the rebel list, you just spend 35 extra bucks on the palp aces list, a small price in contest that so much more lists work really well from that shopping list and not a big deal when you have spend over 200 dollar either way already.

I hate facing my face...it feels like an assistive device of sorts!

I just hate seeing my own squad there. It's like showing up to a party with the same dress as another girl ... or at least, I think it would be. Being a guy and having never worn a dress, I can't say for sure.

It's neither illegal nor immoral, go ahead, you might surprise yourself.

OT?

Tie Swarms. Hands down. Hate them with a passion, especially ones that are flown by people who know how to fly them.

Cheers

Baaa

The bigger irony is that Farlander with HLC + Opportunist + Y-Wing + Biggs is nothing new at all, it is rather a classic one. And I am gonna bet it is as well that ace counter list that the mynocks always speaking off, the one which they want to use the second that scouts are gone. A TLT with super mods is the exact thing you would need to push true autothruster and token stacks, while 5 dice are the other way you can do it.

I think the irony lies in the fact that HLC is only found in large ships, opportunist in imperial aces, R4-D6 in the tantive, and TLTs in K-wings. Yet not a single one of those ships is present in that list.

Multiple angle irony, especially as farlander is from rebel aces which brings another "useless" A-Wing.

So that's is like $50 for the ace packs, 60 for the transport which brings R4-D6, another 20 for the TLT and 25 for the HLC and 15+35 for Biggs and Horton. Though I am pretty sure he meant R2-D6 as Horton has VI. But hey, at least VI comes from the slave one, which got the HCL as well, might not be useful for anything else for a rebel player, but at least he got two upgrade card

Overall the Farlander Opportunist list is $205. Just like all competitive lists. ;-)

My Palp Aces come $90 for the raider + 15 for soontir + 25 for imp aces + 15 for inquisitor + 20 for autothrusters + 15 for a stealth device (ok 25, buying two stealth device in one pack is more efficient with the slave 1 expansion) + 25 for the lambda shuttle. Overall $205 ($215).

Even more ironic is that my imperial aces list gives me more list options as I can use the TIE/AD now too, get carnor jax and can play that really awesome raider multi-branching campaign as well, I have all the needed ships for that now too. For Standard 300pts epic might be not super competitive, but 3 Interceptors with 2 TIEs and one Lambda, a decent expensive raider + the TAP and maybe Juno a flankers sounds like a decent amount of fun and for sure playable.

edit: And I am not counting the core set on the palp aces list, because I assume the blue core set as standard. Theoretically you could cut the corner and play with the old damage set, but that sounds not like a good plan, considering that you want the new damage deck with aces. So the imperial player does not need a second core set just for his list to run optimal, while the rebel list in this example needs both coresets. Either way, even if we are cutting corners, you still spend those 200 bucks on the rebel list, you just spend 35 extra bucks on the palp aces list, a small price in contest that so much more lists work really well from that shopping list and not a big deal when you have spend over 200 dollar either way already.

I have no doubt that these figures ar acurate, but I find it a little misleading to price out a competitive list at $200. It totally would be if you started from scratch, but that isn't my experience. (And I feel not the experience of most of the people we play with.). As the game progress you just buy more ships. And each time you buy another ship you get stuff that works with other ship you already have. The only time I find it expensive to buy a list is when you want one of the cards that comes with one of the epic ships. Like if you want to play TIE advanced you pretty much have to buy a raider. Or maybe needing to buy a Rebel Transport to fly fat Han.

Triples Scouts.

I've read the advice. Watched the batreps. Dared to hope with the agro-nerf.

Yet if I run into a trip scout list played with some skill, it's **** hard to get a win.

The bigger irony is that Farlander with HLC + Opportunist + Y-Wing + Biggs is nothing new at all, it is rather a classic one. And I am gonna bet it is as well that ace counter list that the mynocks always speaking off, the one which they want to use the second that scouts are gone. A TLT with super mods is the exact thing you would need to push true autothruster and token stacks, while 5 dice are the other way you can do it.

I think the irony lies in the fact that HLC is only found in large ships, opportunist in imperial aces, R4-D6 in the tantive, and TLTs in K-wings. Yet not a single one of those ships is present in that list.

