Hi,

last evening we had a dispute over nanok heroic feat and skirmisher's unrelenting skill used in conjuction - so the question is, can Nanok use his heroic feat (in other player's turn), make an attack, then exhaust Unrelenting to make another attack (with other one hand weapon) and then the other player makes the attack (which is part of the heroic feat)?

I played an overlord and I approved it in the end (the heroes had a hard time in the quest nevertheless ), but I was not sure as Nanok is basically interrupting his heroic feat to do an another attack and if he didn't play that round, even if the card is exhausted, during his turn he would enable it again (using unrelenting twice in one round).

Thanks for help!

Is Nanok the Skirmisher or another hero? I guess Nanok right?

So basically, another hero attacks, Nanok uses his feat, makes his attack, uses unrelenting to perform another attack, then the first hero attacks another time due to the feat. Makes 4 attacks for 1 action, 1 feat and 1 skill use.

This is certainly a strong combo, but I don't see why it shouldn't be legal.

So, there are 2 questions:

1) Is it possible to interrupt an heroic feat?

2) Can you use unrelenting outside of your own turn?

I'd say yes to (1) since, the feat just provides attacks to heroes in a certain order.

And also to (2), since Unrelenting says: "Exhaust this card after resolving an attack..." and the heroic feat grants you an attack outside your own turn.

This is a strong combo if the heroes need to bring down a lieutenant, but otherwise, it will most likely lead to an overkill, since the targets are limited.

I am not entirely sure with (1) though.

I am pretty sure this would work. The trigger for the skill is satisfied. The only thing I think should be considered is that the heroic feat is already in progress, and states exactly what comes after Nanok's attack. Therefore, the heroic feat would have to complete before Nanok can perform his unrelenting attack. If the other hero's attack defeats the monster, the unrelenting exhaustion is sort of wasted.

I say this because it has been ruled that for example Stalwart cannot work in combination with one fist's heroic feat (but advance can).

The trigger for unrelenting is "when you resolve an attack with one hand weapon".

Nanok's heroic feat gives him a attack that interrupts another hero's turn.

It IS an attack, no matter when it happens so the skill can trigger.

It is to be noted that the Unrelenting attack can target "one of the same monsters" not "the same target" so if there was another monster from that group adjacent to Nanok (or within reach, if he wields a 1 hand reach weapon), he could target that monster.

Let's go through it step by step.

Nanok's Heroic Feat states:

"Use after another hero performs an attack. Immediately perform an attack with a Melee weapon that targets 1 of the same monsters. Then, that hero may perform an attack that targets that same monster."

So, nothing odd here. Another hero performs an attack, on their turn. Once they have finished their attack, Nanok immediately performs an attack against the same monster. So far, so good.

But then, all it says is that then that hero may perform an attack. It doesn't stipulate immediately, and the attack isn't enforced, it's merely an option.

The Skirmisher's Unrelenting states:

"Exhaust this card after resolving an attack with a Melee weapon with 1 hand icon. Perform an attack that targets one of the same monsters with a different Melee weapon with 1 hand icon."

Nanok has just resolved an attack with a melee weapon, with 1 hand icon. He meets all the prerequisites, and may thus exhaust the card, and proceed to resolve it's effects.

Only after this, the entirety of the attack action started with the Heroic Feat concludes, and the other hero may perform an attack against that same monster.

I see no reason why this wouldn't be legal, and I would argue that the resolution goes OtherHeroNormalAttack->NanokHeroic->into->NanokUnrelenting->OtherHeroFreeAttack.

I am pretty sure this would work. The trigger for the skill is satisfied. The only thing I think should be considered is that the heroic feat is already in progress, and states exactly what comes after Nanok's attack. Therefore, the heroic feat would have to complete before Nanok can perform his unrelenting attack. If the other hero's attack defeats the monster, the unrelenting exhaustion is sort of wasted.

I say this because it has been ruled that for example Stalwart cannot work in combination with one fist's heroic feat (but advance can).

The discussion may well be purely academic, since whether the attack plays out after the Heroic Feat or not is irrelevant, since Nanok would have to declare Unrelenting upon conclusion of his attack, and it may just end up "wasting" it either way, but why do you think that the entirety of the Heroic Feat would have to be played out before Unrelenting is played out?

If anything, I could see them playing out concurrently, meaning that the player whose turn it is would decide what happens first.

Edit:

The trigger for unrelenting is "when you resolve an attack with one hand weapon".

Nanok's heroic feat gives him a attack that interrupts another hero's turn.

It IS an attack, no matter when it happens so the skill can trigger.

It is to be noted that the Unrelenting attack can target "one of the same monsters" not "the same target" so if there was another monster from that group adjacent to Nanok (or within reach, if he wields a 1 hand reach weapon), he could target that monster.

Huh, I always read it worded like that in case the other hero attacked multiple monsters, not "one of the same monsters" as in "the same monster type" or "same monster group".

Regarding "one of the same monsters" it IS written to account for multi attacks. It does NOT allow you to attack a different monster in the same group.

Regarding the heroic feat, I'm not certain exactly the order it would play out. For One Fist, his feat is "when you're defeated, first perform an attack (plus one more for each monster you defeat, THEN you are KO." It was ruled that Advance could trigger as a part of one of those attacks, but Stalwart could not, because the "then you are knocked out" didn't allow an interruption before it. I'll find the actual response and see what I can figure out.

Regarding "one of the same monsters" it IS written to account for multi attacks. It does NOT allow you to attack a different monster in the same group.

Regarding the heroic feat, I'm not certain exactly the order it would play out. For One Fist, his feat is "when you're defeated, first perform an attack (plus one more for each monster you defeat, THEN you are KO." It was ruled that Advance could trigger as a part of one of those attacks, but Stalwart could not, because the "then you are knocked out" didn't allow an interruption before it. I'll find the actual response and see what I can figure out.

Well to me, that supports the idea that you can insert actions that hinges on an attack, as part of that attack being ended, thus continuing the overall action, just "inserting" events as they apply.

Stalwart, on the other hand, is triggered by you being defeated, but ends with you being knocked out.

So you could, for example, use Advance with Stalwart, or use Advance with One-Fist's Heroic Feat, but you can't use Stalwart with One-Fist's Heroic Feat (or vice-versa).

Or, at least, that's how I'm reading it, going through the text.

The key difference between advance and everything else we're talking about here is that advance triggers as part of an attack (during step 5) not when an attack resolves.