Multiple angle irony, especially as farlander is from rebel aces which brings another "useless" A-Wing.

So that's is like $50 for the ace packs, 60 for the transport which brings R4-D6, another 20 for the TLT and 25 for the HLC and 15+35 for Biggs and Horton. Though I am pretty sure he meant R2-D6 as Horton has VI. But hey, at least VI comes from the slave one, which got the HCL as well, might not be useful for anything else for a rebel player, but at least he got two upgrade card

Overall the Farlander Opportunist list is $205. Just like all competitive lists. ;-)

My Palp Aces come $90 for the raider + 15 for soontir + 25 for imp aces + 15 for inquisitor + 20 for autothrusters + 15 for a stealth device (ok 25, buying two stealth device in one pack is more efficient with the slave 1 expansion) + 25 for the lambda shuttle. Overall $205 ($215).

Even more ironic is that my imperial aces list gives me more list options as I can use the TIE/AD now too, get carnor jax and can play that really awesome raider multi-branching campaign as well, I have all the needed ships for that now too. For Standard 300pts epic might be not super competitive, but 3 Interceptors with 2 TIEs and one Lambda, a decent expensive raider + the TAP and maybe Juno a flankers sounds like a decent amount of fun and for sure playable.

edit: And I am not counting the core set on the palp aces list, because I assume the blue core set as standard. Theoretically you could cut the corner and play with the old damage set, but that sounds not like a good plan, considering that you want the new damage deck with aces. So the imperial player does not need a second core set just for his list to run optimal, while the rebel list in this example needs both coresets. Either way, even if we are cutting corners, you still spend those 200 bucks on the rebel list, you just spend 35 extra bucks on the palp aces list, a small price in contest that so much more lists work really well from that shopping list and not a big deal when you have spend over 200 dollar either way already.

I have no doubt that these figures ar acurate, but I find it a little misleading to price out a competitive list at $200. It totally would be if you started from scratch, but that isn't my experience. (And I feel not the experience of most of the people we play with.). As the game progress you just buy more ships. And each time you buy another ship you get stuff that works with other ship you already have. The only time I find it expensive to buy a list is when you want one of the cards that comes with one of the epic ships. Like if you want to play TIE advanced you pretty much have to buy a raider. Or maybe needing to buy a Rebel Transport to fly fat Han.

You need C-3PO for that fat han, which you get either 2nd hand, from a tournament kit or the tantive IV. No rebel transports involved.

And I totally get that the second competitive list is a lot less expensive, but that $200 price tag for having ONE competitive list seems to hold true for quite a while now. It basically the minimum investment when you decide to go with a netlist and it seems as well in most cases for non-meta, but still strong list with the right amount of card synergies and effective ships.

I totally get that it feels different to to lay that $100 note on the counter when buying the raider for just Palpatine. Though from a monetary perspective it makes little difference if I build a $200 palp ace list or a $200 triple scout list or dengaroo or whatever. They are all about in that price range and Palp aces comes ironically even with decent casual play value too. As mentioned epic is really fun to fly with that ship.

As long as FFG manages to not explode the complexity creep beyond that $200 mark for competitive list everything stays fine for newcomer who want to play the game competitive too, veterans can fly more list with their natural growing list, but they buy in stays at those $200 for tier 1 list and about $100 or so to start having good satisfying list. That is a imho good value for your money and makes x-wing a cheap game to enjoy.

Still the raider was a **** move, even when the value is actually ok for the package. Sometimes people just don't want the whole package.

Triples Scouts.

I've read the advice. Watched the batreps. Dared to hope with the agro-nerf.

Yet if I run into a trip scout list played with some skill, it's **** hard to get a win.

Yet triple scouts are no "easy win" list. Quite difficult to play well actually.

The only ship I hate a lot is a Soontir Fel combined with a Palpatine.

Hate's too strong a word. Negative Play Experience, perhaps?

But I do find frustrating ...

1. Regen Corran Horn (though not bothered by other regen, oddly)

2. Dengaroo

3. Bossk Party Bus

Triple Jumpmasters I just find boring, along with any list (outside of swarms) based around multiples of essentially the same thing.